> Germany now shows a 30-point gap between increasingly conservative young men and progressive female contemporaries, and in the UK the gap is 25 points. In Poland last year, almost half of men aged 18-21 backed the hard-right Confederation party, compared to just a sixth of young women of the same age.
> In the US, UK and Germany, young women now take far more liberal positions on immigration and racial justice than young men, while older age groups remain evenly matched. The trend in most countries has been one of women shifting left while men stand still, but there are signs that young men are actively moving to the right in Germany, where today’s under-30s are more opposed to immigration than their elders, and have shifted towards the far-right AfD in recent years.
> Outside the west, there are even more stark divisions. In South Korea there is now a yawning chasm between young men and women, and it’s a similar situation in China. In Africa, Tunisia shows the same pattern. Notably, in every country this dramatic split is either exclusive to the younger generation or far more pronounced there than among men and women in their thirties and upwards.
> Seven years on from the initial #MeToo explosion, the gender divergence in attitudes has become self-sustaining. Survey data show that in many countries the ideological differences now extend beyond this issue. The clear progressive-vs-conservative divide on sexual harassment appears to have caused — or at least is part of — a broader realignment of young men and women into conservative and liberal camps respectively on other issues.
> It would be easy to say this is all a phase that will pass, but the ideology gaps are only growing, and data shows that people’s formative political experiences are hard to shake off. All of this is exacerbated by the fact that the proliferation of smartphones and social media mean that young men and women now increasingly inhabit separate spaces and experience separate cultures.
It looks like the Alt-Right propaganda around the Trump election hit South Korea hard.
What does liberal and conservative even mean ?
Liberal seems to mean open borders shutting down discussion and dissent and being slaves to big business and big pharma.
Conservative means the same thing.
Laughable they the Brits are the most “liberal” yet the government is literally the conservative party.
I’m not really surprised. Mental health and employment among young men are in a terrible state, while the media and politicians are constantly pushing agendas that put women and foreigners in a preferred position.
That’s bound to cause a lot of resentment among the have-nots of the young male population. This has been easily visible in internet discourse for the last 15 or so years.
Young men would literally go conservative instead of going to therapy.
I’m confused. % liberal minus % conservative?
Unless this gap narrows, this is a time bomb waiting to blow in form of male violence and revolution.
If all you have to offer to young men is to say they are the worst and to blame for everything while offering them nothing will you claim women cant do no wrong and are always all powerful while helpless victims at the same time you get stuff like this
korea is now becoming total shit. woman and man are not having sex. they are fighting because of nonsense things..
Dafuq is happening in South Korea?
I don’t know about other countries, but in Poland left wing parties usually don’t offer men much, if anything at all. From a young man’s perspective, he gains nothing from voting on these parties while also being the one paying for it all that if these parties win.
Atleast that is perspective of Konfederacja voters.
I’m unable to read the linked post.
How does one quantify the extent to which men and women are liberal / conservative; is it a likert scale questionnaire or what?
Anecdotally it matches what the media and social media seem to be suggesting but these tend to focus more on the extreme viewpoints.
In European politics there definitely appears to be more movement toward the right in politics and social media filled with arguments against liberal movements.
But my feeling is that goes hand in hand with the cost of living crisis, war in Europe and post COVID environment we find ourselves in, where people are desperately wanting an alternative to the status quo.
Dangerous times, hopefully we only see sane, competent and controlled leaders being elected rather than those pedalling hate and blame.
If u look at the graph, men are becoming more centrist, and women more radical (outside of the UK and SK) Why is everyone talking like men are wrong?
That seems like some of you believe Liberal = good, And Conserative = bad.
Edit: Im not even saying that women are wrong, just that being conservative or centrist is not pledge of alliegence to the III Reich
Or alternatively: young women are becoming more radical while young men are centrists
Hello, am I in the right place at the Sunday Incel meeting? And men, what about the girls, are you making progress?
*the proliferation of smartphones and social media mean that young men and women now increasingly inhabit separate spaces and experience separate cultures.*
I am starting to thing that smartphones, especially social media equipped, should only be available to adults, not when kids grow up. Not everybody has parents to check what they look at, and even those who do it, aren’t effective most of the times
Any poll that divides the entire political spectrum into the English/American two categories of “conservative” and “liberal” is useless trash.
That sucks, did it ever happen in history before? Society is becoming ever more divided, individualized, atomized… While the corporations/governments are becoming more authoritarian. Divide and conquer.
To be clear I don’t have a specific conservative/liberal stance. It’s much more nuanced in 100% of cases.
Edit: the only thing I want to say is, please stop dehumanizing the other side. Most people are adequate beings that would agree on most things — what is good, what is bad. But social media takes the worst examples of how some groups behave and then makes you think that all conservatives/liberals/men/women/etc are like this. Social media is to blame here in my opinion, and also why we see it happening with young people.
Edit2: coming from a young person btw, that had to go through all of this as well (breaking of my echo chambers).
The UK is an interesting example. Brexit turbocharged a huge generational disconnect between voters, to the extent that if the poll was re-run today and everyone had amnesia about the last 7-8 years, Remain would win purely due to the number of Leave voters dying since 2016. Latest polls show Tory support in the young averaging around 15%, and they are dead in the water in every demographic group expect retired people. Even if it wasn’t for the current malaise of the government, the timebomb of their support was going to go off eventually.
Ideology polls like this are as much about perception as anything else. It is “do I consider myself liberal or conservative against the current perception of government in my country?” as opposed to an objective assessment. So in the UK a clear majority of the young will see themselves as liberal simply as a counterpoint to who currently rules the country.
Generally speaking if a society is quite patriarchal, movements to change that are going to see differences betwen men and women. South Korea is the extreme case here. What seems to be going on though is a reaction to the more “active” measures to deal with gender equality. I don’t think this is at all surprising, and it isn’t necessarily a bad thing, sometimes you can’t be popular with everyone especially with an entrenched system. But it does mean that the equilibrium has been thrown out and countries need to look at ways to deal with that.
gee, it’s almost as if elites are deliberately sowing discord in our society with propaganda often specifically targeting teenage boys and men who feel left out.
Who would have thought that young men, who already struggle a lot in their lives, would not choose to associate with the progressive camp. A “progressive” side which villifies men and considers their problems not worthy of attention.
You will never hear the left discussing men’s mental health, or men’s problem in general. Yet you will see them do that for women, illegal immigrants, LGBTQ, and any other “oppressed” minority. It’s a natural consequence that men will turn on to the “other” side which at least adresses some of their concerns.
i’m on my thirties now but i’m seeing this on my younger cousins and coworkers.
they seem way more disinterested in dating and engaging with girls in a deeper level. it seems like too much of a hustle for them. not worth it. even risky. like it seems that being alone is the best optiom for them.
this is a huge problem imo
I’m definitely seeing younger women change their views to the right
Gen xers are growing to be more conservative, want men who are masculine, want familes, want to have children w white men specifically and slowly turning against immigration compared to my millennial female friends.
For context I’m female!
Basically right-wing parties took the role of traditional left-wing parties representing working-class people. Originally the voter base for left-wing parties were workers. Since the seventies-eighties these parties abandoned this voter base to cater to marginalized groups. And working-class young men were simply left without any political representation. Right-wing parties simply noticed this wide voter base without any kind of political voice and moved in to represent them.
That will take care of overpopulation.
>Germany now shows a 30-point gap between increasingly conservative young men and progressive female contemporaries, and in the UK the gap is 25 points.
What’s fascinating is the gap is roughly the same between Germany and Britain, yet German women and British men have roughly the same viewpoints, the gap is just because British women are becoming even more super liberal.
28 comments
Source: https://www.ft.com/content/29fd9b5c-2f35-41bf-9d4c-994db4e12998
> Germany now shows a 30-point gap between increasingly conservative young men and progressive female contemporaries, and in the UK the gap is 25 points. In Poland last year, almost half of men aged 18-21 backed the hard-right Confederation party, compared to just a sixth of young women of the same age.
> In the US, UK and Germany, young women now take far more liberal positions on immigration and racial justice than young men, while older age groups remain evenly matched. The trend in most countries has been one of women shifting left while men stand still, but there are signs that young men are actively moving to the right in Germany, where today’s under-30s are more opposed to immigration than their elders, and have shifted towards the far-right AfD in recent years.
> Outside the west, there are even more stark divisions. In South Korea there is now a yawning chasm between young men and women, and it’s a similar situation in China. In Africa, Tunisia shows the same pattern. Notably, in every country this dramatic split is either exclusive to the younger generation or far more pronounced there than among men and women in their thirties and upwards.
> Seven years on from the initial #MeToo explosion, the gender divergence in attitudes has become self-sustaining. Survey data show that in many countries the ideological differences now extend beyond this issue. The clear progressive-vs-conservative divide on sexual harassment appears to have caused — or at least is part of — a broader realignment of young men and women into conservative and liberal camps respectively on other issues.
> It would be easy to say this is all a phase that will pass, but the ideology gaps are only growing, and data shows that people’s formative political experiences are hard to shake off. All of this is exacerbated by the fact that the proliferation of smartphones and social media mean that young men and women now increasingly inhabit separate spaces and experience separate cultures.
It looks like the Alt-Right propaganda around the Trump election hit South Korea hard.
What does liberal and conservative even mean ?
Liberal seems to mean open borders shutting down discussion and dissent and being slaves to big business and big pharma.
Conservative means the same thing.
Laughable they the Brits are the most “liberal” yet the government is literally the conservative party.
I’m not really surprised. Mental health and employment among young men are in a terrible state, while the media and politicians are constantly pushing agendas that put women and foreigners in a preferred position.
That’s bound to cause a lot of resentment among the have-nots of the young male population. This has been easily visible in internet discourse for the last 15 or so years.
Young men would literally go conservative instead of going to therapy.
I’m confused. % liberal minus % conservative?
Unless this gap narrows, this is a time bomb waiting to blow in form of male violence and revolution.
forever alone
Its a terrible development. One cause could be the very negative discourse on men, while many young men and teenagers struggle in school. Related to this, research shows that not women but men is being discriminated in hiring decisions: https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0749597823000560 and https://academic.oup.com/esr/article/38/3/337/6412759?login=false
If all you have to offer to young men is to say they are the worst and to blame for everything while offering them nothing will you claim women cant do no wrong and are always all powerful while helpless victims at the same time you get stuff like this
korea is now becoming total shit. woman and man are not having sex. they are fighting because of nonsense things..
Dafuq is happening in South Korea?
I don’t know about other countries, but in Poland left wing parties usually don’t offer men much, if anything at all. From a young man’s perspective, he gains nothing from voting on these parties while also being the one paying for it all that if these parties win.
Atleast that is perspective of Konfederacja voters.
I’m unable to read the linked post.
How does one quantify the extent to which men and women are liberal / conservative; is it a likert scale questionnaire or what?
Anecdotally it matches what the media and social media seem to be suggesting but these tend to focus more on the extreme viewpoints.
In European politics there definitely appears to be more movement toward the right in politics and social media filled with arguments against liberal movements.
But my feeling is that goes hand in hand with the cost of living crisis, war in Europe and post COVID environment we find ourselves in, where people are desperately wanting an alternative to the status quo.
Dangerous times, hopefully we only see sane, competent and controlled leaders being elected rather than those pedalling hate and blame.
If u look at the graph, men are becoming more centrist, and women more radical (outside of the UK and SK) Why is everyone talking like men are wrong?
That seems like some of you believe Liberal = good, And Conserative = bad.
Edit: Im not even saying that women are wrong, just that being conservative or centrist is not pledge of alliegence to the III Reich
Or alternatively: young women are becoming more radical while young men are centrists
Hello, am I in the right place at the Sunday Incel meeting? And men, what about the girls, are you making progress?
*the proliferation of smartphones and social media mean that young men and women now increasingly inhabit separate spaces and experience separate cultures.*
I am starting to thing that smartphones, especially social media equipped, should only be available to adults, not when kids grow up. Not everybody has parents to check what they look at, and even those who do it, aren’t effective most of the times
Any poll that divides the entire political spectrum into the English/American two categories of “conservative” and “liberal” is useless trash.
That sucks, did it ever happen in history before? Society is becoming ever more divided, individualized, atomized… While the corporations/governments are becoming more authoritarian. Divide and conquer.
To be clear I don’t have a specific conservative/liberal stance. It’s much more nuanced in 100% of cases.
Edit: the only thing I want to say is, please stop dehumanizing the other side. Most people are adequate beings that would agree on most things — what is good, what is bad. But social media takes the worst examples of how some groups behave and then makes you think that all conservatives/liberals/men/women/etc are like this. Social media is to blame here in my opinion, and also why we see it happening with young people.
Edit2: coming from a young person btw, that had to go through all of this as well (breaking of my echo chambers).
The UK is an interesting example. Brexit turbocharged a huge generational disconnect between voters, to the extent that if the poll was re-run today and everyone had amnesia about the last 7-8 years, Remain would win purely due to the number of Leave voters dying since 2016. Latest polls show Tory support in the young averaging around 15%, and they are dead in the water in every demographic group expect retired people. Even if it wasn’t for the current malaise of the government, the timebomb of their support was going to go off eventually.
Ideology polls like this are as much about perception as anything else. It is “do I consider myself liberal or conservative against the current perception of government in my country?” as opposed to an objective assessment. So in the UK a clear majority of the young will see themselves as liberal simply as a counterpoint to who currently rules the country.
Generally speaking if a society is quite patriarchal, movements to change that are going to see differences betwen men and women. South Korea is the extreme case here. What seems to be going on though is a reaction to the more “active” measures to deal with gender equality. I don’t think this is at all surprising, and it isn’t necessarily a bad thing, sometimes you can’t be popular with everyone especially with an entrenched system. But it does mean that the equilibrium has been thrown out and countries need to look at ways to deal with that.
gee, it’s almost as if elites are deliberately sowing discord in our society with propaganda often specifically targeting teenage boys and men who feel left out.
Who would have thought that young men, who already struggle a lot in their lives, would not choose to associate with the progressive camp. A “progressive” side which villifies men and considers their problems not worthy of attention.
You will never hear the left discussing men’s mental health, or men’s problem in general. Yet you will see them do that for women, illegal immigrants, LGBTQ, and any other “oppressed” minority. It’s a natural consequence that men will turn on to the “other” side which at least adresses some of their concerns.
i’m on my thirties now but i’m seeing this on my younger cousins and coworkers.
they seem way more disinterested in dating and engaging with girls in a deeper level. it seems like too much of a hustle for them. not worth it. even risky. like it seems that being alone is the best optiom for them.
this is a huge problem imo
I’m definitely seeing younger women change their views to the right
Gen xers are growing to be more conservative, want men who are masculine, want familes, want to have children w white men specifically and slowly turning against immigration compared to my millennial female friends.
For context I’m female!
Basically right-wing parties took the role of traditional left-wing parties representing working-class people. Originally the voter base for left-wing parties were workers. Since the seventies-eighties these parties abandoned this voter base to cater to marginalized groups. And working-class young men were simply left without any political representation. Right-wing parties simply noticed this wide voter base without any kind of political voice and moved in to represent them.
That will take care of overpopulation.
>Germany now shows a 30-point gap between increasingly conservative young men and progressive female contemporaries, and in the UK the gap is 25 points.
What’s fascinating is the gap is roughly the same between Germany and Britain, yet German women and British men have roughly the same viewpoints, the gap is just because British women are becoming even more super liberal.