Yeah good. It’s a f’in sideshow anyways. No one cares if you identify as a green giraffe – there’s actual issues on this planet. Man man man…
[deleted]
I have no idea what this all is about… spent 5 minutes googling, still failed…
The article is a bit unclear, but this is about a *suppression* of inclusive language, not a boost of it.
> The amended Bavarian regulation expressly forbids state authorities from inserting a pause, asterisk or colon – all signifiers of inclusivity – into a noun, in official documents and correspondence or during lessons.
Gender inclusive language doesn’t care if you’re a green giraffe and neither should we. I think this is the one step back after two steps forward.
I see that the conservative politicians in the state of Bavaria are serious about the “real problems” of their citizens….
Very misleading title. You can still use, e.g. “Ärztinnen und Ärzte”, and you can also use inclusive terms like “Studierende”. What is banned is forms like “Student*innen” or “Ärzt*innen”, which is confusing, not conforming with German grammar, and widely disliked by anybody safe for some activists.
Edit: to be clear: these word forms are not “banned” in the way that some people seem to understand the word. You can of course speak and write how you like – just for *school books* and *official documents*, the accepted grammar and spelling rules of the language have to be used.
Good news for once.
So they are complaining about people “policing language” and forcing others to use certain language forms, because these forms are used in official communication.
And now the solution: Policing language and forcing others to use certain language forms. Hypocrites…
I agree that nobody should get punished for not using inclusive language, but that’s not really a thing. Even if it were and if there’s some few cases, this law doesn’t seem to prevent that.
From my experience at a university in Berlin (oh so progressive compared to Bavaria) there’s no one forcing us to use that language. It’s used by some faculty, some official communications and part of the students.
However no one’s punished for not doing so. There’s also no exclusion for not using it except in groups that focus specifically on the whole gender thing. If you don’t want to use that language, you are not going to want to be part of those anyway.
I don’t use it and I have no problems on campus whatsoever.
A better solution would be to make it law that no one is allowed to be punished officially (exams, publications, etc.) for choosing not to use that kind of language.
Then those that want to be inclusive can do that while others can avoid it, if it is too much hassle for them.
Wouldn’t this be a compromise?
Additionally: I don’t get what’s so hard to read about it. To me it took a few weeks and I could just ignore it and read again just as fluently as before.
It’s basically just a way to include a glottal stop marker in the writing. Glottal stops are already a regular part of the German language – that’s why it sounds so harsh and choppy for many speakers of other languages – so the changes aren’t even that big.
I hope the word behindert is not banned, because it sums up this whole thing…
Good, I started learning German 2 weeks ago. It is already confusing as it is, don’t make it even more confusing (at least till I learn up C1 or something)
the king strikes again
I love that the conservative politician quoted in the article is named Herrmann!
With this Newspeak, would he be called Damefrau?
genuinely embarassing.
this was mainly done to improve reading flow, especially for scientific texts as the constant use of the “inclusive language” in it’s current iteration really isn’t helpful to get the point across when you have to read “*innen” every few seconds. Also this is more of a guideline/directive to keep it all simple, not something you would be punished for using
Oh i should have brought my popcorn for this thread.
Aha die Sprachpolizei betreibt mal wieder Verbotspolitiker.
Gender what ? 🤮
I read Brazil for some reason.
Conservative language police at it again.
HR departments in Berlin startups shaking in their boots already. Good riddance, *, you were always a stupid idea.
Funnily enough the people celebrating this because gendered language is too conplicated are usually the same people making fun of youth language for not being sophisticated enough. Also the same people complaining about the left wanting to ban everything. Also the same people that have no idea how to use commas correctly.
BERLIN (AP) — The German state of Bavaria on Tuesday banned the use of gender-sensitive language in classrooms and university lecture halls, the latest salvo in an often-rancorous debate about whether the German language should become more inclusive.
The Bavarian state government approved amendments to regulations governing the use of German in all public institutions, including schools and universities, German news agency dpa reported.
Some Germans want their language to evolve to become less male-dominated. For example, some people and organizations have begun deploying a pause or symbol in the middle of plural nouns and favor the feminine word for people to reflect gender diversity.
However, conservatives accuse progressives of trying to force clunky and unnecessary change on citizens, including those who want to stick to more conventional forms.
The amended Bavarian regulation expressly forbids state authorities from inserting a pause, asterisk or colon – all signifiers of inclusivity – into a noun, in official documents and correspondence or during lessons. It was unclear whether teachers or other state employees would face penalties for breaking the rules.
Bavarian dialect should be banned.
Glad to see there still are some reasonable people out there, who were able to rationally take a decision without blindly following populist trends.
These clowns are talking about left-green tyranny while literally policing language. Nothing helpful ever comes out of reactionary conservatives.
CSU is also fighting cannabis decriminalization tooth and nail while Munich hosts the world’s biggest alcohol festival.
The dumbest hill to die on for the left. Thanks again for america for exporting their culture war bs to us
Based and Bavariapilled
The title is incorrect. The ban addresses use of gender punctuation, e.g., Fahrer*in or Lehrer:innen or the even more absurd underscore, e.g., Bäcker_innen. The policy doesn’t ban gender-sensitive language such as “Fahrer und Fahrerinnen” or the more inclusive “Lehrende”.
There are some social circles that really deeply care about gender punctuation. I would argue that we have much more pressing social issues to address, but that take a bit more effort and are more difficult to perform on social media.
Although I am very strongly in favour of inclusionary policies and social structures for all persons of all genders, I don’t use gender punctuation, simply for the reason that it is awkward and performative.
Ultimately, this move is about the current ruling party trying to score political points by defying “wokeness” and playing into idiotic American-style social politics in a context where they don’t belong.
I do agree with this law considering gender neutral language is extremely confusing for students and professors/teachers alike but I can’t help but laugh at the irony of Bavaria of all states moderating the German language.
Jordan Peterson is about to be an expert in German grammar.
Looks like the German is very similar to the French gender inclusive language. It must be a pain in the ass to type and then read those stars – no wonder they don’t like it.
I’d normally be all for it if it wasn’t so fucking ass to read. Imagine going through every other sentence and you see “Kolleginnen und Kollegen”. Just pick one at that point. ( I did love that shit during school though, helped fill word limits)
33 comments
Way to go Bayern!
Good to hear!!
Yeah good. It’s a f’in sideshow anyways. No one cares if you identify as a green giraffe – there’s actual issues on this planet. Man man man…
[deleted]
I have no idea what this all is about… spent 5 minutes googling, still failed…
The article is a bit unclear, but this is about a *suppression* of inclusive language, not a boost of it.
> The amended Bavarian regulation expressly forbids state authorities from inserting a pause, asterisk or colon – all signifiers of inclusivity – into a noun, in official documents and correspondence or during lessons.
Gender inclusive language doesn’t care if you’re a green giraffe and neither should we. I think this is the one step back after two steps forward.
I see that the conservative politicians in the state of Bavaria are serious about the “real problems” of their citizens….
Very misleading title. You can still use, e.g. “Ärztinnen und Ärzte”, and you can also use inclusive terms like “Studierende”. What is banned is forms like “Student*innen” or “Ärzt*innen”, which is confusing, not conforming with German grammar, and widely disliked by anybody safe for some activists.
Edit: to be clear: these word forms are not “banned” in the way that some people seem to understand the word. You can of course speak and write how you like – just for *school books* and *official documents*, the accepted grammar and spelling rules of the language have to be used.
Good news for once.
So they are complaining about people “policing language” and forcing others to use certain language forms, because these forms are used in official communication.
And now the solution: Policing language and forcing others to use certain language forms. Hypocrites…
I agree that nobody should get punished for not using inclusive language, but that’s not really a thing. Even if it were and if there’s some few cases, this law doesn’t seem to prevent that.
From my experience at a university in Berlin (oh so progressive compared to Bavaria) there’s no one forcing us to use that language. It’s used by some faculty, some official communications and part of the students.
However no one’s punished for not doing so. There’s also no exclusion for not using it except in groups that focus specifically on the whole gender thing. If you don’t want to use that language, you are not going to want to be part of those anyway.
I don’t use it and I have no problems on campus whatsoever.
A better solution would be to make it law that no one is allowed to be punished officially (exams, publications, etc.) for choosing not to use that kind of language.
Then those that want to be inclusive can do that while others can avoid it, if it is too much hassle for them.
Wouldn’t this be a compromise?
Additionally: I don’t get what’s so hard to read about it. To me it took a few weeks and I could just ignore it and read again just as fluently as before.
It’s basically just a way to include a glottal stop marker in the writing. Glottal stops are already a regular part of the German language – that’s why it sounds so harsh and choppy for many speakers of other languages – so the changes aren’t even that big.
I hope the word behindert is not banned, because it sums up this whole thing…
Good, I started learning German 2 weeks ago. It is already confusing as it is, don’t make it even more confusing (at least till I learn up C1 or something)
the king strikes again
I love that the conservative politician quoted in the article is named Herrmann!
With this Newspeak, would he be called Damefrau?
genuinely embarassing.
this was mainly done to improve reading flow, especially for scientific texts as the constant use of the “inclusive language” in it’s current iteration really isn’t helpful to get the point across when you have to read “*innen” every few seconds. Also this is more of a guideline/directive to keep it all simple, not something you would be punished for using
Oh i should have brought my popcorn for this thread.
Aha die Sprachpolizei betreibt mal wieder Verbotspolitiker.
Gender what ? 🤮
I read Brazil for some reason.
Conservative language police at it again.
HR departments in Berlin startups shaking in their boots already. Good riddance, *, you were always a stupid idea.
Funnily enough the people celebrating this because gendered language is too conplicated are usually the same people making fun of youth language for not being sophisticated enough. Also the same people complaining about the left wanting to ban everything. Also the same people that have no idea how to use commas correctly.
BERLIN (AP) — The German state of Bavaria on Tuesday banned the use of gender-sensitive language in classrooms and university lecture halls, the latest salvo in an often-rancorous debate about whether the German language should become more inclusive.
The Bavarian state government approved amendments to regulations governing the use of German in all public institutions, including schools and universities, German news agency dpa reported.
Some Germans want their language to evolve to become less male-dominated. For example, some people and organizations have begun deploying a pause or symbol in the middle of plural nouns and favor the feminine word for people to reflect gender diversity.
However, conservatives accuse progressives of trying to force clunky and unnecessary change on citizens, including those who want to stick to more conventional forms.
The amended Bavarian regulation expressly forbids state authorities from inserting a pause, asterisk or colon – all signifiers of inclusivity – into a noun, in official documents and correspondence or during lessons. It was unclear whether teachers or other state employees would face penalties for breaking the rules.
Bavarian dialect should be banned.
Glad to see there still are some reasonable people out there, who were able to rationally take a decision without blindly following populist trends.
These clowns are talking about left-green tyranny while literally policing language. Nothing helpful ever comes out of reactionary conservatives.
CSU is also fighting cannabis decriminalization tooth and nail while Munich hosts the world’s biggest alcohol festival.
The dumbest hill to die on for the left. Thanks again for america for exporting their culture war bs to us
Based and Bavariapilled
The title is incorrect. The ban addresses use of gender punctuation, e.g., Fahrer*in or Lehrer:innen or the even more absurd underscore, e.g., Bäcker_innen. The policy doesn’t ban gender-sensitive language such as “Fahrer und Fahrerinnen” or the more inclusive “Lehrende”.
There are some social circles that really deeply care about gender punctuation. I would argue that we have much more pressing social issues to address, but that take a bit more effort and are more difficult to perform on social media.
Although I am very strongly in favour of inclusionary policies and social structures for all persons of all genders, I don’t use gender punctuation, simply for the reason that it is awkward and performative.
Ultimately, this move is about the current ruling party trying to score political points by defying “wokeness” and playing into idiotic American-style social politics in a context where they don’t belong.
I do agree with this law considering gender neutral language is extremely confusing for students and professors/teachers alike but I can’t help but laugh at the irony of Bavaria of all states moderating the German language.
Jordan Peterson is about to be an expert in German grammar.
Looks like the German is very similar to the French gender inclusive language. It must be a pain in the ass to type and then read those stars – no wonder they don’t like it.
I’d normally be all for it if it wasn’t so fucking ass to read. Imagine going through every other sentence and you see “Kolleginnen und Kollegen”. Just pick one at that point. ( I did love that shit during school though, helped fill word limits)