‎As news of the confrontation between Ukraine and Russia continues, we will continue to make new megathreads to make room for discussion and to share news.

**Only important developments of this conflict is allowed outside the megathread.** Things like opinion articles or social media posts from journalists/politicians, for example, should be posted in this megathread.

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# Links

We’ll add some links here. Some of them are sources explain the background of this conflict.

* [Conflict in Ukraine](https://www.cfr.org/global-conflict-tracker/conflict/conflict-ukraine) by the Council of Foreign Relations. The right bar (on desktop) shows some of the latest news about the subject

* [Ukraine crisis: Why now? What’s the history? What are Putin’s motivations?](https://www.euronews.com/2022/01/27/russia-ukraine-border-crisis-explained-why-now-what-s-the-history-what-are-putin-s-motivat) by Euronews. Last update was on 28 January 2022.

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We also would like to remind you all to [read our rules](https://www.reddit.com/r/europe/wiki/community_rules). Personal attacks, hate speech (against Ukrainians, Germans or Russians, for example) is forbidden. Do not derail or try to provoke other users.

25 comments

  1. I predict there will be a ‘Ukraine-Russia Conflict Megathread 23’, discussing an imminent Russian invasion of Ukraine.

  7. r/Ottawa has already produced almost thirty megathreads about the freedom convoy arriving at that city over the weekend, yet we’re only at the third megathread, and this is a sub for an entire continent. We gotta push up those numbers, everybody!

  8. What can Russia gain by invading Ukraine? Nothing. They can only be dragged in never-ending war which would ultimately weaken their economy. It won’t get anything good to Russia nor Ukraine. The true winners would be US and the West. They would finally get a chance to destroy Russia and gain one more puppet colony state in the East.

  9. If this hasn’t happened by the end of the Olympics, I’m pretty sure it isn’t going to. So, 20 ish days and counting.

  11. I am still holding out hope there is a diplomatic solution. I could see Ukraine still joining Nato without any military bases, troops, or Nato weaponry. Similar to the Russia/Cuba relationship and proximity to the United States.

  12. The ironic thing about this whole invasion (or threat of invasion) is that it’s likely to demonstrate a reason for NATO to exist, and thereby strengthening NATO (and by extension the EU) which is the opposite of Putin’s interests.

  13. If you deploy 150,000 troops how many are logistics and support? Does that leave say 50,000 available for actual operations? The attrition rate from alcohol poisoning alone in the Russian Army must mean they would burn through operational troops in 3-6 months?

  14. I get r/russia posts recommended by Reddit because I browse this sub and honestly, the level of propaganda is ridiculous.

    Not that I’m defending all of r/europe – that we’re getting a dozen Russia posts daily (not related to the current conflict) isn’t necessary either, but at least it’s not “Here is Putin holding a puppy”.

  19. You may want to remove the word discussion from the post, that would suggest that there is a willingness to discuss and listen to the other side and not just an anti Russian bashing circle jerk

  23. also wondering how tomorrows talk is going to go. on one hand, i think things could be peacefully resolved. on the other, every sign points to an absolute “no”, when it comes to a peaceful resolve. time shall tell, i guess

  24. [Germansplaining: Why Germany is apathetic towards Ukraine](https://www.theneweuropean.co.uk/why-germany-is-apathetic-towards-ukraine/)

    Moscow, March 2009: I’m interviewing Michael Gorbachev – or “Gorbi”, as Germans call him, affectionately. He’s hugely popular in Germany, whereas most of his fellow countrymen loathe and blame him for the collapse of the mighty Soviet Union and the economic downfall of Russia.

    Gorbachev asks which part of Berlin I’m from originally – East or West. I reply, “Actually, I’m from Bonn, full West.” I remember him smiling and saying: “You aren’t one of our Germans, then. You see, in the Soviet Union we used to distinguish between ‘our Germans’ and ‘not our Germans’.”

    Does Vladimir Putin (a former KGB agent in Dresden) chuckle at the thought of “his” Germans today, I wonder? Not that he is particularly liked (or his practice to have FSB-hitman shoot adversaries at point-blank range in broad daylight in central Berlin). But what Putin can absolutely rely upon is that the German political elite is hesitant if not outright unwilling to join forces, quite literally, with our Western allies to secure stability and peace.

    The Russian president has amassed more than 100,000 troops plus tanks at the border with Ukraine. Russia has a modernised military force with aircraft, radar, precision strike missiles and recent combat experience in Syria. Ukraine doesn’t.

    But despite Ukraine’s pleas for help, German chancellor Olaf Scholz is trying to avoid the subject. He recently managed a meagre “everything is up for discussion if there is a military intervention against Ukraine.”

    Yet members of his governing SPD label those who demand support for Ukraine as sabre-rattling and warmongering. They refer to – no, not Gazprom-lobbyist and former chancellor Gerhard Schröder – but to the famous Ostpolitik (Eastern policy) of Willy Brandt and Helmut Schmidt, the détente towards the Soviet Union that smoothed the way for commercial relations and political dialogue.

    What today’s Social Democrats seems to have forgotten is that this Cold War détente was made possible because it was backed by deterrence: hundreds of thousands of American and British troops stationed in WestGermany for half a century.

    Deterrence does not seem to be in the German political playbook, though – and it is hard to overstate how much this is weakening a joint Nato approach. The UK, Canada, the US, France, Poland, the Balts, the Czechs – they all send or intend to send defensive weaponry and troops to help train the Ukrainian armed forces. Germany sends a field hospital. Does this only sound cynical to me?

    At least the head of the German navy was sacked over the weekend after a video of him playing down Russia’s aggression and burbling about a Christian alliance against China surfaced on Twitter.

    Interestingly it’s the Green Party which has been most outspoken in regard to Russian human rights infringements and breach of International law. Green foreign minister Annalena Baerback stood her ground last week next to her Russian counterpart Sergey Lavrov. But when her co-chairman suggested supporting military self-defence in Ukraine last year he was immediately shut down by political pushback from all parties. Popular opinion not being on his side either, he toned his proposal down to night vision devices and ambulances. Tovarish Putin will be impressed.

    And the right wing? Equally undeterring. Many aim for a long-term solution with Russia (Germany is Russia’s second-largest trade partner, only second to China), which would of course be great – if only there wasn’t the short-term threat of yet another invasion to a sovereign European state by a Russian aggressor.

    Still, the new head of the CDU, Friedrich Merz, called the idea of sanctions such as excluding Russia from the global financial interchange system Swift an “atomic bomb for the capital markets” and said: “Let’s not touch Swift” (cue satisfied nodding in the Kremlin). Bavarian CSU-leader Söder stated that such new sanctions would hit us – the Germans – as well, so let’s not escalate.

    Doveish behaviour? Please don’t insult the doves. The roots of Germany’s reluctance to become involved in an international military effort – if only to deter – can of course be traced to 20th Century history, aggressive German militarism and the atrocities that followed, particularly in the East. In Russia. And in Ukraine.

    But, to quote Russia expert Anne Applebaum: “Maybe it is time for Germans (and others) to work out that if you are ‘anti-war’, you should help Ukraine deter Russia. Refusal to do so is, in practice, ‘pro-war’. It increases the chance of invasion.”

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