Putin to be given dysfunctional weapons by North Korea

Putin to be given dysfunctional weapons by North Korea

some of them are being tested for the first time and uh the some of the reports from the battlefield suggest that that not all the Munitions uh have functioned uh perfectly Korea to meet Kim Yong un now since the war in Ukraine President Putin uh when Russia have been shunned by the International Community really and slapped with all sorts of debilitating sanctions two years on Russia really needs weapons and North Korea is one of the few countries that will sell to them now for his part Kim yongan is rolling out the red carard it pictures have come out of pyang uh roads apparently are lined with Putin’s face and the Russian flags are flying Jim tanzen is a former deputy secretary of defense for Europe and NATO under presidents Obama and Biden Mr tanzen good afternoon to you good afternoon to you well it seems pretty clear Russia needs North Korea’s weapons what do North Korea get out of this cooperation with Vladimir Putin and Russia well North Korea is a pretty isolated place these days as you know under sanctions seen as a pariah and then having suddenly over the past couple of years the Russians pay attention to them Putin going to North Korea uh in this in the first instance this is a this is a feeling of respectability that I’m sure the North Koreans are beginning to feel although getting respectability by visit from Putin you have to question but there are other things too uh there I think particularly one of them is help on Military uh modernization for the North Korean forces that the Russians can provide including uh space yeah I mean I suppose I’m puzzled by how it is that North Korea have uh weaponry and ammunition to supply to Russia just how good is their technology well their technology for the basics like artillery ammunition and and that type of thing is is is you know it’s it’s kind of moderate it’s what every nation uh has an ability to do is to make artillery ammunition and that type of thing the thing about North Korea is that they’ve got a lot of it uh because they have forces Prime to take over South Korea and artillery will play a big role so they have large storehouses of the type of ammunition that the Russians also use where they’re not very good is in space they’ve been trying to launch satellites and they keep blowing up and so they haven’t been able to put up satellites and uh other ballistic missile types of of capability uh that they want Russian help on uh presumably this visit will be incredibly staged managed there’s no way uh that Vladimir Putin will have any sight of what we still believe to be the the appalling suffering of the North Korean people that’s exactly correct everything in North Korea is stage managed as you’ve seen and countless photographs and videos of these marching troops uh it’s uh it’s quite a choreographed country and Putin will see all of that and that will certainly stroke his ego as well uh the appalling conditions uh hunger and this type of thing will be kept well out of sight he will be fed well he will sleep well he will see his photo all over the place and his ego will swell as he returns back to Moscow is he really that much of a thin-skinned narcissist then uh I think so uh I’m I’m not an expert on Putin but uh certainly his behavior in the past has shown that that he that he is he’s not as bad as Donald Trump but I think he is uh but I think he is certainly has his own uh mental qualities where his ego being stroked is is a good thing for him yeah I mean this is a grim old axis forming here isn’t it North Korea and Russia um and obviously we’re in the midst of our general election campaign in this country with actually very little talk Of defense or defense spending um does does it concern you from your perspective Jim that the the west of Europe appears somewhat uninterested well you know it’s very interesting point and I have certainly noticed that coming out of the UK I’ve spent many many years working with Europe and in the defense area when I was at the Pentagon and I would have expected UK to be in the Forefront in terms of getting itself as well as it’s NATO Allied partners and other Europeans too are ready to go just in case we’re going to have to deal with a very aggressive Russia um and your point about this axis it’s not just between Russia and North Korea it’s China it’s Iran so uh we’ve got a lot on our plate and UK has always been the leader and certainly a partner with us and I don’t want to say that that UK doesn’t lead but I think UK certainly is distracted as youve pointed out the election season upon us we are too by the way uh with our elections as well and I think whether it’s in the US or UK we are not as aware maybe of what the future could hold for us as they are in on Continental Europe yeah uh that’s that’s the difference I mean you you’ve already Illustrated in this conversation you’re no fan of former president Trump let’s say he does get reelected what then well you know that’s the big question and in Europe right now on the continent certainly there’s there’s attempts to try to Trump proof NATO try to get as many things that the US has been doing by itself like organizing assistance to Ukraine getting that put inside of NATO so no matter what happens with a potential Trump election that won’t go away that’ll be part of NATO but but there’s a lot of concern on the continent and that has led to a push to say you know no matter what the situation was politically in the past right now there’s a sense of Crisis and the European nations are really scrambling to try to improve their military capability in case uh the US disengages somewhat uh certainly it will disengage from helping Ukraine uh if Trump were elected or if there was a a contingency in the Indo Pacific where the US has to send forces that are right now in Europe and has to send them to the Pacific there’ll be gaps that have to be filled and the European nations including UK will have to fill those gaps and so there’s quite a scramble right now on the continent and I think I think my colleagues in London are certainly aware of it but I think the politics I think and you know better than I but I think the politics in the UK are distracted and looking in other directions and not necessarily at a more aggressive Russia you know North Korea what do these two leaders want from each other well I think for Putin it’s very much to do with the war in Ukraine and he has appreciated North Korea’s support for Russia’s positions from the start of the invasion in 2022 uh but in particular uh although Russia and North Kore deny it uh he benefits from uh weapon Supply artillery and missiles from North Korea yes for North Korea for Kim Jong-un I think he’s seen a strategic Advantage ever since the uh the the invasion of Ukraine and there are all sorts of ways in a transactional way that he can benefit but it fundamentally strengthens his position against the United States as he sees it right I mean North Korea um alist have been have been stacking up weapons haven’t they for many years now but what about the quality and the quantity of those Munitions when it comes to helping to supply Russia well I think some of them are being tested for the first time and uh the some of the reports from the battlefield suggest that that not all the Munitions uh have functioned uh perfectly uh but not only does North Korea have a large stockpile of uh weapons which are compatible with Russian systems uh but I think it’s very likely that they are manufacturing new uh weapons that they can supply in terms of the north korean’s own launches that you see for its ballistic missiles uh it’s had its failures but it’s had a long run of successful launches so uh I wouldn’t completely discount the capability of their Munitions yeah would it I mean do you do you assess do you believe the Supply Munitions from North Korea to Russia will make a significant difference or much difference at all on the battlefield in Ukraine well initially the uh us position and you know I’m not on a battlefield and I only have secondhand evidence here but initially the US position was that it wouldn’t make a difference but now that we’re seeing uh evidence of very very large scale uh shipment of Munitions 11,000 containers is uh one estimate uh that can make a difference and uh that that I think is now the the the the United States position yeah I mean Russia has hasn’t it in in in comparatively recent time regeared its economy to the manufacturer manufacturer of weapons and and ammunition it’s it’s devoted an enormous enormously larger portion of its National earnings to a defense and security I say defense and Security in the case of Ukraine we’re talking about attack yeah and and of course that’s absolutely right and uh Russia’s own Munitions capability is very great but it’s also looking elsewhere and we’ve seen that particularly with the use of Iranian drones for instance now what about North Korea what does kimyong un want to get from Russia I mean it’s this this visit has been discussed in terms of aid from the Russian side Munitions from the North Korean side but tell us a bit more about what North Korea the country you know so well what do they hope to gain from this well it’s taken quite a long time for this visit to to come about uh the uh when when Kim met Putin in 2019 he invited him and then invited him again when he saw him in 2023 so it’s you know five years if you like since it’s materialized in strategic terms I think that uh Kim Jong-un sees Russian uh support uh as ensuring that he will not face in the United Nations or elsewhere where uh effective sanctions against his nuclear program and he’ll also enjoy Russian support uh on issues like uh human rights as well in terms of the benefits he probably wishes to increase uh economic relations and diversify from China on which North Korea’s become extremely dependent but he will be looking for all he can get and I don’t know how much he will get in terms of uh technology transfers incoming tourism which would be a source of income uh and uh exchanges uh in a a range of uh areas which may provide money for his coffers and what about just basic subsistence um supplies I mean are the people of North Korea well enough fed we we’re all familiar with the famous satellite pictures you look down at North Korea from a satellite and you see Darkness across North Korea you see bright lights in South South Korea you know the economy there and the agricultural economy is so much more so so much more backward are people of North Korea in need of basic supplies food there is a humanitarian need and the United Nations has has attempted to quantify that when I was there which was up until 2018 uh the there was no uh obvious starvation people had a Frugal diet uh with inadequate protein and there was still some um stunting of children and so on but but actually the country was was fed since then uh with the covid lockdown that that uh North Korea imposed on itself and um the the blocking off by themselves of all external trade for a period it’s very likely that conditions deteriorated and that uh levels of subsistence uh went went down and there may have been localized uh loss of life uh I’m not there I can’t see it uh but that’s very likely so yes they do need uh more food it’s a mountainous country it’s difficult for North Korea to grow enough uh food uh for its people of a diverse kind uh so it’s reliant on external trade and when it stops the external trade there isn’t enough food really really interesting to get your analysis Alistair thank you Alistair Morgan the former British ambassador to North Korea e

“Some of the reports from the battlefield suggest that not all the munitions have functioned properly.”

Putin is off to Pyongyang, where he weapons are expected to be on the agenda.

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