I tried to get the most recent data I could find for each country.
If I have somehow misrepresented this data, tell me and I will correct or delete the post. I am not in the business of spreading misinformation and only care about presenting the truth. (If you just say “they like it because they were young” I will ignore you unless you have solid statistical proof that that’s why people say life was better back then)
Can you compare those statistics with antivaxers statistics?
Percent of people who knew the right people to have the edge compared to the rest or were directly members of the Communist Party.
I’m surprised so many are alive after saying it’s not better.
These numbers somehow correlate with Bulgaria, Romania and Hungary being among the poorer European countries. Could it be that they are right in there perception?
Old man says life was better when he was 30.
A considerable amount of people in Eastern Germany thinks the same. It boils down to
> we didn’t have it that bad. Okay it was bad, but at least we were together and we were all friends and helped us out all the time. Now many have moved and you can’t ask the neighbor to fix your heating the 8th time as its impossible to get new parts or heating, you have to pay someone and buy something.
My grandma used to praise it until my grandpa told her – everything was shit, stop talking bullshits.
Guessed why Romania has so many antivaxxers yet?
So why the communist parties are that low on elections? Maybe these surveys are trash?
Didn’t actually read the articles but my general expectation was this: Ok, so if people lived during those hard times, they should probably be the most vocal deniers of communism.
Turns out I was wrong, and on a second thought I think we can sum up some reasons (also mentioned by other people in the comments):
* people generally consider their youth was better because they didn’t have that much responsibility as they do when they are adults, or didn’t fully comprehend the hardships they’ve been through (every generation looks back to their youth as a time of no responsibilities and carefree life)
* this was a very oppressive regime. in order to stay in power, they instilled fear and did their best especially to look good. so basically brainwashing and propoaganda
* there was no internet. If your neighbor got beaten up or jailed because he made a joke about Ceausescu you would probably know, but you couldn’t make a post on Facebook and ask people to “SHARE SO EVERYBODY KNOWS”
* most people lack a basic understanding of how the economy runs. Here in Romania, in an ex-heavily industrialized town they had to demolish a factory that had thousands of employees during communist times. Instead, they’re building two malls. The people on social media went nuts over how “they’re selling our factories as scrap metal” or “the foreigners buy us out to kill our economy”. Who’s gonna tell them that most factories under Ceausescu’s rule were running at a loss, surviving only by feeding off the profit of a couple that actually made a profit? “At least people had a job”, they say…
* the saddest point of all is that a lot of youngsters too seem to like socialism more and more. I don’t want to start an argument about what was communism, what is socialism or what could be, but at least one acquaintance that I had on my friends list invoked arguments about how “capitalism is evil” and so are USA, and others usually put the blame on the rich for how unsatisfied they are with their own lives
How to trigger the Czech 101: call them Eastern European
Romanians and Hungarians wondering why the majority vote for the crap parties.
And, as clockwork…the discussion is filled with people who aspire to liberal ideals, but the moment anyone disagrees – the thin veneer of respect, tolerance and open-mindedness vanishes. Maybe, just maybe, when half the country expresses an opinion based on their life-long experiences, they might have a point? Nah, they’re *dumb, brainwashed by propaganda, ignorant,* and *nostalgic!*
In reality – the regime change has been profoundly disappointing. Even in pure material well being – the strongest point in favor of capitalism – what was delivered is unremarkable at best. The median worker is barely above the trend-line of Brezhnevian stagnation, after being substantially depressed for decades. Capital markets are a joke. Not a single large corporation grew originated from the region in 30 years. Nobody has any vision for the future. The whole business model of those countries is based on pure labor cost arbitrage vassalage. And remember – those are supposed to be the success stories of the transition – Ukraine, Moldova or half of Yugoslavia still haven’t recovered, even in pure economic terms.
In other venues, it fared even worse. For the first time in centuries, the region hasn’t produced a single globally influential thinker, artist, scientist, architect, philosopher, or statesman. The most basic function of a state – sustaining itself, is failing. The nations are committing demographics suicide. Young people cannot afford housing in places they were born in. Talent emigrates. Politics is a cesspool. No sense of community. Military is a joke. Marketing BS left right and center. Institutions are completely captured by interest groups. Police cannot stop petty crimes. Education standards are sliding. Fraud, mafia and scams are rampant – in fact, most of the wealthiest people got their money that way. Media gave up on fostering any virtues, and turned into a cycle of outrage and mindless pop-culture. Rule of law is a coin toss. Sport teams cannot finance themselves, let alone raising new talent.
Historians have a term for a process that behaves like this – *collapse of state capacity*. Who is the brainwashed one here?
“In Eastern European countries”
V4 is typing
I imagine people stuck in places like Romania or Bulgaria preferred the soviet years being that half of their country has now left since they’re allowed to seek better opportunity and 20% of their country is elderly.
*When you’re so fucked up that normality looks absurd*
F*ck communism, communists and their supporters.
Proud of Czechia for once but you would really have to be blind to think things didn’t improve.
Also our Communist Party for the first time since Velvet Revolution dropped out of Parliament two weeks ago. They got measly 3.5%. Hopefully, that’s the last we heard about them.
to compare the figures after the Second World War with the current complete nonsense. I’m just for objectivity.
21 comments
I tried to get the most recent data I could find for each country.
If I have somehow misrepresented this data, tell me and I will correct or delete the post. I am not in the business of spreading misinformation and only care about presenting the truth. (If you just say “they like it because they were young” I will ignore you unless you have solid statistical proof that that’s why people say life was better back then)
Can you compare those statistics with antivaxers statistics?
Percent of people who knew the right people to have the edge compared to the rest or were directly members of the Communist Party.
I’m surprised so many are alive after saying it’s not better.
These numbers somehow correlate with Bulgaria, Romania and Hungary being among the poorer European countries. Could it be that they are right in there perception?
Old man says life was better when he was 30.
A considerable amount of people in Eastern Germany thinks the same. It boils down to
> we didn’t have it that bad. Okay it was bad, but at least we were together and we were all friends and helped us out all the time. Now many have moved and you can’t ask the neighbor to fix your heating the 8th time as its impossible to get new parts or heating, you have to pay someone and buy something.
My grandma used to praise it until my grandpa told her – everything was shit, stop talking bullshits.
Guessed why Romania has so many antivaxxers yet?
So why the communist parties are that low on elections? Maybe these surveys are trash?
Didn’t actually read the articles but my general expectation was this: Ok, so if people lived during those hard times, they should probably be the most vocal deniers of communism.
Turns out I was wrong, and on a second thought I think we can sum up some reasons (also mentioned by other people in the comments):
* people generally consider their youth was better because they didn’t have that much responsibility as they do when they are adults, or didn’t fully comprehend the hardships they’ve been through (every generation looks back to their youth as a time of no responsibilities and carefree life)
* this was a very oppressive regime. in order to stay in power, they instilled fear and did their best especially to look good. so basically brainwashing and propoaganda
* there was no internet. If your neighbor got beaten up or jailed because he made a joke about Ceausescu you would probably know, but you couldn’t make a post on Facebook and ask people to “SHARE SO EVERYBODY KNOWS”
* most people lack a basic understanding of how the economy runs. Here in Romania, in an ex-heavily industrialized town they had to demolish a factory that had thousands of employees during communist times. Instead, they’re building two malls. The people on social media went nuts over how “they’re selling our factories as scrap metal” or “the foreigners buy us out to kill our economy”. Who’s gonna tell them that most factories under Ceausescu’s rule were running at a loss, surviving only by feeding off the profit of a couple that actually made a profit? “At least people had a job”, they say…
* the saddest point of all is that a lot of youngsters too seem to like socialism more and more. I don’t want to start an argument about what was communism, what is socialism or what could be, but at least one acquaintance that I had on my friends list invoked arguments about how “capitalism is evil” and so are USA, and others usually put the blame on the rich for how unsatisfied they are with their own lives
How to trigger the Czech 101: call them Eastern European
Romanians and Hungarians wondering why the majority vote for the crap parties.
And, as clockwork…the discussion is filled with people who aspire to liberal ideals, but the moment anyone disagrees – the thin veneer of respect, tolerance and open-mindedness vanishes. Maybe, just maybe, when half the country expresses an opinion based on their life-long experiences, they might have a point? Nah, they’re *dumb, brainwashed by propaganda, ignorant,* and *nostalgic!*
In reality – the regime change has been profoundly disappointing. Even in pure material well being – the strongest point in favor of capitalism – what was delivered is unremarkable at best. The median worker is barely above the trend-line of Brezhnevian stagnation, after being substantially depressed for decades. Capital markets are a joke. Not a single large corporation grew originated from the region in 30 years. Nobody has any vision for the future. The whole business model of those countries is based on pure labor cost arbitrage vassalage. And remember – those are supposed to be the success stories of the transition – Ukraine, Moldova or half of Yugoslavia still haven’t recovered, even in pure economic terms.
In other venues, it fared even worse. For the first time in centuries, the region hasn’t produced a single globally influential thinker, artist, scientist, architect, philosopher, or statesman. The most basic function of a state – sustaining itself, is failing. The nations are committing demographics suicide. Young people cannot afford housing in places they were born in. Talent emigrates. Politics is a cesspool. No sense of community. Military is a joke. Marketing BS left right and center. Institutions are completely captured by interest groups. Police cannot stop petty crimes. Education standards are sliding. Fraud, mafia and scams are rampant – in fact, most of the wealthiest people got their money that way. Media gave up on fostering any virtues, and turned into a cycle of outrage and mindless pop-culture. Rule of law is a coin toss. Sport teams cannot finance themselves, let alone raising new talent.
Historians have a term for a process that behaves like this – *collapse of state capacity*. Who is the brainwashed one here?
“In Eastern European countries”
V4 is typing
I imagine people stuck in places like Romania or Bulgaria preferred the soviet years being that half of their country has now left since they’re allowed to seek better opportunity and 20% of their country is elderly.
*When you’re so fucked up that normality looks absurd*
F*ck communism, communists and their supporters.
Proud of Czechia for once but you would really have to be blind to think things didn’t improve.
Also our Communist Party for the first time since Velvet Revolution dropped out of Parliament two weeks ago. They got measly 3.5%. Hopefully, that’s the last we heard about them.
to compare the figures after the Second World War with the current complete nonsense. I’m just for objectivity.
Based Hungary