Why wait 10 to 15 years, they could be abolished nearly immediately
This is an interesting one. I really benefitted from my time in a single sex school and wouldn’t have been able to afford going private to attend one. It’s not like a same sex school option wasn’t available though I know that might not be the case I’m every town/village
I remember when I was in secondary school (a single sex one) that it was accepted that the single sex thing was on its way out, and that the school would eventually become mixed. It was mentioned quite a few times, basically any time there was a big political visit. Yet it hasn’t yet, nor does there seem to be any plans to bring that into effect.
I think it’s hard to justify gender segregating kids, and it’s pretty weird when you think about it. At the same time, as we see from the patrons issue, it’s hard to bring these changes about at the local level.
I’ve always found single sex schools bizarre, we live in a society where you literally have to be able to interact with men and women every day, so why would we think it’s a good idea to segregate kids entirely for 7/8 hours a day in their most formative years? It’s just such a strange concept.
I went to an all boys secondary school, I didn’t really know what the phrase meant at the time but “Toxic masculinity” is the best way to describe it.
Having both genders interacting with each other through developmental years would probably be a better situation surely.
I’d prefer them to actually get rid of prioritising religions for schools first. The law they brought in seems to do nothing if a school can claim they prioritise catholics to ‘preserve the ethos’ of the school.
Sounds about right….10 to 15 years to fit new toilets.
Can’t wait to send my kids on the new metro link to their mixed secondary school in 15 years and on the way back they can visit the new children’s hospital to pick up a prescription
From my experience the lads from an all boys school were mental.
I went to a mixed school and we had a lot less fighting going on amongst the boys because we would be busy trying talk to the girls, at this time fights from other local schools were always being passed around on phones. We maybe got 1 a year from our school. Purely anecdotal but the videos of fights were mostly from all boy schools.
Let’s be real, most of the boys from an all boys school arent gonna interact with the opposite sex that much especially if they don’t share the same space.
I’d say those lads have a harder time adjusting and talking to women in general, you can spot them in 1st year of any college course.
They adjust but it takes time and I think it’s bad for men growing up and definitely leads to a toxic viewpoint of women. Ya know stuff like they are only good for the ride etc.
I’ve heard of all girls schools being nasty too but I got no experience of what that was like.
Have newer studies been done, bc previous ones confirm that boys perform better in mixed schools but girls perform worse.
It was strange being with boys for the first two years of primary, then by first class they were all gone to the other local primary by first class. Then only seeing them again for religious occasions.
Never noticed any noteworthy difference between girls that attended an all-girls school and those that went to a mixed one but maybe that’s just ’cause I’m a lad . Definitely noticed the all-boys schools in my area produced a lot of meek, timid lads who struggled socially in general but especially with girls. Conversely also a lot of insufferable pricks, proper lads’ lads.
Personally I’d say keep the Church out of schools first, that’s more outdated in my opinion.
Finally.
I always heard single sex schools gave better education outcomes for girls and worse for boys when measured by results.
This is an interesting way of framing what seems like an improvement in standards for boys and a degradation of standards for girls.
There are presumably other benefits from not segregating kids but Im not sure how data driven they are. Anecdotally I was always shocked as a kid when there was any interaction with the nearby girls school on how well behaved the girls were compared to the boys. On the whole I intuitively guess its for the greater good but its not necessarily better for girls academic results.
Would be a good change.
Was terrible thinking back. 100 boys in my year in secondary school and almost all of us having zero contact with girls except for some of the townie guys.
Frustration is not a strong enough word and god help any semi-attractive female teacher we had, they got stared out of it like they were an alien landed on earth.
I went to a mixed junior and single sex secondary. I think it’s a good balance. While we had girlfriends at the end of the junior cycle, we focused more on friends, sport and school in the secondary. That said, that was before the internet (nevermind social media 🤣) and a lot of shit has changed since then
My girls have been too all girls from the beginning and retrospectively, they should have gone to a mixed in the junior cycle at least
Good. I was scared if boys in my Teens because I went to an all girl’s school
My unpopular opinion: single sex schools don’t seem to be that bad.
I’ve been to both a mixed secondary school and an all boys school (I moved schools after the Junior Cert). From my experience I don’t think the common arguments against single sex schools really held up.
The place wasn’t a circus as you’d think. There was a strong focus on academics. I don’t know what the statistics say in this regard, but I don’t believe that being surrounded by only members of your sex makes any difference on your academic performance, at the end of the day it’s you who decides wether or not to put in the effort.
Then there’s the argument that boys from all male schools grow up to become misogynistic womanisers who can’t socialise around women. Again, from my experience that’s equally false. Yeah, there was the occasional guy like that in the school, but the vast majority of them were perfectly respectful and “up to date” with how to be around girls.
In fact believe it or not, but many of the lads from the all boys school were actually *more* progressive and forward thinking than the ones I knew from the single sex school. This to me is one of the benefits of single sex schools- if there’s more people of your sex, you’re more likely to find your tribe and make true friends with people you really like. In my all male school there were all kinds of guys from all walks of life. Being “alternative” or “weird”, was accepted, even encouraged in some circles. There were extremely effeminate lads walking around with long dyed hair and painted nails skinny jeans, right beside the most over the top caricatures of GAA lads- and they both got on perfectly well with no bullying. I don’t think that would ever, ever have happened in even the most “tolerant” of single sex schools.
In fact I don’t think I recall a single instance of what could be called bullying during my whole time in the school. I don’t know if that’s an argument for keeping single sex schools but it certainly convinced me there’s more to them than meets the eye.
Most people it seems, have a kind of outdated and OTT stereotypical view of single sex schools that isn’t really true. Like the way you have people who think all private schools are like Eton when in reality there’s like five or six ones like that in all of Ireland and Britain.
This is all anecdotal. Maybe the statistics disagree with me. But I just want to say that single sex schools shouldn’t be dismissed, and that there’s more to them than meets the eye.
Why is everything 10-15 years away from being implemented
Why is every single timeline in Ireland on a glacial scale? When I lived in England plans like this were in 5 year terms.
Why does that take 15 years though? why the fuck cant Ireland just stop talking about doing stuff, and yknow, just fucking do it. why does everything take 15 years to do, and then not happen at all.
getting real sick of this “in a couple years” shite when Im allready taxed to fuck, what are you doing with all the fucking money!
The whole idea of the Irish patronage system is that local communities decide from themselves what they want. It shouldn’t be up for the Gov to decide is a new school is ET or VEC or single or coed, or Irish or English medium.
I feel like for girls who want to do well in their exams/studies it is best to go to an all girls school… I went to a mixed school and basically the whole day in leaving cert consisted of the majority of the boys being class clowns and causing havoc… and the teachers constantly giving out and sending them to the principals office… in contrast to the optional biology class I had where it was all girls who chose that subject apart from one boy.. the class was completely different and there was more of a work focus
I think if you choose to send your kids to single sex schools then there’s an onus on you to properly socialise your kids with the other gender. I went to an all boys primary and secondary school, but did music and drama with girls and I was fine. A lot of lads in my school didn’t interact with girls until they were shoved in next to them at the discos in 3rd year, and it showed.
I had a friend that went to a boys only Catholic school until his junior year. It went very well. Hi last two years it was co-Ed. He said having the girls there ruined it. The priests wouldn’t allow the sort of frank discussions that had previously been common, and the boys started acting like dicks as they tried to impress the girls.
Edit: “dicks” autocorrected to ducks, which is funnier, but not as accurate.
I don’t understand why we can’t just keep a choice. If you don’t agree with single sex schools don’t send your kids to one! Ultimately you should just listen to where your kids feel happiest
What about parents who want to continue sending their kids to single sex schools. Some might.
I’ve gone to both. All girls and a mixed school. To be honest there’s advantages to both. But from my experience girl’s health and fitness suffer in a mixed school.
If it’s all girls no one cares in PE how shit you are at sports. But in my mixed school instead of at least giving it a go the girls would come up with excuses to miss it or just stand off to the side and pretend they were above it all.
My all girls school focused on all their sports teams. My mixed school only had a boys team.
At the all girls school we played rounders outside on a sunny day, and basketball shoot outs inside when it rained. In the mixed school only boys played ball sports at break time.
Academically I did the same in both schools. Socially, having friends who were guys was definitely important for my development. But I did find the lack of sports available to me because I’m a girl in a mixed school really demoralising.
29 comments
Why wait 10 to 15 years, they could be abolished nearly immediately
This is an interesting one. I really benefitted from my time in a single sex school and wouldn’t have been able to afford going private to attend one. It’s not like a same sex school option wasn’t available though I know that might not be the case I’m every town/village
I remember when I was in secondary school (a single sex one) that it was accepted that the single sex thing was on its way out, and that the school would eventually become mixed. It was mentioned quite a few times, basically any time there was a big political visit. Yet it hasn’t yet, nor does there seem to be any plans to bring that into effect.
I think it’s hard to justify gender segregating kids, and it’s pretty weird when you think about it. At the same time, as we see from the patrons issue, it’s hard to bring these changes about at the local level.
I’ve always found single sex schools bizarre, we live in a society where you literally have to be able to interact with men and women every day, so why would we think it’s a good idea to segregate kids entirely for 7/8 hours a day in their most formative years? It’s just such a strange concept.
I went to an all boys secondary school, I didn’t really know what the phrase meant at the time but “Toxic masculinity” is the best way to describe it.
Having both genders interacting with each other through developmental years would probably be a better situation surely.
I’d prefer them to actually get rid of prioritising religions for schools first. The law they brought in seems to do nothing if a school can claim they prioritise catholics to ‘preserve the ethos’ of the school.
Sounds about right….10 to 15 years to fit new toilets.
Can’t wait to send my kids on the new metro link to their mixed secondary school in 15 years and on the way back they can visit the new children’s hospital to pick up a prescription
From my experience the lads from an all boys school were mental.
I went to a mixed school and we had a lot less fighting going on amongst the boys because we would be busy trying talk to the girls, at this time fights from other local schools were always being passed around on phones. We maybe got 1 a year from our school. Purely anecdotal but the videos of fights were mostly from all boy schools.
Let’s be real, most of the boys from an all boys school arent gonna interact with the opposite sex that much especially if they don’t share the same space.
I’d say those lads have a harder time adjusting and talking to women in general, you can spot them in 1st year of any college course.
They adjust but it takes time and I think it’s bad for men growing up and definitely leads to a toxic viewpoint of women. Ya know stuff like they are only good for the ride etc.
I’ve heard of all girls schools being nasty too but I got no experience of what that was like.
Have newer studies been done, bc previous ones confirm that boys perform better in mixed schools but girls perform worse.
It was strange being with boys for the first two years of primary, then by first class they were all gone to the other local primary by first class. Then only seeing them again for religious occasions.
Never noticed any noteworthy difference between girls that attended an all-girls school and those that went to a mixed one but maybe that’s just ’cause I’m a lad . Definitely noticed the all-boys schools in my area produced a lot of meek, timid lads who struggled socially in general but especially with girls. Conversely also a lot of insufferable pricks, proper lads’ lads.
Personally I’d say keep the Church out of schools first, that’s more outdated in my opinion.
Finally.
I always heard single sex schools gave better education outcomes for girls and worse for boys when measured by results.
This is an interesting way of framing what seems like an improvement in standards for boys and a degradation of standards for girls.
There are presumably other benefits from not segregating kids but Im not sure how data driven they are. Anecdotally I was always shocked as a kid when there was any interaction with the nearby girls school on how well behaved the girls were compared to the boys. On the whole I intuitively guess its for the greater good but its not necessarily better for girls academic results.
Would be a good change.
Was terrible thinking back. 100 boys in my year in secondary school and almost all of us having zero contact with girls except for some of the townie guys.
Frustration is not a strong enough word and god help any semi-attractive female teacher we had, they got stared out of it like they were an alien landed on earth.
I went to a mixed junior and single sex secondary. I think it’s a good balance. While we had girlfriends at the end of the junior cycle, we focused more on friends, sport and school in the secondary. That said, that was before the internet (nevermind social media 🤣) and a lot of shit has changed since then
My girls have been too all girls from the beginning and retrospectively, they should have gone to a mixed in the junior cycle at least
Good. I was scared if boys in my Teens because I went to an all girl’s school
My unpopular opinion: single sex schools don’t seem to be that bad.
I’ve been to both a mixed secondary school and an all boys school (I moved schools after the Junior Cert). From my experience I don’t think the common arguments against single sex schools really held up.
The place wasn’t a circus as you’d think. There was a strong focus on academics. I don’t know what the statistics say in this regard, but I don’t believe that being surrounded by only members of your sex makes any difference on your academic performance, at the end of the day it’s you who decides wether or not to put in the effort.
Then there’s the argument that boys from all male schools grow up to become misogynistic womanisers who can’t socialise around women. Again, from my experience that’s equally false. Yeah, there was the occasional guy like that in the school, but the vast majority of them were perfectly respectful and “up to date” with how to be around girls.
In fact believe it or not, but many of the lads from the all boys school were actually *more* progressive and forward thinking than the ones I knew from the single sex school. This to me is one of the benefits of single sex schools- if there’s more people of your sex, you’re more likely to find your tribe and make true friends with people you really like. In my all male school there were all kinds of guys from all walks of life. Being “alternative” or “weird”, was accepted, even encouraged in some circles. There were extremely effeminate lads walking around with long dyed hair and painted nails skinny jeans, right beside the most over the top caricatures of GAA lads- and they both got on perfectly well with no bullying. I don’t think that would ever, ever have happened in even the most “tolerant” of single sex schools.
In fact I don’t think I recall a single instance of what could be called bullying during my whole time in the school. I don’t know if that’s an argument for keeping single sex schools but it certainly convinced me there’s more to them than meets the eye.
Most people it seems, have a kind of outdated and OTT stereotypical view of single sex schools that isn’t really true. Like the way you have people who think all private schools are like Eton when in reality there’s like five or six ones like that in all of Ireland and Britain.
This is all anecdotal. Maybe the statistics disagree with me. But I just want to say that single sex schools shouldn’t be dismissed, and that there’s more to them than meets the eye.
Why is everything 10-15 years away from being implemented
Why is every single timeline in Ireland on a glacial scale? When I lived in England plans like this were in 5 year terms.
Why does that take 15 years though? why the fuck cant Ireland just stop talking about doing stuff, and yknow, just fucking do it. why does everything take 15 years to do, and then not happen at all.
getting real sick of this “in a couple years” shite when Im allready taxed to fuck, what are you doing with all the fucking money!
The whole idea of the Irish patronage system is that local communities decide from themselves what they want. It shouldn’t be up for the Gov to decide is a new school is ET or VEC or single or coed, or Irish or English medium.
I feel like for girls who want to do well in their exams/studies it is best to go to an all girls school… I went to a mixed school and basically the whole day in leaving cert consisted of the majority of the boys being class clowns and causing havoc… and the teachers constantly giving out and sending them to the principals office… in contrast to the optional biology class I had where it was all girls who chose that subject apart from one boy.. the class was completely different and there was more of a work focus
I think if you choose to send your kids to single sex schools then there’s an onus on you to properly socialise your kids with the other gender. I went to an all boys primary and secondary school, but did music and drama with girls and I was fine. A lot of lads in my school didn’t interact with girls until they were shoved in next to them at the discos in 3rd year, and it showed.
I had a friend that went to a boys only Catholic school until his junior year. It went very well. Hi last two years it was co-Ed. He said having the girls there ruined it. The priests wouldn’t allow the sort of frank discussions that had previously been common, and the boys started acting like dicks as they tried to impress the girls.
Edit: “dicks” autocorrected to ducks, which is funnier, but not as accurate.
I don’t understand why we can’t just keep a choice. If you don’t agree with single sex schools don’t send your kids to one! Ultimately you should just listen to where your kids feel happiest
What about parents who want to continue sending their kids to single sex schools. Some might.
I’ve gone to both. All girls and a mixed school. To be honest there’s advantages to both. But from my experience girl’s health and fitness suffer in a mixed school.
If it’s all girls no one cares in PE how shit you are at sports. But in my mixed school instead of at least giving it a go the girls would come up with excuses to miss it or just stand off to the side and pretend they were above it all.
My all girls school focused on all their sports teams. My mixed school only had a boys team.
At the all girls school we played rounders outside on a sunny day, and basketball shoot outs inside when it rained. In the mixed school only boys played ball sports at break time.
Academically I did the same in both schools. Socially, having friends who were guys was definitely important for my development. But I did find the lack of sports available to me because I’m a girl in a mixed school really demoralising.