Scholz’s call with Putin risks opening a ‘Pandora’s Box,’ Zelensky warns

https://kyivindependent.com/scholzs-call-with-putin-risks-opening-a-pandoras-box-zelensky-warns/

17 comments

  2. I would like to see a word for word transcript of the call.

  3. Zelensky nailed it here. Nobody in NATO should even be talking to Putin any longer. Talk to Ukraine and Putin talks to Ukraine.

    Russia went to the negotiation table with Ukraine’s right to have identities when the war first started. That’s how oppressive Putins regime is.

  4. Germans and being sellouts to Russia. Name a more iconic duo.

    At least the Poles have learned not to trust Russia.

  5. Less dialogue is always better between nuclear armed entities

  6. Schilz freaking out because the economy contraction is a 0.3% instead of a 0.1%.

    Well, also the U.S. is now a Russian asset, so that is definitely a worry.

  7. This Scholz guy just seems like an embarrassment. Too afraid to do anything useful. Or too stupid to

  10. It’s diplomacy. You won’t get anywhere without talking. Time to finally understand that for all who play a role here.

  11. Extending an olive branch for Putin? It’s going to be a tough year for Russia next year, they will have exhausted most of their remaining stockpiles by next summer according to some analysts. This looks like the EU trying to start dialogues for Russia off-ramping

  12. I mean, this is basically a civil war. It’s Russians fighting almost used to be russians.

  13. The only call Germany should be making is Putin’s grid coordinates to NATO snipers or artillery.

  14. God forbid we keep a certain level of dialog and discussions open with Putin in hopes we could find a way forward that could bring an end to this war through a diplomatic solution that doesn’t involve more Ukrainian blood being spilled.

  15. Correct me if I’m wrong but did we give them weapon systems that could technically fire into Moscow and really fuck up Russia but Biden essentially said that America was not going to give them the go-ahead to do these things because it would be an international disaster? If I was a Linsky and I knew that Trump was coming into office and that with his presidency we would essentially lose this war because help would no longer be coming but I had these tools to do a job right now.. I think the only choice from here is to rain hell down upon Moscow and inflict as much damage as possible before anything else occurs. If I’m going down I’m going down swinging

  16. Pandora’s box was opened by the election of Trump, and all the contained evils are now flying free – in other words, Putin has won the strategic game, and just like Trump, you ignore a winner at your peril

  17. I’ll just add the points made in “To Avoid Another Munich, Europe Must Act to Secure Ukraine”:

    **1. The inevitability of Russia prevailing is a myth.** Russia cannot sustain its war effort
    at current levels beyond 2025. For example, Russia is losing 260 heavy caliber
    cannon barrels (artillery and tank) per month and can produce only 20. Likewise,Russia is losing an average of 144 infantry fighting vehicles per month, yet can
    produce only 17. For these items of equipment, as with many others, Russia is
    scheduled to exhaust its stockpiles in the second half of 2025.

    **2. There is no credible plan for Ukrainian (or European) security after any ‘ceasefire’.**
    The Putin regime has demonstrated time and again that it is not a credible
    negotiating partner and that it cannot be trusted to keep to any ‘deal’ that it signs.
    Yet Ukraine’s route into NATO – the only truly credible security guarantee in the
    medium term – is blocked and there are no compelling alternative offers yet on the
    table. If this continues to be the case, a ceasefire only buys Russia time to
    reconstitute its forces, while European allies have not yet kicked their own
    production into gear, leaving us at a major disadvantage.

    **3. Failing to win endangers all European allies.**
    A ‘Minsk III’ (or Munich II) agreement, reached in full knowledge that it was the failure of Western willpower that obligated
    it, would neither guarantee Ukraine’s stability nor enhance the security of its
    European neighbours. To the contrary, demographic models suggest it would create
    a new refugee crisis in Europe and require uplifts of European defence spending
    well above any currently envisaged. It would also signal weakness and a lack of
    resolve that only invite coercion upon us.

    **4. The route to Ukrainian victory still exists.**
    This is well understood in defence ministries across European NATO states. Using new military technology we can
    quickly leverage Europe’s industrial capacity to build the capabilities Ukraine needs
    to disable Russia’s war machine. For example, building a massed precision strike
    force for Ukraine, with no external restrictions on its targeting, is within our grasp.
    To realise this goal, we must, however, strategically focus our support around a clear
    theory of victory.

    **5. Those who want to act, can.**
    The means to victory do not require sign-off at the
    level of the 32-country NATO alliance but can be provided by a coalition of willing
    powers, including all those committed to Ukraine’s recovery of its currently
    occupied territory and then to providing Kyiv with real security guarantees.[3] These
    are the countries that understand that our own security is dependent on defeating
    Russia in Ukraine and thus buying ourselves time to boost our deterrence. They
    understand that we still can, and must, act in the name of our security and freedom
    – and that if we do so in ways that change facts and policy on the ground, others will
    follow.

    https://www.democratic-strategy.net/_files/ugd/dcfff6_17f621993d194aeda9bb6c7cf7352dd6.pdf

    Here’s an excellent video interview about it on the youtube channel Silicon Curtain:
    [Benjamin Tallis – Lack of Leadership and Will in Europe Risks Another Munich and Defeat of Ukraine](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SrQDZSGW6-Q)

    Some of the signatories:

    Gen. (retd.) Michael V. Hayden, fmr. CIA and NSA Director
    Maj. Gen. (retd.) Mick Ryan AM, fmr. Commandant, Australian Defence College
    Larry Pfeiffer, fmr. CIA Chief of Staff
    Vice-Admiral (retd.) Didier Piaton, French Navy, fmr. Deputy Commander, NATO Maritime Command, current Assoc. Professor

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