Probably made the survey in the middle of a protest haha
I want to know the age group because I’m sure the majority who wants to go to war are the ones too old or lame to go to the Frontline anyway.
Guess I’m in the minority.
If we join nato or the eu army it’s the time imma start a guerrilla in the alps. We’ve been doing fine for centuries. I’d rather not kill the entire country just to suck up to the US a bit more
52% vs 39%??
Am I stupid or does that not add up at all? Lmao
Well, we need it if we’re no longer neutral.
Not me….
Are you guys going to make me hide out of ww3 in the third world?
russias attack on ukraine showed what happens to countries not in a military alliance. anyone who thinks neutrality will protect us in the future is delusional.
the only difference is that if we don’t appease nato/eu countries we won’t have anyone around us to supply weapons.
Cooperation in terms of exchanging information yes but not in terms of military actions and so on. Since 2009 the EU has its own assistance clause, which means if Switzerland will ever join EU, which I dont hope, we could be in war if an EU-member will be attacked. This is not compatible with our neutrality in my opinion.
Therefor I would support to raise our military budget to 2% of our GDP. With this it wouldnt make us look as we were relying on the help of our neighbours anyway in the event of a conflict. Would only be fair to our neighbours.
Not in my household! Where are they finding these people who want to nix neutrality here? I don’t know a single Swiss person in favor of that.
Bruh, chill tf out, i thought that we were too slow for this reactionary bullshit. Keep neutral motherfuckers
I just wonder… are a majority of Swiss people proud that we were neutral during WW2?
“Oh yeah, there was a guy who was systematically killing millions of people in concentration camps and trying to conquer the world, and then another group of countries trying to stop him. But I’m proud to say, we remained neutral and that was the good thing to do.”
I mean, I’m sure it was way more complex than this. I guess what I want to say is… neutrality is good but that doesn’t mean you have to be dumb just to hold to a principle of neutrality at all times.
At the moment, Switzerland is just a parasite of NATO.
It depends on their protection without contributing anything.
How do the 39% see the world? Do they think that Switzerland can fight off every potential enemy without EU help? Do they think, they could defend us against the EU? Are they not aware that Switzerland is extremely safe because it is surrounded by EU and mostly NATO states? Or do they know and just want to enjoy this safety without contributing to it?
What about the other 9%?
Seems I’m with the majority for once.
And it indeed should be mainly with the EU, not necessarily with NATO.
Polls do not necessarily translate well to actual votes. And the lax ‘closer military cooperation’ might mean lots of things. So, calm your tits, this doesn’t actually scream abandoning neutrality altogether.
I think there is a certain value Switzerland provides to the international community by remaining neutral. The EU and NATO enough military power as is. Not sure it’s worth giving up a neutral country in exchange for Swiss military.
Neutrality has served Switzerland and the European community well.
Minority here. Let’s go.
Is protecting the pope not enough? Do we want to go back to before we were forced to stay neutral because of our mercenaries? Historically i think we could argue both ways.
Sorry but first of all we need to define what “neutral” means.
Saying that Switzerland was neutral during WW (no mistake at all, there was only one World War), is way too simple. Switzerland never stopped trading with Germany: Switzerland sold technology and commodities and was paid in yellow hard cold gold (and now we know where it came from, don’t we?)
Well, IMHO this is far from being really neutral. Sure, Switzerland protected its interest (people, economy, etc.) but also helped German war efforts providing what they needed. Let’s just say it seems to me more like being Pontius Pilate…
Jumping to present day, Switzerland did not send any weapon (neither defensive ones) to Ucraine but also prevented Russia from using its financial system to bypass sanctions and finance the war. Well, this looks much more neutral to me.
Just to put it in a real prospective, can someone be really neutral when the war is just few hundreds kilometres from his house (and ICBMs can hit a target thousands of kilometres far)? Doing nothing in the name of (an imposed) neutrality is being neutral or hypocritical?
In my opinion, we’re no more in the XIX century and the concept itself of neutrality has no real sense in a world which is so deeply interconnected. Moreover, do we really think that a perfect neutrality (if it exists) can save us from the fallout of an atomic bomb exploding in one of our neighboring countries? On April 1st, 1944, 400 allied incendiary bombs hit Schaffhausen and, obviously, it was not their intention…
Today we have Putin and Russia and tomorrow there will be someone else (as history teaches) but, if Switzerland doesn’t ally with neighboring countries (with whose people shares blood, language, religion, culture, etc.) to protect itself, are we sure neutrality and a small army will be enough to assure peace, democracy and independence?
As an italian immigrant who first came for love (of my – at the time – fiancée) but moved ’cause felt in love for the country too, it’s my honest opinion that EU is often pointed out as an enemy even if it’s and will always be the first partner (perfect? No but it could be much worst). If comes the time – and I hope not – that USA, Russia, Cina, India or anybody else attacks Europe, Switzerland can just rely on the idea that close countries will be attacked first, will respond and, hopefully, will prevail, ’cause neutrality might not be enough to stop bombs, tanks or the will to conquer of next Putin. In this case, wouldn’t it be better to team up with those close countries that will be attacked first and build a common front?Does we (yes, i feel part of the country too) really have the option to be neutral or are we using neutrality as en excuse? (it’s not a rethorical question)
Well, if you read ’till here, you can roast me 🙂
‘online umfrage’, given this is an emotional topic in all the western world, i think we can not even imagine the amount of astroturfing havin took place in this ‘survey’
Switzerland is neutral because it can afford. There is little tactical value in war that justies an invasion of Switzerland (e.g. France vs Germany? Just pass through the belgian plains). Everyone is fine with the status quo. But let’s be honest is Switzerland truly neutral? For example, would the US had accepted a communist Switzerland during Cold War? The Hotz-Linder Agreement (https://hls-dhs-dss.ch/de/articles/048308/2006-11-17/) is not really something that a true neutral country would do. The truth is that Switzerland is a western-aligned country, obviously it keep a greater indepence than other western countries but that doesn’t mean it isn’t aligned.
I believe that there is nothing wrong with it. It is also beneficial for the west having a country that can be used for peace talks or for good offices (and also for other less transparent matters…)
Edit: fixed some errors
I will never figure out how this particular sub is so much more conservative than anything else on Reddit.
I’d like to see a more robust survey on this topic
What’s the point? Besides the source being extremely vague, what would be “closer military relations ” with the EU? Anyone believe our tanks and planes will do coordinated exercises with other countries? The only “relations” the EU can ask us is to contribute financially to the NATO’s coffers. They’ll ask for money.
Screw that.
Nein Danke! Lasst unser Militär unabhängig schlecht sein.
EU Military forces are so week, and so slow to take action. We cannot rely on them.
Question is what can we offer them in return and whether they like it otherwise we’ll just end up with a bad deal.
With the framework agreement being binned, I don’t see much room for military <-> economic bilateral stuff.
But time will tell I suppose.
Just be shure the people who voted also contribute in Military operations
Let’s put those Swiss Army knives to some actual use
33 comments
Probably made the survey in the middle of a protest haha
I want to know the age group because I’m sure the majority who wants to go to war are the ones too old or lame to go to the Frontline anyway.
Guess I’m in the minority.
If we join nato or the eu army it’s the time imma start a guerrilla in the alps. We’ve been doing fine for centuries. I’d rather not kill the entire country just to suck up to the US a bit more
52% vs 39%??
Am I stupid or does that not add up at all? Lmao
Well, we need it if we’re no longer neutral.
Not me….
Are you guys going to make me hide out of ww3 in the third world?
russias attack on ukraine showed what happens to countries not in a military alliance. anyone who thinks neutrality will protect us in the future is delusional.
the only difference is that if we don’t appease nato/eu countries we won’t have anyone around us to supply weapons.
Cooperation in terms of exchanging information yes but not in terms of military actions and so on. Since 2009 the EU has its own assistance clause, which means if Switzerland will ever join EU, which I dont hope, we could be in war if an EU-member will be attacked. This is not compatible with our neutrality in my opinion.
Therefor I would support to raise our military budget to 2% of our GDP. With this it wouldnt make us look as we were relying on the help of our neighbours anyway in the event of a conflict. Would only be fair to our neighbours.
Not in my household! Where are they finding these people who want to nix neutrality here? I don’t know a single Swiss person in favor of that.
Bruh, chill tf out, i thought that we were too slow for this reactionary bullshit. Keep neutral motherfuckers
I just wonder… are a majority of Swiss people proud that we were neutral during WW2?
“Oh yeah, there was a guy who was systematically killing millions of people in concentration camps and trying to conquer the world, and then another group of countries trying to stop him. But I’m proud to say, we remained neutral and that was the good thing to do.”
I mean, I’m sure it was way more complex than this. I guess what I want to say is… neutrality is good but that doesn’t mean you have to be dumb just to hold to a principle of neutrality at all times.
At the moment, Switzerland is just a parasite of NATO.
It depends on their protection without contributing anything.
How do the 39% see the world? Do they think that Switzerland can fight off every potential enemy without EU help? Do they think, they could defend us against the EU? Are they not aware that Switzerland is extremely safe because it is surrounded by EU and mostly NATO states? Or do they know and just want to enjoy this safety without contributing to it?
What about the other 9%?
Seems I’m with the majority for once.
And it indeed should be mainly with the EU, not necessarily with NATO.
Polls do not necessarily translate well to actual votes. And the lax ‘closer military cooperation’ might mean lots of things. So, calm your tits, this doesn’t actually scream abandoning neutrality altogether.
I think there is a certain value Switzerland provides to the international community by remaining neutral. The EU and NATO enough military power as is. Not sure it’s worth giving up a neutral country in exchange for Swiss military.
Neutrality has served Switzerland and the European community well.
Minority here. Let’s go.
Is protecting the pope not enough? Do we want to go back to before we were forced to stay neutral because of our mercenaries? Historically i think we could argue both ways.
Sorry but first of all we need to define what “neutral” means.
Saying that Switzerland was neutral during WW (no mistake at all, there was only one World War), is way too simple. Switzerland never stopped trading with Germany: Switzerland sold technology and commodities and was paid in yellow hard cold gold (and now we know where it came from, don’t we?)
Well, IMHO this is far from being really neutral. Sure, Switzerland protected its interest (people, economy, etc.) but also helped German war efforts providing what they needed. Let’s just say it seems to me more like being Pontius Pilate…
Jumping to present day, Switzerland did not send any weapon (neither defensive ones) to Ucraine but also prevented Russia from using its financial system to bypass sanctions and finance the war. Well, this looks much more neutral to me.
Just to put it in a real prospective, can someone be really neutral when the war is just few hundreds kilometres from his house (and ICBMs can hit a target thousands of kilometres far)? Doing nothing in the name of (an imposed) neutrality is being neutral or hypocritical?
In my opinion, we’re no more in the XIX century and the concept itself of neutrality has no real sense in a world which is so deeply interconnected. Moreover, do we really think that a perfect neutrality (if it exists) can save us from the fallout of an atomic bomb exploding in one of our neighboring countries? On April 1st, 1944, 400 allied incendiary bombs hit Schaffhausen and, obviously, it was not their intention…
Today we have Putin and Russia and tomorrow there will be someone else (as history teaches) but, if Switzerland doesn’t ally with neighboring countries (with whose people shares blood, language, religion, culture, etc.) to protect itself, are we sure neutrality and a small army will be enough to assure peace, democracy and independence?
As an italian immigrant who first came for love (of my – at the time – fiancée) but moved ’cause felt in love for the country too, it’s my honest opinion that EU is often pointed out as an enemy even if it’s and will always be the first partner (perfect? No but it could be much worst). If comes the time – and I hope not – that USA, Russia, Cina, India or anybody else attacks Europe, Switzerland can just rely on the idea that close countries will be attacked first, will respond and, hopefully, will prevail, ’cause neutrality might not be enough to stop bombs, tanks or the will to conquer of next Putin. In this case, wouldn’t it be better to team up with those close countries that will be attacked first and build a common front?Does we (yes, i feel part of the country too) really have the option to be neutral or are we using neutrality as en excuse? (it’s not a rethorical question)
Well, if you read ’till here, you can roast me 🙂
‘online umfrage’, given this is an emotional topic in all the western world, i think we can not even imagine the amount of astroturfing havin took place in this ‘survey’
Switzerland is neutral because it can afford. There is little tactical value in war that justies an invasion of Switzerland (e.g. France vs Germany? Just pass through the belgian plains). Everyone is fine with the status quo. But let’s be honest is Switzerland truly neutral? For example, would the US had accepted a communist Switzerland during Cold War? The Hotz-Linder Agreement (https://hls-dhs-dss.ch/de/articles/048308/2006-11-17/) is not really something that a true neutral country would do. The truth is that Switzerland is a western-aligned country, obviously it keep a greater indepence than other western countries but that doesn’t mean it isn’t aligned.
I believe that there is nothing wrong with it. It is also beneficial for the west having a country that can be used for peace talks or for good offices (and also for other less transparent matters…)
Edit: fixed some errors
I will never figure out how this particular sub is so much more conservative than anything else on Reddit.
I’d like to see a more robust survey on this topic
What’s the point? Besides the source being extremely vague, what would be “closer military relations ” with the EU? Anyone believe our tanks and planes will do coordinated exercises with other countries? The only “relations” the EU can ask us is to contribute financially to the NATO’s coffers. They’ll ask for money.
Screw that.
Nein Danke! Lasst unser Militär unabhängig schlecht sein.
EU Military forces are so week, and so slow to take action. We cannot rely on them.
Question is what can we offer them in return and whether they like it otherwise we’ll just end up with a bad deal.
With the framework agreement being binned, I don’t see much room for military <-> economic bilateral stuff.
But time will tell I suppose.
Just be shure the people who voted also contribute in Military operations
Let’s put those Swiss Army knives to some actual use
I wonder what recent events brought this on?