We don’t really have anything in common with baltics.
Asside from the language with Estonians.
And majority of foreign influence came from Sweden.
Yes but I wouldn’t call it greater fondness. It is just because of Finnish history. Finnish systems are very similar to Swedish ones and we share a long history and also minority language with them. Finland has been more of a passenger before 1900s being part of different empires. Baltics feel quite different probably because Soviet influence. Estonia of course shares more common language but even that is a false friend in many case as neither can understand each other without studying.
I don’t think there’s an actual preference, but the swedes definitely get pissed on much more.
Yes, we have more in common with them. A long shared history that has resulted in intertwined cultures.
Generally Estonian history is quite different to ours and they’ve received influences from both Germans, Scandinavians, Poles, and Russians. Language is the biggest common thing between us, though even that is not mutually intelligible
yes
Yes, I believe it’s mostly because we are geographically more similar to sweden. Also we have history and swedish is our second language.
The Finnish society is in many ways more like the other Nordic countries than the Baltics. The Nordics also have had close ties for a long time. But none of this is absolute. It’s Sweden and Estonia that generally tend to be the closest friends and allies for Finland.
Why “friends” vs “brothers”? Yes we speak a similar language to Estonian but we’ve had a different historical development for millennia. This is like saying that Portugal and Romania should have a special relationship because they both speak Romance languages. We were part of Sweden for 500 years at the least and this has informed our history and society much more than any Finno-Ugric tribal past before recorded history.
And I thought we were past the ethnic obsession.
Yes, definetly. We are a Nordic state and the decision to lean West has been concious. Baltic countries are associated with “Eastern Europe”, i.e. former Soviet Union countries and slavic culture.
Back in the early 2000s visiting Estonia felt pretty different coming from a Finnish and Swedish point of view. There were still Soviet buildings left and the service felt “Eastern European” meaning not very service minded.
Lithuania and Latvia are even further.
Personally i feel like its pretty much 50/50.
We have cultural history directly tied to Sweden. (Edit: But i honestly think that this is as far as it goes, otherwise culturally, i dont think we have more cultural similarities with sweden than we would have with Germany for instance).
We also have cultural similarities with baltic nations, when it comes to the historical events in the previous 100-150 years, and geopolitical climate like how the neighbour in the east has been trying to influence in multiple ways, i figure we have more in common with the baltic states.
So personally its hard to say, but if we considered the connections like a Venn Diagram, id say that finland sits where baltics and nordics intersect.
First of all, I do not really identify that strongly even with the Scandinavians, if it’s just about my own intrinsic feelings. However, “Nordism” as an ideology has seen a huge uptick in the past 10-15 years in public discourse so when you get told this all the time then I guess some people start taking it for granted. It’s typical Finnish single-narrative stuff, and our Fenno-Swedes are well placed to deliver their talking points.
History took different routes for Finns and Estonians so “institutionally” we share more with the Swedes than the Estonians. The Baltic Germans were much nastier masters than the Swedes, who just generally take the “everybody is equal as long as everybody is like us” route.
But I can’t help but feel an affinity to their almost-recognizable related language, the shared appreciation of the sauna (let’s not let the Scandinavians appropriate it in modern times) and that fact that in deep history, we’re ethnically related. I wish the guys south of the gulf all the best.
No. Estonians are our brother Finnic peoples and scandinavians are not nearly as much related germanic people, who did mix in some, but are not Finnic peoples like Estonians are.
However the culture is shaped more by scandinavians, because sweden conquered Finland at some point and forced their culture and language on us.
So culturally scandinavians are closer, but Estonian people are closer to us.
Seeing as my mothertongue is swedish and I don’t even speak finnish, it’s pretty self-explanatory why
Me as a Swede with the exception of the language has more in common with Finland then Norway/Denmark.
I would turn this question around, “has Swedes more in common with Finland then rest of fenno-scandia”.
Lifestyle , coffee, liquorice, Sauna , architecture and plenty of relations, fondess for logging, introverted social structure and rally/icehockey.
I agree. I feel more connection in a sense to Estonian people. Swedish people feel a little bit indifferent to me.
There is also this weird phenomena that when I visit Estonia, I can have a few beers, speak Finnish there and they can speak Estonian to me and we manage to communicate and do business together. Generally feel very welcomed there and warm interactions with the locals.
You can choose your friends but not your brothers.
If you have to choose, then yes. Finns as a country are closer to scandinavia than baltics. I like to think we are our own thing, unique nation in the area.
Ehhhh. I would think we see ourselves as bridge in between. Estonians are dear cousin (straight up genetically and ethnically closely related finno-ugric peoples). Where as Swedes are dear neighbors. Ethnically we are actually rather distant to Swedes, but we have a very very long half a millennia history with the Swedish realm.
Finland in general has a “bridge in between” identity from sitting and having been fought over by the Swedish Empire and the Russian Empire.
However on same very deep level I would think the fondness for Estonia is deeper. Since it’s lingual, genetic and unique. We can have lot of friendly neighbors, but Estonia is the only natiom talking closely related language.
However for long time in recent history there was more active relations with Sweden on business, economh, people immigrating and so on simply based on “Estonia was occupied by Soviet Union for half a century and Soviets restricted the access and activities with Estonians”. Finland straight up did diplomatic bargaining and smoozing with Kremlin over “heyy can Finns do tourist trips to Estonia and how many visas annually are alloted for that”.
However what I would say is certainly true is, that we are closer with Nordics compared to Latvia and Lithuania. As said Estonians have a special position as closely related Baltic-Finnic people.
As an out sider, I “and majority of outsiders” think of Sweden and Finland like siblings, much more closer than any other country!
Finland is connected to Sweden and Norway by land and has been part of that for hundreds of years. And share the same values.
I mean would you want to be together with your sister or your hot neighbour who you have some history with?
We don´t rate our family members. Sweden is our sister and Estonia our brother.
I thought the Finns and the Swedes had a longtime rivalry
Stockholm syndrome is real.
The meme is inaccurate though, even Estonians show more fondness for Scandinavians than their Baltic brothers.
I can’t speak for all the Finns, but I personally have more positive view on Swedes and identify with Scandinavian side closer than Estonian side.
It’s heavily colored by my personal exp in dating. My exp with Estonian men is similar to Russians; that they are alcoholic and violent when drinking, they have a family back home in Estonia (wife, kids) but have no problem sleeping with local Finnish women while working here.
Swedish men have been far more respectful in my experience, more safe and peaceful partners. They are similar to Finns in that sense.
This is anecdotal. I’m aware such scum exists in Finland and Sweden as well, and domestic violence in Finland is high because of substance abuse and mental health problems.
Until World War II, Finns and Estonians had a close relationship—so close that the Soviet Union saw it as a threat. During the Soviet occupation, Estonians were discouraged from moving to Karelia out of fear that ties between the two nations would strengthen again. Meanwhile, Soviet propaganda painted Estonians in a negative light to Finns, portraying them as lazy and unwilling to fight for their freedom.
For Estonians, the collapse of the Soviet Union was a dream come true. For Finland, however, it led to an economic crisis, as the country had relied heavily on trade with the USSR. Fortunately, there are strong signs that the era of Finlandization is coming to an end. The coming years will reveal whether Finland chooses to strengthen its ties with the East or not. However, the current wave of anti-American sentiment is deeply concerning.
Ests and Finns have been under the same ruler for 250 years since 1561. Together for thousands of years. Ridiculouly close and similar. Them speaking english to eachother is one of the biggest geopolitical catastrophes of our time.
Bara bada bastu
We’ve identified ourselves in the Nordic reference group for a long time, while we have had more contact with Estonians for a shorter time (=after Estonian’s independence). What I have noticed is when Finns know personally Estonian Estonians, quite many of us consider them more like brothers. Other Baltics and Russian Estonians are not quite the same, though other Baltics do share some similar cultural features. Funny thing is, even though we identify as Nordics, culturally (after Estonians) we are actually closer to the Dutch than Scandinavians.
Jes
I feel like countries and their relations is always related to power (money), at least at some level.
Finland was under the rule of Sweden for 600 years. The language of administration was Swedish for a long time. We still have to study Swedish.
On the other hand, there are no resources to study the Estonian language in most schools. Estonian is the closest language to Finnish – both of which are real anomalies within European languages.
I think the Swedish infulence can still be seen in our society when it comes to politics, ministries and other administrative practices.
I have not read many books about administration and society and even if I were, I couldn’t probably express my opinions clearly as my English is not at the level with the thinking class.
But, my argument is, that even though there are historical arguments to see Sweden our closest friend over Estonia, there are also pragmatic argunents to prefer Sweden over Estonia.
Estonia is poorer than Sweden. Estonia is smaller than Sweden. Estonia was occupied by the USSR.
When Estonia got their independence, the president of Finland didn’t recognize the independency of Estonia in the first place. Before Finland joined NATO, there were some pragmatic and selfish approaches towards Estonia and the Baltics, that Finland could just save itself if Putin decided to attack the Baltics. Some older politicians thought that Finland had some weird know-how when it comes to dealing with Russia.
So, historically and politically, Finland is probably closer to Sweden. Linguistically we are closer to Estonia. Some Finns want to identify with Sweden because they want to be in power and survive -an attitude that I find appalling.
Well we were Eastern-Sweden for almost 800 years, officially. Settlements and coexistence obviously happened for centuries before that.
Our culture and wider society is very similar to that of Swedes. Obviously there are small nuances and differences, but broadly speaking. Swedish is also Finland’s other official language along with Finnish.
Estonian of course is linguistically close to Finnish, and we have close ties to Estonia as well. But I think that their time under the Soviet Empire drove us adrift for a bit. Of course these days we’re really close with Estonia. But it’s still nothing similar to the ties we have with Sweden.
When it comes to Latvia and Lithuania, they’re our friends but there really aren’t any cultural or historic ties.
Depends where you are I think. The west side is really Swedish oriented but I’ve found that places like Helsinki is sometimes more baltic
Similar to Swedes showing greater “fondness” for their Finnish “friends” rather than their Austrian “brothers”
Neither. I identify as Nordic = Scandinavian + Finnish + Sami
I am pretty much under impression we identify closer as society to Scandinavian societies and regionally, but as population, important parts of culture (SAUNA), and in language we identify closest to Estonians.
I mean I do not differentiate that much between Estonians and Finnish, like close enough to be pretty much same people, Estonians are just ones who happen to be living in closest edge of Baltics. or something like that.
I always see estonians as cousins and swedes as siblings that kinda patronize me yano
What kind of Estonian created this post?
Depends on how nationalist you are, personally im taking my uralic brothers everyday over the scandinavians
It’s more like Baltic friends and Scandinavian brothers
41 comments
We don’t really have anything in common with baltics.
Asside from the language with Estonians.
And majority of foreign influence came from Sweden.
Yes but I wouldn’t call it greater fondness. It is just because of Finnish history. Finnish systems are very similar to Swedish ones and we share a long history and also minority language with them. Finland has been more of a passenger before 1900s being part of different empires. Baltics feel quite different probably because Soviet influence. Estonia of course shares more common language but even that is a false friend in many case as neither can understand each other without studying.
I don’t think there’s an actual preference, but the swedes definitely get pissed on much more.
Yes, we have more in common with them. A long shared history that has resulted in intertwined cultures.
Generally Estonian history is quite different to ours and they’ve received influences from both Germans, Scandinavians, Poles, and Russians. Language is the biggest common thing between us, though even that is not mutually intelligible
yes
Yes, I believe it’s mostly because we are geographically more similar to sweden. Also we have history and swedish is our second language.
The Finnish society is in many ways more like the other Nordic countries than the Baltics. The Nordics also have had close ties for a long time. But none of this is absolute. It’s Sweden and Estonia that generally tend to be the closest friends and allies for Finland.
Why “friends” vs “brothers”? Yes we speak a similar language to Estonian but we’ve had a different historical development for millennia. This is like saying that Portugal and Romania should have a special relationship because they both speak Romance languages. We were part of Sweden for 500 years at the least and this has informed our history and society much more than any Finno-Ugric tribal past before recorded history.
And I thought we were past the ethnic obsession.
Yes, definetly. We are a Nordic state and the decision to lean West has been concious. Baltic countries are associated with “Eastern Europe”, i.e. former Soviet Union countries and slavic culture.
Back in the early 2000s visiting Estonia felt pretty different coming from a Finnish and Swedish point of view. There were still Soviet buildings left and the service felt “Eastern European” meaning not very service minded.
Lithuania and Latvia are even further.
Personally i feel like its pretty much 50/50.
We have cultural history directly tied to Sweden. (Edit: But i honestly think that this is as far as it goes, otherwise culturally, i dont think we have more cultural similarities with sweden than we would have with Germany for instance).
We also have cultural similarities with baltic nations, when it comes to the historical events in the previous 100-150 years, and geopolitical climate like how the neighbour in the east has been trying to influence in multiple ways, i figure we have more in common with the baltic states.
So personally its hard to say, but if we considered the connections like a Venn Diagram, id say that finland sits where baltics and nordics intersect.
First of all, I do not really identify that strongly even with the Scandinavians, if it’s just about my own intrinsic feelings. However, “Nordism” as an ideology has seen a huge uptick in the past 10-15 years in public discourse so when you get told this all the time then I guess some people start taking it for granted. It’s typical Finnish single-narrative stuff, and our Fenno-Swedes are well placed to deliver their talking points.
History took different routes for Finns and Estonians so “institutionally” we share more with the Swedes than the Estonians. The Baltic Germans were much nastier masters than the Swedes, who just generally take the “everybody is equal as long as everybody is like us” route.
But I can’t help but feel an affinity to their almost-recognizable related language, the shared appreciation of the sauna (let’s not let the Scandinavians appropriate it in modern times) and that fact that in deep history, we’re ethnically related. I wish the guys south of the gulf all the best.
No. Estonians are our brother Finnic peoples and scandinavians are not nearly as much related germanic people, who did mix in some, but are not Finnic peoples like Estonians are.
However the culture is shaped more by scandinavians, because sweden conquered Finland at some point and forced their culture and language on us.
So culturally scandinavians are closer, but Estonian people are closer to us.
Seeing as my mothertongue is swedish and I don’t even speak finnish, it’s pretty self-explanatory why
Me as a Swede with the exception of the language has more in common with Finland then Norway/Denmark.
I would turn this question around, “has Swedes more in common with Finland then rest of fenno-scandia”.
Lifestyle , coffee, liquorice, Sauna , architecture and plenty of relations, fondess for logging, introverted social structure and rally/icehockey.
I agree. I feel more connection in a sense to Estonian people. Swedish people feel a little bit indifferent to me.
There is also this weird phenomena that when I visit Estonia, I can have a few beers, speak Finnish there and they can speak Estonian to me and we manage to communicate and do business together. Generally feel very welcomed there and warm interactions with the locals.
You can choose your friends but not your brothers.
If you have to choose, then yes. Finns as a country are closer to scandinavia than baltics. I like to think we are our own thing, unique nation in the area.
Ehhhh. I would think we see ourselves as bridge in between. Estonians are dear cousin (straight up genetically and ethnically closely related finno-ugric peoples). Where as Swedes are dear neighbors. Ethnically we are actually rather distant to Swedes, but we have a very very long half a millennia history with the Swedish realm.
Finland in general has a “bridge in between” identity from sitting and having been fought over by the Swedish Empire and the Russian Empire.
However on same very deep level I would think the fondness for Estonia is deeper. Since it’s lingual, genetic and unique. We can have lot of friendly neighbors, but Estonia is the only natiom talking closely related language.
However for long time in recent history there was more active relations with Sweden on business, economh, people immigrating and so on simply based on “Estonia was occupied by Soviet Union for half a century and Soviets restricted the access and activities with Estonians”. Finland straight up did diplomatic bargaining and smoozing with Kremlin over “heyy can Finns do tourist trips to Estonia and how many visas annually are alloted for that”.
However what I would say is certainly true is, that we are closer with Nordics compared to Latvia and Lithuania. As said Estonians have a special position as closely related Baltic-Finnic people.
As an out sider, I “and majority of outsiders” think of Sweden and Finland like siblings, much more closer than any other country!
Finland is connected to Sweden and Norway by land and has been part of that for hundreds of years. And share the same values.
I mean would you want to be together with your sister or your hot neighbour who you have some history with?
We don´t rate our family members. Sweden is our sister and Estonia our brother.
I thought the Finns and the Swedes had a longtime rivalry
Stockholm syndrome is real.
The meme is inaccurate though, even Estonians show more fondness for Scandinavians than their Baltic brothers.
I can’t speak for all the Finns, but I personally have more positive view on Swedes and identify with Scandinavian side closer than Estonian side.
It’s heavily colored by my personal exp in dating. My exp with Estonian men is similar to Russians; that they are alcoholic and violent when drinking, they have a family back home in Estonia (wife, kids) but have no problem sleeping with local Finnish women while working here.
Swedish men have been far more respectful in my experience, more safe and peaceful partners. They are similar to Finns in that sense.
This is anecdotal. I’m aware such scum exists in Finland and Sweden as well, and domestic violence in Finland is high because of substance abuse and mental health problems.
Until World War II, Finns and Estonians had a close relationship—so close that the Soviet Union saw it as a threat. During the Soviet occupation, Estonians were discouraged from moving to Karelia out of fear that ties between the two nations would strengthen again. Meanwhile, Soviet propaganda painted Estonians in a negative light to Finns, portraying them as lazy and unwilling to fight for their freedom.
For Estonians, the collapse of the Soviet Union was a dream come true. For Finland, however, it led to an economic crisis, as the country had relied heavily on trade with the USSR. Fortunately, there are strong signs that the era of Finlandization is coming to an end. The coming years will reveal whether Finland chooses to strengthen its ties with the East or not. However, the current wave of anti-American sentiment is deeply concerning.
Ests and Finns have been under the same ruler for 250 years since 1561. Together for thousands of years. Ridiculouly close and similar. Them speaking english to eachother is one of the biggest geopolitical catastrophes of our time.
Bara bada bastu
We’ve identified ourselves in the Nordic reference group for a long time, while we have had more contact with Estonians for a shorter time (=after Estonian’s independence). What I have noticed is when Finns know personally Estonian Estonians, quite many of us consider them more like brothers. Other Baltics and Russian Estonians are not quite the same, though other Baltics do share some similar cultural features. Funny thing is, even though we identify as Nordics, culturally (after Estonians) we are actually closer to the Dutch than Scandinavians.
Jes
I feel like countries and their relations is always related to power (money), at least at some level.
Finland was under the rule of Sweden for 600 years. The language of administration was Swedish for a long time. We still have to study Swedish.
On the other hand, there are no resources to study the Estonian language in most schools. Estonian is the closest language to Finnish – both of which are real anomalies within European languages.
I think the Swedish infulence can still be seen in our society when it comes to politics, ministries and other administrative practices.
I have not read many books about administration and society and even if I were, I couldn’t probably express my opinions clearly as my English is not at the level with the thinking class.
But, my argument is, that even though there are historical arguments to see Sweden our closest friend over Estonia, there are also pragmatic argunents to prefer Sweden over Estonia.
Estonia is poorer than Sweden. Estonia is smaller than Sweden. Estonia was occupied by the USSR.
When Estonia got their independence, the president of Finland didn’t recognize the independency of Estonia in the first place. Before Finland joined NATO, there were some pragmatic and selfish approaches towards Estonia and the Baltics, that Finland could just save itself if Putin decided to attack the Baltics. Some older politicians thought that Finland had some weird know-how when it comes to dealing with Russia.
So, historically and politically, Finland is probably closer to Sweden. Linguistically we are closer to Estonia. Some Finns want to identify with Sweden because they want to be in power and survive -an attitude that I find appalling.
Well we were Eastern-Sweden for almost 800 years, officially. Settlements and coexistence obviously happened for centuries before that.
Our culture and wider society is very similar to that of Swedes. Obviously there are small nuances and differences, but broadly speaking. Swedish is also Finland’s other official language along with Finnish.
Estonian of course is linguistically close to Finnish, and we have close ties to Estonia as well. But I think that their time under the Soviet Empire drove us adrift for a bit. Of course these days we’re really close with Estonia. But it’s still nothing similar to the ties we have with Sweden.
When it comes to Latvia and Lithuania, they’re our friends but there really aren’t any cultural or historic ties.
Depends where you are I think. The west side is really Swedish oriented but I’ve found that places like Helsinki is sometimes more baltic
Similar to Swedes showing greater “fondness” for their Finnish “friends” rather than their Austrian “brothers”
Neither. I identify as Nordic = Scandinavian + Finnish + Sami
I am pretty much under impression we identify closer as society to Scandinavian societies and regionally, but as population, important parts of culture (SAUNA), and in language we identify closest to Estonians.
I mean I do not differentiate that much between Estonians and Finnish, like close enough to be pretty much same people, Estonians are just ones who happen to be living in closest edge of Baltics. or something like that.
I always see estonians as cousins and swedes as siblings that kinda patronize me yano
What kind of Estonian created this post?
Depends on how nationalist you are, personally im taking my uralic brothers everyday over the scandinavians
It’s more like Baltic friends and Scandinavian brothers
Comments are closed.