The Meidas Touch vs. the Right-Wing Media Machine
It’s no secret that one of the things that propelled Donald Trump to victory in the last election was right-wing media. A potent combination of conservative cable podcasts and social media influencers. Now, progressive voices are trying to make sure that their footprint is as powerful and as big. The Myelis brothers have created the mightest touch network. That’s right. one of the few digital networks to crack the code, gaining millions of followers and even beating Joe Rogan to be the number one podcast on Apple Podcasts a few months back. So, I’m very excited to talk to them about what they’re doing and how they’re doing it. First of all, hello guys. Welcome to Next Question. Thank you so much. An exclusive the first time the three of you have done an in-person interview together, right? Absolutely. First time. Wow. I’m very I’m very honored and very flattered. And I wanted to ask a little bit about your life story. You all grew up on Long Island. You all had your own respective careers. Ben, what were you doing before you decided to embark on this venture? Well, I was a lawyer. I went to law school at Georgetown Law, was a civil rights lawyer, and I was working uh civil rights cases out in the Bakersfield, Fresno area, representing families who lost loved ones in police brutality cases. Wow. So, it was through that work that I ended up meeting Colin Kaepernick and Colin Kaepernick took an E for police brutality to bring attention to it and then from there the pandemic happened and the Midas touch network kind of sprung out of it. But my background was a lawyer. I think my parents were surprised when I went into podcasting, but I think they’re happy with it now. I’m sure they are. How about you, Brett? What were you doing? I was a film and TV. So, I moved out to Los Angeles to go to USC and I was in film school there, and then I graduated, freelanced for a bit, ended up uh working for the Ellen Degenerous Show, was an editor there, ran the digital department, post-production team over there. You guys were really early adapters for like digital content. And I remember Ellen doing such an incredible job. So you knew, gosh, a lot of people aren’t watching this show at home. We are going to make sure that everyone sees it online. And I got to give them a lot of credit and the producers there a lot of credit. They saw that incredibly early on. And what ended up happening was when I got there, there was a team of like five people. I was the new guy. There was like, you know, four or five other people. By the time I left there, you know, we had a team of, I don’t know, if you include, you know, kind of other staff kind of associated with it, probably more like 80 people there. And so I saw this entire division of digital blossom and I got to be there while it happened. And I never thought that editing and and helping to create videos that maybe about human interest stories and cat videos and whatever we were doing there would end up apply to making video political videos, but somehow I think it ended up uh being a great education actually in doing that. So I’m sure it did. Meanwhile, the baby Jordy, tell me what you were up to before you got involved in this marketing and advertising actually right here in New York. uh heart of time square, this agency called translation. Incredible agency. I like to say that they gave me my my PhD in new age marketing. Uh it was really awesome. It was a nimble operation over there. I think they had less than maybe 80 to 100 employees when I was there. And so you got to wear a lot of different hats. So from the creative department to strategy to account management, just kind of seeing campaigns taking them from the earliest stages of development and seeing the whole execution all the way through was really really cool. and seeing how they kind of used new age tech and social media to really emphasize and reach their audience in different ways. It was eye opening at the time. So you all your skill sets really complement each other. You all bring something different to the table. And so it’s the pandemic. You all are getting increasingly frustrated by what you’re watching unfold to say the least. And and and Ben, what was your aha moment like we have to do more? and and how did you all come together and say, “Let’s launch this new venture?” Well, you heard our backgrounds. We’re not political people. Missing from those backgrounds was stories of working in politics. We’re just people who were scared during the pandemic. We were nervous. We were worried about our families. We were worried about our friends. And we were sending each other text messages about what we were going through. And so we said, how do we translate those messages into, you know, we almost felt selfish if we didn’t bring what we were talking about to the public. So we just started saying, what if we wrote about this? What if we started a blog? What if we used Brett’s skills who could do videos and editing? What if we used Jord’s marketing skills? And just start telling people, here’s what we’re feeling. Here’s what we’re experiencing. You’re not alone. We’re a family. And here’s what we’re trying to do to help each other. So we start releasing a article, a video that Brett edits. Jordy helps coming up with some of the framing of it with his marketing skills. And it seemed to resonate because nobody had really seen a focus on these topics that really focused on the human experience as opposed to just kind of an overtly political side to it. So people had this kind of aha like I feel that way too. And once we started seeing that, the shock to us was like, wait a minute, no one else is really talking like that and and connecting in that way. And so we did it again and again and again. And from there it just kind of kept on growing. You know, a video did 100,000 views, then a million views, then 5 million views, and from there it kind of sprung up and a community started developing around it and the months progressed and we started seeing that this was actually having a real impact. And then you sort of broadened your aperture, if you will, and kind of started focusing on all kinds of things, not just obviously COVID and the vaccine or misinformation or how you were feeling and what was upsetting you, but the political spectrum in general, right, Brett? Yeah. No, 100%. You know, I I think we just, you know, we we were trying to share our lived experience with everybody out there. And so when we saw something was that we thought was crazy, we would just be like, “This isn’t this crazy, everybody? what we’re watching together like is it just us and like I think for a while we were all just looking at each other like I don’t understand like why is this being treated like this is normal especially it was during the time when you know Trump was saying there’s 15 cases going down to zero it’s never going to come to our shore it was just lie after lie after lie and I was like we were all like you know this is going to be bad right this is and then we just kept seeing you know all the kind of political ramifications stem from there I think that was a very kind of pivotal moment in shaping people’s beliefs and In addition to just co I think a lot of people at that point were sort of being siloed into different kind of groups at that point and there was a deep division that was kind of being uh kind of put into our society and people were kind of falling reinforced by their own self- selection or algorithmically reinforced and the fact that everybody was home and everybody was not speaking with each other and so as we developed people were mad too people were people were mad for all different reasons I mean people some people were mad that they had to you know be home some people were mad that you know why isn’t this why don’t they just take the vaccine why why don’t they respect my space there people were all mad at each other for all different reasons and so there were these communities developing and so community became an essential aspect to us more so than the politics of are you able to kind of assemble a community that’s based around kind of positivity and wanting to do the right thing rather than a lot of these sort of more malicious online communities that exist out there that seek to kind of sew division and and hatred. And during that time, there was definitely, you know, a lot of that. And so, as we built kind of Midas touch, the community aspect was almost more important than us saying, you know, here are our political beliefs and here are these political stances, but more like, hey, don’t you all want things to be normal? Like, can’t we see that this stuff is freaking nuts? And like, if we could all just rally around that, like maybe we could actually put those political differences aside in many ways. And so as we progressed, one of the things that we saw was that, you know, there were folks who may consider themselves, you know, as liberal as could be joining us. Then there were folks who consider themselves Republicans or former Republicans who were joining us, independents that like we we saw, you know, people coming to us for all sorts of reasons. Um, but at the end of the day, I think the core was people just wanting things to be like normal again and understanding that what we’re seeing then, and by the way, what we’re still seeing now is not normal. I was going to say, I mean, I wouldn’t necessarily say, and you could correct me if you disagree, that your content exudes positivity at this moment in time, and I feel like you have gone through various iterations. Jordy, during the Biden administration, were you guys a little more dormant? Uh, there were fewer things for people of a certain political persuasion, I think, to be outraged about. So, so did your growth really explode after the election of of Donald Trump the second time? No, I would say we saw our strongest growth period when President Biden was president during that during that era. Um, I think it’s a slight misconception about what we do that, you know, maybe like like just angry, you know, at the world or or anything like that. We really just try and bring folks facts and data and it’s sort of that approach that has led the community to grow. When you watch our videos, for example, you know, Ben will say a couple sentences. We’ll just say, “Play the clip.” Because playing the clip many times is way more effective than Ben explaining every little slight detail and maybe even giving his opinion in that second. If people would just take away the receipts from the videos, and we let them form their own opinion. You know, that’s where we’ve genuinely seen the most growth of the network and of the community because it speaks to really the values that that we care about. Um, we just want things to be normal. We just want people to, you know, live their lives and and be happy and be able to enjoy it without some, you know, lunatic screaming in their face uh every three seconds. And so I think we’ve seen tremendous growth during the Biden administration. And we continue to see growth right now as well. But again, I think people are always coming to us for the facts and for the data. And that’s what it’s allowed it to grow. I think because we’ve been there now for about five years, people shut off after the la a lot of people shut off after the last election and they were looking for fighters and they were looking for people to stand up to them. And I I hope we’ve always been authentic to those same values when we just started this out in 2020 as what we’re doing now. So as we were out there still fighting and I think people group of people lost a lot of hope after the this election. So they turned and they saw what we were doing and I think that also helped give them hope which allowed a lot more people to maybe notice what we were doing now. And also we were doing things on the digital realm that a lot of people are adopting now. I mean our YouTube strategy, our focus on simal casting videos and audio was just a different way to even kind of approach this space which also I think has been a bit kind of pioneering and we could talk about that later but that’s part of I think where we’re seeing and and we’re humble and grateful for it but some of the recognition is oh lots of people didn’t even know what we were talking about when we were saying simalcast right a year ago or more and now that’s the you the new lingo. You know, if if a Martian landed on Earth and you had to explain to him or her what the Midas Touch Network is in, you know, an elevator pitch, how would you do it? Who wants to take that? I mean, I mean, I think it’s a podcast that’s fueled by a community and the community, but it’s not just a p Well, podcasts, I guess, as we know, are video and audio, but it’s sort of you’re doing everything everywhere all at once, right? But sorry, the Martian interrupted you. Go on. No, you know, it’s it’s it’s the the the community is built on, you know, I think core values and principles and that’s what’s the success and what we’re trying to readjust everybody to remember is that polit the Martian’s going to I may have lost the Martian in my elevator speech right there, but I’ll give you my academic speech to the I’m assuming the Martians academic Well educated well educated Martian professor here’s a professor so got a PhD on Mars go on exactly but but I think politics has been uh gamified into you’re this team you’re that team you’re angry you’re angry yell at each other and the viewers left a little bit confused wait what’s what’s even the issue and they try to pick what team do I like based on the style of the fight and the style of the debate and who’s winning that fight and that’s the you know split screen cable news yell yell yell so we try to deconstruct that and we come with an opinion and a strong opinion but we try to root it in a trial lawyer approach here’s the evidence here’s the exhibit here’s why we feel this way agree with us don’t agree with us but here’s here’s what we’re grounded in so rather than have a 4minut segment of yelling with 30 seconds of the actual news we try to root it in 11 to 13 minutes of the facts with opinion, but it’s the facts that drive it. Well, I what I would say to The Martian, I would say that, but also one of the things I think you all do so effectively is connect the dots in this crazy fragmented media landscape. you know, with so much happening, particularly in the early days of the sec second Trump administration. I think what you do so artfully is you kind of connect, you know, you thread all these things. if an expert’s saying this and then uh Caroline Levit is saying that or someone you’re not a big fan Caroline and and you know you’re taking all these different things and you’re kind of helping people understand in aggregate what all these these moments mean is that that’s why that’s why you’re Katie Kirk you know is is that sort of is that sort of your goal you know it’s funny because we were speaking about this I think like just yesterday that there’s so much noise out there and you I think we all thought you know if we went back I don’t know even 10 years ago but probably more than that probably thought oh with the internet with digital media with all there’s going to be so much information people are going to be so well informed it’s it’s people are going to be smarter than ever they’re going to be on top of everything it’s going to be so clear to know what’s true and what’s fiction it’s clearly like the opposite at this point of what we’re seeing there’s such a deluge of information coming at people every single day. So, I think one of the things that we do try to do is is what you just hit at, which is how do we cut through that noise with a message that’s clear, that could resonate, that gets the truth across um in the midst of just all of this chaos that’s coming every single day. Certainly, that’s been ramped up since Trump’s second administration where I think part of their strategy is also to flood the zone. I mean, you think back to what Steve Bannon Yeah. You think back to what Bannon said in in 2016 or whenever he made that statement, flood the zone with with I don’t know if I’m allowed to say that. We we curse occasionally here and and and that’s definitely been their strategy this time around as well. Just do so much that it’s almost impossible for, you know, an average person to try to keep up with it. But we that’s one of the things we try to do is really center the conversation on you know these are the distractions these are the important issues these are the things that are actually going to affect you know you your family uh you know your friends your co-workers these are the things you really need to understand for sure and I think it you’re right I mean a combination of things is making it so difficult to to stay informed and a story that happened 4 days ago the country has moved on and it’s like hey whatever ever happened to the Associated Press getting kicked out of the White House press room? And you know what about all these right-wing media influencers who are now taking over seats that once belonged to legacy media? Do would you describe yourselves as journalists, curators, producers, or do you think there isn’t really a category for what you do? Jordy, you’re smiling. Go ahead. You know, I I’ve never thought of it like that. I I view us as concerned citizens. Uh first and foremost, we just want to get They’re building a media empire. Well, the funny thing about that is a Jordan, I don’t mean to No, go for it. When we do interview, we don’t do a lot of interviews about ourselves. Mhm. So we’re actually not that and I mean this sincerely reflective on like who we are because we center the network around the community and around the message to the people. So it is always you know interesting sometimes you know and lately we don’t do a lot of interviews but sometimes when we’re reflecting on like who we are and what does it mean but maybe just think about instead of you guys like as brothers sort of who is the Midas network right you know and I guess it’s a lot of things right yeah and it’s most importantly it’s been built on the community of people in America and frankly people around the world who are concerned about the human condition and experience. That’s how I would say it very, you know, very succinctly. But I think we are a media network. Um, we we run a media network filled with some of the best reporters out there. We have a great editorial team that breaks stories. You know, I consider what I do on a day-to-day basis. I’m reporting on the news. We break exclusives. We report on news that happens. And you know, we try to contextualize everything as best we can. That’s all I You know, I’m wondering I I it could you do what you do without legacy media? In other words, I know you use a lot of clips from MSNBC or Fox or CNN. You use reporting. Um, and then I think you make it understandable, as I said, you you callull from a lot of different sources and kind of give people the big picture, at least in a lot of the content I’m looking at. Um, you know, but but the big beef while legacy media gets trashed and everything is a lot of these content creators and even med digital media networks could not do what they do without, you know, with all due respect to the reporters you have, but with this vast array of of legacy media organizations that are covering the world who are interviewing Scott Galloway on CNN or doing something else with some other expert from you. You you might run a clip. So, I’m just curious how you feel about that. If legacy media poof went away, I don’t think you could do what you you’re doing. I don’t know. I mean, I think that I think that a lot of uh uh the things that we find are on social media. It’s what hearings on Capitol Hill. I was thinking about that, you know. So, I would say there’s maybe five to 7% of what we do is maybe commenting on an interview that’s on a cable news, legacy news network, but I don’t think that drives the network, even a small fraction. I mean, the majority of it is is people are out there saying things either on social media, on their own Tik Toks, on their own Instagrams, on their own ex accounts or whatever. They’re putting people are saying things on on Capitol Hill like Marjorie Taylor Green claiming that guy was flipping the bird. Did you I you guys I’m sure did a story. Yeah, we we we did that the deceptive photo where Representative Stanbury ended up showing the actual photo and then was that her who was holding it up behind Marjorie? It was Mar was Marjorie Taylor Green had the big poster board of the head of USA Fencing, right? why they brought in USA fencing even though they received no federal funding is because there was a Fox story saying that there was a transgender fencer. So the whole conspiracy is is that they wanted to punch down on a marginalized community using the fencing guy. So they showed a photo of the head of USA fencing in a Doge committee and he had a peace sign or he had two fingers up and they edited out to look like he was giving the camera the middle finger and they said look he’s giving you all the middle finger and then Congresswoman Stanbury said no let me show you what the photo is you know it’s actually a peace sign that was so crazy remember and Marjorie Taylor Green just hitting see but that’s the kind of thing like to to me I don’t care what your politics are like that’s not okay, you know, and and we should all be able to acknowledge that that’s not okay at the end of the day to to do that kind of deception and to try to punch down at people like that. And so I think that’s at the heart of, you know, a lot of what we’re trying to trying to get across here. But you know I think one of the other great examples too and you know I think Legacy Media certainly plays you know a tremendous role and I think there are some you know excellent reporters out there who do a really you know terrific job and I you know I commend their work you know especially the reporters who are out there in these war zones and reporting on these international stories. You know I I have so much respect for um the stuff they do but I I will say also you know the a lot of the bread and butter of what we’ve done especially throughout the past few years also is looking to like the firsthand documentation ourselves. And so I think one of the great examples and one one of the reasons I think Ben is so good at at what he does is with his you know background as an attorney. One of the things that we do is we’ll go through court filings for example and so during all the various court cases over the past few years and even everything that’s happening in the courts right now because you know there’s a whole lot of legal uh stuff happening right now in the various courts very busy. Yeah. Oh yeah. We started a whole new channel, legal AF channel because we had so many legal stories, right? And so we so we have a whole channel now specifically dedicated to the legal. Um but on those the attorneys are going through the source documents, the fi the court filings, you know, this judge said this, their argument is this, they’re analyzing it. Um and and so I think that is at the heart of it. And I think one of the things our format allows us to do that may not be as uh conducive to a 24-hour news format or a kind of a a TV news format is we could go there and we could sit there and we could say pull up the filing. We could read an eight-page filing and our audience likes that. It probably doesn’t make good TV, but our audience likes us going through. Okay, now let’s look at the footnote on page three and let’s go to the paragraph on page and they like Ben. Probably turn the channel at that point. But our audience, you know, likes that because they like seeing what’s actually being said. And I think sometimes it’s the most revealing rather than, you know, you hearing what I have to say about this topic. Let me tell you what the judge actually said here. Let me tell you what they’re what the Trump administration’s argument actually is here and then you be the judge of of what the truth is. So, fair enough. You guys do a ton of original reporting and not just on on clips, but uh that you see on cable news. In fact, I thought it was funny. I know that you hired this guy and he is sort of like how how can I explain him? He’s sort of like the truffle. Yes. The the the truffle sniffing sniffing dog who can figure out like what is going to be the big story and kind of does clip. And I I read one of you said something like he he’s so undervalued as the best cable news producer in the business because in a way you all are setting the agenda for at least more progressive cable news networks and I would imagine even more conservative ones that are often reacting to more more uh progressive ones. Right. Well, one of the things that we notice and it’s it’s a funny thing to see is that you know as who’s one of the most brilliant people on the planet. Yeah. I might have to hire as away. He truly is a savant when you see what he does with like the eight screens and he sits there for like 18 hours a day like mentally ill. Yeah. And let me just say he’s ours. You can’t have him. But but he he goes he goes through you know the clips all day long. And you know he’s got an eye for it. And I think it’s something you do need an eye for, right? What out of all the things that are said during these congressional hearings, for example, or on the floor of the House, whatever it is on cable news, there’s a lot of stuff that isn’t uh newsworthy, that isn’t exciting. But for you to be able to capture, contextualize, and and 99% of the time, he’s literally just putting the captions of what people are saying when he puts out these clips. But to pick those moments that are the moments that you know he knows will be important for people to see. I think that’s a real skill and a real talent. And one of the interesting things that we see is he’ll do that throughout the day and then coincidentally you know on the prime time suddenly talking about yeah you go watch another lawyer right then whether it’s MSNBC or Fox you know they’re playing those same clips. They have a different perspective on the clips but but they’re playing those same clips that pulled earlier in the day. I don’t think that’s any accident. I think, you know, it’s just how people are consuming media and it’s not just us, but it’s cable news producers as well are seeing what happens in Congress, not because, you know, these hosts are sitting there watching, you know, the hearings all day, but because they see what people are speaking about online and often times that originates with our our team. So interesting. You talk about your values. You know, you describe the trans community as a marginalized community. I couldn’t agree with you more. I think our values are probably aligned. Um but but clearly you guys are left of center. Is that fair? Yeah. You know, it’s funny. I just I think that’s certainly fair. you know, in the kind of traditional political spectrum. I mean, if you’re thinking about issues that you all care about and believe in, maybe you can describe some of those issues like we all grew up, you know, not that we grew up, you know, we didn’t grow up political, but like we’re we’re all, you know, Democrats and we all had, you know, had, you know, beliefs that go in that, but we don’t we really don’t view everything like through necessarily a political end like in that way. We don’t necessarily view ourselves as like like I don’t care what the Democratic party does, you know? I don’t care about their internal squabbbling. I don’t care, you know, like to me, we’re just doing our thing and if we we have our values and if people want to meet us at our values, that’s kind of all we care about. So, what are your values? Look, I think people should get uh for a hard day’s work or just working, they should get paid with dignity. I think Americans should be able to be able to afford homes. I don’t believe Americans should be living paycheck to paycheck if they’re working. I think that’s a form of psychological torture. I believe that Americans should all be have access to health care. It should be very affordable or free for Americans. I believe Americans should have access to education which should be affordable or free to Americans. I believe in equality. I don’t believe that marginalized communities should have to wake up and be scared how they’re going to be treated in a given day. I don’t believe that people should be bullying marginalized communities. I believe diversity and equality is a strength and equity is a strength. And I don’t think that the lesson from this past election should be running away from that. It should be standing up for it and being strong and standing up for it and showing actual convictions. I think a lot of marginalized communities see fair weather supporters who are with them when it seems cool and then abandon them when the seasons change. And I think they see that a lot in how the media portrays them, how corporations portray them. Oh, everyone’s with DEI now and everyone’s not with DEI now. I think that’s I think you got to stand with people and be who you are. And that’s ultimately is the right thing to do. But I think that’s also what ultimately will win elections, too, because if you’re really care, if you’re really fighting for people, they’ll recognize that. And I think when they see that you’re wavering, they don’t even know if you’re a real ally or not an ally. And I imagine working with and representing Colin Kaepernick was very transformative. I maybe not transformative, maybe that’s not the right word. For sure. It was in terms of how you view things like Black Lives Matter and uh some of the things that that Colin did and as we were talking about racial equality and DEI issues and um gosh we’ve seen so many so much of that progress reversed. How do you feel about reproductive rights? Well, the first Colin just on the Colin side, nobody wanted to work with us at first when I started representing Colin. Remember that Colin was one of the first people, if not the first person Trump targeted, get that sob off the field. Colin lost his job. No one would do deals with us. No one did business with us. And Colin and I were working together then. Then all of a sudden everybody wanted to work with us because Colin fought. People perceived what what everything was as Colin won. He stood up. Everybody was with us. And then then people leave. And then they’re no longer oh we we can’t do you know all these corporations, all these groups, everybody who wanted to invest get scared, right? And they were all said they were all talking about diversity initiative, chief diversity off, you know, all those things. then they get rid of them. So if you look at that, you think who who has my back? And I think you need to h as a leader setting aside are you center left? Are you left left? Are you left left? You just as a leader have to say I have your back and I’ve always had your back. I’m the person who was marching with you in Bakersfield on the streets. Whether you were a Democrat or Republican, if you lost a loved one, I was with you and I was fighting for you. And I’m the civil rights lawyer who was fighting for you, I was the person there. We we have your back. And I think that authenticity is what’s most important beyond, you know, how how do you describe yourself? As it relates to reproductive rights, we feel strongly that reproductive rights, it’s a woman’s decision. We as men get the hell out of it. It’s it’s it’s it’s not it’s not for me to even think for a moment that I should be in any way controlling, lecturing, talking, having anything at all to intrude in the conversation, you know, here, you know, and and so for us, women’s reproductive rights that is sacroen to the woman, men stay the hell out. So, you I think are antithetical to the current sort of right-wing media ecosystem. And I want to read a quote from this guy named Michael Tamasi who was who is uh the editor of the New Republic. I interviewed him a few days after the election. And I asked him about his essay about why Trump won. And when exploring why he did, Tamaski wrote, “The answer is the right-wing media. Today, the right-wing media, Fox News and the entire news corp, Newsmax, One American News Network, the Sinclair network of radio and TV stations and newspapers, iHeart Media, not all of iHeart Media, formerly their channel, the Bot Radio Network, Christian Radio, Elon Musk X, the huge podcast like Joe Rogan, and much more sets the news agenda in this country. He repeated that in the next paragraph. Sets the news agenda in this country. and they fed their audiences a diet of slanted and distorted information that made it possible for Trump to win. Before I ask you about how this informed your decision to move forward with the Midas Network, I’m I’d love to hear your take on why you think and maybe Jordy as a marketing person, you have something interesting to say about this. Why has right-wing media been so incredibly effective? Yep. I think when you go down that list, the Fox Newses, the Roans, and you keep going down and down, you mentioned the so-called Manosphere and all those dudes, right? And there’s one thing that that’s really standing out to me every time you go down through one of those lists is who they funded by billion like these billionaire billionaire Elon Musk billionaire, Fox News, Murdoch billionaire. you go into the Rogan sphere. I I don’t know his what whatnot, but but it’s it’s heavy funding, heavy funding and influence that then just trickles down into that quote unquote manosphere. And so once you get hit with, you know, the Fox News clips, it’s an ecosystem that all feeds into itself and then the algorithm takes it on your social network. So you really can’t escape it. Like it it’s it’s consuming in such a way that it’s almost unavoidable. Here’s the thing. Sorry, Brent. I got say one thing. Go ahead. People are suffering. People feel pained right now. And people want answers about why they feel pain. They can’t afford a home. And they’re seeing rich people with 10 jets and mansions and they can’t afford a home. They don’t know if they’re going to be able to. You have to We have to listen to people and what they’re saying. Democrats people polit people are actually saying to you people are suffering out there and I think that they’re getting easy answers from right-wing media about where their suffering is coming from. They’re being told the immigrants are doing it to you. They’re eating your cats and your dogs. And that sounds stupid to a lot of people, but they people want an easy answer about why they’re feeling pain. And when you can blame a marginalized community as they’re doing it, they’re doing it. And then somebody comes in and says, “I’m going to make you rich. I’m going to make you the richest person ever, just like me. You’re going to be so rich, you’re not even going to know what to do with how rich you are.” That message resonates with people who are suffering. It’s built on fraud. But you combine the lies with a right-wing media network giving you a simple answer and that connects with people. Now, how do you combat it? You have to combat it by pointing out that that’s a lie and that’s a fraud. But you also have to provide solutions and you have to speak to people’s real human condition. You have to look somebody in the eye and you have to say to them, “I hear you. I listen to you. I understand what you’re going through.” And that’s what, you know, we we could talk about the podcast bros, the media ecosystem, but ultimately whether this massive funding machine, they’re pumping easy answers by scapegoating the other and making people understand, oh, that’s why I’m going through this. And that’s not why they’re going through this. are going through this because people like Trump and other people are the ones doing it to them, inflicting that’s what’s causing it and they’ve managed to the people who are causing it has managed to convince the people they’re inflicting the pain on that they’re helping them and they’re not. And so the antidote to that is also simple messages. I was saying messaging is so important, isn’t it, Ben? because it seems to me there is sort of an orchestrated effort to keep it simple but also to have it kind of almost echoing throughout the whole ecosystem, right? In a in a way that is just much more effective. You know, I think also people think uh that that people are paying attention to every little thing and they’re just hearing sort of this this orchestrated effort. I’m not really making sense right now, but I think like lot most people aren’t like us like reading everything or like your guy who’s watching eight screens, right? By the way, it is coordinated and you know that those people you mentioned, they do work together. You know, I I’m sure and I’ve seen certainly evidence of it. There’s been stories about it as well that there are signal chats and iMessage chats and various things where they talk about the Roger Als used to do that every morning on Fox News and they all distribute a memo with talking points that every anchor had to adhere to. One of the things that we noticed early on, and I feel like we were ridden off for it a lot, is that those conversations were starting on the internet, and they would then permeate to legacy media. They would then get to people’s Facebook feeds. They would then get into the conversations that people are having with one another. But you wonder, where does this cats and dogs rumor, where does that even begin from? And you could trace stuff like that back to an internet post, back to a tweet that went viral that people spoke about. And so oftentimes because everything is so fragmented right now, you don’t actually know where that information even started from. What was the kind of match that ignited it? But oftentimes these conversations are beginning in these spaces and then they kind of become more mainstream and in many cases now make their way to the president of the United States who lives in these spaces as well. Um, but I think, you know, I I think it’s a bit nefarious kind of how it operates in a way. And I think folks have learned, in my opinion, a lot of the wrong lessons from the election. And by nefarious, I I I I mean I I think people think like these people were created in a lab that, you know, the Manosphere podcast that these people were created in a lab designed to spread propaganda and spread certain lies. But to me that’s not what it is. I think the these a lot of these shows did begin organically and they had audiences and they connected with people through typical you know life things or whether it’s you know ultimate fighting or or weightlifting or um you know discussing uh a pop culture trial or you know whatever it may be something that doesn’t necessarily seem political but once they have you in they could then use that space to send people down these other rabbit holes that I think could um you know kind of a bit more dangerous I think in that way. So it’s like a lifestyle lifestyle podcast that that sort of morphs into they suck people in then they say okay now that I got you have you considered that the vaccine might be hurting you you know like once they get you heard of ivormect yeah have you heard of yeah and and then all of a sudden you start getting put down this path. You know I read an interesting article a few years ago at this point. I think it was in the New York Times and it was about how the the Epoch Times, the Epic Times, uh is uh they were I signed up for that once and I tried to because I I always like to hear what everybody’s saying and how stories are being framed. The Isn’t it called Epoch? Epoch Epic. Yeah, I don’t know. But anyway, it’s like it’s like from China or something. Someone will correct me in the comments and know and I was like, “Oh my god, these people are insane. Stop.” And they kept sending me stuff. Finally, they stopped. And so in this New York Times piece, they analyzed how they pulled people in with viral videos of cats and dogs. And they would promote on Facebook videos of cute cat videos and cute dog videos. And so they would get people to engage with their content because they thought that they were engaging. Oh, look at this cute cat who’s on a skateboard or, you know, whatever it is. Next thing they know, they’re being pushed, you know, Fouchy needs to go to prison on all this crazy stuff. And it all started because they watched this video of a of a dog on a Roomba or something, you know, and and so that’s what I mean by nefarious, that people could get pulled in with things that seem benign or seem like they’re, you know, things that relate to their interests. Next thing they know, they’re taken down this algorithmic hell hole. Um, and that they really can’t escape from once they’re in. And so I think that’s one of the kind of dangerous spaces that we’re in right now. also is, you know, social media is going to continue to push stuff at you that you engage with and then it thinks you want to see and once you do a few clicks sometimes people get lost in these algorithms and and it just takes it consumes their life and they just kind of lose a grip on you know a little bit of normaly and kind of even respect for other people or humanity and I think that’s kind of one of the dangers that we’re facing right now programs you to have this visceral reaction to anything that is different than your point of view. Yeah. Right. Um and and I know that you all say the the talking point or the conventional wisd wisdom is like the left needs a Joe Rogan. They need their Joe Rogan. And I know you have all said that that’s the wrong way to look at it. But clearly to deal with this ecosystem that is so powerful uh different points of view or even truth right needs to have a more potent platform. So, how do you think different views or truth and everything that’s going on with the Trump administration gets out there and explained to people and do you worry that you’re kind of preaching to the choir? I know I just asked like 12 questions in one, but how do you do that? Well, on the preaching to the choir, I always ask this question when people when I I ask about Fox and I said, ‘Do you think that Fox News is preaching to the choir? I say, raise your hand if you think Fox News preaches to the choir. And usually in my group, everybody uh raises their hand and says, “Of course, they’re preaching to a right-wing choir.” I go, “Do you think Fox is one of the more powerful forces in politics in general?” Okay, so they’re preaching to the choir. You don’t view that as a negative. Right. Right. Okay. Well, what if your choir uh just needs to sing louder than the other choir? What if you just need a choir to begin with? What if your choir doesn’t believe you’re a good conductor? You should first be a good conductor of your own choir. This is going back to what I said before. And ensure that your choir knows that you’re actually their conductor and that you’re fighting for your choir. So, I think that whether you want to say it as the Democrats or whoever, I think that one of the problems has been that the choir needed to be preached to a little bit from an authentic position and saying, “We’re here with you. We’re fighting for you.” And then you can start to build and grow because I think other people start to see, wait a minute, that makes sense. Your choir needed a church to go to. They needed a place basically, right? you know, and and and to me, when you’re building, do you want to model that on a choir built upon values that you don’t think are helpful? And this is goes to your Rogan question. I’m going to tie it all together, you know, but you know, but do do you want to then say we should be like that? Well, you’re going to start losing people in your choir if you’re saying I want to start acting that way because then they’re going to go, well, what do you mean? I don’t like the way they’re treating marginalized. I don’t like the way they’re bullying. I don’t like the way that they’re making a mockery of women. I don’t like that. So why do you want to be like that? That Huh? No. I think that they just want to see you say this is what I believe in. I give you an example. Andy Basher, governor of Kentucky. I just interviewed him on Friday. That’s great. Right. Oh my god, he is. I mean, talk about wholesome and all American. He is like out of central casting. It was like Andy Basher rush chairman 100%. Democratic governor 68% approval rate in Kentucky. 68 in Kentucky. He doesn’t say I’m not for LGBTQ rights. He says the opposite. He vetos any bill that comes his way that’s anti-LGBTQ. And he then he does a press conference and he’ll say this is why I’m vetoing it. We need to treat all human beings with respect. and they respect him in Kentucky for doing that. So to me, if he can do that in Kentucky, we should be able to do that everywhere else. And to me, that’s a great example. I was so impressed in the interview I did with him where he conveyed, you know, that message to me. So there there’s that. And then there’s what Senator Bernie Sanders said to me, which is that the most important issues are sometimes the least discussed. And that’s true. you know, people aren’t talking about the issues that actually impact us the most. Whether that’s housing, whether that’s healthcare, whether it’s education, whether it’s, you know, living paycheck to paycheck, and all of these issues are not being discussed. So, we should discuss them. So, to me, in terms of building what our version of what’s going on on the other side should be, I think it’s obvious. We should make sure our choir sings louder and we should be focusing on the issues that actually occupy a lot of the mental space in Americans minds but are filled with conspiracies and we should fill it with the truth and solutions and and how what is the reaction among say people who are more conservative you know because everyone’s all over the place and you see like workingclass folks who supported Donald Trump but if you’re tackling the issues they care about do Do you find that they are gravitating toward your platform? Yeah. I mean, look, or not. I think I’ll say this, whether they’re gravitating or not gravitating, I’m confident that the views and values I I stand behind them. I stand on business and I stand behind them and I’m confident that that’s the approach. Um that will, you know, I’m not trying to chase people and beg them to be good people. I’m simply want to let them know that here’s a place where we feel very strongly about these things. There’s a massive community now of millions of people who watch this. Join it if you want to join it. Don’t join it if you don’t want to join it. But we are we are here and we’re standing and struggle what we believe in. So I I don’t I don’t it may sound I don’t occupy myself so much thinking about you know I’m really hoping that I’ve just changed you know you know Mr. Maga’s mind and and made him into a Mr. Midas. Like I I if if if they want to live in their rage algorithm mightest mighty. Yeah. If they want if they want to live in their Midas mighty the best. you know, if they want to live in their rage algorithm, then that’s where they could live, you know, and and and and but they should know that there’s other places where we’re going to talk about the issues in an impactful, logical, smart way, and then we’re going to layer that with some positivity, do you think? Do you feel that that you that this whole kind of opposite views of, you know, the foxes of the world are in aggregate gaining traction? You have for example Pod Save America, you have Courier Newsroom. You have a lot of these digital companies, networks, honestly. I know you call yourself a network, but they’re networks, too, kind of rising up and and and creating a force field that is, you know, bumping up against this other huge ecosystem. Did that make sense? It does. And I I just gave you the data quickly, you know, from our our network. 350 million or so YouTube views every single month. I’m very jealous. So that’s more so that’s more we’re all like what’s going on, right? But that’s more on a day-to-day basis on digital. And I think we all agree things are moving digital. So the cable news digital, right? So there forever. I was like, what is wrong with you people? But anyway, so on that platform, the Midas Touch Network, on a day-to-day basis, and some days Fox beats us, but on a day-to-day basis, we’ll get more views than Fox on YouTube. Um, and then CNN, MSNBC, and all the rest, Midas Touch Network, will beat those. We’re the fastest growing Substack right now of all Substacks out there. Substack after Memorial Day to every Substack. Not that we’re all such good friends. Exactly. Exactly. And then um you know across and then on the podcast downloads themselves uh the Jordy showed me the data today. So in the last month the Midas Touch Network beat Rogan, Tucker Carlson, Candace Owens, Charlie Kirk and Ben Shapiro all combined for the month of for the last month as they do in sority. So in terms of in terms of growth, you know, I think that that, you know, that shows that there is an appetite for this out there. And I think that, you know, we we got to preach to that choir, you know, and and expand it. But let’s start also with fortifying the choir and let them know we care about them. Yeah. I I’m I’m curious uh because I’ve struggled with this as someone who you grew up watching, I’m sure, and it started in very traditional mainstream media. Um now pointing out the facts and what is really happening is automatically interpreted as being biased. Right. Right. And and of course uh I think there’s no such thing as true objectivity. But having said that, you know, I really struggle with that. And many people say, listen, the rules have changed. It’s okay to say you support trans people. It’s okay that you say I am 100% for reproductive rights. um you know all these things that honestly as in personally I hold dear but professionally I’ve ne never really I’ve been trained to not share that. So, I’m curious if you think sort of old-fashioned, semiobjective, knowing that pure objectivity is impossible, that kind of journalism still has a place in the culture, or is it simply, you know, the 75 and up people who are watching the network evening newscasts? I have a view of that, but you Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I I certainly think it still has a place, but at the same time, I think everything is so fragmented now that I think such a large portion of the audience are going to places that share a a point of view. And I think, you know, I I think if we just did a report that is this happened, then this happened, then this happened, then this happened. I mean, there’s there’s plenty of places where people, you know, could find Not really. I mean, fewer and fewer, right, Brett? Yeah. But but I think I I think the key thing that we do is connect the dots on all those things. And I think when you’re able to weave it into a story and actually connect the dots, I think that’s what people want to be able to gain clarity on because I think as as we’ve kind of been saying, there’s so much information out there that in order to be able to digest it, um it has to be presented, you know, I think in many ways um you know, in in certain ways just to make it clear, um from even just a storytelling perspective so people get how how does a tariff affect you know, their you know, their business or the price they’re going to pay for goods, you know, and how does this affect their medication and their f like I think you just I think you need to be able to tie it all together in a way. And whether people think that’s biased or not when you’re speaking on those issues, to me, I think you just need to put that aside because now we live in a time when people are going to comment on on everything, right? Like I said, people are going to comment, I I mispronounce something, we’ll get a comment, right? It’s it’s there’s going to be a comment about everything. You have to almost bake that into what you’re doing in my opinion and just be you, you know, and and and and let the chips fall where they may. I I think the biggest thing that you need to do though is is be authentic, you know, to yourself. And I think people could smell from a mile away. Um, and that’s why I think when after the 2024 election, when there were so many I I feel like I saw so many Democratic politicians and and people in media and podcasts and and you name it, to all of the sudden everything I thought they believed in and the communities that I thought they supported, all of a sudden they seem to be backtracking on that. Maybe we focused a little too much on inclusivity. Maybe we focused a little too much on reproductive rights. And when you try to kind of shape your opinions based around public polling, right? And kind of like that describing as the DEI people who when it was cool, it was great. Now they’re like, “What what does that stand for?” Yeah. And and so how do I trust you with anything? And I don’t speaking of Mr. MAGA, Mrs. Midas, whatever we were talking about before, you know, I don’t think you’re going to win. You know, the Mr. MAGA is not going to vote for you because you have those beliefs. They’re going to vote for the MAGA guy. Okay, they’re not going to come around. They may say they respect you more or something. You know, you’re not getting their vote. I I I assure you. And you’re just alienating your choir, as we were speaking about before, and you’re angering the people who you’ve built trust with because you violated that trust. So I think right now and I think whether you’re Midas Touch or whether you’re Joe Rogan or you name it, I think the most important thing is that you’re authentic to your audience and that people trust the things that you are saying and know where you are coming from and know that tomorrow if a poll comes out that says this big thing you’ve been pushing may not be super popular right now that you’re not all of a sudden going to just change your beliefs, you know, based on it. Um, and I mean that’s that’s my thought on that. I think, you know, one of the things I could say about Donald Trump, I’m not trying to say anything nice about the guy right now, but uh, one of the things I could say is I think he’s pushed forward a lot with things that are incredibly unpopular and then he’s taken his people kind of on that journey with him going way back. I mean, remember he was being laughed at at these uh, debates at the White House dinner. I mean, everyone is making a mockery of him. Um, but he pushed forward and he tried to make the case to bring people to his side. Um, and he’s a marketing genius, don’t you think, Jordy? In a way, uh, I I would say he’s a Ponzi schemer and a fraud. Some That’s a good characterization. I mean, you you can think dialectically. He can be all those things, can he? I mean, was Bernie Maid off a good marketer? Well, I think he was very I think he was very different. I I don’t think he had a public persona that was charismatic and and and got people to buy what he was selling. I mean, he did have a small group, right? But I don’t know, just on a Well, we don’t have to get estimate. I think what Brett was saying though, too, about um audiences these days, uh and it’s a marketing buzz word, authenticity. I know I used to say it a lot back in my marketing days. Uh but genuinely, I think people are viewing what we’re doing here at the Mestouch Network as absolutely authentic. You know, we’re three brothers. We don’t try and be anything that we’re not, right? We rely on Ben for the legal, Brett for the digital, and me for the marketing, and then we bring in experts in specific spaces that could speak to issues that we’re not experts in. Yeah. And we don’t pretend that we’re experts in, but we have a clear value set of, you know, right or wrong. And if those lean more democratic, well, I think that tells you kind of where we are as a as a country, as a society. Uh, and we just stand behind it wholeheartedly. And I think people like that. I think that’s what folks are gravitating. By the way, that’s not to say that your ideas cannot evolve, that you cannot change your opinions. I think certainly you can. And I don’t think that your beliefs that you had at age 18 have to be the beliefs that you have at age 50. You know, I I I think that evolution is a part of life. exploring new ideas, engaging with them, changing your mind is is a part of life. But I think people, to your point, know when you go, “Oh, this uh poll came out yesterday and all of a sudden I uh maybe I shouldn’t support transgender people so much. Maybe I shouldn’t support, you know, diversity. Maybe I shouldn’t support reproductive rights.” I think people see right through that crap, you know, and then they go, you know, they go, “This person, you’re okay. So, you’re just a fraud. How do I trust that? Anything else you’re telling me right now? How do I know you’re being honest about that? What if tomorrow, you know, some other politician won that was the opposite of that and then all of a sudden you’re switching your beliefs on that, too? Like, h how how do you trust somebody, you know, who’s sort of a shape shifter like that? And I think it’s important to not view, you know, as you go from election to election or, you know, issue to issue, whatever it is, that you don’t just change with the way the wind is blowing, but that you are staying true through those moments and that you’re sticking up for your beliefs cuz I think at least, you know, at least people will respect you, you know, right? And giving them facts and and and data that actually reinforces your position. I think that’s really critical. Uh a just a few more questions. I could talk to you guys for hours. We’ll have to do it over a beer sometime, but but I I’d love to know just sort of logistically uh selfishly a little about the secret sauce uh that that has made you so successful. Um you guys have hired a bunch of different I it’s interesting. I I I didn’t realize Michael Cohen was part of your network, you know, the former Trump lawyer, but you have hired a lot of different people. you have correspondence, but you also have sort of what might traditionally be called pundits and and and do you ever feel like you’ve got too much content that’s coming out or how how do you kind of organize what you’re doing? So, we’ve taken the 24-hour cable news cycle and we’ve tried to deconstruct it. So, whereas a 24-hour cable news cycle, you’ll have how many stories in a given day? Five to seven that are on repeat every day. So we try to take those five to seven stories that and I don’t watch what cable news is those five to seven. We program it based on what we think are the most important. Say 7 to 10 stories of the day and then that becomes basically 10 to 12 YouTube videos you know every day from you know and they’re all your different contributors right cuz you do some right and do you do you I’ll do yes I see you do Jordine every now and then. more more so social. They do they do more of the long form stuff. So, every day we probably have about one or two, some days three live shows that last about an hour. And so, that may be the show I do with Brett and Jordy. That may be a show called Legal AF that I do with a guy named Michael Pop and Karen Freriedman Agnif. And she was the number two DA in the Know these are like top lawyers for um No, no, no, no, no. It means analysis friends by the way. That’s super. Is that true? It does. It does. Analysis is friends some people. It could be a play on something else, but it’s analysis friends. Okay. Get get your mind out of the gutter. Sorry. And so about 10 videos to 12 videos a day that are about 10 to 15 minutes in length, whatever it takes to go through a court filing or to provide all of the data where we feel that we’ve covered the issue in a way that people really get. So we do that 12 times a day. Maybe there’s a 4 a.m. Although now that I’m on East Coast time, it’s all screwed up. But on the West Coast, it’s a 4 or 5:30, a 7, you know, and you basically go 90 minutes out and and you program it like that with two or three live shows a day. And some days, maybe on the weekend, it’s one live show. Um, and then we have our other social media built around it. So, we’ve got the Tik Tok, we’ve got the Instagram, we’ve got all those at the blue sky, which our accounts do very well on as well. And then the audio podcast as well has some the main brother podcast and maybe a few selective you know guys ever sleep. Yeah. Yeah. And how do you how do you make money off all this stuff because that has been of course the big uh dilemma for people who have transferred to kind of a pure digital uh platform. Uh you know they used to talk about analog dollars and digital pennies. So that’s changed as more than 50% of people are now getting their news and information from from social media. But what is your what is your financial model? I think it’s still analog dollars, digital pennies, although the analog dollars are getting a little bit less and the digital pennies are getting more, which is which is a good thing. I I I just spoke recently at a panel and I said one of the most important things I think to monetizing it is you don’t go in to monetizing it. I mean truly we never went into this thinking how do we make the biggest business decisions that naturally grew out of building good content and a good base and a good and a big community and then the community Exactly. And and the community was there and that’s what we fought for always and and stood by the community built the community and they built us. it’s been, you know, very mutual. And then as you grow that, you know, then you start to get into your digital pennies, analog dollars, and you start to look at, you know, what’s a YouTube CPM, which has a different name for it, but and what’s a podcast CPM, and then you and then what’s a host red CPM, and then you start getting into conversations that start to not fully are, but start to look similar to the way traditional TV viewed things. you know, what’s a CPM? And and and here’s the here’s where things are moving. I think right now, if you were to buy an an ad, a 30 second or 60-second spot on a cable news network, your CPM would be super high for 30 seconds, and you may be paying an out, you know, they’ll say it’s a good, you know, the networks will say it makes sense, but you’ll be paying whatever X dollars for that 30 seconds. after the show airs, no one sees the ad again. And you’re one of five ads that may be during that block or four ads during that block and no one ever sees it again. And I don’t know what the conversion rate even is for, you know, cuz it’s not even really tracked that way. How many people bought a car based on those those vitamins that taste like vegetables? That’s all I see on Fox News, you know. So, if we’re getting a million views, if we’re getting a million views, you know, on a video, and then there’s a host red, you know, read and Jordy, you know, works with the with the advertisers to make sure we’re getting advertisers that kind of meet our criteria and we’re not bringing advertisers that we think are not the right fits for us. You know, you start thinking about, well, what does that CPM look like? And you know, I think it’s a more valuable proposition ultimately to an advertiser down the road. And I think this is where this is where the industry is moving. And I I think this is why we see so many people looking at a model, you know, that that I think we you know, and again, there’s been a lot of people involved in this, but I think that we’ve helped, you know, show that this is a a viable path for one of the first and people are seeing it and saying, “Oh, got it. I see how Midas did it. let me try to build a network and and and and that’s kind of how we you know how how we think about things there. It’s it’s interesting over the past few years since we’ve been doing this we’ve seen a lot of companies kind of come and go try to enter the space and I think the theme that I’ve seen in the ones that have kind of come and gone quickly are the ones that start with a top down approach rather than a bottom up approach and by that I mean you know you see this big splashy announcement so and so was you know the editor-inchief of such and such you newspaper and now they’re going to make the digital network for the future and they got an $80 million investment and they’re going to open up 12 offices around the world and they’re going to hire 150 staff and and anytime I see that I’ll be I give them a year. I I mean how I the economics aren’t going to even work for I mean the offices alone are going to sink in like I I don’t even understand how how you because it’s still dollar penny. still and so like to me I’m like I don’t even know how this is how you think this is going to work but so so how many how many people do you have al together on your team so I think one of the one of the things that is most effective about what we’ve done here is the way we’ve decentralized it so you know I think as far as like kind of fulltime staff is concerned you know at this point we’re probably what 10 to 15 like fulltime full-time like you know and then in addition to that though we have dozens and dozens and dozens of contributors who are also producing content and contractors and and people like that. So, so it’s not it’s their side hustle kind of or is it for some contributors? You know, it’s it’s one of those things where um it you get what you put into it. And so there are some folks who are, you know, making videos every day, doing two a day, you know, you know, are just really crushing it and this is like become their main thing and now their livelihood is making, you know, videos for Midas Touch, which I think is amazing that we’re able to, you know, offer offer that to folks and then we may have folks who do, you know, a video a month or, you know, a couple videos a month and and, you know, they’re this will be their side thing. And so I think, you know, I think we offer that flexibility to folks, you know, who work with us, kind of how much do you want to put into it and and what’s kind of resonating with folks. But, you know, I I think it’s cool that we’ve been able to build this platform from the ground up completely independently without a penny of outside investment money, you know, getting us to where we are, you know, right now. No, it’s really impressive. So, you know, and and and obviously, you know, we were certainly afforded, you know, privileges of, you know, all having jobs and being able to take this leap that other folks aren’t necessarily able to do. And I completely acknowledge that. But I think I think it’s important that, you know, you do have that kind of groundup approach when you approach it because when you’re dealing with when you’re dealing with pennies, you can’t be spending, you know, you can’t be spending dollars. You you need to figure out a way to do this. And you know, I’ll also go back to our roots here. I’ll take it back to the beginning cuz during the pandemic, one of the things that we noticed was everyone was recording from their homes. And so we would watch CNN, we would watch, you know, NBC, we’d watch all the networks, everyone was on Skype or Zoom or whatever. And so we were like, we could do that. Yeah, we have Skype. Well, I mean, it’s amazing. I mean, as somebody who, you know, used to have hair and makeup every morning or night and be on a fancy, you know, desk with lights and camera cruise and everything, and I’m like, there’s something great, too, about the immediiacy. Like, we’d have to call somebody and get get them in a car and have them come to the studio. And there’s something great about just being able to talk to someone right away if it’s by way. There’s a rawness to it. There’s an authenticity to it. Also, you know, I believe when people see me without makeup. I I totally do not think that, but um but you know, I I I think though it it, you know, it requires you to, you know, think a little differently, right? You don’t necessarily, you know, I I know and I think Ben knows he doesn’t have necessarily, you know, studio, music, all the stuff lifting him up and so he has to, you know, in many ways focus on the content, right? And there’s a fakiness about like good evening. Yeah. you know, and and and I think people see, you know, see through a lot of that. And so, you know, in in doing it in that way, you know, I think ultimately, like, if anyone is like watching this and like, I do start something like this, like you want to make sure your sound is good, you want to make sure people could see, okay, you want a good camera, good audio. Aside from that, people are going to be actually pretty forgiving um with the rest of the stuff. And I think in the beginning also there were so many people who would come to us, you know, I got this, I got this great video, I got this great painting, I just need to run it through a few weeks of testing and then we’re going to make some changes and then if I could just get an investor, find a distributor and and you know that’s the one question I also wanted to ask you. You know, you do it in real time, you experiment, you get kind of the reaction. I promise I only have this one talking to you guys. Um, we’ve before you ask a question, we’ve been very excited to do this interview. We’re big Katie. We get asked for a lot of interviews. We don’t really do interviews, but we’re very big fans of you and and looking forward to this. Thank you. That that means a lot to me. Um, but you know, when you you talked about how responsive you guys are to your community, and I’m curious, you know, I love the interactivity. You know, it’s not always fun to read because when you read a mean comment or whatever, but tell me what that actually means, being responsive to your community. Can you give me sort of an example of that? I’ll give you an example of the message that resonated and how we do it. If you looked at Senator Bernie Sanders and AOCC’s rallies recently where there have been 30,000 people and 15,000, there’s a part of it where they go into the audience and they say, they ask the audience, “How do you feel about this?” And then they just listen and you hear what the people are saying. and we do something intuitively similar for the past five years where we want to know how they’re feeling, what they’re thinking about issues and and really listen and learn from their experiences. And that’s where we understand, you know, okay, this is what you’re going through. This is what you’re going through. This is what you’re experiencing. And so we have that sense in our overall programming where they are. And another what is it reading like their comments or is it do you have a special uh site or or email address where you actually hear from people? How do you do that? It’s all of the above. I mean it’s reading the comments. We hold sometimes one two times a month we’ll hold meetings with our uh supporters and with the mightest mighty as we call them and we’ll do Zoom chats and they’ll tell us how they’re feeling. They’ll they’ll explain to us on our social media handles. they’ll usually, you know, at us on certain things. And so it’s an aggregate of of of all of that. And we’re just constantly listening to them every day. It’s not necessar we have those meetings, but it is kind of a constant back and forth since this started. Just another example is when we started covering Canadian politics, which was a big and and our expansion from a lot of Canadians internationally, but we listened and listened and listened and a lot of American media networks supplant the Canadian experience with their American centric views of how Canada is versus really listening to what people in Canada are experiencing. And so before we started doing any reporting on Canada, we had to understand the dynamics of the Liberal Party and the Conservative Party and the NDP and the Green Party and how things work and what’s going on with Carney and what’s going on with Pierre Polyv and understanding you know all of those dynamics and this it was it was a relentless listening experience and then we started talking about it and then it started connecting in Canada. So, the Midas Touch Network podcast became the most listened to podcast in Canada about Canadian politics, right? Um, and that and what we heard from them is which is such a compliment, right? It’s so which told us that but but the but the feedback there was it’s because you’re listening to us and you understand that when Donald Trump is making these threats against us, it’s not a joke. Nor do we view it as a trade war. We view it as a war. We view that type of language the same way that Ukraine views Putin talking about denazification is how when he uses language 51st state, it’s an attack on our very existence and our sovereignty. So we want you to understand why it is we’re boycotting American products. And it’s not that we don’t like Americans, it’s that the leader of your country right now is basically threatening an invasion against us. And so when you start speaking like that, they go, “Thank you.” you know, they go, our local media doesn’t even talk about it in those terms. And that’s how we felt. Yeah. It’s obvious that you have an audience first mentality. And it is surprising to me as somebody who’s been doing this a long time how all these interactive tools are at our fingertips and still most media organizations really don’t utilize them. Not to blow my own home for a nancond, but when I was uh I wrote about this in my book, sorry everybody who works with me because they’ve heard the story a million times, but when I was at doing the CBS evening news, I was covering the Gulf oil spill. And I said, “What do you guys want to know?” Yeah. About the Gulf oil spill that, you know, because I think you get in a media cycle or a news cycle and you kind of repeat the same thing over and over again or you give a little bit of more uh, you know, advance the story in a small way, but you kind of miss the forest for the trees sometimes. So, I asked on Twitter back then, you know, what are your questions about what’s going on in the Gulf? And the people at CBS were so unnerved by me trying to to understand what people cared about, what they wanted to know, and what they were thinking and what they were wondering about. But to me, if you’re serving an audience, why wouldn’t you listen to them? And I think Brett, you were talking about the top down approach and kind of serve your audience at where they are and and and what they want to know instead of what you think they should be told. Right. Yeah. And hey, and whether whether you’re a politician or a reporter or you’re selling tires or I I don’t care what it is that you’re doing, if you don’t understand what people want and and what people are looking for from you, you know, I think you’re I think you’re going to miss it. And you’re right. You know, now more than ever, people are going to let you know what they think. You know, it’s they’re not shy about it. For better or for worse, for better or worse. They’re not exactly shy about it. I used to say the the good thing about the internet is everyone now has a voice. The bad thing about the internet is everyone now has a voice. Yeah. So, I mean, people aren’t shy about it. and you know and and and people may disagree with us too at at times you know but at least we know you know what they’re thinking and at least they know that we’re coming from a place of like this is what we really believe in it and we’re not going to BS you you know on it and I think that’s kind of the most important corporate news took surgery yeah I was from my perspective I don’t think the Midas touch network exists at the scale that it does now without our audience without the Midas mighty and without that relentless relationship of listening and feedback that we have every second of the day. We read everything again for better or for worse. I don’t know how you don’t have time to do all this, but I’m glad you do. Because it’s very important for us that we really understand how our audience is feeling. And they were with us 5 years ago when uh I moved back into my mom’s basement uh during the during the lockdown. Yep. Doing it from there to now I have a kid and I’m living with my wife in Pittsburgh. And so they’ve seen us mature and the network mature every step of the way. And it’s really been this familial relationship that we’ve been able to foster these days and the walls have been broken. You know, I think there still is this sort of artifice about a lot of mainstream media and the way they communicate with people and obviously you all have tapped into that the a word authenticity which I think it’s overused but I think it actually still holds. Yeah. It’s it’s one of those cliche for a reason sort of you know sort of things. I mean, I think that’s been one of the reasons I’ve been successful professionally is I think people think that I’m the same on camera as I am off, which I am most the time. You know, I’m not fully unfiltered when I when I do things. And maybe I should be a little less, you know, or more unfiltered. But before we go, I I want to We’ve kind of mentioned the manosphere and and young men in this country. How old are you, Ben? 40. 40. Well, Ben’s about to be 40. She’s got a few days. You’re you’re you’re over overselling. I don’t know when I don’t know when when’s this going to air. Okay. I’m assum I’m thinking that Thursday. So, I’m right on the cusp. Okay. How old are you? I needed to stay. 35. So, 40 35 32. 32. Do you all have any sisters? We do. We do. Why aren’t they involved in this enterprise? No offense. She’s in She’s in college. She’s in college. Oh, wow. She was Okay. Okay. You say you’re bros, but you’re not bros, right? and and you you know tell me tell me about um what you think is happening to younger men in this country both really primarily Gen Z and how they have gravitated so enthusiastically to Republican to MAGA politics and how well first of all I want to know why you think this has happened and and then I want to know what you think can be done to change those dynamics. I think the idea of alpha has been hijacked by the least alpha people in the world, okay? Like a JD Vance was saying, “Oh, my masculinity is under attack.” Okay? That’s not an alpha thing to say. Like, let’s be very clear when when I hear stuff like that, I’m like, “What are you your your masculinity? This is what you think about that your masculinity is under attack? What the hell are you talking about?” You know, all of this like, you know, whining that I hear from these mag Oh my god, you’re coming after me. Oh, my friend Joanne Litman wrote a whole essay about that. Got doxed and attacked. It was awful. I’m going to send it to you guys. You know, all of that when I grew up, I don’t like the term alpha in general. It’s, you know, you’re an alpha, you know, but to me, at least as I was raised, you know, being a good guy or good person, but you stand up for people. to me like the cool kid or the or or the growing up when I was in high school what now would be considered that you would stand up against the bully. The bully wasn’t like the alpha person. The bully was like the loser you know and like why are you bullying these people? Like you would want to stand up for people and that’s to me what was always viewed as like cool and and how you know at least how I was raised. and and being a good man to me is being a man of your word, being someone of honor, you know, uh, you know, again, standing up for people. And that’s kind of been, you know, in inverted with this, to me, this corrosive culture that has, you know, basically said the opposite that the the bullies and the people who punch down that’s been viewed right now as like what it is. And and it shouldn’t be that way. It’s because of Trump really, isn’t it? the way he speaks and the way he talks and the way he demeans people suddenly that has and probably the way he’s also been rewarded for it in so many ways. You know, it’s funny when when when you speak about that I think about I think it’s in 21 Jump Street uh there’s a scene in the movie uh you know where Channing Tatum where they go to the high school and they try to be cool as they knew it like in the 80s and tried to be like kind of the bullies and stuff and they’re looked down upon as like nah like we’re not into that anymore. what are you doing? Like this is weird this weird stuff. And uh and I I feel like I you know I I grew up the same way. But you know I think that I think that too many people are looking at you know Gen Z or Gen Alpha right now as being molded and kind of set in certain ways and that this election was you know a reflection on who they are now and who they’re always going to be. And but I do think they’re being molded by some of these Christian 100%. I I think they’re having anti-women’s empowerment bros, right? I think 100%. But I don’t think that’s something that is going to be like concrete in them necessarily. I think people have their lived experiences. And I think one of the interesting things that we’ve even seen in the past few months since Trump has taken office is when you look at a lot of those public opinion polls of Gen Z, they’ve completely flipped on their head. and polls that show Gen Z, you know, even are supporting Trump back in November, December, now it’s something like 68, 20 something, you know, in the opposite direction. So, you see how even, you know, those shifts could happen. And I think when people even go out into the world and have experiences and and have jobs and need to, you know, afford medication and and need to, you know, help their mom who’s on social security and and they see these real world things that, you know, have been kind of gamified in this kind of manosphere world and and that have kind of been stripped from them. I think the reality wakes them up, you know, a little Do you think because I feel like they’re still watching the same people and still getting the same information and unless those people are flipping or changing or abandoning this administration and what they’re doing, they’re going to be steadfast. Yeah. You know, I just I I don’t think they’re locked in. I I may maybe I have uh you know, too much faith, but but I I I think you have to look at the going back to where we almost started, right? is I think you have to look at the root cause which is how is this group able to be kind of prayed upon by in my opinion these types of fraudsters and people who push this and it’s because you know I think a lot of young people and young men are scared that they’re not going to have a future right and I think it stems from their their weakness and that other people can prey on it because they’re worried that am I going to am I going to have a job am I going to be able to afford a home? Can I bring someone on a date and afford to even pay for it? What’s my future going to be? But it’s also more than that to me, Ben. It’s sort of, oh, women are making all these strides, right? There are more women in college and law school than there are men or gosh, DEI programs are giving unfair advantages or affirmative action or diversity programs in colleges or whatever you want to talk about. I mean, I’ve seen it play out in my own life among people I know, and they think when other people do well, they do less well, right? And so, there’s just been this tremendous backlash. And to your point, like a lot of whining, like, oh, poor us. And and and playing the victim for a lot of young white men. Yeah. Um and and I think you’re right, people are exploiting that. But how do you reverse it? How do you how do you get people to think differently and to see that this is, you know, because I do think they’re having some real world effects? Well, I I I think you can’t solve that by trying to imitate it. You just become a worse version of something that’s not already good. Which is why the learning experience of oh the left needs to find a Rogan is the wrong advice because you want to become someone who’s already kind of praying on these communities. So what does that mean exactly? So you have to again you have to be a voice that is a fighter. I mean you have to go back to you have to be a doer. You have to be someone who actually accomplishes things and says here’s what I stand for. I mean here here are the views and values. It’s not a zero someum game. You against other groups and marginalized communities taking your that’s not it. That’s a pathetic way. You know who deals with that? Whiners deal with that. Like not like like people who are losers deal with that. You you want to be a winner. Let’s work hard. You know he let’s let’s focus on being entrepreneurial. Let’s focus on actually building things versus destroying things and ripping things apart. You want to be step up. Yeah. Yeah. Step up, you know. step up and and and yeah, I’m not going to be, you know, when I talk to sometimes my um you know, I I lecture in undergrad. I have a big class. The semester’s wrapped up. But but you know, at the end of the semester too, sometimes I like to, you know, reflect on the way that I don’t know what the class’s political views and I don’t inject my political views ever in the class, but I do talk about how I have white kids, black kids, Latina kids, Asian students in my class, men, women, trans in my class. No one in my class ever thinks it’s acceptable during the class to say, “Oh, look at you. This race, look at you, this person. Look at you. This person, I don’t like you. I don’t like you.” I mean, could you imagine what would happen in a class if everybody was interacting and treating each other like, “No, we act professional. There’s a professor. We go through the semester. We get along. The diversity in the class, the different views, different genderful experience.” and we were all happy with it. So, as I end the semester, I always go to them, so why when we leave this classroom and go into now what an a political setting or a professional setting, now we’re supposed to all of a sudden take this and now fight each other and now not like each other. We saw the strength of what made this class of 105 people strong. It was the very diver. We all liked each other. So go out there and remember that this was a valuable experience for all of us and that should be what the real world was and that’s what we should be fighting for. Not to see in the halls of Congress them not letting people in bathroom like what are they even doing? You know I mean it’s it’s Mace has lost her mark. She was somebody who a few years ago, you know, kind of pretended to be an ally and and she’s now the biggest voice, you know, against what she does is selfies and background. It’s like weird, right? It’s like like 60 times a day posting 60 times a day about any topic at all. Even like a hobby would be strange. I mean yet alone like this is what you you know this is what you occupy your time with. And that’s how I try to flip it on that you know them you know more than I’m like this is what you’re focused on like you wake up thinking about bathrooms all day. this is your main view, you know, and and and that’s to me how you address it versus living in their framework of of all of their grievance and and pettiness and hate. Flip it a little bit. You know, I I think one of the things that people I think one of the reasons why people gravitate to the stuff we do as well is because they leave with the information and then I think they also leave empowered. And I think folks need to be empowered. They need to feel in control of their lives. And I think a lot of these, you know, young kids right now don’t feel in control of their lives and and a lot of it’s not their fault, right? I mean, this is the situation. This is the hands that they have been dealt and it’s, you know, through decades and decades and decades, you know, whether it’s poor policy or just shifts in global everything like whatever it is, you know, they’re looking now, they’re looking at their parents and they’re going, “Well, they had it easy. They were able to get a, you know, my, you know, dad was able to get one job and work, you know, five days a week, you know, eight hour days and and come home and have dinner and we had two week vacations, you know, twice a year, you know, they they they look and they go, “How the heck am I going to do that?” You know, even even if I had a job where I was making six figures, I’m not going to be able to afford a house. I’m not going to be able to have savings. I’m not going to be able to live in a neighborhood where I could walk around and and get everything that I need to survive. And then in doing all that, how am I going to have kids? How am I going to be able to afford a family? I can’t even afford to get a coffee for myself. You know, it’s so these are real issues also. And so what I don’t want to do is write off also a lot of this as mere whining and you know kind of woe is me, but understand that you know people are hurting going back to what we were saying at the beginning and that’s including these younger generations. And so I think we need to empower them and I think and also like acknowledge acknowledge and struggle uh you know whoever they may be right and and I think we need to you know acknowledge it and you know what we’ve seen in those communities that you’ve talked about the manosphere all that stuff they’ve acknowledged it and then they’ve directed that anger at the other they’ve direct you’re you can’t afford a home because the Democrat rats are giving the money to illegal immigrants and that money should have went to you and then you know the second there’s a social program that may actually help people they go oh no we’re not going to pay for that that’s socialism that’s communism we’re not going to do that it’s like okay so so you don’t believe in any of this right um but but too often that energy is taken and then it’s pushed in a negative direction to blame other people for you know for those woes for those issues um I think we all need to figure out a way as a society in general to how do we empower people you know in a in a productive, positive way. And some of that also is going to require structural change in in you know, how are we going to ensure that these kids are going to be able to grow up and have families and have, you know, productive lives and and have a job that they could support their families with and and enjoy the American dream as they’ve been told. I mean, we were all promised growing up, right? You know, go to college, you get your good, you know, you get a good job, you’ll you’ll be good, everything is good. And now that’s not simply not what’s happening in so many cases. So I think there’s a bitterness that develops and that bitterness is then, you know, taken and and weaponized for for bad. And I think we need to kind of figure out how to, you know, take that and and put people back on the right course. That’s a good segue to my final question, which is, you know, you talk about empowering people and, you know, I I I get very discouraged about the state of the the country and um disappointed and frustrated and I’m I’m curious. I I I like the idea even though you know some of your YouTube things are like these big bold letters like the video he doesn’t want you to see or pathetic mel meltdown lock him up you know it’s very kind of I I like it you’re sort of being a slightly New York Posty about it to be honest with you with the yellow almost like in your face uh graphics but I I’m I’m curious if if you’re optimistic about the country and and what kind of words of encouragement can you give me and other people watching this or listening to this that we’re going to be okay and democracy is not going to go away. I am hopeful. I am optimistic. And I think that the plan that Trump and Musk had was to pretty much control all levers of everything right now. and really beat down any opposition and resistance. I think what we see right now in federal courts is judges appointed by Trump, Reagan, George W. Bush on the due process questions. They made a lot of bad rulings on a lot of things, but on the due process questions, all judges have said, at least as of now of this recording, there is something called due process. you have to go and follow it. And we do not live in an authoritarian country. And so federal judges on that question by and large across the country are standing up to Donald Trump. More significantly though, I think you see the protests, peaceful protests growing. I think that’s a good sign. I think what we saw with the hands-off protest, no King’s Day, I think that’s going to continue to grow and that gives me a lot of hope as well. Um, and I think that I I take a lot of hope that people are in the fight right now. I was worried that after the election and you saw a lot of people just for about two months tuning out tune out and just didn’t do anything. I I think that we now have a opposition and resistance that looks and feels even stronger than what we saw back in 2017 2018. I think people have seen Trump Trump’s reckless on and off again tariffs and all of this rhetoric that you know it’s the same kind of pattern. He huffs and he puffs and does something that causes harm and then he withdraws from it and then declares that a victory. And there are still some news outlets that report these things as victories. It’s like he just is the arsonist who slightly put out a fire that he created and now things are worse and now he wants to declare that a a victory. But I think that the public’s by and large is is seeing that. I mean Americans are smart, right? I mean a lot of them are smart. Yeah. And I and I think we see Trump’s approval right now is basically the worst in presidential history at this time, including his first term. as you look across the polls. And so he still has that 35% kind of MAGA floor plus or minus another five or 6%. So some polls at 39, some at 42. But by and large, I don’t think people um like hostile takeovers of the federal government. I think people want to feel safe going on airplanes and not have a transportation secretary kind of panic on TV about flights and staffing and try to blame other people. Um, I think people see veterans getting fired and disrespected. I think people see education being gutted and and I think that people don’t like that stuff. Women dying in parking lots, too. Absolutely. And I think that people saying, you know, you know, no, we’re not we’re not okay with this. And that and that gives me that gives me hope. Even slactivism which so-called you know sitting on your chair as a and and and trying to do something which was derided for so long I think is actually a pretty good barometer of how people are feeling you know what they’re saying on social media how they’re commenting and and and what they’re watching like the Midas network right you know 100%. Yeah. And and that’s why we always say, you know, do what you can, right? You don’t have to go out there and build a media network, right? Like that’s not what we’re asking, right? But but if your thing is getting your messages out on social media by sending messages, do it like or talking to a neighbor and listen to, right? Do it. If if you if you’re a painter, paint, right? Like whatever it is that you do, do it and use that to empower yourself. Also, I think one of the things that um you know I I also think about is just how much throughout history and not even just American history, but in general there are these big pendulum swings and they happen quickly. And you know, I think I’ve never seen one happen quite this quick. That’s what I was going to say. I’ve never seen it happen as quickly as we’ve seen it happen now. And even since Donald Trump took office to right now, I think we’ve also seen a tremendous pendulum swing kind of in influx as we are kind of all living in this moment. How this will end, when it will end, what it looks like when we’re on the other side, you know, I don’t know that history has not yet been written, but I know that the pendulum always does swing. It doesn’t happen on its own, but you know, it happens by collective action and, you know, a lot of people staying engaged and in the fight. But I I know it will. And that’s why when we speak about these fair weather, you know, folks who change their opinion based on the way the wind is blowing, I think they may get caught on the wrong side of, you know, that pendulum when things swing back to, you know, people uh, you know, pushing forward on, you know, inclusion, diversity, people championing, you know, workers rights, people championing, you know, the ability for people to afford their, you know, medication or get their social security or or whatever it is. I think there’s a breaking point that society reaches and I think we’ve kind of did a a speedrun, you know, to where we are right now, even a speedrun to Trump and now a speedrun kind of back as people are like, “Oh maybe this wasn’t the best idea on the planet.” I did I did feel like Andy Basher who I don’t know if you all talked about this Ben but he did have a good point about you know the Democrats and some progressives I think became a little too precious about words and about uh you know shaming or judging or you know being self-righteous about framing certain issues to the point where it was like a turnoff for a lot of people. Um, so I mean there’s Do you do you agree with that criticism? Well, I think ultimately speak how people speak. You know, don’t don’t try to cook up phrases in a lab. Don’t try to, you know, come up with euphemisms for things or, you know, you know how many times people have also, you know, come to us, you know what, I think you should say, you know, like experts, maybe instead of saying language this way, maybe you should say it, you know, this other way. And I’m like, I’ve never heard somebody use that phrase in my life, though. Like, I I can’t I don’t even know what you’re talking about, honestly. It sounds like mumbo jumbo. Like, tested.3% higher. Yeah, this tested.3%. I’m like, I don’t even know what that means. Okay. Like, I I I’m going to talk how I speak with my brothers and how I speak with my friends, you know? And and I know you say what what you can have in a group chat, right? Like, it it’s got to be sort of figured out that way. Jordy, bring it home, honey. Hey, I I I I want to echo your point that you said just before. Americans are smart. Americans are resilient. And it’s not going to be easy these next couple of years here. But democracy will prevail. I genuinely have hope. I know from the folks my age. I know where they’re sitting at right now. And I know from, you know, folks around Ben and Brett’s age and then older, you know, where they’re sitting at. People love this country. This country is the greatest country in the world. Americans want this country to succeed. The world wants this country to succeed. And we just have to put our heads down every single day and do the work and make sure that we leave this country better off, you know, not just for our kids, but for the next several generations of kids, hundreds of years down the line because that’s how much this country means to us. From the mouth mouths of babes, right, the youngest. Did he nail it or Yes, you nailed it. You nailed it. Do you guys ever fight, by the way? Do you ever get into big arguments? Oh, absolutely. You do. But listen, it’s not they’re not it’s not like but they’re not like you know it’s it’s little things honestly like we don’t all that much but you know do you like working together it’s honestly it’s a dream like and I think always growing up like we always wanted to work together in some capacity and like as kids we would like make movies together you know we would make like little action movies or horror movies or mystery movies or whatever and and that you that would be like our way of working together or we play sports like whatever it was like we’d always love doing stuff together then there just became a time came a time in life where our age difference, you know, sep you se separates you naturally, you know, when when Ben’s already in college and I’m just starting high school and Jord’s in middle school, you know, whatever that is. Or I’m a senior in high school, Jord’s just starting, you know, as a freshman in in in high school. And luckily, I set the stage to make sure everybody likes Jord and you know, but there’s always these kind of I think you live up to Ben’s who is, you know, school president and teachers. Teachers pet. Teachers pet. Yeah. It’s a ridiculous award. You won it though. Real award. Real real award. What? A teachers pet award. Class of what do they call him? Uh yeah. Biggest suckup. Senior suckup. That’s him right here. Focus on the student government president. Well, I have to say this is officially the longest podcast I’ve ever done, but it felt like the shortest. Thank you guys so so much. This was such a fun conversation. and I learned a lot and um just really enjoyed getting to know all three of you. So, thank you so much. It was great to be here and um you know, we did grow up watching you and so I know I know that we are such mass admirers of yours. So, it’s truly an honor. So, for this to be, you know, the first show that we’re actually in person on together, you know, it’s it’s not by accident and we’re we’re really grateful, you know, for that and we’re just so thrilled to be here with you. So, thank you. Thank you. I’m not just saying that cuz I’m the teacher’s pet, right? I’m not trying to suck up. You see how he won the award?
They weren’t political operatives—they were a civil rights lawyer, a digital editor, and a marketing guy. But in the chaos of the Trump era, the Meiselas Brothers felt compelled to act. In their first in-person interview all together, Katie gets the behind-the-scenes story of how a pandemic group chat turned into the ascendent progressive MeidasTouch Network, and why truth, clarity, and community—not partisanship—are at the heart of what they do.
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33 comments
Katie, thank you for having these fabulous brothers!!! I value family, integrity, & transparency! I wish these brothers longevity & happiness moving forward in the future!
Meidas Touch, Legal AF, The Talking Feds, Democracy Docket! All these channels are leading the way in real independent media!
🎉🎉🎉
Meidas Touch kept covering during the BIDEN ADMINISTRATION. TRUMP NEVER WENT AWAY DUE TO HIS TRYING TO OVER THROW THE GOVERNMENT ON JAN.6!
TRUMP NEVER BACKED DOWN FROM CLAIMING (FALSELY) THAT HE REALLY WON THE 2024 ELECTION BY A LANDSLIDE & CONTINUED TO LIE AND DOUBLE DOWN ON THE LIE. TRUMP SPENT 4 YEARS touring the country lying. We needed MEIDAS TOUCH TO TELL THE TRUTH & EXPOSE TRUMP'S LIES!!
Lies are what propelled him to the white house, and the stupid people that believe them
I feel much better than I did before listening to your
interview with the
Medias Brothers .
Feel encouraged to
hope for better future
These guys have been sorted by the happiness they exude
How grateful that these three brothers stepped up,we so need the hope that their exposure gives,we are not alone!
Hang on….. because of TRUMP… 😂😂😂Didn’t he just start. Was anyone there before him …. Hilarious.
Thank you Meidas Touch!
1:00:16 Educate me! ❤I never knew until now…😂(as I crawl out of the gutter)
Loved this interview.
They were way before the pandemic — they were instrumental in the 2018 blue wave!!! I was a VERY early adopter!! You could tell, these guys were special!!!
Why is nobody talking about 45-47 actually stealing the 2024 election. ?????
Watching and listening from Kent England I applaud these brothers for being not only direct in what they say but truthful too ,lets hope their ratings over there in the States multiply and soon those crazy people who voted the way they did last year will regret what they’ve done to The USA
Have been watching these guys for along time. We don't watch any networks garbage. THANK YOU SO MUCH GUYS!!!!
Phenomenal interview! 💖💯
Love these guys, so glad i found them recently
Katie I've always loved you and your reporting. I watch the Meidias Touch religiously.
I didn’t want to devote this much time to this podcast but I couldn’t shut it off. Great great listen.
Keep these guys safe ❤ I love them and watch their videos daily
MTN has set the bar for the future. Kudos to all 3 of you for remembering the "Golden Rule" and where and from whom you come from. Pearl Jam's Eddie Vedder sang "and he who forgets will be destined to remember". We are living that truth now. Watching in horror and shame as the worst memories of the past are being relived. But seeing with dignity and courage that the Mighty recall and build on the memories that create not destroy. The memory of how to love each other and what it means to be human. Carry On and Mighty Meidas Strong!💪
💙💙💙💙OMGOODNESS! What a GREAT interview!!! Thank you Katie and the Maidas touch!⭐️⭐️⭐️⭐️⭐️
#MeidasMighty here!!!!!
💙💙💙🇺🇸🗽💙💙💙
I am so incredibly proud of you guys! This is so fantastic. I've been with you since the beginning !!!! #meidastouchnetwork
At 70 years old, I have seen a lot of news in my life. Midas Touch is the only place I feel I can go for the truth ❣️❣️❣️
Love them!!!
I am a proud member of the Meidas Touch Network!!!
Yeah I don’t want no men going to the bathroom with my daughter and she yall have being attacking men masculinity for years. You 3 fatgets on your show. So they can agree with your shit. Women want power not equality.
Information is not truth.
It's what the fascists dictators did in Europe- presented simple answers to complex problems/issues. It's part of the fascist plakybook.
Love you meidas brothers because of you three the world knows there is a news media that you can believe ❤❤bless you all and your families..plus the team that now has grown ❤❤❤
Great Watch 👍🏻
Katie Kouric, whilst you were interviewing the Meiselas brothers, you kept talking OVER THEM, you kept INTERRUPTING THEM, I suggest you play this interview backvto yourself, and do a self critique. For me, YOU SPOILT THIS INTERVIEW for me. I would not watch you or your interviewing podcasts due to you making them about YOU. Meidas Touch Network and the Meiselas brothers run rings around you. You need to count yourself lucky to have even be able to interview them. I only watched this video, because THE MEISESELAD BRO'S were being interviewed. I'm a 76 year old lady in New Zealand.
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