By insisting that the Leopard 1 tanks sold to Germany cannot be re-exported to Ukraine, despite Ukraine’s ongoing struggle for sovereignty and survival against a full-scale Russian invasion, does Switzerland realize that it may be effectively limiting the defense capacity of a nation under attack? In doing so, is Switzerland not indirectly providing an advantage to Russia, whether intended or not? One must ask, given this policy, does Switzerland, perhaps unintentionally, wish to assist Russia by blocking aid that could significantly support Ukraine’s defense?
by ProfessorWild563
23 comments
No weapons in to warzones !
I don’t know what about this sentence is so hard to understand.
Just because other countries seem to forget their principles, we don’t have to do it also.
You can look at it as allowing Germany to allocate already existing tanks to Ukraine, and the Leopard 1 would replace them. I don’t think it can be put at the same level or even close to assisting Russia in any way.
No weapons in conflict zones means no weapons in conflict zone, as simple as that.
Good.
As someone said before: these tanks are gonna fight the Russians sooner or later, no matter whether they stay in Switzerland or go to Ukraine or Germany.
For all practical purposes, due to the depth of integration with its (NATO, EU, Western aligned) neighbours, Switzerland has not been meaningfully neutral for some time.
I don’t think that the reexport of arms to Ukraine would be the straw the breaks the camel’s back. But for sure the restrictions on it are going to severely damage the Swiss arms export market, which in turn decreases domestic defence capability and ironically probably increases the level of dependance of CH on NATO arms export nations.
Neutrality should not be an excuse for turning a blind eye on injustice. History will judge us.
Grow a pair, Switzerland. And quickly.
They should just be smuggled into Ukraine, the Swiss can write a angry letter if they want. Who cares, bigger things at stake.
All it takes is 4-5 countries from EU to stop exports of aliments to Switzerland, and then switzerland in a very non-neutral way might ask for help 🙂
This neutrality is and has always been an illusion, with how dependent Switzerland is on other countries.
Even more, Ukraine was and still is one of the bigger exporters of grains in europe; so they could also put the condition on export to Europe with the condition that they must not be resold on Swiss teritories 🙂 Slippery slope, and don’t think Ukraine won’t remember or that other countries won’t take notice
Of course they attach strings. Well go and unfreeze Russian assets while you‘re at it KKS.
That’s an insane insinuation. I won’t even entertain this sick idea.
Most people here have no idea what they are talking about. This is not a neutrality or Geneva Convention issue.
Some years ago, Switzerland banned the export of weapons to any country actively at war. Because Swiss weapons kept turning up in African civil wars and other places. We don’t break our own laws, so we can’t export to Ukraine.
I think we should change the law to be able to export to countries like Ukraine who are defending themselves. It wouldn’t fundamentally break our neutrality. We are anyway siding with Europe and Ukraine already, because we have adopted all EU sanctions against Russia. And we’re spending a few billion to support Ukraine economically, with reconstruction and humanitarian aid.
Edit: Parliament is currently working on loosening the export law. Weapons re-exports to countries at war can be allowed if the country is defending itself under international law (UN resolution).
its not giving an advantage if they dont give to ukraine.
Germany will give them to so other country in exchange for them sending their tanks to ukraine.
No one should ever buy any arms or components from Switzerland ever again. The only thing that may make them care about their precious “neutrality” is losing enough money.
Putins favourite little country
Lol, SP and Greens wanted Switzerland to be military and arms free and kill the defence industry and now we have this mess 🙃.
Neutrality is a silly illusion that will one day bite Switzerland in the behind.
Stupid German government caused this problem for themselves.
Switzerland as a neutral country needs to officially be able to claim that they told the direct recipient (Germany) „you can‘t export this to a country currently at war“.
Now, Switzerland doesn‘t really give a f..k what Germany does with these tanks. Give them to Ukraine, give them to Russia, sell them on eBay or use them as oversized sex toys, we just don‘t care. If you „violate“ our original conditions (not to export to a country at war), we will write you a concerned letter but you will not face any real consequences.
It would have been so easy, but ze overly pedantic German auzorities („ze rules must be gefollowed, JA!“) had to ruin the whole thing for Ukraine – and now even tries to blame Switzerland for their (Germanys) own pedantry.
TLDR: Switzerland just needs plausible deniability due to our neutrality. We don‘t care what Germany does with these tanks. Just give them to Ukraine, we will then have to ‚officially‘ complain to some German embassy underling with a formal letter – but inofficially most people in our government would probably secretly „agree“ with that export to Ukraine, of course.
**Here’s the ELI5:** It isn’t about neutrality or not want8ng to participate/take side, the law explicitly forbids exporting weapons to – “countries involved in an international or internal armed conflict”.
**2009:**
* **[Group for Switzerland Without an Army]** We should ban ALL arms exports!
* **[Population & international community]** Switzerland exports weapons to active war countries? That’s war profiteering, outrageous!
* **[Government]** Ok, ok, we’ll introduce a restriction on exporting arms to “countries involved in an international or internal armed conflict”, but you tell the GSoA to fuck off.
* **[Population]** Fair enough, GSoA, fuck off.
​
**2022-2025:**
* **[Population & international community]** But why won’t Switzerland export arms to Ukraine? That’s outrageous!
And the uninformed outrage wheel keeps on turning…
Of course not. These are ancient. First they have to be upgraded to be even ready for modern combat scenarios.
I will never understand why Germany stupidly keeps buying arms from Switzerland.
The defense industry deserves to die if they only sell weapons you aren’t allowed to use.
Many comments sound so American “if everyone had a gun then we would all be safe”
I’m personally against all military, and pretty sure we could have way better ways to prevent/solve conflicts without them. But weapons lobbies and army mafias/greedy business people see money to be made so they act like there is no other solution and everything is a menace
goodbye CH defense industry
Comments are closed.