Hunter Biden Interview
I was drinking so much alcohol, almost a handle of vodka a day. And alcohol is the most destructive drug, not just to to your body, but it puts you in more danger than any other drug that I’ve ever experienced. And then you add on top of that the amount of uh crack that I was using at the time. And crack cocaine in terms of your physical health is not as dangerous as the situation that you put yourself in to be able to obtain it. How do you get crack? Uh, one of the things I don’t want to do is give a how-to to uh any uh [ __ ] like myself that may think that it’s a good idea. Um, but crack cocaine is a um I I I am fully aware when I’m talking about it in relationship to my own experience with it. It is a still a shocking thing for most people because we have been fed this perception of crack cocaine. It’s more than just a drug. It’s more than like if you say meth or if you say heroin or if you say cocaine, it comes with a whole bunch of different baggage. And because of that, places that you can go get it are some of the most dangerous places in whatever location you happen to be in. And it’s everywhere. Mainly for that reason, I learned how to make my own. Have you read um I’m going to pretend like you’re not getting attacked by a bee right now. Hey, it’s all right. Keep keep my train of thought. Without them, we would all trying to root. By the way, that’s true, too. Birds aren’t real, but bees are. [Music] independent crowdfunded newsroom in the United States. The following interview is with Hunter Biden, the controversial storied son of former President Joe Biden, who issued a full and unconditional pardon for Hunter during his final month in office shortly after Hunter was found guilty of tax related crimes and being an illegal drug user in possession of a firearm. Hunter has yet to speak to the media about this pardon and hasn’t done a televised interview in years. In fact, aside from a very limited and controlled press run to promote his new book, Beautiful Things was 2021, Hunter hasn’t given a single statement to the media, especially in regards to the laptop scandal that was a crucial component in the Stop the Steel movement back in 2020, wherein millions of Trump supporters alleged that Joe Biden was being controlled and manipulated by nefarious foreign actors who leveraged their business connections with Hunter to pedal influence in the White House. As I mentioned, this alleged intel connects to private messages and emails that were found on a laptop that Rudy Giuliani and his lawyer claim Hunter left in a computer repair shop in Delaware sometime in 2020, where after the laptop repairman, John Paul M. Isaac, pictured here, essentially leaked its contents to the world. Along with evidence of alleged corruption, tax evasion, and influence pedaling, what was also leaked from the laptop is nearly a decade of private photos of Hunter in the thraws of crack cocaine addiction. All right, in today’s interview, we’re going to discuss the laptop, the 2020 election, crack thank you so much for your time, man. I really appreciate it. How long has it been since you’ve done a uh a formal sitdown interview? You know, I it been a while. Been a been a long while. I had a conversation with um Jamie Harrison, who’s a former chair of the DNC, who’s a great friend, loyal, and I was down in South Carolina for other things and kind of like family down there. So, I sat down with him and talked about some stuff, but nothing like this. What made you feel like now’s the time for official unedited long form? Well, I don’t know when it is the right time or not the right time. I’m an admirer of your work and we have a mutual acquaintance. It didn’t take me uh much to agree to be really interested. I think you’re the work that you’ve done is is uh some of the most interesting commentary on the moment we’re living in. The expanded moment that we seem to be continuing to live in of the uh from 2020 on. I hadn’t seen much of the uh the earlier work that you had done, but I do know that I at least appreciate the um sincerity with which you approach everything that you do. I appreciate it. You said 2020 on. Do you feel like that’s the year the world kind of went crazy? No, I think that that’s the the the year that we all kind of woke up to the realization that things are crazy. But no, I I think that they’ve been going crazy for a while. And I don’t know whether crazy is the right word. I think that that um I don’t know how interested people are in my um my take on why I think the world is a little bit crazy right now. Well, I think there’s probably millions of people out there who just want to know how you’re doing. I personally it I’m I’m great. I tell everybody and Melissa gets kind of upset with me because it has been obviously a difficult time. You know, u the past 5 years have not at least from any outsers’s perspective been fun. But for me, as a person in recovery and being able to maintain that recovery through this and uh stays clean and sober throughout it, the one thing I allow myself uh to take some pride in. And I know about my life is that I survived almost certain death. And um I mean I I don’t know if you read my book, but it was pretty um transparent about it. having survived that hell kind of prepared me to be able to uh make it through kind of the the public humiliation that um I don’t know any other way to put it that I’ve experienced over the past close to 5 years now and it it doesn’t seem to stop but I’m more grounded in who I am and what matters to me and uh what I’m grateful for on a daily basis than I’ve ever been in my life and physically I’m in uh in a hell of a lot better shape than I was since my last uh drink or drug 6 years ago. So, it’s been 6 years. Yeah, just uh just over 6 years. When you say you almost died, can you kind of give us some more context? I was a a drinker. Um and at the at the end, my my addiction had progressed so much that it was potentially deadly on a daily basis. Um the the thing that was the most concerning and the the most real about you know facing death was in actuality the alcohol. Once you fall into that lifestyle and I I wouldn’t call it lifestyle because there’s no life to it at all. You enter a completely different world in which you’re living kind of completely outside of the the bounds of any communal uh norms. I don’t know. It it it’s a it’s a scary place to be. And I’ve met some of the most um truly heroic, astounding, thoughtful um kind people that I’ve ever met in my life that are living, you know, lives of quiet desperation. Not quiet, very loud desperation. But even in that, um found uh space in their hearts for empathy and uh kindness. And I’ve met some of the most awful predatory people that I’ve ever experienced in my life. So you feel that the thraws of addiction do often times swallow up very genuine earnest people but at the same time that underbelly is home to a specific breed of evil as well. One of the things that I’ve realized is that addiction is one of the most universal conditions. I don’t know many people that have not been impacted by it in some way. Whether it’s addiction to drugs or addiction to behaviors, they have the same dilatory effect uh on not just you, but more importantly on your immediate community, your family, and then it just spirals outward. And I don’t know anybody that hasn’t been impacted by drugs and alcohol in a really significant way or at least a way in which it’s created trauma in their own personal lives and the lives of those that they really love. And so while it’s universal um it’s something that we rarely talk about and it’s kind of the way in which we treat drug use uh as is it’s something that uh someone else is doing and that someone else happens to be your brother, your sister, your mom, your dad, yourself, your coworker and it only becomes a problem when it becomes a problem for you. Do you think that you would have been treated differently by the media if your addiction was to an opiate or perhaps methamphetamine as opposed to crack, which kind of has a racialized context to it? Uh, well, maybe I I don’t know. I because it depends upon what media you’re talking about because I don’t like what is the media, you know? I think it was just an added bonus for them that they could they could say crack addict and everybody would go, “Oh my god, he’s a monster.” So, I think for those that wanted to use it as a bludgeon, it just was it’s easier when you slap the word crack addict onto it, it made me a lot easier target for the Don Juniors of the world, you know, the Marjgery Taylor Greens of the world, just because of their inherent kind of meanness about things. Um, but I I’m not a victim here. I was crack addict, you know, I wrote about it, transparent about it. I’m naive to the idea that somehow that would be something that anyone or everyone would be able to fully comprehend and have empathy for. We’re lacking um empathy uh across the board, not just for Hunter Biden. But I I guess I was a little bit surprised in uh terms of a lot of people in the press, whether it was the New York Times or the New York Post, kind of dismissed um addiction as um somehow unique to my family or without taking into account what they were doing to other people that were looking to get clean and sober. One of the things about getting clean and sober, at least I found, I don’t know uh what your experience in your life or with your friends or others, is one of the um things that keeps us in the cycle of addiction is our guilt and our shame. Is the the lies we tell oursel and the lies that we tell the people that we care about the most. And you get clean and you get sober and what ends up happening is you still hold on to these secrets like I smoke crack. I was I was a crack smoker. they know that I did cocaine or they know that I was drinking, but they don’t know that I was also an ineterate drug user. And uh and so you keep that secret and it and that guilt kind of boils up and the only place that you can talk about it is in rooms full of uh virtual strangers. Um which is really helpful, but it isn’t the uh it it doesn’t release you from that awful feeling that I’m about to be found out and I and that anxiety. And so then you get triggered. Your brain tells you to do the only thing that it’s learned how to do is that you need to save yourself. And the way the fastest way to save yourself is a drink or a drug. So you get caught in this loop. And the favor that they did for me is I don’t have any more secrets. Now, not everything that’s been said about me is true, but uh but there are the the things that most people would be very embarrassed about. I’ve been very open about. I spent more time on my hands and knees picking through rugs um smoking anything that even remotely resembled crack cocaine. I probably smoked more Parmesan cheese than anyone. And so I don’t get triggered in the same way. But the thing that scares me is for people that look at the way that I’m treated in the media, whatever the hell the media is, and think, do I want to get honest? I mean, seems to me if you look at that as a test case, better to keep some things um unsaid. And I think that’s really dangerous for people, at least in my experience with recovery. As far as the media goes, what do you think are the three craziest things you’ve heard about yourself in the press? Oh my god, the list is forever and forever. They got stuck on for a while, even Fox News, that I funded the Wuhan lab. I said that to someone um a long time ago on camera as in response to a question like you just asked. And you got to say, you got to be really careful. Somebody’s going to be able to cut that and say I did not fund the Wuhan lab. I did. Yeah. Oh, you did? Yeah. Exactly. Me and George Soros supposedly me and George Soros are um have a lot in common. Um the one thing I’m positive we don’t have in common is that I am uh very very far from being a billionaire. But those conspiracies are are kind of the the craziest. You know, I just heard uh Jake Tapper is going on TV saying that, you know, I basically acted as the chief of staff. I think Hunter was driving the decision making for the family in a way uh that people he was almost like a chief of staff of the family. Does that strike you as pretty bizarre? I think I spent 12 days in the White House in the last two years of the administration. I had a lot of other things going on. I think the the the one that was like the you feel like you just got hit in the in the gut, you know, by an elephant. um is when Rudy Giuliani and Bernie Carrick went to the Newcastle County Courthouse here in Delaware and uh talked about me being involved in uh I think uh you know child uh sex crimes and stuff like that. And um I mean literally with no nothing. that one um is like was the last and the only one that was kind of hard to wake up from is like how how do you ever how do you ever um take that out of somebody’s uh head after they’ve heard it, you know, but I mean truly the list just goes on and on. Did you try to like sue for defamation or damages or anything after that? No. And um I mean I I I am in a defamation suit right now. I mean, one of the craziest ones is the is what Patrick Burn has said about me. And let me get this straight. He said that I was the the um the key person in ensuring that the uh sanctioned Iranian oil money that was being held in South Korea was released at the behest of myself and somebody in Pakistan. And I took a 10% fee off the $8 billion for my family. We have to give 10% to the big man. you’re the big man, I think. And then I had traveled to Tran and to the Middle East in 2022 and 2023 in order to affectuate this. And then that ultimately his followers made the direct connection that that money was used to fund Hamas for the murder of over 1400 Jews on October 7th. That’s the kind of stuff. And now I know you guys look and say like, “But who believes that?” you know, I don’t know the, you know, the million people that read that tweet. You know, I had one guy in California who is a um I don’t remember his name, but he’s associated with SpaceX, big big investor in SpaceX, a very very wealthy guy, claim just months ago that uh that I rented a house from him and that I trashed the house and I had the Secret Service stiff him on the rent and that I tried to pay him with a book of art made of my own feces. His ex- landlord claims he stiffed him on a whopping $300,000 in rent. What happens to the back rent that Hunter Biden owes my family? Is that pardon now? And you know, like how insane is that, right? You know, but you look into the background of this person and he’s a major major investor in SpaceX. He’s probably worth a few hundred million dollars and he has this huge following on X. Elon Musk retweeted that and went, you know, and went viral. It’s pretty messed up, man. There’s also some people though who just think that if you leave the country, you’re a spy. You know what I mean? Like why is he going so many places? Oh. Oh, me. Yeah. Oh, yeah. Yeah. Um, you know, I the the the really interesting thing is they created this a character that is both in in some sense a near well failed son uh that uh has not ever accomplished anything and a criminal criminal mastermind allin one. I kind of feel like, you know, pick one. most of my travel during that period of time when my dad was vice president and by the way I haven’t uh I didn’t travel anywhere when my um uh when my dad was president I don’t think I left the country but when during that time is that I was the chairman of the board of what’s called the US UN World Food Program and I was also chairman of the board of the Truman National Security Project chairman of the board of the center for national policy I was a professor at Georgetown University adjunct professor for over four years in the master’s program at the school of foreign service. I taught a course on advocacy um and largely based upon the implementation of an a thing called PEPAR president’s emergency plan for aid relief in Africa and as the chairman of the board of the uh US UN World Food Program. It’s kind of like what you know of like as a kid growing up like UNICEF. UN has voluntary aid organizations in which each nation state that is a part of the UN voluntarily contributes to the continued operations of UNICEF, UNHCR, UNESCO. All of these organizations are all voluntary aid organizations. UN World Food Program is the largest voluntary aid program in the United Nations and it is the largest humanitarian organization in the world. It serves over 80 million meals on a daily basis in 72 different countries and it is the first on the ground because it controls all the airlift and communications for all of the relief efforts globally in any natural disaster or civil war or conflict. And so the UN US uh is is responsible for about 65% of the um of the budget of the world food program which was my responsibility as chairman of the board and I increased the budget of the World Food Program which just won the Nobel Peace Prize 2 or 3 years ago by um 50% when I was chairman of the over my term to like $2.4 billion. It’s all gone now. Trump ended all of that. But point about traveling. So I went to the Philippines after Taipun Hyenne. I went to Kenya to Dav when refugees were flowing in from across southern Africa and Ethiopia. I’ve been to Syria, Lebanon, and Jordan. And I’ve been to all over the world. 75% of my travel during that period of time was on behalf of the World Food Program and other, you know, NOS’s that I worked on behalf of. So I want to back all the way up to the very, very beginning. Little short bio. We could do a long bio, too. So, you’re born here in Delaware or born here in Pennsylvania? Oh, in Delaware. Okay. In Delaware. Yeah. Wilmington. Wilmington. Yeah. 10 minutes from here. 15. What are your thoughts on Wilmington? Delaware. Nice place. Oh, yeah. One of the things that I I still do love about the East Coast and Delaware and the Mid-Atlantic is the history. And so, I’m um a little bit of a history geek. Yeah. Because Delaware doesn’t really get much representation because you got Philadelphia, powerhouse of history and culture. You got Rocky, a lot of other things going on there. two important stuff. And then we we agree on that. I’m basically living in the suburb of Philly. Yeah. Well, I don’t want to I don’t want to say that, but you got Baltimore, the wire. Yeah. You know, got people on horses in the streets out there, people on ATVs. And then Delaware is kind of sitting in between. People know that it’s a corporate tax haven. People know that the Biden family is from there. What’s something that people don’t know about Delaware that they should? Delaware is the first state. I don’t know if they should know this, but it’s the first state to ratify the Constitution. When Thomas Penn um basically colonized Pennsylvania, he carved out um uh Delaware and he called it the uh the the diamond in the jewel in in the crown of the of the colonies. Delaware is almost, you know, a state of almost all coastline. Here’s the thing that’s interesting about Delaware. Delaware is is geographically and historically and emotionally a both a southern and a northern state. So the northern part of the state is feels very much like Philadelphia. The southern part of the state feels very much like South Carolina. So do you see like Confederate flags in Dover? Maybe not do but definitely Gumbaro. You know, I think that the National Association for the Advancement of White People started in Gumbboro, Delaware. How are they doing? I don’t know. It was a long long time ago. Seems like they’re doing pretty well. I think they they probably had a real comeback. But um but that’s because Delaware was a slave a slave state that fought on the side of the um uh of of the Union and the Mason Dixon line actually Delaware is the only state and the Mason Dixon line does not bisect and that is because it starts at our western border the actual line for the Mason Dix line and in right in the middle of the state. So there’s three counties in Delaware and if you go below the canal you’re in the southern part of Delaware, Kent and Sussex. And you were born in the 70s. I was born 1970. Yeah. Wow. Yeah. Couple years after the summer of love. Yeah. My brother was born 1969, uh, February 3rd, and I was born uh, February 4th, 1970. Then my sister was a year and a couple months after that in ‘ 71. Now, I know that you’ve talked about this story before, but there was a tragedy pretty early on in your life. Can you kind of tell people what happened for those who don’t know? Uh, yeah. My dad got elected to the Senate on December 18th of 1972. So I was almost three years old. And my brother, myself, my little sister were with my mom and the dog in a station wagon and we were hit by a tractor trailer. My mother and sister was killed instantly. My brother and I were trapped inside the car, but they got us out and I had significant head trauma. My brother basically broke almost every bone in his body and was in traction and and we were in the hospital together for weeks and family and this community saved us and my aunts and uncles moved in with my dad and he figured out a way to be with us and be a dad to us and also be a senator commuted every day and so I grew up here. I spent a lot of time with my dad. My brother and I had this rule with my dad is that we could go with him whenever we wanted to. um uh and kind of no questions asked and obviously we didn’t take advantage of it otherwise it would have gone away but we were smart enough to do that but we spent a lot of time on the train going down to the Russell center office building with my dad and just to be with him we did everything together the thing about my mom and my sister dying and my brother and I being in that accident it’s like the realization that I have with addiction and being someone public is that I’m in no way unique you know everybody’s had a tragedy in their family. And when you’re in the in the public eye and and as transparent I think as my family has been about those tragedies and and uh whether we wanted to or not, you have this incredible wellspring of other people that come to you and want to talk to you about your own experience or their experience like how’d you get through it and like I had the same thing and you realize that we are almost all universal in that way is the one thing that binds each and every one of us is not necessarily love. People can go through life without being loved. It’s not um uh the only experience that we will all have between the time we’re born and then we die is pain. And um and being able to recognize pain is a is a thing that connects us all is a real gift. I think at least given me a lot of uh strength when I needed it. How do you feel that particular experience impacted you growing up? I don’t know. I think it’s something that’s a lifelong journey to be able to figure out what that kind of a trauma has on you. I don’t know. I mean, I used to fight against the idea that it had anything to do with my addictive behavior. Um, I don’t fight about that as much anymore. It kind of um uh makes sense to me in a way. I think some of the genetics make sense to me in a way, too. But in terms of that trauma and and how I see it today and the way that people responded, it’s all about the love that I um experienced during that time. I look back and I think of the way in which my family surrounded me. I I was given the gift of of having known and having two mothers that I consider my mom uh both of them, my birth mother and my mom now. And I feel incredibly lucky for that. Instead of uh thinking of it as some tragedy, I feel incredibly lucky that I had my aunts and uncles that literally moved in with us and I got the experience of having an extended family. My uncle is my best friend in the world outside of my dad and my brother and that um I don’t know whether we would all be as close if it weren’t for that. But you know I mean you come from a big Irish Catholic family. This isn’t like like oh wo is me. Yeah. You know I mean everybody’s gone through this. It was definitely a cultural kind of instinct to not allow ourselves to be defined by traumatic events and to take responsibility for the way that you know we’ve handled things that have happened. Oh yeah. I I think so. And I think ultimately at the end of the day, we all have to take responsibility. Um, regardless of the reason, the consequences uh aren’t always fair. But I think the the biggest question is is whether you use it as an excuse or do you use it as a um a catalyst to be more empathetic with other people and and also yourself. Yeah. That make sense? Yeah. And it sounds like the kind of double-edged sword you’re talking about or the flip side of the coin is that even in the wake of tragedy, the wake of tragedy allowed for your extended family like your uncles and stuff to become closer because they recognized that you needed like an extra layer of support. And so do you feel like without that happening there wouldn’t have been as strong of a bond within the family? I don’t know. I do know this is that my family um is just incredibly uh close-knit, but I can’t imagine that. I mean it obviously Yeah. I think your relationships are forged by the circumstances and the more dire and uh consequential the circumstances, the stronger the bond. I mean, I don’t know what your experience is. Um, but I do know this is that I feel very lucky. And the reason I feel very lucky is because this state, not just um not just my family, but the people in this state, it’s like when I was on trial here, I walked out of that courtroom after the conviction in Delaware in the gun case and the first thing I said to the group of people that were there, my family and and closest friends, is that how grateful I was. I mean, I’m truly grateful. It was like being able to go to your own funeral. I looked behind me and realized that no matter what, there was a whole courtroom full of people that knew who I was and I had a whole like a whole family of people that were like aunts and uncles to me. I felt lucky and I still feel lucky and I and I don’t take it for granted. I think in a lot of ways catastrophe reveals character. You know, you’re able to see how far someone’s willing to go to help you or how much they care about your well-being when things aren’t going well. Yeah. And I feel like you’ve had a couple different cycles of that throughout your life. Yeah. Feels like a never ending cycle of that, you know, but you know, I mean, it’s like I hope that at the end of the day, like look, I trying to figure out how to make uh as clear as possible. Addiction is not an excuse, but it is an explanation. There are consequences for people. um as you know or anybody that’s in Greek recovery or spend any time is regardless of whether those consequences are legal, financial, relationship wise or anyway is that you know that addiction and when I say addiction I mean alcohol too because I don’t know of any more destructive drugs drug than alcohol has there are consequences and I’m still appropriately paying the price for some of some of it or trying to to u make amends for uh stuff that are personal that I that that I believe that I still need to make amends for. I don’t believe that um there should be a continued that somebody should have to wear Scarlet A for the rest of their life. You know, it’s interesting the the way that people talk about addicts because if they just step back for a second and examine their own lives and the people that they idolize, I mean, I guarantee you at least 50 60% of them are are or were or are in recovery if hopefully or or uh experienced uh some level of addiction in their lives without kind of attaching um this um you know, scarlet a to everything that they How old were you when you first started, I guess, drinking or experimenting with drugs? Uh, I think the first time that I I I think I write about this. The first time I took a drink was a party where I I stole a glass of champagne and hid under the head under the table maybe 8 811 something like that. Okay. So before high school. Yeah. And but you know that was like I my first memory with alcohol was that I don’t think then I didn’t like continue drinking after that but I can remember that um distinctively. But then in high school was, you know, when I started to drink. I played football, so you didn’t, you wouldn’t really drink during the football season, but, you know, weekend drinking. Yeah. So, just like standard going out Friday, Saturday. Yeah. No, no. Like, no. Obviously, no crack. No, no, no, no. I didn’t, you know, I experimented with drugs in high school. Um uh but drugs as a uh as an issue did not occur until uh until crack. So it was just like you didn’t go from cocaine to crack. No, I I I not not it wasn’t as linear as that. And so what with me what ended up happening was when my brother was dying, he was dying in a very slow but certain way because he had glyobblast uh multifiform stage 4 cancer which basically you have a 2% um uh survival rate and even that 2% your chances of of being fully intact physically and uh and uh mentally are you know basically 0.2% 2% of people survive without, you know, their life, but almost a 98% certainty that you’re not going to live outside of two years. And so my brother never wanted to um uh really know those numbers. And so I remember, you know, I haven’t read all of the book, but the people giving me little synopsises of like this guy, Alex Thompson, who no reason anybody would know who the hell Alex Thompson is. He has this whole thing I understand in which he says that the Biden’s covered up those cancer diagnosis and I feel like saying what the [ __ ] are you talking about man you get a terminal uh uh diagnosis okay what do you do you accept it go home and die or do you say I’m not dying I’m going to be part of that 2% I sit down with the oncologist and the ancologist tell me that there are new procedures and there are new experimental things that they’re doing as it relates to X Y and Z at MD Anderson or at Sloan Ketering and I’m going to do that and I’m going to try that and I’m going to survive and I’m going to run for governor. My brother was the attorney general. He was no longer the attorney general. He did not run for re-election as attorney general, but he was considering running for governor at the time. When my brother would be asked, he’d say, “I’m I’m okay. I’m I’m okay.” And he’d keep doing his job and he would keep and he was in private practice at this time. And so what does Alex Thompson think my brother would owe [ __ ] anyone to say, “Oh, no. I’m dying. I’m not going to run for governor.” And why would he do that? Why would you give up on life? And it’s almost like you like I’m I somehow that this human being does not is not a human being. Like he has not experienced life. he has not had any um anyone in his life that has, you know, and I I find that really hard to believe in a day and age when I don’t know anybody that hasn’t had somebody in their family that has cancer. And so what do you say to them? Oh, you have cancer? Oh, so you going to go tell your boss that you’re that you’re dying and you’re going to you should quit now? No, you don’t. You go do your chemo. You do do your radiation. you get up in the morning and you eat better and you do go on a a different uh diet plan and you get experimental um uh procedures done and you fight and you fight and you fight. At least that’s what my brother did. Anyway, that my point being it was slow and I knew that there was going to be a real transition and I knew that there was going to be a uh in the entire family, not for any other reason than proximity. I was with them all the time uh as was his wife and as was his children and as was the rest of the family. But I was with him all the time and so I knew what every doctor was saying and what every and um and I stayed uh I was clean and sober through that period of time and you know off and on. I had had some relapses but I had gotten sober in 2003 from alcohol and uh and I was clean and sober basically for an 8-year period of time and then I and then I cycled in and out. But when my brother was sick, I was ostensibly uh clean most of that time. And when he died, it was a awful uh I mean, my brother kind of connected us all in a way that it was almost impossible to imagine him not being that glue. I mean, it’s the hardest thing of anything, anything I’ve ever been through. And I know people are close to the to the brothers and sisters. I’m not again I don’t it’s not going to be unique but the only dream that I ever had nightmare that I had as a kid was losing my brother like the one that you wake up in a cold sweat and I did and it was it was really difficult and my wife of 20 years stopped talking to me uh you know maybe 20 years of reasons not to have a relationship but it was pretty pretty awful timing and I fell apart and I went to rehab um uh almost immediately and I stayed in rehab for a long time uh for well inpatient outpatient for close to a year and between up in a place in Pennsylvania and then uh back in DC to be near my kids and uh was not wanted by my ex-wife back in in the house and so for the first time in 46 years I’m living alone I don’t have my brother the rest of the family is in this awful state of grief And uh we feel rulesless I think for the first time in my life completely ruddless and anyway long story short is I I kind of held it together for about a year and uh almost exactly a year to my brother’s death and then um I admitted that I slipped up with a drink and the doctor uh the outpatient program that I was in I was going to four times a day and getting tested. I said look I I um I drank. He said we want to test you anyway. And I said, “If you test me, it becomes a part of a record and I don’t want it as a part of a record because it’s not protected by HIPPA.” And he said, “Well, you can’t come back in if if we don’t test you.” And I said, “Well, this is what I did.” And they said, “It doesn’t matter. You’re telling us.” And and said, “We’re still we we need it for our records.” I said, “Well, [ __ ] you.” And I walked out and I walked out to the park across the street um in uh Lincoln Park in DC, which is not very far from the White House, which is I knew to be a, you know, kind of sometimes an open air, you know, uh drug market. And I saw someone that I knew from my past life is being in the streets, a woman that I referred to as bicycles. And I knew that it was kind of a uh a suicidal thought. I said, “Do you got any crack?” She sold me crack and then that was it. From there it just progressively got worse and worse. What kind of places did it take you? Physically it took me to uh um I mean like geographically it took me to some uh you know the worst parts of any city, town, state that you’ve been through. And you know, I mean, I know that you’ve been through these places. I I’ve watched, but you know, it takes you to um metaphorically and literally to the Super Eight motel off the highway, rooms for rent on an hourly or daily basis, you know, for tens of dollars. And that’s kind of where it takes you. Takes you to public housing, too. Yeah. And um not safe places, places people live, but you know, not safe places. How long was the run for after you saw bicycles? That was in 2016 and then uh May of 2000 June of 2016 about almost 3 years. Wow. Yeah. Now there were periods where I would stop. I would uh try to get help or half try to get help or appease people in my life and say that I was getting help. And so I did a whole host of different things to try to pull myself out of it. I I did try and people would come in and out of my web and try to help me and my level of toxicity would drag them down until they would kind of like uh disappear and then people that would uh come into my life that were nothing but blood sucking leeches that would literally saw vulnerability and latched on and drained me of literally every thing that I had whether from emotional well-being to my physical well-being to my um to my bank account And that was the eb and flow for almost three years until I met Melissa. The one thing that is true about it is that um as I said before, I met some people in that period of time that are living uh and have no escape. I had an escape. My family, I thought that I had burned all bridges. There was no exit. you know, I was um in a hotel in a big city and I don’t want to name it city and this drug dealer um uh who would pretended kind of to be my friend and would organize these, you know, uh things around me where they just would live off of me for like days at a time and they’d get hotel rooms and they’d bring people in and you’d be like a big party and I would find myself invariably kind of like trapped in the in the room and uh kind of trotted out um to deal with hotel security or whatever at any time. Someone had given me something and there was a spa tub hot like a big hot tub pool and they found me floating face down in the pool and this person saved me and I woke up after about 12 hours where they just held me. My whole point of the story is that this person put themselves at enormous risk. um to save my life for nothing other than to be human because every single other person that was there literally they stole the shoes off my feet, stole my clothes. I I’ve gotten over the fact that, you know, Matt Gates or Eric Trump is going to like use this story as another, you know, data point for like how [ __ ] up Hunter Biden is. But I don’t give a [ __ ] anymore. And what I don’t give a [ __ ] about it is because people even in the midst of their addiction, some people can be so incredible and generous and humane and caring and um I I mean this person had literally nothing to gain and I don’t I don’t even know their name, but they saved my and they sat with me and they nursed me back to health until I was good enough to be able to like you know get up and realize but I mean literally for what the the most likely outcome for them was that the you know the hotel like going to walk in and you know and I was dead and she gets that they get blamed for it. Yeah. Anyway, I guess my point is is that um I think I was worth saving and I think there’s millions of people out there that are suffering from addiction that are worth saving. You mentioned one thing earlier I thought was pretty interesting is that you know you would take breaks throughout this period of time. I think that when you’re in active addiction especially those tolerance breaks can give you the illusion of control cuz you’re like oh I’m just going to chill for a bit. I’m so good at you know moderation. Wow I’m the best. But in in your mind, you’re like, I’m chilling so that I can mentally be on board for the next vendor. Absolutely. You know what I’m talking about? 100%. And I mean, it’s the oldest story in the rooms, at least my experience, is that so many relapses start with the with the with the assumption that, you know, like, well, look, I I can smoke pot. Mhm. Or, you know, like I can drink beer, which is not hard liquor. Or, you know, I can drink, but I don’t but I’m not going to use hard drugs. or I can take prescription drugs and not drink. Yeah. You know, and um or like the very beginning, I remember when I first thought like maybe I should stop drinking so much. You’d say, “Well, you know what? I’m not going to drink for the month of January.” And I don’t know how many people that I know do that, but I would make it 10 days. And you say, “Well, I’m not going to drink for the first 10 days of January.” Yeah. And then it’s like, “Well, I’m not going to drink on weekdays in January.” Mhm. And then it’s like, well, I’m not going to drink on Wednesdays in January. And it’s like, [ __ ] it. But yeah, you know, you tell yourself that. And it’s the same with any um, you know, you get 30 days away from the drug, but you haven’t created any new habits, and you put yourself right back into the environment in which you were using, and all of your problems have just built up and build up and build up. And that anxiety comes crashing down on you, and you don’t have any outlet other than your brain. And this is the thing that people don’t understand is this. Why do addicts drink and drug? Because it works. Yo yo, what’s up everybody? Let’s take a quick break here and look at the media coverage of Trump’s executive order to rewired chemistry of my brain was telling me is that you’re going to die from like you cannot like you have to take care of this. I know the fastest way to take care of it. Best way to take care of it is a drink or a drug. Unlearning that is a really really difficult process. Did you find that you know a lot of addictions especially kind of comorbid. They go with each other. So you said alcohol was one. Do you feel like drugs and alcohol, specifically like stimulants and alcohol, work really well together, or did you ever find yourself smoking crack just without drinking? No. It almost invariably. I found with all the addicts I’ve had personal experience with over my life, whether it’s the the meth addicts with the benzoizipams or the cocaine users with alcohol. I mean, really hardcore addicts. Or when I say hardcore, what does that mean? Most people try to find like some kind of stasis in which they can withstand the downsides of whatever their addiction is, but it never works and it always falls out of balance. And uh you always overdo one and and don’t prepare enough for another. Let’s say this, alcohol causes more death and violence than every single other drug combined times five. Do you think a lot of that has to do with the normalization of alcohol culture or do you think it’s the the substance itself? Both. Because it’s like every everywhere you go you see Let me tell you about alcohol. One of the things my my dad never drank. My brother never drank really. And the reason that they didn’t isn’t because of some bad experience that they had with alcohol. It’s because they witnessed what alcohol did in the lives of the people around them. You’re not talking about like Irish ancestral memory here. I am kind of Okay, cool. That’s what I’m thinking. Yeah. No, I really am. I’m talking about like I think it is in our bones. I look up my family tree and one of the cool things about your dad becoming president is the Latter-day Saints who have the largest database of genealogy in the world. I have this really uh uh a lot of material on you know the both sides of the family, the Bidens, the Finneans, the Hunters and but mainly the Bidens and the Finneans. And you go back particularly on the Finnegan side and you see Francis W. Finnegan died age 32 consumption. All these people that that died age age age 39 left four children consumption and it’s it’s a catch-all disease and what it is is it’s alcoholism. You died of alcoholism. And the reason is is this is alcohol is the only drug that impacts every single organ in your body. So from your brain to your liver to your kidney to your spleen. It enters your bloodstream and it’s the only drug that you can die from withdrawing from. What about Xanax? Except for benzodiizopams which are in large quantities you can dam because it has the same impact that alcohol does on your body because once you withdraw it from your body it’s the only drug along with bzzodioipams that um can send you into seizures because your body is saying I need this to live and so it has tricked it so conclusively that the sugars of those alcohol in every single organ scream out and basically you you have seizures and die. The way in which alcohol as a disinhibitor works, you know, causes people to do some of the most ridiculous [ __ ] up things that you can possibly imagine. From what they do in terms of what they say to the car that they get in and get behind a wheel to the um anger with which they respond. Most people with alcohol, it simply is an amplification of their worst qualities. And your wife’s qual mine was never violence. And I I’m not going to judge what my worst qualities were, but maybe there’s delusions of grandeur. It was my worst things, but like that and it’s a really really toxic mix for me. It’s like extremely depressive nostalgia. You know what I mean? I’ll like hijack the touch tunes and play some song that makes me think of a different time. I’ll start getting really sad and talking about how I missed 2008. So your kind of most prolific bender was during the Trump era between 2016 and 2020 which I think is important to clarify is not when your father was in the White House. Exactly. Exactly. 100% not. There’s this conflation that people have. I mean, you know, I think they’re opening up an investigation to cocaine that was found in a cubby outside the the West Wing of the White House. I think it was Don Jr. Oh, you’re talking about old White House. Yeah. When my dad when my dad was there. Oh, so they blame they just got to blame you automatically. Yeah. I mean, they’re literally going to do an FBI another congressional investigation because they’ve convinced themselves that it had to be me that there was a little tiny am I guess my point of even bringing it up is is that no, I have been clean and sober since June uh of 2019 and I have not touched a drop of alcohol or or a drug and I’m incredibly incredibly proud of that. And why would you bring cocaine to the White House? Why would I bring cocaine to the White House, stick it into a cubby outside the situation room in the West Wing? Yeah. When I wasn’t there anyway, I like I mean this must who who the [ __ ] knows? And politicians, I mean they do they do blow, right? I testified before the House Oversight, Judiciary, and Ways and Means Committee. It was a whole big family shindig on the Republican side. All of them showed up from Marjgery Taylor Green to Lauren Boowbert to Matt Gates to, you know, they’re all sitting there. Now, none of them had the guts except for a couple at the very end to ask me any questions. At one point in the uh 7 hours that I was being deposed, and which by the way, I demanded that they do it in public and they refused. And the reason is is because they’re [ __ ] morons. Matt Gates of all people was giving me [ __ ] about my drug use. I said, “Really? All the people at this table, you’re going to talk to me about my addiction and my alcoholism?” And I said, “How many of you have had your own experience with alcoholism and addiction?” Because I knew at least four or five people in that room on the Republican side that were in recovery. And I knew of three that have been accused credibly of being drug users. And I knew that every single one of them had somebody in their family that was nec that was absolutely facing a serious drug problem. I think there might be a lack of understanding there because they think that cocaine is fundamentally different from crack cocaine. I don’t I I don’t know what they know. Do you know what I mean? Like Well, because they think cocaine, Scarface, very cool. Crack cocaine, they think the wire. Oh, in that sense. Oh, absolutely. You know what I mean? Like they don’t know how similar the chemical compounds are. Well, the only difference between crack cocaine and cocaine is sodium bicarbonate and and water and heat. Literally, that’s it. And those things are pretty much free if you go to like a science store. This is free. You You can go to a your neighborhood convenience store and just get Anyway, I don’t want to tell people how to make co how to make crack cocaine, but it literally is a managed jar of cocaine and baking soda. How different is the experience? Oh, it’s vastly vastly different. And like for real, I I I feel really reluctant to um kind of have some euphoric discussion. I know you’re not asking me to do that, but have some euphoric discussion about crack cooking. I think this might be kind of the opposite here. Okay. No, I It’s the exact opposite. I’m saying I don’t want to have the experience of some euphoric recall. That’s how powerful crack cocaine is. Does crack cocaine make you act any differently? No. Is it safer than alcohol? Probably. People think of crack as being dirty. It’s the exact opposite. When you make crack, what you’re doing is you’re burning off all the impurities so that it can bind with the sodium bicarbonate, which makes it smokable. That’s all. You know, all of these actors and, you know, people in the past that talked about they had a problem with cocaine and freebasing, they were smoking crack. So, straw on the stove is the same thing. Not exactly, but close to it. Um, but uh it’s a little bit different. But anyway, my point about it that your point about it, which I think is is true, is that there’s a thing about crack that is really insidious. And what it is is that anytime uh you know I think one of the reasons that they believe that smoking cigarettes is so addictive is because it combines three really important things. It’s habit forming. There is an oral fixation and there is a ritual combined with it. And so the idea of hand to mouth is a habit and a fixation that we learn very early even as children with a pacifier with a spoon with your thumb to even to breastfeeding. Okay. So that really so I and I don’t want to get into the psychology of it because I’m I’m no expert but I do know this is that you combine with that ignition combustion and then you combine the ritual. You have your cigarette in the morning. You have cigarette when you get out of the car. You have your cigarette with your coffee. Crack is that on steroids. It’s over and over. There’s ritual to it. There’s a ritualized part of it. The combination of all of those addictive behaviors together becomes like really powerful. And the drug in and of itself is a more immediate euphoric sensation uh connected to it than in my experience cocaine alone. Does it require more frequency to maintain the high? Yes. Yes. And the capacity to use more than you could otherwise with powder cocaine just physically to be able to ingest it. So you you’re kind of saying that cocaine reaches a certain plateau of euphoria where you can’t necessarily get any higher. My experience. Yes. This is like a PSA if you want to completely utterly [ __ ] up your life. You know, I don’t think that anything is necessarily, oh, you do it once, you’re addicted. But there’s about the closest thing that uh statement could be true would be with crack cocaine. Yeah. I mean, if you look at the impact in communities in the inner city in the 80s, it I mean led to an entire generation being destroyed, left without parental guidance and stuff like that. You know, when I went to I went to Y Law School and I had a professor Duke who is the one of the key voices in the country at the time from a policy perspective in a law perspective about um the inequities of our drug laws. And you could very much make an argument that by the way the Clinton crime bill that my dad helped architect was the consequences of what you call the crack wars during those period period of time the result of the war against crack cocaine or was it the result of the crack cocaine itself? I’m not saying that crack in and of itself is in any way safe or recommended. But the response to it I think was far more destructive in those communities than the actual drug itself. Which by the way, like all drugs, all addictions are completely dependent upon the way in which a community responds to them. Nobody gets clean and sober without community. Nobody gets clean and sober without um support. If you know the response is um you know met with just violence from the dealing to the um to the to the destruction. I don’t you know do you think that like looking back at the crime bill and stuff your dad and that kind of Oh yeah my point was when I was at Yale I wrote a my senior analytical uh thesis was on the disparity between crack and powder cocaine sensing that was in 1996 in which I mean we knew then and you know that’s when my dad became president he he did away with all of that and I think that Obama did part of it and he eradicated it all and then he pardoned almost everybody at the very end of his administration that had been swept up and were still in prison as it related to those disparities in federal sentencing. Obviously has no control of the state, but he hundreds hundreds of people were commut commuted sentences and were pardoned. And you feel like your paper at Yale kind of helped implant that idea in his mind and helped forward that cause. No, I don’t think he remembers my paper at Yale more than anybody remembers my paper at Yale. I think I’m the only one who remembers my paper at Yale. But I do know this is that at the very end I was a very very the The only the only thing that I can say that I truly weighed in on with my dad was on on that level and he and he was pushing on an open door. I think people forget the historic record number of people that he uh uh pardoned based upon the drug laws. Also, he uh pardoned Leonard Peltier or commuted his sentence from life imprisonment in Florida to house arrest at the Turtle Mountain Reservation. I would never more proud of my dad. And again, literally the only things that I advocated for were those were those things. Peltier and the sensing reform. Yeah. Yeah. We just did a report up in North Dakota about his homecoming event. And uh it was definitely interesting. I didn’t think it would happen. Hey guys, here’s a quick preview of our upcoming episode that’s being referenced called Leonard Peltier Comes Home. So, I’ve been studying his case and you have to realize there are elements that were inside of the FBI that still to the very end were very um threatening said that that there would be huge consequences uh within that community of the former and current FBI agents who still firmly believe that uh Leonard Peltier was responsible for the death of that agent. Anyway, so I I knew a an inordinate amount about the case and and had studied the case. I was in a course of a guy named Steven Bright who ran um the Southern Center for Human Rights, not the Southern Poverty Law Center, two different organizations, same same purpose, but the Southern Center for Human Rights, which mainly dealt with representing people on death row. one of the cases that we touched on um uh because I don’t think Leonard was ever taken off of death row anyway. We worked on Hurricane Carter’s case and I became friendly with Steven Bright who is a leading expert and unjustly imprisoned people and so we studied Leonard Leonard’s case. I was really really really proud because it was a really courageous thing that I think that my dad did by letting him out and I think some people take it for granted that you know why wouldn’t the president do that? This is the right thing to do. he was 80 blah blah blah because you have a lot of really really powerful people that can really mess with your life and particularly in this atmosphere by doing the right thing. What do you think is the uh biggest inconsistency in the government’s case against Peltier? the two cases that were held against his two accompllices who both were acquitted and the lack of evidence that was allowed in in Leonard’s case as related to the leadup to that event on Pine Ridge where the tribal police force along with the FBI had basically created a goon squad and over 60 individuals had been tribal members and living on the reservation had I think it was over 60 had been murdered by this like goon squad had been taken out or was it 60 or 16 I can’t remember the exact numbers But they were on a mission basically backed by the FBI and the judge never allowed all of that information which they had got into the case when uh when when Leonard was tried and I can’t remember all the other inconsistencies but one of the things that also was is that the woman that they said was Leonard’s girlfriend when they were able to extradite him from Canada to the United States. They used her testimony to justify the extradition from Canada. Once they got him back, she completely recanted and said that she was basically threatened by the FBI to say that she was Leonard Peltier’s girlfriend and that she witnessed the whole thing when in fact they hardly even knew each other. She had lived on the reservation but didn’t have any relationship to Leonard. But there’s a whole bunch of other inconsistencies. On a deeper level, what do you think it was about Leonard that scared the federal government in such a capacity? You know, that’s a good question. If you believed Leonard, then you had to understand the rest of the story of what the federal government was doing, which they were systematically murdering members of an organization that were setting out to highlight the injustice that was occurring on reservations across the country. I think that we are in such a ahistorical, is that even the the term time right now? I know why they want to erase history. I know why they don’t want to teach about the actual history of this country because to do so makes a lie out of almost everything that they are trying to achieve. And how could anyone see the way in which Native Americans then and now are treated on Pine Ridge by the federal government to the degree that they basically paid for and implemented a program to systematically murder those that were simply speaking the truth. Our government, the FBI, by the way, they were able to do much of it at his but all of the documentation was available. all of the communications were um available at the time of the trial and a judge wouldn’t allow that that that information to be um uh shared with the jury. Yeah. I mean because if you look at the bigger picture, American Indian Movement was just one of many groups they were targeting. Oh, absolutely. Maybe one of like 150. Yeah. Absolutely. Absolutely. 40 50 years later. What has it been? How long was it Leonard in 40? Uh something like 50. Yeah. Almost exactly 50 years I think. Right. 75. Why do we still hold on to that? Because it still makes a lie. I don’t believe in conspiracy theories in the sense of I don’t believe that the government has the capacity to carry out a conspiracy, you know, a a secret plan. It’s all in the open, man. There’s no conspiracy behind what ICE agents are doing in the streets of Los Angeles, you know, right now or, by the way, in the streets of Detroit or Chicago or Philadelphia or Tampa or whatever the hell they are, is that they’re openly terrorizing people for the purpose of scaring the [ __ ] out of them. You know, people look at this moment in time and they get this impression. I used to think it was hyperbole. I’m not so sure now. and the comparisons to 1930s and 1939 and 1932 and crystal knock and this is the time and are we before this are we after this and and you know I look at what we’re going through right now as more associated with a moment in our own history which was reconstruction you’re talking about for reference after the Civil War. Yes. From 1865 to 1877. What people don’t understand about reconstruction is that we just fought the Civil War. All of the of of the freedoms which the Constitution guaranteed was guaranteed for black citizens that had just been released from slavery. And people think there was this great migration. It all fell apart. The black population because of the weight of slavery or whatever other excuse you want to make kind of fell into this um communities of poverty and disenfranchisement, blah blah blah blah. Total [ __ ] Yeah. Between 1865 and 1877, the South Carolina state legislature was a majority black. I was going to say the state senate that was, I think at the time, based in Charleston was almost all black. Yeah. All black. And and and on top of that, because by the way, it is a vast majority African-American state after the Civil War in South Carolina, you know, and by the way, which was where the first slaves were delivered in the 1600s, right there in Charleston. And so what happened after the Civil War? this amazing thing, this amazing renaissance, these people that jumped in that have been in slavery for over uh 200 years. These communities are thriving and then you have in what was it? Uh Kfax, Louisiana. Is that where the first clan started? Not for the first clan started, but the first major lynching occurred in the sense of this is that you had in Kfax, Louisiana, you had black lawmakers that had gone in to secure the boat in this little town in the courthouse and white supremacists surrounded the courthouse and they rolled up a cannon and they said, “We’re going to kill all of you unless you come out and give up this effort to, you know,” and they’re all wearing masks. Part of them were the the local law enforcement. And so the black leadership comes out and they murder them all and then they go on a rampage and they kill 105 African-Americans in Kfax, a little town in Louisiana. What happens? Nothing. So the US government doesn’t do anything. The Union troops throughout the South won’t take any action. Local law enforcement and the state does not prosecute any of the people. And then the federal government does prosecute a number of the people, but the Jim Crow Supreme Court overturns their convictions. So nothing gets done. So what ends up happening that happens all across the South, all across the country is this campaign of violence, a campaign of intimidation. And by the way, remember what how many states at that time? 16 states, 18 states at the time. You had 14 members of Congress that were black. You had two United States senators that were black between 1865 and 1877. And then the door shuts because everybody gave in to the corruption of the Supreme Court, the corruption of the president. Johnson ripping the rug out from under the entirety of of Lincoln’s reconstruction plan. All achieved through violence, corruption, and making a complete and utter mockery of the of the Constitution. And there’s also this perception if you look at whenever segregation on public transport was codified with pie versus Ferguson, I think it was in 1902, there’s this perception because of the voting records of that time that most people supported it. People don’t understand, well, some people do, but the clan emerged as a voter intimidation force that was it wasn’t just simply terror for terror sake. That was a part of it, but it was to specifically target black area polling stations, voting booths. It did. And by the way, and that’s exactly what they’re doing right now. Whether it’s voter suppression through violence and intimidation or disinformation, it’s the same goddamn thing. It’s whether it’s an algorithm or whether it’s a cross burning in your yard. That is what we have fought. We are caught in this loop. It’s like the permanent reconstruction loop. Okay. The permanent Jim Crow loop is that every single time that we get closer to that idea, that promise, that potential of um a more perfect union, what ends up h [ __ ] happening is they come in and they shut the door down because there’s this there’s this evil symbiosis between money and power. So, what do we do? If I said to you, look, I’m going to tell you a story from the past. It’s about a minority group of people that live in a country. It’s constitutional democracy that has had its problems in the past, but it’s an economic powerhouse and it is the center of learning. It is the center of culture. It has a deep and rich history. But there is a minority group that the those in power that came into power through democratically elected means are going to target this minority group because they’re stealing all the jobs. Today, our cities are flooded with illegal aliens. Americans are being squeezed out of the labor force and their jobs are taken. They’re not originally citizens. They’re not the original people. When Mexico sends its people, they’re not sending their best. They’re not sending you. They’re not sending you. On top of that, they’re spreading disease and distrust. And they’re criminals and they could be violent. They’re eating your dogs and cats. They’re eating the dogs. The people that came in, they’re eating the cats. And what we’re going to do is we’re going to send mass men to this marginalized group and we are going to take them put them on planes, put them on buses, put them on trains, and send them to a prison camp in a foreign country. What am I describing right then? Am I describing Germany? Am I describing the United States right now? Because I will tell you what, if you think that the prison in El Salvador is not a [ __ ] concentration camp, you’re out of your [ __ ] mind. Tell me anybody that’s returning from there. You saw those pictures. Do you think anybody’s getting out of there? You know, is it a rehabilitation center? You think I’ve been to those places in South Sudan and around in those areas. You think anybody’s getting out of those South Sudan prisons ever? Ever? Out of your [ __ ] mind. That’s a [ __ ] That’s a death camp. They’re done. They’re over. And if you’re not dead, you would want to be dead if you were in that prison. And we just sent a bunch of people without due process. Some of them most likely legally in the United States. Like I think of that poor guy that they said was a gang member because he had a tattoo on his arm that was a makeup artist and they say he was MS-13. He literally a makeup artist that that fled I think what I’m I’m making it up Venezuela because of a dictator and came to the United States and sought asylum was received asylum. And they literally take this poor guy and they pick him up and he has a family and he has friends and he has an entire community and they give him no due process and they put him on a plane with maybe a bunch of other criminals and send him to that [ __ ] hellscape. He’s dead and nobody gives a [ __ ] And I mean it like we sit here and we talk about the one guy, the one guy because there’s a clear legal path to being able to get him back. What about all those other people? Am I not supposed to feel for someone? Am I going to be like all these Democrats say you have to talk about and realize that people are really upset about illegal immigration? [ __ ] you. How do you think your hotel room gets cleaned? How do you think you got food on your [ __ ] table? Who do you think washes your dishes? Who do you think does your [ __ ] garden? Who do you think is here? By the [ __ ] sheer [ __ ] just grit and will that they figured out a way to get here because they thought that they could give theirelves and their family a better chance. And he’s somehow convinced all of us that these people are the [ __ ] criminals. White men in America are 45 more times likely to commit a [ __ ] violent crime than an immigrant. And the media says, “Well, you got David Axelrod and you know Rahm [ __ ] Emanuel was so so [ __ ] smart Rahm Emanuel.” He said, “We got to understand that these people are really mad and these we got to appeal to these white voters.” Rom the only people that [ __ ] appealed to those [ __ ] white voters was Joe Biden, 81 years old, and he got 81 million votes. And he did because not because he appeased their [ __ ] Trumpian sense, but because he challenged it. And he said, “You can be an 81-year-old Catholic from [ __ ] Scranton that doesn’t understand it, but still has empathy for transgender people and immigrants.” Then nobody said, “Oh, Joe Biden’s going to turn us into a socialist state, no matter how much they said it.” But these guys think that we need to run away from all values in order for us to lead. I say, “Fuck you. How are we getting those people back from [ __ ] El Salvador?” Because I’ll tell you what, if I became president in 2 years from now or four years from now or 3 years from now, I would pick up the phone and call the [ __ ] president of El Salvador and say, “You either [ __ ] send them back or I’m going to [ __ ] invade.” It’s a [ __ ] crime what they’re doing. He’s a [ __ ] dictator thug. B Kelly or Trump? Both. Yeah. The craziest thing to me is especially interviewing migrants and like hearing about the journey they went through to get here. You got some people who walked for 30 days through the deserts of Mexico into the Arizona desert in 110°ree hot summer. Their feet are bleeding. They have a gallon of water. There’s people dropping dead while they’re walking who they physically cannot stop to help because they are so determined because the coyotes trafficking them will kill them if they stop to. And they finally get to the US just to do menial labor. And you have people saying like do it the right way. It’s like trust me if there was an easier way they would have done anything but that. And secondly, I feel like anybody who goes to that length to get here deserves to [ __ ] be here. I mean, deserves to be an American. Like, we didn’t do [ __ ] to get here. I mean, I’m sure at some point like our great-grandparents did get on the boat from Ireland and we’re like, “Fuck, I don’t know what’s going to be over there.” But it wasn’t like the grueling conditions that people experience on the way here. And it’s just the lack of humanity and also the lack of understanding as to how American corporations economically dominate those countries and how US intervention has created unlivable conditions there too and are the are the incredible beneficiaries of that new blood that enters our the our bloodstream year after year after year. only thing that makes us different from [ __ ] China or Russia or anywhere else or Europe or anywhere. And the only reason that we that I believe that we as America are different beyond the fact of the idea of the constitution, the idea that we represent is immigration. I I can’t even believe sometimes I’m having this discussion with anybody. How do you think that we are reborn every generation? How do you think that we attract the smartest people in the world to to to the United States of America? Through immigration. I mean, you sit here and I mean, like, just think about it. You got some [ __ ] who’s made over what, $251 billion being a United States citizen that got here and stayed here illegally before he got his citizenship, sitting here lecturing us on who we should allow into the United States of America and giving us a [ __ ] hile Hitler along the way. Are you [ __ ] kidding me? And talking about how gangs are like a threat that’s going to come here from other places. I’m like, MS-13 started in a Korea town in in LA. Yeah. Not to mention like the US prison system invented gangs. Yes. Like we are basically like the creators of worldwide gang warfare. Like the styles, basically everything about it. And so it’s just crazy the idea that like we’re going to build a wall. Yeah. To keep gang members out. Yeah. 21 Savage is on uh Saturday Night Live. Yeah. Exactly. Or you know, or we we sit here and watch Sons of Anarchy. It’s just such [ __ ] It’s just such racism. It’s just so easy pickings and it just makes me so angry. Have you read that the quote from Dietri Bonhopper? No. It’s a cool name though. I wish it was my name. Dietri Bonhopper was a philosopher in the 30s in Germany. He fled Germany, but he went back to be a part of the resistance inside of Germany against the Nazis. He was a devout Christian and real intellectual writer and thinker about how to apply the principles of Christ in your everyday life and in society. and he wrote this piece about the Third Reich and um and of course he was imprisoned and murdered by the SS and he wrote this quote and I don’t I’m paraphrasing but basically it says is that the real problem and he was obviously was in the context of what was happening in the world at that time is not evil you know it’s kind of like you know Hannah’s you know the finality of evil you know what I mean when she witnessed Ikeman trials and Ikeman himself it’s like evil is boring The real problem is stupidity, is ignorance. Because how do you defeat ignorance? you can point out to people that are willing to hear of the evil of someone and I and I mean this sincerely. I don’t know anyone personally that if you took Steven Miller isolated and you played a clip of the things that he says every day we arrest another alien they let into this country who raped a child who beat a woman. quote, “All the kinkyhaired, sworthy skk skinned, long despised phantoms, all the teeming ants toiling for the white man’s comfort and his little physical demeanor and not be able to say there’s something [ __ ] up about that motherfucker.” However, how do you identify and change the mind of someone who is so ignorant that they cannot discern between a fact and an outright lie? Which brings me to the one conspiracy that I believe in. Why some I believe in some, but really is that I’ve watched your [ __ ] You believe in more than one. That’s true. But modern conspiracy theories and that lore that often convinces dumb people they’re doing important research is the true conspiracy because freedom and understanding would be reading alternative histories, reading actually digesting information and processing crazy things in the world and also like you said coming to terms with the chaotic and unknown variables that lead to some of these situations. Wait, explain that to me again. What’s the So what’s the conspiracy in that? The conspiracy is that most mainstream conspiracy theories, flat earth, chemtrails, QAnon, all that stuff is deliberate misinformation to convince dumb people that they’re doing important research and keep them away from the truth, which requires a higher Oh, I totally believe that. Like look here, I give you I give you the hierarchy of things. You have Steve Bannon. If you want to understand what the intellectual direction of what uh the we’ll call it the MAGA movement is, just listen to Steve Bannon. He spells it out. He says flat out. He says that he’s going to bring the war that they’ve known for a long time that if you the the war for the United States of America is going to be won on the streets of Los Angeles. Steve Bannon flat out said that you know what we’re going to do before the election was even over. He said that we’re going to contest the election. We’re going to say that the mailin ballots were fraudulent and we’re going to contest the election and we’re going to go as far as we can and we’re going to break the institution as much as we possibly can. almost 100% believe strongly that the 2020 election was stolen and we’re not going to allow this to be stolen in the canvasing room and we’ll break the courts and we will break Congress and we will break the Constitution and he he lays it out exactly what he intends to do. My point being is on on the hierarchy of that it goes from Steve Mannon to [ __ ] Alex Jones and Alex Jones talks about the flat earth and he talks about the I mean what whatever Alex Jones talk about I eat babies I eat them every night with barbecue sauce and I flew to the moon last night with a witch and I took DMT with Easter bunnies. Sandy Hook and things like that. This holy alliance has come together because of one one really big reason. They’ve all figured out how to become incredibly [ __ ] rich because of it. So maybe the conspiracy isn’t, you know, Russia telling people what to do and how to think. It’s just profit incentivized content creators farming outrage through these ridiculous conspiracies. Yeah. And and yeah, I have like for instance um what is that what’s that thing called? It’s a technique that the Russians perfected and of course they had like a term of art for it. Neural linguistic programming. NLP neural linguistic. No, no. It’s it’s more along the lines is that if you say the most outrageous thing possible about someone or a group of people that by the time if you say it over and over and over again, Rachel Maddo did a whole thing on it. I can’t remember the the term of art. We’ll put it on screen. Basically, here it is. And they did it. This is how I’ll give you the example of how they did it. The way that they did it is in when Vladimir Putin came to power after Yelson in the early 2000s. Okay? Remember? And everybody looked at him and he said, “Hey, this guy may be okay. He is a um he’s a technocrat and he is um and he’s really smart and he has seemed to be able to quell all of these you know and control all of these oligarchical tendencies that are occurring. And so what he systematically did is he eliminated all potential disscent from with inside of Russia. And the way that he did it to many people was he took people that were of good stock that were decent human beings that were family people and he accused them of being pedophiles. Everybody said, “What are you kidding me?” And he just it didn’t matter. They would send out these things. They say they’re pedophiles. They’re pedophiles. They’re pedophiles. Use loyal press organizations to distribute that. Yeah. or just you know at that time as that time goes on in whatever way that you distribute it to the point that what he did to a couple of them including one guy I just saw an interview of him it’s an oligarch he made it to London they planted pictures on his laptop London police raided him and he spent 5 years defending himself and I forget what it’s called but this my point being is is that I believe in those conspiracies I believe that there is a real conspiracy in academia uh to not actually tell um you know the true history of the United States or of you know of global history. Interesting thing about erasing history is it’s only possible when you create a monolith out of the past like capital P past. Like I always think about the way they do that. If you watch some of like the Charlie Kirk debates, he says, “Well, why should we talk about the past? I’m trying to move forward to the future. Don’t be a victim. Don’t feel bad about things that happened.” And it’s playing on like a trope in psychiatry that you should just move on. But they’re using it to like cut the connective tissue between the present and the past. So they want you to believe that the past has no connection and nothing that was done by the ancestors or anybody else or even the older people of today has any coherent connection to modern times and we need to be utopian and look forward because looking back will only cause that trauma to repeat itself and it’s just total [ __ ] Yeah, it it almost invariably ensures that we’re going to repeat the past. Yeah, it almost And by the way, that isn’t that the point. Hey guys, it’s me again. So, obviously like that’s when your personal affairs kind of took center stage as far as the media cycle goes. You also mentioned before we get into that that your sobriety date was before the 2020 election cycle. When exactly do you think you had your last go? Officially June 1st, 2019. Oh, so pretty significantly before. Yeah. And you met Melissa? Right around then? Yeah. Yeah. I met Melissa in the beginning of May. We got married in the middle of May. I tell the story and you know I and I’m and I have enough uh sense to recognize that if I was being told this story by my daughter in real time, I would say you’re out of your mind. It was a miracle that I found her. I met Melissa and within literally an hour I was telling her my whole unvarnished life history in the immediate problems that I was facing, which was crack addiction. She literally said, “Well, that ends now.” And it did. I mean, it not that minute, but um over the next 2 weeks. And then I asked her to marry me and she said yes. And I said, “Well, why wouldn’t we do it right now?” And so we literally called Justice of Peace to the house. She came and she married us. For me, it was a miracle. For Melissa, the really hard part started then in the sense of like, you know, getting clean and sober’s not easy. It’s even harder on the people that love you. And if they’re that support system, it is it’s a full-time job in in that immediate period of time because, you know, as I said to you before, the dangerous part is withdrawing from alcohol and it could be kind of scary. and she went through all of that and she went through the entire process with me and she did things that I I wouldn’t allow anybody else to do. I saw Emily as somebody that without any history between us looked at me with as much love as I looked at her and I accepted that love in that moment and a lot of it was tough love. Like I mean she took my car keys, she took my um wallet, she I mean she took my clothes for a period of time so I couldn’t leave the house. The way you took your clothes I didn’t have I didn’t have anything. I mean, like it would have been impossible. We were living in the Hollywood Hills. There was nowhere to go. And if I could go anywhere, there’s nothing to buy anything with. So, so I can remember covering the 2020 election about a year later, and I think it was the first stop the steel rally at Reading Terminal Market in Philadelphia, and I saw what I thought was a BLM flag, Black Lives Matter, but it actually said Biden’s laptop matters. Oh, yeah. And so I asked the guy, “What the hell does that mean?” And he just sort of kept yelling the slogan over and over again. Couldn’t get much out of him. Yeah. So, for those who don’t know what happened with that, well, I don’t know. You tell me. And I really mean that sincerely. Like, you’ll have a lot of people that will come up with something about the laptop, but I always say to anybody. I mean, you’re steeped in the in and just through your work, the right-wing narrative around it. And my question to anybody that is keeping an open mind is what is it that you think the laptop proves or what you call the laptop? So, everybody has a laptop. So, when they say Hunter Biden’s laptop, what is it that they’re talking about? Do you know? Well, I know that you uh your entire iCloud was connected to it. All of your personal text messages, private photos, all that kind of stuff. Like everybody’s laptop. Yeah. And you left it with a repair shop owner who for some reason gave it to Rudy Giuliani. Not exactly sure how that’s legal. He distributed it to the press, particularly. I think the New York Post was involved in the spearheading of this uh mass dissemination of your private materials. From what it seemed like, it was a lot of private text between you and your friends, family. Your entire sort of private life was on there. Yeah. And again, so everybody has a laptop. Everybody has a No, no, no, no, no. Not everybody has a laptop. Everybody has a digital life. Almost everybody has a digital life. Everybody has a digital life pretty much. And that includes voicemails and pictures and test messages and emails and location data and you know everything. Every everybody you do you do everybody that is here right now by whatever means they got my digital footprint going back decades 20 over 20 years. Again I like I ask anybody you you’re steeped in this and and this isn’t a challenging question but it kind of makes my point. What does my laptop prove about criminality or anything other than what I have had already readily admitted to completely transparent about is my drug addiction? Well, I’m trying to remember specifically what the most radical conspiracies that I heard. I think that a lot of people are concerned or curious about various international business dealings. So I served on the board of well over a dozen different entities um way way more than that including major global organizations was vice chairman of the board of of uh national passenger rail corporation which is otherwise known as Amtrak. It’s the largest passenger rail company in the world which is more than just a rail company. It’s also a real estate company. It’s also a commercial real estate company. It’s residential real estate company and it is probably uh the largest owners of property in urban metro centers of any organization in in in the country and a huge employer and a multi-billion dollar business and I was the chairman of the corporate governance committee on that board and vice chairman and elected chairman and then resigned before the Obama administration took as I told you before I was the chairman of the board of the US UN World Food Program responsible for sustaining a budget above $2 billion a year for the world food program and the contribution the United States makes to the global uh relief effort as it relates to hunger. I was chairman of the board of the center for national policy was on the board of Catholic Charities. I was on the board of Jesuit Volunteer Corps Northwest. I was on the board I I mean I keep going down the list of board memberships that I had. And a year and a half before um my dad was to leave office, uh I was approached by a Ukrainian natural gas company um through one of their board members to uh uh to consider being of assistance to a company that was being threatened by the Russian aggression and the invasion of Crimea and the incursions into Daetsk and the Dombas. and I took them on as a client because I was a partner um of council excuse me at um Boyce Shiller Flexner which was a major national global um uh law firm in which I focused on corporate governance and commercial law and I represented them for about a 3-month period of time and through that representation they asked if I would join the board which I did. The day that I joined the board, I announced it and sent out a press release um uh of the reasons why that I was joining the board of which um came and went and did not become an issue until Rudy Giuliani along with uh a guy named Andre Durkatch and uh a number of others that have all been convicted of treason for being Russian agents came up with a conspiracy that Joe Biden was involved in a in a bribery scheme. The FBI arrested the person who offered those allegations for falsifying the his testimony and to the FBI for over a 10-year period of time. I worked with a group of people that had a crossber private equity firm inside of uh China and I had a a a business that was based around um uh um advisory for multinational global um funds, private equity funds, doing infrastructure work and others. And I was asked to join a fund, the startup inside of China that was uh had a headquarters in Beijing, Shanghai, Hong Kong, and New York. And um I had a 10% equity stake in that of which I paid um I I made my my equity contribution in that just like every other member of that. Federal officials are looking at his foreign business dealings, including his ties to a Chinese energy company. And those are my two Yeah. Yeah, foreign business. Yeah, cuz I was kind of looking into it and it seems like the conspiracy is that through those connections that you had to these uh I guess foreign governments, they were using you to leverage pressure on to your dad’s like what? Well, that’s the thing is that when you’re looking I’m not putting you on the spot and I guess my whole point is is that I ask these same questions to the House Oversight Committee. I’ve been investigated by the House Oversight Committee, the House Ways and Means Committee, the House Judiciary Committee, the Senate Judiciary Committee, the Senate Oversight Committee, and I have been investigated by Main Justice, the US Attorney in Pittsburgh, the US Attorney in Philadelphia, the US Attorney in District Columbia, the US attorney in Los Angeles, US attorney of Delaware, the special counsel’s office. Not one single person has ever accused me of a crime based upon anything that was in or discovered as it relates to my laptop. Not one. Not a single thing about my laptop. So this whole idea that there was some conspiracy to cover up the laptop, they uncovered 20 years unvarnished of every single communication that I have ever had over a phone um or by text or over email or computer in any digital way. There’s not one communication that you can even remotely say is evidence of a crime. Not one. Not one time, not one communication I would challenge anybody to show one instance other than me um seeking drugs for myself, my own personal use, okay, or women as it relates to uh you know uh people that were in the drug trade that I would seek for the purchase of drugs. One single instance in which anyone has accused anyone used any one of those communications as evidence of a of any any kind of crime at all. Now take that. Okay, that’s it. So you say Biden H 100 Biden’s laptop. What I I By the way, I’m and I’m I’m talking out there to to my to people that I would assume are, you know, or or want to be on my side or at least want to be on the side that I’m that that I’m a part of. What about Hunter Bayan’s laptop? How about this? Well, it was a cover up. Twitter took it down and it was a big cover up, you know, and you have Matt B Tibbe and all these guys who say, “Yeah, it was a, you know, that Twitter took it down and Facebook took it down.” It seems that big tech only senses media companies only censor stories when they’re negative towards the Biden campaign. You know why they took it down? Because what they did was they published naked photos of me and women, which is in violation of their terms and which by the way is a criminal act under the new federal law that was passed by Melania by accredited to Melania Trump with universal support in the House and the Senate. That’s why they took it down. It wasn’t a cover up. And then you had 100 former national security officials come out and say this looks like it could be a Russian op because it is. Because in the course of an election, what happens? You have Rudy Giuliani in conjunction with Steve Bannon in conjunction with Miles Gao who’s in jail who is I don’t know how many other counts of fraud and and and and bribery and is a you know a Chinese national was working directly with Steve Bannon and a number of others including Bernie Carrick who god rest his soul is dead that basically came out and you know said we have Hunter Biden’s laptop and The big reveal about Hunter Biden’s laptop was that I was a crack addict. But, you know, unfortunately for them, I had already admitted that I was a crack addict in the pages of the New Yorker and did a, you know, 13,000word article with Adamos in which I told everything about myself and my own struggles. And they just simply conflated the two. They said, “Well, Joe Biden fired the prosecutor in Ukraine to benefit his son.” Completely debunked. person that said that I took a bribe for that happens to be a guy named Shoken who is in prison for lying to the FBI on a form FD 1023 in prison admitted to it admitted that he was enticed into making it up on behalf of the Trump ad the Trump’s the Trump team aside the only other guy that came up and said that there was uh illegal um uh and wrongdoing and bribery was a guy named Gal who was later convicted or and an abstentia both um by the EU and as a uh arrest warrant out for him for Interpol and the the United States as a arms dealer selling Chinese weapons to the Iranians and to the Libyans and so again I ask so so Hunter Biden’s laptop so what so what it sounds like it was just became political cannon fodder to you know make that election cycle as colorful how do you defend yourself against it though so Somebody says, “Well, let’s start with the fact that your private photos were leaked by somebody that was supposed to be repairing your laptop.” Some people will go, “Well, hey, wait a second. Aren’t you just leafing through someone else’s private property?” Uh, it can be perceived that way, but again, he hired me to do that. Number one, I literally have no memory of ever dropping my laptop off there. Okay. He uh this guy swears that I did. Okay. Regardless, to your point, okay, this is Wilmington. that laptop repair shop is in trolley square. I had family that owned a um a business uh that was literally the opposite side of them. There are literally within a stones throw of where that person is in a very very small community at least a dozen people directly related to my family. Every night he used to go to uh two or three different bars in which he could have literally turned and and talked to anyone and said, “Do you know how to get in touch with Hunter?” You’re talking about the laptop repair. The laptop repair guy. Somehow that doesn’t happen. But somehow this guy who’s supposed to be repairing a laptop, he says, decides what he’s going to do is he’s going to review the material and what he sees is he thinks is evidence of a crime. Mcizac says he also found documents that show payments made to Hunter Biden from a Ukrainian energy company that have become the center of a political firestorm. More emails from Hunter Biden’s laptop keep surfacing. I want to know where Hunter Biden’s laptop is. Let’s get the truth. What’s in this laptop? Now, again, the evidence he thinks is of a crime is my drug use. He thinks it’s embarrassing. And all of a sudden, who ends up with my laptop? The one person in that moment in time that had more to gain than anyone else? I got the hard drive legally, completely legally. Why are they worried about how I got it? Why don’t they just say it’s untrue? Rudy Giuliani and his lawyer on behalf of Donald Trump. How is that is that possible? Is that just happened to happen? You think that somebody that knows you may have been paid off to orchestrate some kind of data? I don’t know. And but at this point it’s like who cares? So then I start ar then I get in an argu about like okay well who who took the laptop? How did the laptop disseminate? Was there really a laptop? Because there really isn’t. By the way, here’s another anomaly of this. There really isn’t a laptop. There’s a hard drive. And then there’s an amalgamation of a hard drive. There’s an original hard drive that said he says he has. And he argues with everybody else who says that there are like 400 GB more that were added on to that from a um uh from the dark web. You never got a laptop before you wrote that story, did you? That’s correct. You got a hard drive. Hard drive. And you received that hard drive from Rudy Giuliani, right? Yep. Okay. who had been openly associating with an agent of Russian intelligence in the months leading up to your story. You agree with that, right? Uh, I guess. So, you think the repair shop story is made up? I think I I don’t know. But all I know is that whatever this amalgamation of stuff is came from a whole host of different sources. Yeah. Because you literally you can look at it now and the stuff that like who thinks this is right? Who thinks it’s right that every picture that you’ve ever taken, the ones that you would be embarrassed by and the ones that you would be proud of, should be on a website controlled by a guy that is cristofascist [ __ ] incel that lives in Indiana or Illinois, I forget which one. Let’s hope Indiana cuz it’s worse. But really, who who comes up with a 435page dossier about all the crimes that it details? But literally, it just is a I mean, it is it is an entire fiction that makes money off of who thinks that’s right. And so, but again, I get these discussions where how did the laptop how did the laptop the laptop really doesn’t exist, but what so what is it like? You go down these rabbit holes and you do exactly what they say. As long as they say laptop loud enough often enough, you automatically and Hunter Biden crack crack cocaine and you know here’s the picture and here he is shirtless smoking crack in a bathtub and you know I keep flashing that over and over again and I say Hunter Biden laptop Ukraine China Ukraine China Hunter Biden laptop bird flu like literally you you keep doing that over and over and over again. What? like none of it is bears any resemblance to reality. The reality is this. I ran into legal trouble based on two things. One is I failed to pay my taxes on time during the worst time of my addiction. Remember I said to you that I started in the downward spiral of my life and I did not come out of that until May of 2019. When I came out of it, I immediately started to try to pick up the pieces of my life and put them back together. And like anybody that comes into recovery, you don’t come into the rooms of Alcoholics Anonymous or anywhere else. You don’t come in on a winning streak. Nobody comes in like just haven’t won the lottery. Everybody’s on the balls of their ass to come in and they got a lot of things to clean up in their life and some worse than others. Mine at this point, you know, was uh about relationships and my finances. And one of the things that I realized is that my accountant had died. I go to get a new accountant. I figure out how I’m going to pay for the new accountant. And they they go to get the transcripts of my previous taxes. And they say, “We don’t have any record of your taxes being filed. 2016 and 17, which would mean the years 2017 and 18, like the worst years of my addiction.” Now, for 15 years of my life, I had my own business and I had a partner and I had an accountant and I had an a staff of people that did my, you know, did my taxes like I somebody else did my taxes. They had authorization to sign my name and send my taxes in and they had a tax account and they would pay it out of the tax account because it would be withheld from my income. That all [ __ ] completely fell apart when I was smoking crack every 15 minutes and my business failed. My the people in my life left, my wife divorced me, it all went away. And when I realized that my taxes had never been filed, they’d all been filled out, signed, checked attached, but never filled and never sent in because that was my the final step of my responsibility. I realized that I didn’t I filed my taxes and I paid penalties and interest. That’s one thing. Second thing is I in 2018 went and I bought a uh I was here in Delaware. It was a period of time in which I was uh I had one of those times that I was trying to get clean and sober and I had just come back from a rehab. I came back here. I went to get my phone replaced at AT&T. Next door there was a survival gun shop and I went in and just to look around while my I was waiting for my phone and on a whim I bought a uh I bought a handgun, put it in my truck. Somebody in my life thought I was going to hurt myself with it. threw it in a trash can and I made them go back and try to find it. And when they couldn’t, I told them that they needed to call the police and file a report that the gun had been lost. The gun was recovered. It had never been loaded, never been fired, was in my possession inside of a lockbox for a total of 10 days. They charged me with tax evasion, 13 different counts in three different jurisdictions jurisdictions. By the way, 50 million over 50 million Americans a year pay their taxes late. There are over a hundred billion dollars in taxes that there are identified people that have not paid that have failed to pay their taxes for over 5 years. Okay? There’s a box that you check and that box when you go to purchase a gun says that you’re not addicted to a narcotic illegal substance including marijuana. And I checked that box because in my mind it was a state of mind question. Are you in the moment right now addicted to any any uh illegal drug? Well, even though it had not been in the commission that used in the commission of a crime, even though there never ever fired the gun, even though I’d never bought it with the intent to do a crime, even though people buy guns every single day obviously that smoke marijuana and it is equally against the law to check that box if you do or to own a gun if you smoke marijuana on a regular basis in any way. They charge me with three different counts that let that could be up to 30 years in prison. Those are the two things. And this is obviously a special counsel that had come to an agreement with me and a plan in which I would have a diversion agreement and a plea agreement and they blew it up on purpose at the behest of the rightwing. I got sober in 2019. So the acknowledgements in his own words he read his audio book are that hey I was not sober when I was I was not off drugs when I was purchasing that gun which is illegal. My whole point of all of that is that was the culmination of years of investigating me. Nothing about Ukraine, nothing about a laptop, nothing about my father, nothing about bribery, nothing about China, nothing about children, nothing about nothing. None of it. I’m on your team. No, I know you are. And I and and and I and I get so tired of h not I’m not saying to you, but it’s just like like it’s just it’s like spitting into the wind, man. Like what’s the point? Like it is just like how do I fight against New York Post? How do I fight against Fox News in their echo chamber? No matter what I say, they can say whatever the hell they want to say and they know it. They absolutely know it. They can say whatever they want to say. For over a year, I was the number three most spoken about person on Fox News without having done anything in three years. Like me personally, I have not left the country. I had not left the state of California. I had not left my house on on more than, you know, uh, you know, two or three occasions for the simple fact of not being harassed. I literally sat in the garage by virtue of my choice and my desire and painted for 3 years. And then they and and then they accused me of crimes for painting. What do you mean? Well, that I couldn’t sell my paint. that it was a clear conspiracy to launder money and to curry influence by selling acrylic on canvas abstract painting by Hunter Biden. How do you prevent a purchaser paying too much so as to ingratiate themselves with the first family? All of a sudden, the Iranians are going to change their nuclear weapons program. I mean, it’s such [ __ ] insane [ __ ] Meanwhile, these [ __ ] with Trump mobile, we’re going to be introducing an entire package of products. They’re selling gold telephones and sneakers and $2 billion investments in golf courses and selling tickets to the White House for investment into their memecoin. Overnight, President Trump returning to the White House after a black tai gala for the biggest buyers of the Trump cryptocoin. The Qataris give him a jet and the Amiradis put $2 billion into their cryptocurrency and the Saudis are going to build a tower. And I mean, and by the way, that’s just what we see. And I even hate mentioning my name in that because either I am the biggest [ __ ] [ __ ] on the face of the earth or like what the [ __ ] are we talking about? Like what is Fox News talking about? Anybody that mentions my name in in in Crime Family in the same I’m like like what are you talking about? Like okay believe the worst case scenario that you believe about me. Believe that I was painting paintings not because I’ve been a painter my whole life. Not because it literally saved my life. Not because it’s really meaningful to me. believe that I was painting paintings to somehow uh curry favor with who whomever okay as compared like if you believe the worst possible thing that they’ve ever said about me what they are openly doing they’re openly doing and nobody’s batting an eye Don Jr. is opening a club called the Executive Club in Georgetown in which it is promised that you will be able to rub shoulders at the cost of a $500,000 initiation fee. The $500,000 membership fee would make it the most expensive private membership club in the country after Mara Lago to join the club with people and decision makers in the cabinet of his father. Mhm. Now, the launch party on Saturday night included a who’s who from the Trump cabinet with Secretary of State Marco Rubio, Attorney General Pam Bondi, SEC Chair Paul Atkins, Dr. Oz, and a lot of others. What is that other than literally the sale of influence? And by the way, that’s just like an that’s just like a side thing for them. Yeah. And like you mentioned, that’s what we know about now. Exactly. And that’s the stuff that’s out in the open. Yeah. It’s stuff you can Google at this moment. at this present moment. I don’t get it. I don’t get how I don’t get why people don’t understand that it is the biggest grift that there is. And and just look over here. Look at Hunter Biden, the crack guy. Look at him. Laptop. Laptop. Mhm. And then I get in an argument about the providence of the laptop and what it was and where it came from and who and these random like you know uh morons like the laptop repair shop owner and you know that the blind laptop repair shop owner that wears a Scottish to judge people but that guy looks like a [ __ ] [ __ ] Oh my god. Do you fear for your safety every day? Yeah, I don’t leave the house. Oh, regardless, I mean, by the way, watch him speak and anyway, whatever. I don’t I don’t know. I don’t know the motivations other than I think that a lot of people that are just so in need of some kind of relevance and so they they convince themselves. I don’t think that these that all of these people just come at this. I mean, I’ve watched the way in which you have communicated with and had sincere conversations with people that are crazy and um but you did it with empathy and you do it with a open at least in my opinion is that the thing that I like about the and I’m not blowing smoke is that you do it with the sincerity you listen and you give space for them to not be laughed at and so I don’t want to make fun of these people well the thing is the reason I do that is because I have a fundamental belief that most people think they’re doing the right thing. Most people out there don’t wake up and say, “I’m going to repeat misinformation, cause harm to people, and make people feel like shit.” Those people do exist. So, I always look a level deeper for Kelly, for example, from the movie. To help with context, this conversation that I’m having with Hunter is in reference to my recently released independent documentary film called Dear Kelly, which chronicles the radicalization of a middle-class family man from California into a diehard January 6 MAGA soldier. The protagonist is a man named Kelly J. patriot who I first met in 2021 at the White Lives Matter rally in Huntington Beach. captured what I believe to be a powerful portrait of a family broken up by economic downturn and then reactionary political discourse that prayed on those financial hardships. Do you guys know who Hunter Biden is? I’ve heard that Hunter Biden and Bill as a pawn to forward their own agenda? who’s taking advantage of whatever grievances or economic or social insecurities he has to make him think this way. And so I think that the evil and you know maybe that’s kind of a simple term. I would call it the sort of nihilistic capital-driven self-interested crowd who just want to grow their own profile and make as much money as they can by giving people misinformation. That is where I’m I’m more critical of. So what I’m what I was curious about when I met Kelly is what are your media consumption habits? where do you get your information from? You’re able to understand theformational ecosystem and then you can kind of get to the the bottom of it. And so I was really curious going back to when those contents of the laptop first leaked. I want to help the audience understand the anatomy of a smear cuz we know that there was nothing in those files that was significant enough to hold you liable for any criminal prosecutions. But how does it work? Cuz we know that it went from the repair shop man to Giuliani. Who were the first journalists to take that story and make it the massive story that it was? Um, Miranda Divine at the New York Post. Miranda Divine is on the case in her book Laptop from Hell has made an entire cottage industry in two books and her own podcast now and she’s an Australian journalist. I don’t know when she came to the New York Post, worked for the Murdoch Empire for I I think um in some form or fashion between Australia and the United States. So those two things are interesting. So you have New York Post which is definitely based upon ad revenue and clicks is more of a tabloid and then the Murdoch family is is a bit of a deeper agenda with more committed investors. Yeah. Were they different or were they were they together? I don’t know enough to know the um uh the level to which the um uh the Murdoch family involves itself in um whatever choices the Post or Fox News is making about um the the stories that they’re going to tell. I just don’t know and I and I don’t want to speculate but I do know this is that it’s all a business. So what I figured out really quickly is that a lot everybody that is by the way really smart people smart people that have been in the business of politics and communications and media for a long time people that I trusted that said that that I I trusted in the past for good reason because they’ve been because they’re smart and and and they care and they uh have a great track record said look it’s going to pass. The only way that the story continues is if you feed it by responding to it. It’s so outrageous that the only way that it stays in the news and stays a thorn in your side is if you respond to it. Okay. So when the laptop story came out as the October surprise, the advice was don’t respond to it because the insanity of what they were saying about like Miles Ga was going out there with that guy in a uh in New Zealand who took the hard drives in New Zealand and was pressing a story about how I was running sex trafficking rings in in China. Okay? And they were doing all this stuff and it was so outrageous. 68 national security people came out and said this has all of the um the hallmarks of a Russian operation because it did. They didn’t say it was, but it had all the hard rocks of it. And so everybody said just don’t don’t respond. Don’t respond. Don’t respond. Well, what I figured out is this is that doesn’t matter. Once they had a story that involved the son of the president of the United States, drugs, sex, nude pictures, mysterious figures across the globe, all in the mix of the biggest political story um in in in all time. It was just too much of a money maker for them. All they had to do, if you go back and look at all these stories, it didn’t matter whether it was a story about, you know, um what color shirt I was wearing that day. Every single story included a picture of me naked. Every single story the the the the story that you would come to with the title and Hunter Biden um heads the court today was a story of me, you know, smoking a crackpipe in a bathtub without a shirt on or with a blurred out woman in a in a hotel room. All almost every single one of them. And so they would draw people’s eyes with that and then people would click on it. And so instead of doing one story about me a day, they would do two stories about me a day. And then the Daily Mail picked up on it. You know that the times the Daily Mail over the course of the last six years has reported that I was with from witnesses that I am in rehab or that I was seen at an Airbnb or that I had bought a home in Beverly Hills and crashed a Ferrari. How many times? 500. I don’t I mean I’m really not joking. I mean dozens and dozens of times. Okay. So maybe 30 times. Yeah. It just became a money maker for them. Mhm. It just became I think Miranda Divine said it was the it’s the number one revenue generating story in the history of the paper. Yeah. Because you also like I was saying you have the individual egos and pockets of these journalists who are looking for a juicy story to make a name for themselves. Yeah. And meanwhile it became this thing and you know like I I I really don’t mean it like oh poor wo was me but um it became this thing. Where do I start with my defense? So, I start with my defense about the fact that yeah, the the special counsel charged me. Yeah, I I didn’t pay my taxes on time. Yeah, but then I paid with penalties and interest, but then this happened and you know, but wait, what about the gun? And you were a crack addict, right? And when were you a crack addict? And there was cocaine found in the Oh, wait a second. You were doing business in Ukraine? What about that bioweapons lab in Ukraine? And don’t you have some connection to George Soros? I mean, you can go down that chain, like I said before, from the reality uh based kind of conspiracies um that are um trumpeted by Steve Bannon all the way down to Alex Jones. Yeah. Or and and below. I mean, the I just feel like this maybe this isn’t a woe is me thing, but I mean, it’s just kind of sad like I don’t want to, you know, make you play the victim here or anything, but you got a year sober, year plus sober. You know, you’ve just married the love of your life. Things are starting to look up and all of a sudden all of your private messages and photos for two decades are now owned by the political opposition of your father and are being published by a sort of horrible ecosystem of these like carnivorous journalists who are just looking to destroy and dissect every element of your private life. Do you feel like um sobriety became harder after the October surprise? You would think the answer was yes, but what it ended up doing is is that it ended up I had for the first time ever to truly make a choice uh in sobriety like in full sobriety, you know, months of sobriety for the first time in my life to make a choice whether to live or die. And what I mean is is that I knew there would be no coming back. If I lost it then at that moment in time the level of shame and guilt that I would have had and blowing it for everybody I would have rather died. So there was the first time in my life in which I was able to literally say, “Are you going to get up in the morning, get out of bed this morning and exist without a drink or a drug or are you going to kill yourself?” Because that was that that was the real choice because how could you ever make it back from that? In that moment, if I had relapsed or in any moment since, but it it my my level of confidence in who I am, it’s given me much more of a reason to like not be that dramatic about it every morning. But in that moment, if I had if I had used, can you imagine the the the fallout from that, I mean, it would have been a a failure that I know that I I truly don’t believe that I could have recovered from. And by the way, potentially a lot of the people that I loved, I don’t know that whether they could have recovered from that. Yeah. And so the incredible gift that they gave me was was a freedom that I had never known which is to fully comprehend the choice that you have in life is that you can wake up and live or you can wake up and die. And every day since then to varying degree of success I’ve chose to live. And I know that that sounds hyperbolic or maybe it just sounds a little melodramatic, but I can tell you from my perspective, it has not been melodramatic or hyperbolic in any way. And I’ve chosen to live every day since then. And I really do mean it. I’m in a better place inside than I’ve ever been in my life because of that. if that um yeah, I don’t know if it makes sense, but makes perfect sense to me. So, you mean to say, you know, when those headlines first broke, the emotional impact was so strong that you felt like for one, if you would have relapsed, you would have gone down a hole that you never would have been able to dig out of. And because you were able to survive and also because overexposure has kind of whittleled down your sensitivity to certain headlines, pictures, and buzzwords that you’re now stronger and able to face things with less fear. Yeah, I think I think for a lot of people what happened to me is literally their worst nightmare, particularly if you if you’ve ever suffered, you know, from addiction. Mhm. Imagine having every most embarrassing moment of your life or I mean some that aren’t even embarrassing but just private literally not just published once in your local newspaper or you know in a magazine article that went away but by everyone over and over and over again constantly and then add on top of it and then add on top of it. And so then everything that you do is a um whether it’s positive or completely neutral to move on with your life is reframed to fit their narrative. So like for take the painting for instance. Well, yeah. To clarify, you had an art show pretty much in the midst of all of this controversy. I remember like I was trying to cover it I think back in the day, but it was almost impossible to get pressed cuz I emailed the gallery where you had the show like a day before. But I remember that thinking to myself, that’s cool that he’s putting himself out there. didn’t realize that it had also been spun into the uh laptop web. Well, by the way, not only spun into that, but what had ended up happening was is that the gallery got attacked, literally physically attacked. Someone came into the gallery and assaulted two of the people that worked there, spray painted the walls. They set up a you know um a protest like for weeks on end in front of the in front of the gallery. They um they doxed my the gallery owner. They doxed the people that um that that was known that purchased um the playbook. They got subpoenaed. My gallery owner had to spend close to half a million dollars to defend himself before Congress. I came to the conclusion that one of the reasons that I didn’t choose a life that is uh as an artist younger age because I didn’t have the courage to do it. Well, like you were kind of scared to put yourself out there in a way that’s not like traditionally. Yeah. Exactly. you know, so I took a different route and I went to law school and I became a professor and I opened up a law firm and I you know and by by the way I think I did all of those things pretty successfully and but when it became the only thing that I could do to to not sink into absolute and complete despair was to fall back on the thing that I love to do the most was paint is that that’s what I painted. And then somebody came by just by happen stance one day who’s had a gallery in New York. Literally a friend of a friend. He said, “You should do a show.” And I said, “I would love to do a show.” And then I was scared to death when I did it. Then the first show that I had in LA, I didn’t offer anything for sale. I just did the show. Wasn’t even for sale. And immediately it became this thing, you know, like I I realized that, you know, that also gave me a gift, which is this. They said, “I don’t give a [ __ ] I paint. I paint every day and I paint for the people that I love. I paint for myself and one day I’ll have another show. But I really don’t give a [ __ ] what the [ __ ] New York Post or um James Comr of Kentucky, the chairman of the oversight committee thinks about my [ __ ] paintings or what anybody really thinks for that matter. I guess the whole point of even talking about it was is that it wasn’t just the fact that they um of the investigations, the congressional, the DOJ, all of it. It wasn’t just the like the constant from like the Murdoch, you know, media empire and and all of the ancillary organizations around it. In the New York Times, you know how many you know how many stories the New York Times wrote about my my art? How many? I don’t know, like dozen. To what end? Mhm. I mean, really, to what end? I mean, at the time that they were writing about my art, Jared Kushner was in Saudi Arabia after being the head of the Middle Eastern policy group for the White House and covering for the leader of Saudi Arabia in the murder of Kosogi, collecting $2.1 billion investment when he was doing that. and they were selling golden sneakers and Bibles to people off their donor list. The New York Times was still writing stories about the legitimacy of me deciding that I wanted to be a painter or not. Well, as you mentioned, it’s a business. Businesses are profit driven and they know that there’s a bigger appetite, a larger media market that’s going to prefer to hear about Hunter Biden’s potential artistic career after the scandal versus a typical, you know, Kushner Trump family corruption thing possibly happening in a different country. They know that, you know, Trump’s audience is going to be more hungry for anything about you than about, you know, it’s the classic diversion thing, too. It’s like, don’t look at what I’m doing. Look at this guy. You know, one of the things that’s interesting is that when I when we first uh talked, I said to you, when we had a brief conversation about whether we’d do this or not, and I said, you know, I I suspect that many people in your your audience, like you’re you’re kind of, for lack of a better phrase, your loyal listeners would kind of have probably looked at me over the past 5 years and said, you know, we don’t know if Hunter Biden is the villain that they say that he is, but kind of a sleas ball, you know. I recognize that and the question that I have is like what how how do you move forward in this world if every um discussion you begin is a defense of you know I know why I went on the board of uh of a um a Ukrainian natural gas company. A lot of it had to do with money 100%. You know, I had an organization that was willing to pay me for a service that I was 100% qualified to do. I went to Yale Law School. I served on dozens of boards before this. I was an expert in corporate governance. I had a I have a encyclopedia knowledge of the region. I had served on a major infrastructure companies uh board and um had done work in uh global aid relief throughout the entire world and had an enormous list of connections of my own and I was qualified to be on that board and it gave me the freedom at a time when I really needed the freedom to be with my family to focus on uh my brother’s health and I and I chose to do it and I and I was transparent about it and I did it. Nothing wrong with making some money here and there. But by the way, I I you know, you say that and I could say that and you know, enlightened and be like, “Oh, you know, it’s just a you know, there’s this reporter Ken Vogle and he calls it like soft corruption.” As if I could separate myself from my father in any meaningful way that would not disadvantage or remove the advantage or potential disadvantage of being his son. So for instance, if I decided to be a painter, I chose something in the when my dad became president that was completely 100% outside of any of the purview of what I thought of the of the federal government. What control does the federal government have or the the White House or administration or president could have on whether somebody buys a painting of mine or not? It became a national scandal. So I have I I I h how how can I possibly argue that I’ve not had enormous advantages afforded me because of who my dad was? But I certainly have paid the [ __ ] price, too. And I’ve been held accountable in ways that nobody with that with uh that didn’t have my last name would be held accountable. And I’ve been afforded options as it relates to that accountability that nobody that didn’t had my last name would be afforded at that. But and I’m not looking for sympathy. Interesting. I mean, the way you put the fact of life, the way you put it, it’s actually pretty fascinating. Like every way that you’ve been able to get ahead kind of boomerangs to where if you do anything that is seen in the public eye as being like negative or problematic, it gets thrown back in your face 10 times harder. Yeah. And the the thing is this is too is that here I am. I’m a 55year-old man. I’ve raised children. I’m a grandfather. Um, uh, I’m obviously a father and a brother and a son and a grandson and a nephew and a painter and a business person and a lawyer and I’m sitting here like talking about my dad. Do you know what I mean? It’s like it’s like Jesus Christ. I don’t know if that makes any sense. But my my point is I interviewed Tom Hank’s son once. Yeah. And he’s got a similar dilemma. He’s a rapper. He’s a weightlifter. Yeah, he’s also in recovery. He does a bunch of cool stuff, but still, you know, people want to ask him, “Hey, man. Can I meet your dad one day?” Or he still has to comment about what it’s like being Tom Hank’s son. I remember he he said he was getting a haircut and the guy was like, “Yo, tell your pops I love Forest Gump.” He just walked out cuz it was round 1000. And I take it that you’ve had a similar experience. Yeah. I I’m not I I can’t judge, you know, uh anybody else’s relationship with their dad is that all I know is this is that I am more proud to be my dad’s son than ever anything in my life. I mean truly mean that I I don’t know I I mean I I’m not exaggerating. I haven’t seen somebody depict it in fiction, in a movie, in a book, story from a friend, real life, my own experience that anyone that is as good as father as my dad is. and just that I mean I the the one single thing that I aspire to what I don’t know whether I ever achieved to the degree that he has is um is the way in which he has been a father to me to my brother to my sister and a grandparent to my to my children and a father to so many people that you’ll never meet there is story after story after story that will never be told of the kid that he met on the rope line that stuttered and he was 12 years old and and you do know ones, but I’m telling you there are dozens. My dad any given moment you turn around and he’s on the phone with somebody you met on the train whose brother just died and they’re having a hard time because their mom’s shrinking again and he’ll slip in his number as president of the United States as vice president. Story after story after story while still having the time to never never not be there for me. I’m not kidding. And I think people think it’s like an exaggeration. My dad does not go a day without leaving me a message by phone or by text. Not a single day that I can remember in my whole life. And that goes from my children. And it’s all born out of from him. This this this the lesson he learned from when he lost my mom and my sister is that you will have a day in your worst moment like he did in which you won’t be able to pick up the phone and call that person ever again. And so like for me, I heard this uh who’s that guy? Chuck Todd, you know, the guy that got fired from MSNBC or whatever he did, you know, I mean, he used to run the he used to be like one of one of the big reporters. Do you know what I’m talking about? Yeah. I saw him say, you know, thing about Joe Biden is that it’s all a lie. He was a horrible father because who would put their loved ones through that they knew were suffering from addiction through the grueling process? He is a you know it it it’s beyond selfish. No one there’s no one no one that could do that could be good. Like what the [ __ ] do you know about [ __ ] anything? Like you’re telling me and by the way what percentage do I have to say now what I say about my dad other than he literally is exactly who you think he is or exactly uh uh who he appears to be. Exactly who he says he is. How’s he doing now? Uh, he’s he’s okay, you know. Um, the one thing about my dad is that he’ll never complain. Sometimes I wish he would, you know, and I mean that not only about like the big things, but like, you know, like the little things. Sometimes I get scared that I’m not like uh I wish he would complain a little bit more. Um but you know to your question how is he? It’s just like he’s just out. He just keeps going you know. I mean with the health the health stuff though I saw in the news. Yeah. No that’s what I mean like he has you know he has very advanced cancer spread beyond I mean so this is all public. So it spread beyond his prostate. For some reason, they did not do a PSA. I guess after the age of 70 or 75, if you don’t have prostate cancer, the standard of care is not to give a PSA. And they didn’t while he was president. And he went in and got tested and had had he had prostate cancer and it had um spread to his bones. Along spinal cord, it’s called bony mets, I guess, is the metastatic bone cancer. His bones are strong. He’s strong. Uh he’s in good health otherwise. Uh he’s in great health otherwise. and uh they can treat it but it’s not curable. And so that’s all the public knowledge of it. But I think that that is literally everything that there is to know about it. They do this thing called hormone therapy and and it makes you tired and stuff like that. But seeing him dayto-day he’s doing well. Yeah. like I you know I mean what was it yesterday he flew to Galveston Texas and showed up at a tiny little church amb church to celebrate Junth and day before that we were up in Philly out to breakfast with my sister and my mom and then he’s working on his book and he’s you know writing speeches and he’s you know talking on the phone every day and he’s going out every day. So did you um kind of see him dropping out of the race? Did you see that coming? No. No, I I was uh I thought that we had um cleared all the hurdles that they had set up for us. And so, if you remember, it was a horrible debate and there’s no arguing that it was anything but an absolutely horrible debate. And I think it scared the [ __ ] out of a lot of people because they were already concerned about his age. But, as I say about everybody, the thing that we’re going to have to grapple with as a societ society that’s bigger than Joe Biden is this. how we handle people that age in front of our eyes and recognize that they may have lost a physical step, but that does not mean they don’t have the mental capacity to continue to do their job and whether there still should be to be valued. So my dad grew old in front of everybody’s eyes and the difference between whether or not you thought that he was politically viable based upon your own biases or whether you thought that he was uh politically capable based upon his uh accomplishments. Just remember Joe Biden got 81 million votes and it wasn’t because of Donald Trump that Joe Biden got 81 million votes. Joe Biden got more votes than anybody that’s ever run for president in the United States before by a large margin. I mean, just think about it this way. The maximum number of votes that Barack Obama had got just six year or eight years earlier was um was 69 million. Okay? Population hasn’t grown that much. They had the highest voter participation of any presidential election since 1901. Joe Biden had the most successful midterms of any president in either party in their first term. Since FDR in 1932, we won more state legislative, we won more state houses, more governorships. We picked up a seat in the Senate, which has never happened since 1932. And we held uh the uh the Republican gains in in the the House to an all-time low, lower than even 1932. Then with the slimmest majority of any president ever with a 50/50 Senate in a six vote I think a four or five vote majority in the House of Representatives he passed more legislation in two years than any president has in 8 years since Lyndon B Johnson including the investment reduction act the uh the recovery act including the pact act which was troops healthcare the first gun legislation that has been passed in uh over uh in a generation And the list goes on and on. And he came off of that. And for some reason, the intelligencia of the Democratic Party with 2020 hindsight believes that Joe Biden should have considered not running again because of their perception that he was too old. And so then the drum beat began and the New York Post wrote, I mean New York Times on a near daily basis, egged on by the the Pod Save America uh saviors of the Democratic Party with what four um uh white millionaires that are dining out on their uh on their association with uh with with Barack Obama from 16 years ago. living in Beverly [ __ ] hills telling the rest of the world what black voters in South Carolina really want or what the women in uh the waitress living outside of Green Bay, Wisconsin really believes. I mean, who the [ __ ] I mean, I can’t believe that we did we do this over and over again. Yeah. Or I hear Rahm Emanuel is going to run for for president. What a [ __ ] like I David Axelrod’s going to run his campaign for him. That’s like Oh boy. There’s the answer. There’s the [ __ ] answer. Genius is all you know h all the things that they’ve won. You remember this is that everybody talks about Joe Biden now as if he was somehow the the choice of the of the of of the Democratic party. [ __ ] We lost Iowa. We lost New Hampshire. We came in second uh in Nevada. David Pluff and David Axelrod went on TV. They said that there’s no way Joe Biden can get the nomination. Not a chance in the world. Mike Bloomberg is going to crush him in California. Elizabeth Warren’s going to beat him in in Massachusetts. There’s going to get wiped out in Texas. He doesn’t have the money to run. A lot of rural voters said, “Fuck you. We love Joe.” A lot of urban voters said, “Fuck you. We love Joe.” And they voted for him overwhelmingly. And not only that, everybody said, “Well, he’ll never be able to be Trump.” And then they said, “Well, he’ll never bring us out of CO.” And then he said he’ll never be able to pass bipartisan legislation and he doesn’t know what the hell he’s talking about and he’s living in a different generation and he’s living in a pastime and over and over again. David Axelrod would go on and say you know the thing about the president is that he is just a a man who time has passed by and he doesn’t understand Congress. We passed bipartisan legislation more than any presidents in Lynen Bane Johnson and who had a super majority in both the House and the Senate with Joe Mansion and Kristen Cinema. And who did that? That didn’t happen by magic. That didn’t happen in the Obama administration. That happened because Joe Biden got on the phone with Christian Cinema and Joe Mansion and Chuck Schumer and the rest of the party and Republicans in the party and he passed a [ __ ] bill because Mitch McConnell didn’t stand in the way like he did to every other president other than Joe Biden. And he got it done. He did it. Him alone. And then they said, “Well, look, it’s all going to come down to this State of the Union speech. Going to come down to the State of the Union speech.” That was it. And he knocks it out of the park. And it was that one debate that caused the fullback, man. And I’ll tell you what, I know exactly what happened in that debate. He flew around the world basically and the mileage that he could have flown around the world three times. He’s 81 years old. He’s tired as [ __ ] They give him ambient to be able to sleep. He gets up on the stage and he looks like he’s a deer in the headlights. And it feeds into every [ __ ] story that anybody wants to tell. and Jake Tapper with literally how many anonymous sources. If this was a conspiracy, Andrew, you know this somehow the entirety of a White House in which you literally living on top of each other has kept their mouth shut about, you know, like what and what’s the conspiracy? Yeah. That Joe Biden got old. Yeah, he got old. He got old before our eyes. The people that came out against him were who? Nobody except speaker Pelosi Speaker Pelosi did not give a fullthroated endorsement which allowed everybody else to kind of go okay except who who came out fullthroated progressives AOC Bernie the entire progressive ring Roam the entirety of the progressive side of the Democratic party said Joe Biden has got more of our agenda accomplished in four years than any president in history. The largest investment into climate change in history. Just that alone. Okay. And so he gets over the hump. He goes and does a Stephanopoulos. Everybody’s everybody’s okay. That’s not enough. We got to see him give a press conference for what you remember that it was about two-hour long press conference and he gave a tour to force around the world history lesson about the existence of NATO Russian aggression and Ukraine. They said, “Uh, okay. Well, wait. He’s got to go give a speech in um he’s got he’s going to speak to the NAACP because the NAACP and the Hispanic caucus and the Black Caucus said, “If you [ __ ] over Joe, don’t count on us.” Because you know what they’re now they’re doing? They’re trying to take South Carolina away as the first as the first primary state. the first time in history that the heart and soul of the Democratic Party gets to have his voice heard first after 50 years of of Iowa and New Hampshire with 3% black population states. I thought it was less less than that. New Hampshire’s got to be closer to one closer to one. I saw a few blacks finally. And you know what? You know what you have? You have the pod save America [ __ ] saying, you know, I don’t think South Carolina that’s only was only there because of Joe Biden. If Joe Biden would get and that’s what he did to save his own self, why should South Carolina have the What the [ __ ] I mean, are they out of their [ __ ] minds? So, moving forward, you feel like did did he want to drop out? No. So we got to we got to Nevada and he made the speech before the black caucus and then right before he was about to give which was rousing success and he then was going to give a speech to the Hispanic caucus who was in Las Vegas at the same time in Nevada and uh he woke up in the morning and he had a severe case of CO and the pictures of him getting on and off the plane were just devastating and then the vultures descended. George Clooney’s uh you know came out with his maybe it was a little before that with his op-ed and then you had all the money people and then you had a whole host of other people that had um you know I mean I guess that you know Truman saying is it can be implied to Joe Biden more than anybody else. If you want a friend in Washington get a dog. Why is George Clooney always saying [ __ ] I didn’t even I thought he was just acting in Oceans 11 and stuff like that. He’s seriously been saying [ __ ] Yeah, you know, I I um I I Here’s what he said. He said that the president needed to be introduced to him at a fundraiser that he was ostensibly the uh the host of there’s this gigantic fundraiser in which George Clooney wasn’t really the host. He was the he was the the entertainment, I guess. You know what I mean? Like, you know, God bless him. I that I I appreciate when entertainers and movie stars and um people of conscious and you know that are on our side want to do you know raise money and stuff like that. If you’re if you’re with the president at at any given time you probably have you been like at a rope line for the president or anything like that. Anyway, what happens is is that you go to uh people come to take a pictures and usually before or after an event, the president will line up, people will come and they’ll take a picture with them and he’ll say hello and there’s a person that stands next to the president and they say, “Mr. President, George Clooney and Julia Roberts.” Hey, George. Julia, how you doing? Mr. President, Andrew Callahan. And you may have been filming him all day and he may know George for the last 30 years and he may have met him 15 times, but the guy on his shoulder who’s usually a military officer has a one job to say the name of the person that’s walking up. That’s it. And George Clooney is now to rationalize why he he attempted to cut the knees out from a sitting president, the most successful president in the history of his party in his life in terms of the legislative policies that he wanted to see passed, had to justify somehow him going above and beyond to write an op-ed in the New York Times to try to force the sitting president of the United States out of the out of the race. And so he makes up this story about how the president had to be introduced to him. Oh, like he didn’t recognize George Clooney. Exactly. Because of like dementia or something. I don’t know. Well, that’s that that’s the implication, right? Yeah. Yeah. Like he’s forgetting things. Yeah. And by the way, I remember this story is this is that George Clooney wasn’t going to show up to that fundraiser and he was he was bitching to the White House staff and to the people the senior staff is that he was so angry that the president would not would criticize the um uh the arrest warrant that was um uh executed for Netanyahu and the president when asked said would they arrest Netanyahu if he came to the United States and he said he would not have the authority nor would he do that and I guess George Clooney’s wife was the principal architect of that arrest of of that warrant for Netanyahu. And I don’t judge that in one way or another was the right thing or not. He was very very angry that my dad did not I guess like pay homage to her or something. And I understand, you know, defending your wife or something, but I mean I saw the text messages that he wrote, you know, reams of text messages like how dare he do that. And he kept promising that he was going to embarrass the president and pull out of the of the fundraiser. Before we continue about the vultures, I have a George Clooney story. Hopefully we can leave it in. My only really famous Hollywood friend is actor Jack Black, you know, from School of Rock. And so, uh, we used to be neighbors in Los Felis. And so, Tenacious D did a concert in Sydney, Australia. You know, this is a day after they tried to assassinate Trump in Butler, PA. And I guess, uh, Jack Black’s guitarist or whatever jumps up on stage and he’s yell something to the effect of, “Hey, next time you aim, you try to shoot Trump, aim a little bit closer. Don’t miss Trump. Next time George Clooney is blowing his phone up being like if you don’t kick your band member out of the band and like publicly denounce this guy like I don’t know what the consequences were but it was kind of like you’re out out of what? We don’t know. And so his hand was basically forced to be like oh sorry my band member has serious mental health problems. We’re breaking up the band for now. The tour is canceled. And so I mean it is cool to see Hollywood actors voice more progressive opinions, but [ __ ] him. [ __ ] him. [ __ ] him and everybody around him. I don’t have to be [ __ ] nice. Number one, I agree with Quinton Tarantino. [ __ ] George Clooney is not a [ __ ] actor. He is a [ __ ] like I don’t know what he is. He he he’s a brand. And by the way, and God bless him. You know what? He I he supposedly treats his friends really well. You know what I mean? Buys them things. and he’s got a really great place in Lake Ko and he’s great friends with Barack Obama. [ __ ] you. What do you have to do with [ __ ] anything? Why do I have to [ __ ] listen to you? What right do you have to step on a man who’s given 52 years of his [ __ ] life to the service of this country and decide that you, George Clooney, are going to take out basically a full page ad in the [ __ ] New York Times to undermine the president at a time in which, by the way, what do people care about the most? Why do you think that the Republicans have an advantage over us? because they’re unified. They will go along with anything. I wasn’t asking anybody to go along with anything. I was asking people to go along with this. The most successful administration in my lifetime, and I’m including the Obama administration. I’m going the Reagan administration. I’m including every administration in my lifetime. We have gotten more done for the agenda of the things that your generation and my generation cared about than any president in history. And we didn’t get it all done, but more than anybody else with the slimmest majority ever. And everybody said that there’s no way that he’s ever going to be able to do that. And you know what George Clinton did? Because he sat down, I guess, because he was like given the blessing by the Obama team or the Obama people and who whoever else and David Axel Rod and whoever the [ __ ] else is to go, “Okay, yeah, you know what? We’re going to we are going to insert our uh judgment over yours. We, me and James Carville, who hasn’t run a race in 40 [ __ ] years, and David Axelrod, who had one success in his political life, and that was Barack Obama, and that was because of Barack Obama, not because of [ __ ] David Axelrod, and David Pluff, and all of these guys, and the Pod Save America guys who were junior [ __ ] speech writers in um uh you know, on Barack Obama’s Senate staff who have been dining out on on the relationship with him for years, making millions of dollars. the Anita Duns of the world who’s made 4050$50 million dollars off the Democratic party. They’re all going to insert their judgment over a man who has figured out unlike anybody else how to get elected to the United States Senate over seven times, how to pass more legislation than any president in history, how to have a better midterm election than anybody in history, and how to garner more votes than any president that has ever run. And they’re going to replace their judgment for for his. Not to mention too about actors. When actors take up very like staunch progressive opinions, it gives working-class Americans the perception that left-leaning beliefs are elitist because they’re seeing all these rich people that they perceive to be these untouchable celebrities and the shining lights in the marquee as being liberal. So, it’s really easy to market conservatism as like a working man’s counterultural thing. And what was the one thing that Joe Biden, no one ever could pin on him, that he was a left-leaning rich liberal elitist. Yeah. The one thing that Joe Biden was not that they could not take away from Joe Biden, he was the stuttering kid from [ __ ] Scranton that [ __ ] worked his way up and that he said some [ __ ] things that were a little impolitic at times. But you know what? He reminded me of my dad. Not my idiot dad, but my dad who brought us through the tough times. And I knew at the end of the day that Joe Biden actually cared about me. And you know what? I think Joe Biden is a little bit as confused about what transgender is as I am. But you know what I know that he also is not going to do? He’s not going to beat the [ __ ] out of my kid if I decide to let my kid be transgender. But he’s going to say, “I like I don’t I don’t get like explain it to me.” You know what I mean? Like, explain it to me. That’s who he is. He’s the guy that’s going to be asked in an interview when he was vice president, well, what do you think about marriage between a man and a man? And he’s going to say, “I think love is love.” Doesn’t mean that he has to necessarily understand it, but all he knows is his own personal experience. But he wasn’t shoving it down your throat like George Clooney shoving it down your [ __ ] throat. Also, I know you’re a man of peace now. Who says that? You won’t. But if you did see Jake Tapper, would it be time for a little bit of a Jake? Look, man, I I don’t I mean this sincerely. It’s almost not worth commenting on it because he’s completely irrelevant. And I and I really mean this is this what who’s Jake Tapper’s audience? Jake Tapper, my mom or something? I don’t know. Well, I don’t know. For real, though. is that I don’t even think it’s your mom anymore because by the by the numbers what influence does Jake Tapper have over anything he has the smallest audience on cable uh news and beyond that I think that the book is right now in Amazon that he put out I mean his ratings just went to [ __ ] after he put the book out you know they did a twoe infomercial for it I mean it was such a money grab such a disservice to everybody that he serves with um uh that the journalism that he purports to take part in and he’s very personal he he has a real problem with me. He does this whole rant about how I was the acting chief of staff and that I took control of the White House and I orchestrated this cover up um of my dad’s uh health and well-being at the same time as who would ever trust a person like me that was a crack addict that got their sister-in-law addicted to crack cocaine, things that he has no notion of or idea about in personal, you know, like Jesus Christ, Jake, grow the [ __ ] up. Well, a lot of these dudes now like really is this a personal thing with me? I feel like this is this is the Trump era now. You’re seeing a lot of like liberals and progressives kind of start to shift a little bit, right? Or at least capitulate to right-wing tendencies cuz they’re following power and capital. Like I don’t know if you’ve seen this A24 movie recently called Warfare. It’s a really good movie, but it’s borderline like valorizing the Iraq war veterans, which I think I respect veterans in general, but like with no context as to like what was going on in Iraq, like why we were there and sort of like paints the locals as these sort of is this based off the book that he did that he said that he wrote he would take 15 minutes with his coffee and he wrote a book in like 6 months because he’s some kind of [ __ ] genius. But the point is like A24 is the same company that made Moonlight and was making movies that were all about like trans issues four or five years ago. So now you’re starting to see you’re you’re seeing money move, right? So I’m not surprised that somebody like Jake Tapper who’s probably concerned about revenge. That’s it. And by the way, again, it all comes down to money. Every single thing is that you can see the choices that these people make. What is the historical value of a book that is not sourced? Correct me if I’m wrong, but I don’t know of any on there source of that of of any significance other than the story that like that’s being repeated over and over again, which I can tell you I was there. I watched George Clooney be introduced to my dad with 30 other people in line and the guy said, “Mr. President, George Clooney and Julia Roberts.” That’s it. That’s the story. There’s dozens of witnesses. Yeah. Other than that story, there is literally no sourcing. So, what’s it about? It’s about money. It was a money grab. Jake decided I could basically do this infomercial. I’m going to pick up the entire right-wing because they’re going to want to read this book and they’re going to and they’re going to do exactly why the they’re they’re not reading it. They’re not buying the book and they’re criticizing him. But what they’re also doing is they started a congressional investigation and now I have to deal with another [ __ ] subpoena because Jake Tapper has decided that he’s through anonymous sources going to create some conspiracy of a crime. And here we are to what end? To what end? As the world falls apart around us, why do I have to [ __ ] spend my time worrying or thinking about or even talking about somebody as irrelevant as Jake Tapper? I mean, really, Jake Tapper in history, what where does he stand? I don’t know. I saw him in the streets of Ukraine in Lviv during the war and I think he thought that I was a right-wing sort of troll or something. So, I was like, “Hey, Tapper.” I don’t know why I said, “Hey, Tapper.” I just thought he would respond. And he just like started [ __ ] walking away as fast as he could. And I was like, “Tap her.” And he was just like out of there. So, I mean, that made me think, “All right, this is not not really my guy.” But backing up a little bit, you know, I’ve known Jake for 30 years. Okay. Well, yeah, Jake, if you see this, you should have said what’s up to me. Moving back to the the vultures that ensued after that, I feel like we kind of lost track a bit. You’re talking about the decision to drop out and you were talking about the day after CO vulture. So, he gets out of that, he he comes off of the plane. He looks absolutely um distraught and disheveled and he it’s the exact wrong image at the exact wrong time and then they descended and they truly descended. This is my recollection of of what happened and it is not his and he will be able to tell his of why he decided and what he decided and what he did. But what I felt happened is that he was given a choice either they decided on a nuclear option. They said we are going to what we are going to blow up the party if you don’t drop out. We’re going to protest this all the way up for the next month all the way up to the convention. Every single moment in every single day is going to be a test of your ability to put one foot in front of the other without tripping and blowing the whole the whole thing up. We’re going to hold you to such a microscopic um uh uh accountability in terms of your health that if you if if you have an off day and misspeak, if you um if you do one of the things that Donald Trump does 35 [ __ ] times a day, did you see the other day when Donald Trump pointed to the Declaration of Independence and said, “You know, I’m against war. I think we could have we could have saved 600,000 lives in the Civil War.” You look right up there. I don’t know. see the Declaration of Independence and I say, “Uh, I wonder if you, you know, the Civil War always seemed to me maybe that could have been solved without losing 600,000 plus people.” As if there’s a connection between the Declaration of Independence and the Civil War. But can you imagine my dad did that? Can you imagine if he opened up that treaty with the Prime Minister Starmer at the G7 in Canada and all the pages fell out and then he said that he just signed a treaty with the European Union with the Prime Minister of the UK standing next to him. Can you imagine? And then if he got on a plane and said the reason that he was going home early from the G7 is because he had a major major announcement the next day and then the next day he put up a flag pole. Can you imagine any of those things? So you’re saying where the [ __ ] is Jake Tapper? Where the [ __ ] is George Clooney? George Clooney is making money off a play because he’s such a God’s gift to the defense of democracy that he is doing a play on Broadway for us. Thank you very much. He was given a choice. We are going to fight you every step of the way. The party is going to implode. We are going to have a floor fight. We are going to attempt to stop you. We are going to challenge you. We’re going to have the black caucus, the Hispanic caucus, the progressive wing of the party against the liberal elite money side of the party and that they were going to try to dry up all the money. And so they decided that they were going to do a nuclear option. So Joe Biden, I think, did the most selfless thing that I know of any politician in the history of this [ __ ] country did. He stepped aside to save the party and in that void filled the only person that he would ever ever ever endorse off out of out of the gate because he chose her as his vice president. There’s no choice in that. And by the way, I love Kla Harris. I think that she would have made an incredible president. I know that she was an incredibly loyal vice president and she did everything that she could to support my dad, everything, and to support me and my family personally. I mean, I truly love her like family. And I think that she would have made an incredible president. And I think she ran an incredible campaign. You know who did not want Kla Harris to be to be president and did not want her to be the nominee? Nancy Pelosi didn’t want her to be. None of Nancy Pelosy’s people wanted her to be. They wanted an open um uh convention. They wanted a a floor fight. They wanted a I don’t know what the hell they wanted, but they wanted to be the ones to anoint whoever they were going to anoint to become the next president of the United States. Who do you think that would have been? I don’t know. I really don’t know. I don’t have any idea. All I know is that they definitely did not want Kla Harris. And again, which undermined her, which undermined the campaign, you know? I mean, I look at these people and talk about like, well, where were they? We had a 100 days. She got she got a hundred She literally was handed a hundred million dollar check. She ran her ass off. She had an incredible organization, incredible grassroots organization. David Pluff took over the campaign. You know, what did they do? Where did they spend their money? Those camo hats they thought were going to make the kids go crazy, but most of the kids are pretty power. It was Look, I’m telling you, one of the the reason I think that whether you know I I’m not a conspiracy theorist completely, but I don’t know what happened in that election. I don’t think that it was her uh her fault necessarily. I don’t think that it was uh anybody’s fault except this. One of the reasons that people would stick with my dad is because of the loyalty that they had to him. And you had to be unified. You have to make it feel like you’re part of something. What they proved, what the Democratic Party proved is they have no guts. I mean, what? By the way, I say party. I would the elite white ultra um uh uh um uh I wouldn’t even say liberal because it’s not liberal. the old school moneyed liberal wing of the Democratic party. like the people who donate to the colleges, the people that donate to the colleges, the people that donate to the um uh you know, multi-million dollar checks to the to the DNC and the DC and the DSCC, the Schumer people and the Pelosi people and the those people, not the rank and file of the Democratic party, not the Black Caucus, not the Hispanic caucus, not the progressive wing, not the people that came out for AOC and Bernie and those people. I’m talking about not the heart of the Democratic party, but the, you know, this uh the controlling interest of the corporate side of the Democratic party, right? They proved to America that there is no loyalty in the Democratic party. 81 million votes in 2020 was all about Donald Trump and nothing about Joe Biden. I’m asking you this question. If that’s the truth, then what? Did people become more comfortable with Donald Trump after 34 felony counts January 6 and a civil lawsuit in the Eugene Carol case? I think a huge issue too, especially in my generation was like the post October 7th Israel Palestine situation. I think there was so many people that felt like that was kind of like the BLM 2.0, you know, with the campus protests and Yeah. Where are they now? Who this the those protesters some of them? Well, when he said that he’s going to turn Gaza into a Trump literally Yeah. Trump branded golf course and he’s on track to doing that. He said that he would have the the the conflict, the war over the day that he took office. More people have died in Gaza between now between when he was inaugurated and today than at any time between October 7th and when my dad left office. And where is where are they now? The protesters. Yeah. Uh they’re they’re still active, but not as active. And I think part of that has to do with just the fact that the conflict’s been going on for longer. But I’m saying this made a lot of people not even vote. Oh, I agree with you. You know what I mean? Not not for Trump or or Harris. They’re just like, you know what? I’m so Cuz you talk about a media market. Like I had a lot of friends who were just so buried algorithmically in the Hamas Israel conflict that they’re just like that’s all they’re seeing. And so if they’re if they’re only seeing these like and the images are horrible. The videos are like nightmarish. So if you’re consuming this all the time, I’m in that algorithm. I understand what you’re saying. Yeah. And then like you just see this, you’re like, “All right, well, if this huge issue is not going to change, then why would I even participate?” And that’s the sort of they call it the black pilling. It’s like the nihilism that’s setting in. And I’m glad that you don’t have that. And I I resist it all the time. And I think that uh our generation will learn for next election cuz Trump wasn’t able to do that many destructive things between 2016 and 2020 and a lot of our lives compared to what’s happening now. the situation in LA, there being no taco carts in Los Angeles on the streets, not seeing one multicolored rainbow umbrella in anywhere in LA, that’s something you can feel in the streets. And so I think a lot of the crowd that said, um, nothing will change. It’s just it’s just going to be two sides of the same coin. It’s just the establishment. And I fell victim to a lot of that thinking, too, you know, especially cuz I was only around both probably Antifa and like the Proud Boys for like four years. So I’m only seeing, you know, radical, you know, fronts on both ends. And now I’m looking back thinking, damn, it would be a lot better right now if Trump was not in office. You know, just straight up like I mean just on a day-to-day basis. I know that people like to blame the media for sewing fear and discontent, but it’s this LA situation is the first time that I can say and maybe it’s just a result of underexposure that I’ve seen like genuine fear amongst the populace of a large metropolitan area. It’ be interesting like you said that you wanted to get out and it start roaming again and to see if you if if you see that across the country. But I mean, by the way, I I I you know, I’m afraid I’m afraid for the people that I love. I’m afraid for what he um uh could do. I mean, he he constantly continues to to talk about me, you know, and there’s still threats of criminality and lawsuits and and you know, all that kind of stuff. But I can’t imagine what it’s like to be a um uh someone here that that has gone through the legal process to uh apply for asylum that’s going to the next court case in you know the Newcastle County courthouse here and wondering whether you’re going to end up in a prison camp in El Salvador and legitimately believe that that’s a real possibility. How long have people put up with that I guess is the is the question and friends and neighbors. One of the things that shifted the um uh the postreonstruction era, DreadScott era into the civil rights movement was the fugitive slave act and watching community members literally being ripped out of their house by people in masks and hoods and and taken away and never seen from again. How do you how do you turn back the clock here? I don’t think there’s turning back the clock in the trust of our um our allies to to will trust us in on anything for for a long while. But here in the United States in terms of you know the guard rails to um to democracy like what will it take? Do you think the um Democratic party’s dead? No. No, I don’t think the Democratic Party is dead. I think that there’s some really incredible leaders in the Democratic party. Wes Moore gives me incredible amount of hope. He’s incredibly dynamic. He’s so goddamn smart and he’s truly a genuinely decent human being. I love uh I love Governor Moore. I think that Tim Walls is an incredible leader. I think that Kla Harris is an incredible leader. Whether or not they can run again, I don’t know. Whether or not they want to run again, I don’t know. I think that the Democratic party the you know that thing that will Rogers said I don’t belong to any organized party I’m a Democrat is that everybody in every election before a president or somebody is nominated to lead the party says the Democratic part is in disarray there’s no leadership nobody’s doing anything and everybody that’s always been the Democratic party but someone will emerge there will be leader that will emerge um the stakes are too high whether they’ll succeed in this environment I don’t know and that’s the question how far are people willing to go? And I don’t mean violence, but in terms of putting themselves in jeopardy on behalf of the American people. How many congressmen, congress women are going to show up to detention centers to get arrested? How many senators are going to go and demand to be heard at these show trials and press conferences by, you know, the likes of uh of Christy Gnome? How many people are going to go and challenge Tom Holman to arrest him on the spot? How many people are going to demand that ICE agents take their masks off because it’s just [ __ ] unamerican for law enforcement to be masked, unmarked, pulling people with no due process, no habius corpus off the streets of the United States. We fought a [ __ ] revolution against a king based on two things in particular. Havy’s corpus and due process. And we’re so willing to give them up. Anybody that sets foot on US soil had those two guarantees. And that set us apart. And we literally fought a [ __ ] revolution over it. And here we are having a debate about whether we want to defend illegal aliens. I don’t want to defend illegal aliens. I don’t want to do this. You know what I want to do? going to want to defend due process and the humanity of actually a living human being that fought his way to get here that Tom Hman individually and Christy Gnome of all [ __ ] people don’t have a right and Steven Miller don’t have a right to to say you you’re gone you go to you go to a concentration camp because nobody’s going to give a [ __ ] about you. Do you think that kind of coming full circle your experience with addiction and having those kind of lows has helped you feel more sympathy for people who are being disenfranchised and being dehumanized by the press by politicians? You know, I think I don’t know about it from uh I’m certain that my own experience Yeah. But I think more than anything it comes from watching my dad who has given his entire life to this. And by the way, like you know, you can have I understand generation to generation from political party to, you know, inside the party to progressives to, you know, uh you can criticize my dad for some of the choices that he’s made in terms of the things that he supported. Sometimes I do too. I don’t agree with everything that my dad has supported, but I know this is that at base, the one thing that you cannot uh challenge about Joe Biden is that everything that he’s done was with the intent of making people’s lives better, not enriching himself, not doing it for his friends and donors, is to, you know, actually impact the lives of people in a way that, as he always talk about, the people that he grew up with, the neighborhoods where he came from, just make it a little bit easier to make it through the day. Understanding that people sit around their kitchen table, if people sit around their kitchen tables and have time to do it anymore with their family and eat dinner and talk about like how are we going to pay for college if you get into college? Like more than that, how are we going to pay for groceries next week? How are we going to pay for groceries? How are we going to pay for you know uh you know, how are we going to pay for baby formula? That’s what people are [ __ ] worrying about. 90% nobody’s sitting here talking about whether uh you know what George Clooney wrote in the New York Times editorial or whatever. On a totally different note, you mentioned baby formula and babies and stuff. Mhm. You know that there are some adults who identify as babies. Some days I identify as a baby. I didn’t tell you that. But h have you heard of this subculture? No, I have not heard of this subculture. All right, guys. It’s me again. Brace yourself here. I’m about to show you a do they support? Who do they who are they uh who they vote for? I wonder who the adult baby diaper lover population. Are they more Democrat or Republican right now? Yeah, that’ll be interesting cuz Trump looks more like a baby than Harris. I mean, he’s sort of shap there’s that whole conspiracy. Then you know I don’t know that Trump’s a baby. No. We could start it. We could start a conspiracy. Oh, the baby. Eating the babies. Eating Oh, no. Not eating eating the babies. Yeah. I didn’t know that one. Well, that’s that was a big one back in 2020. Oh, was it? Yeah. Adrenic Romero, you know. Oh. Oh, that. Yeah. Yeah. Well, really it comes from the the book Fear and Loathing. I was thinking about the diaper thing. I learned the whole diaper thing. Oh, okay. Yeah. Cuz there eating a baby and being a baby are two different animals. One’s illegal. Yeah. The other maybe should be. Well, some elements of the adult baby stuff I understand. Yeah. The music is comforting. Maybe nursery music. Oh, they Yeah. You know what I mean? You mentioned oral fixation. Oh my god. She could actually make me go through with this conversation about the old baby diapering. Okay. Do you see our involvement in the Middle East as something that should be limited or increased? I I definitely think it should be limited. It’s really interesting is this is that, you know, I am a firm believer in the right of the state of Israel to exist, but I’m also a firm believer in the right of the state of Pal the of Palestine to exist. And so I sit here and and I believe in a two-state solution. And I believe that in any of these conflicts, you should have been able to find that there that that was the only obvious and potentially realistic path forward because on either side, you’re not going to sit and allow for or condone a genocide or mass upheaval of an entire population. Somehow the Israelis and the Palestinians have to find a way to coexist. Correct. And I I do know this is that if you don’t start there, then you end up where he is, the the the current president, which is that the Palestinian population of the West Bank and Gaza have to be completely removed from the region. Right? So then the idea of a mass deportation of millions of people is the most unreasonable and unrealistic impossible thing to even conceive of. But even if you could where and there’s not one of the regional partners would could possibly handle that. Not the Egyptians, not the Jordanians, not the Syrians, not the Lebanese, um uh not the Saudis. There’s nobody that would take take that population. Do you think that’s because they’re concerned with their trade relationships being threatened or they just don’t want their country to become a hotbed for Israeli bombardment? Oh, I think that they don’t want it to become a hotbed for poverty unrest. I think that they look at the lesson of Lebanon um in which the Palestinian refugees settled in Beirut and um and Beirut has never um been the same and Lebanon has never been the same. It’s completely corrupt. It collapsed by the way because of pressure from the Israelis, because of pressure from regional partners, because of pressure from internally, because of the political pressure, because of the Shia Sunni split. And then you have this situation in which nobody wants the Palestinians, but everybody wants to protect the Palestinians, but nobody wants to take the Palestinians and they don’t want to move. It’s their home. Yeah. So, what do you do? And the same as this, if you’re an Israeli and just a citizen, not a part of this government, not a supporter of Netanyahu, but you are somebody that is sitting there and you watch what they did on October 7th and you go, “How the [ __ ] can I possibly like live this way? How can anybody live this way? How can you live this way without eradicating the the threat? And that’s humanity. I don’t I I know that there’s no way about talking about this without really offending so many people. Yeah. It’s what I call a can’t win topic. There is no win in the topic other than to say this. There’s only one way forward and the only way forward is a two-state solution and a diplomatic solution. Bombing the [ __ ] out of whatever remains of Hamas in Gaza and turning it into a golf course like Donald Trump said is not going to work. No matter what, unless you literally kill every single person that inhabitants Gaza right now, you would have a generation upon generation that would justifiably haunt Israel and haunt the United States and haunt the United States and haunt any of its western any of the Western allies. 911 every weekend. Yeah. And why people can’t understand that? Same goes for Iran. The Iranian people, the Persian population that is not a part which is the vast majority adherence to the Ayah and a or a supporter of the dictatorial um government that rules Iran right now. They don’t support their government. But I tell you what they also don’t support. They don’t support being bombed to the [ __ ] stone ages by the United States. and and uh and Israel to rid them of the leadership that they have not risen up to to rid themselves of. Seems to me that’s up to them. And BB Netanyahu has been promising us that Iran was on the verge of a nuclear weapon for what 22 years now? Longer than that. I think he first wrote it in a book that they were months away from a nuclear weapon in 1996 and then he said it again in 2000 and then he did it in 2004 and then he did it during the Iraq war and then he did it a few months ago and then he did it a few weeks ago and then he dropped bombs. But he’s been wrong every time but he’s the boy who cried wolf and one day the wolf is going to you know the the the wolf is going to be pushed. They have no other other option. If they do have the file material to be able to create a crude weapon, which according to Secretary Monise, former Secretary of Energy, they have enough um um uh uranium to create basically a a crude nuclear bomb that could be transported by uh by rail car or or tractor trailer. Now, the ability for them to deliver that payload into Israel would be almost near impossible with the with the intelligence capacity and capabilities of the United States and Israel because you would not have safe passage through Syria now without Assad. So, even if they could do it, their ability to deliver it is almost zero. Does anybody think that BB Netanyahu is not doing this to save his own ass so that he doesn’t end up in jail because he has a favorability rating inside of uh Israel of about 22%. that the NASA is completely um uh in disarray. Look, here’s a real question I have and this get me in trouble, not relate to anybody but BB Netanyahu. If the MSAD had the plans for the October 7th attack a year before it occurred, why were you not prepared? Why did you not have soldiers in the southern part of Israel where the attacks occurred for like up to 7 12 hours? Maybe the same reason they didn’t capture Osama after the Kenya bombings. Maybe, but I don’t know the answer to that. But no one has been able to actually ask that question in earnest because we have still been in the fog of war because we’ve maintained the fog of war. I don’t know if you’ve read Tom Freriedman. I think it’s probably the most preient um thing that’s been written about this in uh at least many months. Tom Freriedman wrote a thing is that the worst thing that’s happened to the people, the the Jewish people is the Israeli government, Jewish people globally. the threats to their lives, the the anti-semitism that has that it has generated, the implication that if you are a Jew that you support Netanyahu, by the way, not Israel, not the the right of Israel to exist, not that you aren’t as Zionist as my father is a Zionist. Not that you do not believe that that that Israel and the state of Israel is sacred, but that you are associated almost implicated with the the horrific acts of BB Netanyahu of a man who last night went on TV and said about the awful sacrifices that he’s had to go to because his son has had to cancel his scheduled wedding twice now. He said that on TV on TV and then said and his wife has gone through so much pain because she’s had to put her life on hold these last two years since October 7th. And he hadn’t said one [ __ ] thing about how many people that are still hostages that he refuses to negotiate for about 100. That to me is a monster. And I support Israel and I definitely support my Jewish wife and my Jewish son. And I believe in the right of the state of Israel to exist in peace and in and prosperity. How do we talk about it without offending everyone? And I think my dad tried his hardest to be able to figure that out. The people that you said that stood up and you know would would you know just felt despondent because they didn’t think that anything has changed. At least my dad was saying over and over again the only solution is a two-state solution and we must find the answer to the two-state solution. Yeah. Without dropping bombs. He took away the bunker busting bombs from the Israelis. He tried to curtail Netanyahu’s thing. He forced Netanyahu to open up shipping l shipping lanes and uh uh aid lanes into at the um rapid crossing to be able to get food aid in. He put pressure over and over and over again. And now, by the way, that is not even remotely happening. What is happening is they were bombing food lines. There’s no one in there to be able to record it. The World Food Program, the UNHCR, none of the aid organizations are able to make it in. Doctors without borders no longer can make it in. There have been more journalists killed at this war in Gaza than in any other war combined. And nobody’s doing anything about it. And if you don’t think that Donald Trump gave BBahu all the free hand he wanted to when he said what I think is is that I think it’s great waterfront real estate and the US will own it. Literally said that. And so I do really ask you, where are all those young people that I saw show up in mass on campuses in front of the White House every single day? There were hundreds of people outside of the White House chanting genocide Joe, where are they today? Because it’s 10 times worse than it was. And the end is near. And so I think that the one thing that we all have to do, your audience, those people that you’re talking about, those people that became despondent, that the Muslim Americans, Latino Americans that all said that they’re going to vote for Trump because they believe this, that or the other thing, that are now in ICE detention centers or we’re facing a world conflation in in Iran, in the Middle East, you know, at the scale of which we haven’t seen since since Iraq. I think that we all have to [ __ ] unite. And what they did to my dad in 2024. And the reason I think that we failed in November of 2024 is because we showed the world that we did not have the one thing that is required to lead. And that is unity. That there was a purpose to us getting up in the morning and being together. That there was a purpose for the black community, to trust the Latino community, to trust the gay community, to trust the Jewish community, to trust the communities that were at risk. for transgender people to not be embarrassed to say that they’re transgender or can be concerned about whether they’re going to get beat up. One thing that we all have to do is just unify. I mean, there’s so many more of us than them. I always point out to everybody, and I talk too much, I’m sorry, but I always point out to everybody that Donald Trump garnered 75 million votes. Okay, that is uh what out of 350 million people, it’s pretty much the west coast. 28% of the entire population. Okay. And that is who we’re being governed by now. 28% of the of the population. That is not the majority of Americans, you know. Yeah. It’s not it’s the majority of people that voted in the last election. We just have to convince normal people of what’s at stake. I think it’s a lot at stake. Maybe not if they watch this podcast. If we’re counting on us, man, I think we’re in trouble. Oh my god. Well, look, either this podcast or the one that you’re doing tomorrow with the baby diaper um wearing one of the adult baby diaper lovers. One of the two and there’s a big division in the community and I swear to God I can’t do it. But you can probably guess I’m sorry that I even I even brought it back up. Brought it back up. But you can imagine what the division is. What do you think it would be? I’m not going to guess. I’m not going to guess. Well, I mean the f the division that I thought is angry baby versus happy baby. Yeah. Cuz babies are, you know, you have a young child, they’re not always happy. Yeah. And an angry baby has very different activities than a happy one. Yeah. Happy is laughing. They read Good Night Moon. They like milk. And then angry baby Yeah. You know what they do? Scream, throw stuff. But they also swear to God. Stop. Oh my god. So, the term for [ __ ] your diaper in the adult get there. Literally, I knew you were going to get there. Stop. Okay. Okay. Stop. What is messing is when you do number two. For me personally, I don’t allow poo poo. No poo poo. That’s a big no no. No. Oh my god. I won’t tell you. But everyone needs representation. You have any message to the, you know, people out there, not adult babies, but just people who might be struggling with um addiction or have an uncertain future ahead? Yeah, I do. in in in earnest is that getting clean and sober is the [ __ ] easiest thing you’ll ever do. All you got to do is change everything. But if you do, you know what? I promise you, there is literally, and I’m here to attest that there is no problem too big that um Come here. Come here. Come here. Come here. There’s no problem too big that uh that being uh clean and sober doesn’t uh make it a thousand times uh easier. You think that like it’s easier to do with the program or you do you advise people to just try doing it by themselves at first? Oh, no. No. I always always always try to get support. The best part, you know, look what there’s one thing is that regardless of what you think about the program or what it it saved my life in so many different ways and it saved the lives of it’s it nothing is nothing is a silver bullet. Nothing is ever a silver bullet. But I’ll tell you what, having a place to go to know that you’re not terminally unique. having a place to go to like say, you know, one time I and you know, realize that there’s six other people in the room that are listening to you or that you’re listening to, they’re like, “Hey, me too. I’m not so awful or I’m not so unique.” I think one of the things that addiction does to us is that regardless of how many people may be around, it it uh it isolates us in the most awful ways. It isolates us and makes us feel as if that we’re completely alone. And then one of the things about being in the rooms it gives you is is is a knowledge that you’re never never alone. And different piece of advice to somebody out there who might find themselves in the midst of a a scandal of any kind that involves media attention, whether it be warranted or unwarranted. What’s your advice to them? That’s a great question. Um I don’t I don’t know if I have any advice to give other than this. No matter how awful it is, always remember that you are in control of uh of your life. I mean what somebody else thinks about you can’t affect you unless you let it you know whatever it may be or whatever being said about you whether it is true or not true or whether you need to make amends for it or whether you need to be able to stand up for yourself about it is the fact of the matter is is that the only people that matter in my life the ones that I know at the end of the day that the only thing that I can rely on is what I think about myself based upon what the people I love the most in the world think about me and the only way that I uh can um garner their esteem is to do esteemable things. So, one of the things that we learned in the in uh the program that I’m part of is just try to do the next right thing. It’s all you can do is just try to do the next right thing. I don’t know if that makes any sense, you know. Super good. So, prioritize like acts of service and kindness to the people closest to That’s what I tell everybody about the program is that at the end of the day, there’s only one thing that you’re told that you will achieve and uh that you need to continue to do over and over again is to get to a point in which you will have the ability to be able to serve those that are still sick and suffering. And the only thing that takes you out of yourself, the only thing that ever takes you out of yourself is to be of service to somebody else. Whether it’s somebody in in that is in need in the program or whether it’s your family. You know, there’s that great quote from um I don’t know if she actually said it, but Mother Teresa, if you want to save the world, go home and love your family. You have any advice out there to, you know, Irish Americans from the Philadelphia area that have a hard time with vulnerability and are scared to open up to their friends and family? Only the only advice I have is to fly eagles fly. That’s it. Would you uh would you sponsor Jake Tapper? Would I sponsor Jake Tapper? Of course I’d sponsor Jake Tapper. I don’t think Jake Tapper has that problem, though. And uh and he’s got one thing good thing going for him. He’s an Eagles fan, so really he can’t be that bad. Yeah. All right. Well, thanks so much for the great interview, man. I really appreciate it. Yeah. Thanks, buddy. That was it. I really hope that you guys enjoyed this interview with Hunter. Um, now at the time of the interview, which was conducted about a month ago in the beautiful foothills of rural Delaware, a corporate tax haven just a stones throw from Kensington, Hunter wasn’t really in the news and was enjoying something of a long-awaited break from the constant onslaught of attacks from Trump and Code that had been a uh near weekly occurrence in Hunter’s life for four years straight. But a few weeks after this interview, that would all change, of course, when President Trump and Attorney General Pam Bondi dropped what may have been the worst deflection of all time related to the Jeffrey Epstein files. I’m sure you guys have seen this footage, so I’m not going to go through the process of putting it on screen, but in short, the White House, FBI, and DOJ dropped a report unanimously signing off on the fact that there was no significant wrongdoing to report inside of the Jeffrey Epstein files, alleged client list, and flight logs that were seized from international underage sex trafficker Jeffrey Epstein. Um, to the shock of the entire world. And not just on the progressive or liberal side. This inflamed the core Trump base to an apocalyptic degree because after all, Donald Trump along with Cash Patel and JD Vance had ran nearly an entire campaign promising to release these files and framing themselves as the protectors of children sent by God to wage a holy war against a satanic pedophile cabal of Democrats and Hollywood actors. And then boom, Trump’s lambasting reporters in real time for even asking about the Epstein files and shaming them for not instead focusing on the victims of the floods in Texas. and of course evoking the Hunter Biden laptop conspiracy once again in a desperate attempt to divert attention away from himself and back toward his former adversaries, pleading that MAGA supporters stop asking about the Epstein files, which by the way are simply an Obama and Bill Clinton false flag, and instead focus on more important things like the contents of Hunter Biden’s laptop. This resulted in a renewed surge of headlines about Hunter, and I felt like given the report that him and I had, it warranted a second interview to get his thoughts on the Epstein matter. To my surprise, Hunter was not at the Biden estate in Delaware, but instead in uh in Southern California at his home studio working on some art and spending time with his wife and son. So, I figured I’d pay him a visit. And it goes without saying that our second interview was a bit crazier than the first as far as like the stuff that we talked about. Unpopular opinion if there was no
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00:00:00 – The Depths of Addiction
00:03:23 – Why Speak Out Now?
00:06:09 – Surviving Addiction and Finding Recovery
00:11:52 – Media Myths & Conspiracies
00:18:39 – Family Tragedy and Early Life
00:29:41 – Coping with Loss & Descent into Crack Addiction
00:35:55 – Life in Active Addiction
00:46:09 – Public Perception and Media Treatment
00:49:02 – The Reality of Crack vs. Cocaine
00:53:13 – The Crime Bill & Drug Sentencing Reform
01:20:49 – Sobriety Before the Political Storm
01:23:05 – The Laptop Story
01:57:28 – Staying Sober Through Scandal
02:12:00 – Joe Biden’s Health and Decision to Step Down
02:32:34 – Critique of Media & Celebrity Influence
02:53:28 – Israel, Palestine, and U.S. Involvement
03:04:32 – Advice for Those Struggling
47 comments
Go to https://ground.news/channel5 to stay fully informed with all sides of every story. Subscribe for 40% off the Vantage plan through my link.
Use code CHANNEL5 at https://www.incogni.com/channel5 to get an exclusive 60% off.
Our documentary 'Dear Kelly,' is currently streaming at https://www.dearkellyfilm.com/ for the low rental cost of $5.55. Go watch it or purchase a physical copy at https://dearkellyfilmdvd.bigcartel.com
To see our extended part 2 interview with Hunter go to our Patreon at https://www.patreon.com/channel5
Excellent subject, even aside from his personal life I feel like interviewing people close to the circle of power gives so much more insight than interviewing people in positsions of power. Allows for more honesty which I think most people can actually stomach and take into account. If you're a politician then honesty is never appreciated no matter how people say they want honesty. But if a person is not part of the approval ratings I feel that people have a much more open mind.
This pedophile should be in prison.
He sounds exactly like his dad
I've seen this exact scenario play out in real time too many times. 37:11
He was also a choir boy, donated to charity, helped old women cross the street, volunteers at puppy mills, volunteers at strippers r us and buys and test drugs before they make it to the streets….hes my hero 🥰
To see the maga in this chat mock someone who went through something so horrible. Funny how the 2 billion trumps son in law took just went away.
just shows their lack of compassion and empathy. But we know maga lacks any decency. Tapper is a pos. He was becoming irrelevant so he came up with this crap.
bussed bike leaped hike straw sedge vast thatch arches amaze haunt tiled though what fame isles aware banyan ways node chilly said at bray sledding though broad leaf arid jaunt wharf sake shoal dub yews strum vanishes dune odd muck science wharf odd slog jaunt ado schist wharf height
All the advantages in the world mean nothing in a no-win situation. Bro could'a been a dishwasher and they'd claim it was compromising the white house.
OMG. Pete Hegseth talking about Hunter Biden's drinking…that's insane.
TREASON
Of Course Addiction & Trauma Are Related, Thee Drug is The Way Some People Cope With Reality or Try An Escape From Reality or Change Their Reality To Better Themselves Or Their Mind To 4Get Abt Their Life 💯🫡🙏🏼🤌🏼🤷🏼♂️🤔🧐😳🙏🏼
"and by the way" is a family slogan lol
Very humanizing interview. Shout out to Andrew as well as congratulations! Still suspicious about the influence peddling and the Burisma/Ukraine stuff. Nonetheless, like I said, very humanizing video of someone who is a recovering addict. Blessings!
What an absolute scum bag Cunter Biden is.
excellent interview. Hunter needs to do Theo Von’s pod next
1:12 got me 💀💀😂😂😂😂😂 already
Fantastic interview. Regardless if you like him or his dad, this is history
As a drug addict Trump has fucked me over
Consumption refers to tuberculosis btw, not alcoholism
he was pardon by his dad he was not held accountable,
Drinking doesn't make me violent, when i was young it made me more se xualy impulsive, but I became able to control that, the problem for me is that if I'm going through hard times, I can use it as a crutch. So I don't drink anymore and I'm better off for it.
Omg what a idiotic pos. Another billionaire whining about their self destruction smh. Yeah I'm 1000x better than this guy any day without even trying.
@1:26:30 PEOPLE!
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He absolutely cooked the GOP. Hunter for Pres.
💙💙💙
Been saying since the pardon that i really want to hear from hunter Biden… interesting
Watching this video of him, give me vibes I think he’s high while he’s doing this interview and then the line that he said about addiction is not an excuse is an explanation listening to that I was like what🤯.i know is when a person has to explain themselves then they’re lying. like his whole video he’s like ranting. But my opinion still interesting to see him give us interview.
Another “Conspiracy Theory” now a “Conspiracy FACT”!
2.3 mill views, barely 100k likes,,,pretty sure its obvious we hate hunter and for a good reason.
Your father is worse than Netanyahu he is killer he slaughtered Palestinians
This humonkulus should be in prison
I realized this is the son of a president and obviously he looks up to his dad. But he displays the ego driven delusion of Joe Biden and why he stayed in the race. Saying stuff like "he passed more progressive legislation than any president since FDR!" blah blah and its like, do you realize how low of a bar it is to pass? Also, all that stuff wasn't passed bc of Biden. It was passed bc of COVID. In fact, they would've gotten more done if Biden hadn't stepped in to allow Manchin and Sinima to gut legislation. He didn't win bc of who Joe Biden is either. He had the party hand him the nomination to avoid Bernie from winning it. Biden was showing he was too old in the 2020 primaries. He won bc of COVID. It was a once in a lifetime event and it gave him the excuse he needed to stay out of the public and not campaign. If Covid didn't happen, he absolutely would've lost in 2020. I have no doubt. People didn't vote FOR Biden. They voted AGAINST Trump during a national crisis. Hunter makes it out like the party had something against him…dude, those people are the reason he became president in the first place. They got all the candidates to drop out and endorse him over the course of 1 weekend…all to stop Bernie Sanders. Because Bernie was well on his way to winning the nomination.
Biden is not the great man Hunter thinks of him. But I don't blame him. Of course he's going to have a delusional view of his dad. Just as Joe Biden had a delusional view of himself.
I bet Hunter could whup junior in a scrap.
This guy is my friend. His points on community to injustice conducted by the US State Dept. I feel so heard and seen, so validated.
This changed my view of this man!
So glad I watched it and I am so sorry for judging this man from the news reports.
Not my place to judge anyone and this taught me alot about that!
15:10 Shaun Maguire is kinda cooked, made some rasist comments about Mamdani. Didnt expect to see his name pop up but yeah. Kinda funny to see Hunter dunking on Maguire
Good to know that citizens that are illegal are good for disch wassers why didn't you give them then a green Gard and if they are good citizens why are there then criminals and murderers that are illegal good to know he is a real junky
consumption = tuberculosis
How the fuck did this fool make more sense about palestine and israel than most people? Scary when the crackhead sounds more diplomatic than our current administration. And I voted for trump. Wtf!
Love this man.
The reason the Trump kids are so hard on Hunter is because of pure jealousy. They KNOW, Joe loves his kids fiercely and it’s a love they will NEVER get from Trump.
"I've probably smoked more parmesan cheese than anyone" … I've known some challengers to this feat. It is insane when you look back at it. I'm so glad Hunter got out.
Whether or not you think Biden was a bad president or a good president, it's clear that he was a terrible father. All that cussing, the drugs, the alcohol, the hedonism… But his enabler dad was the best! 🙄
Delusional Democrats
I trust this man more than I trust Trump and Elon. Lol
Miranda Devine was laughed out of Australia – The USA needs a little Australian B.S, detector. I am bewildered by the lack of BS detection and crazy gullibility by US folks. I think education has a great deal to answer for. Congrats Mr B, stay steady and please find safety from the fools.
"Just because the elitists are liberal, people assume that they're a liberal elite" 🙄
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