Surely the comments on this one will be tasteful and full of insight.
I hate that one data set uses % and the other per 100000.
Man, women can’t even do that right.
/s
Men tend to do it more violently (firearms, hanging) which are generally effective and permanent, while women do pills generally which is either ineffective (not enough) or reversible (stomach pumping).
I’ve heard that women are more likely to attempt overdosing on pills, while men are likely to use a gun. That said, men’s mental health is still something that our culture doesn’t really know how to address while toxic masculinity reigns supreme.
This data visualization is horrible. The axes (one of them not even starting at 0), the different chart types, the units. My god. This should go to r/dataishorrendous.
There’s no “paradox” statistically. Men die more bc they are statistically more likely to choose methods with higher fatality rates such as firearms, compared to women who are statistically more likely to choose methods with lower fatality rates such as drug overdosing. There is undoubtedly a lot of discussion to be had around WHY that is, but the numbers are pretty clear on what is happening
I have female patients who come into the ED twice a week for paracetamol poisoning. Always in good overall condition. I have only ever seen men come in after hanging themselves sucessfully.
In case anyone things this is just a guns thing, we see the game gender imbalance in Canada despite the fact that less than 10% of suicides involve firearms: [https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0165032724013971](https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0165032724013971)
Interestingly, if you look at assisted suicide, the numbers show almost no gender difference:
What is considered an “attempted suicide”? I can see that category being genuine attemps on life, or any kind of self harm. WHO doesn’t have standard definition, in some instances it includes acts where not injury is done to a person, or even suicidal ideation, which may contribute heavily to the differences.
As for women attempting more: Many people point out correct facts (men tend to choose more violent and effective methods, for whatever reason that may be), but what I have not seen pointed out is that the dead can’t re-attempt. Women tend to choose less effective means, therefore get saved much more often, and are able to re-attempt, some several times.
women want attention, men want results
that’s why we get paid more, we get the job done /s
Unpopular opinion: Men die more because more men than women live fucked up shitty lives and when they commit suicide they mean it, not for attention.
This chart is so annoying. Left you have per 100.000 and right per 100. Ok, but then you look at 15-24yo male and think, oh one per 1000 attempts is completed (which seems actually pretty low) and you notice, not even the numbers match. This makes both charts hard to compare.
This is saying 5% of female preteens attempt suicide *annually*.
Data that isn’t beautiful.
Mixing per 100,000 and %, having both a bar graph and a line graph. How much worse can it get?
I wonder if women are more likely to attempt suicide as a cry for help, where most men assume they won’t get help anyway, so they use something that is more likely to do the job the first time?
Mostly, women don’t really mean it. They do it as a cry for help, so they use methods that have a less likely chance to succeed. When men break, they have fully broken and intend to die.
The real story here is how successful old people are at committing suicide compared to young people.
One wants to die.
The other wants attention.
Pretty simple.
Are men less likely to attempt to commit suicide, or are they less likely to admit that they attempted to commit suicide?
I haven’t dug enough into the research to answer this question, but my suspicion leads me to believe that data on suicides is much more accurate than data on suicide attempts. But admitting this would require us to ask difficult questions about why we treat men so horribly.
If you succeed, you can’t try again.
~5% of women aged between 10-14 attempt suicide annually?? Much higher than I anticipated. Quite unfortunate 🙁
men use guns a lot more for this, but overall they choose more violent methods, such as jumping from somewhere high.
The problem with this is that it is two completely different data sets aquired by different groups with different methodology. The graph makes it appear as though they recorded all of the suicide attempts by gender and divided them into “successful attempts” and “unsuccessful attempts”.
But suicides are determined by coroners and similar people investigating deaths. They don’t have patients. They have a corpse, and they determine how that person died.
Attempts that aren’t successful are discovered by doctors treating living patients, and whether it gets documented depends in part on what the patient reports to the doctor.
So, you would expect data like that to be biased towards a group that goes to the doctor more often, especially for mental health. Which gender is that?
Also, attempts that are successful aren’t reported as attempts at all. The coroner just identifies suicide as cause of death.
Big takeaway for me is that men’s attempts are more and more successful as they get older.
Somehow, men aged 75 and up have among the lowest attempt rates but the highest suicide death rate. I’m so curious as to why.
Inb4 weirdo redpillers come in saying shit like “men better at killing themselves than women! W”
I don’t understand why anyone is calling this a “paradox”. Apparently men are simply a hell of a lot better at successfully committing suicide. What is paradoxical about that?
finally something males are better at!
This data is not beautiful.
Some suicides are a cry for help. But the idea that all suicides fall into this category is whitewashing reality and pretending existence is nicer than it really is. Some are deliberate, considered decisions to end things. And the results reflect this.
35 comments
Source: World Health Organization (WHO)
Done with Python, using matplotlib library. [https://colab.research.google.com/drive/1OYSDL1t0YzksSOyMXzRAW29kSojkIUho](https://colab.research.google.com/drive/1OYSDL1t0YzksSOyMXzRAW29kSojkIUho)
Surely the comments on this one will be tasteful and full of insight.
I hate that one data set uses % and the other per 100000.
Man, women can’t even do that right.
/s
Men tend to do it more violently (firearms, hanging) which are generally effective and permanent, while women do pills generally which is either ineffective (not enough) or reversible (stomach pumping).
I’ve heard that women are more likely to attempt overdosing on pills, while men are likely to use a gun. That said, men’s mental health is still something that our culture doesn’t really know how to address while toxic masculinity reigns supreme.
This data visualization is horrible. The axes (one of them not even starting at 0), the different chart types, the units. My god. This should go to r/dataishorrendous.
There’s no “paradox” statistically. Men die more bc they are statistically more likely to choose methods with higher fatality rates such as firearms, compared to women who are statistically more likely to choose methods with lower fatality rates such as drug overdosing. There is undoubtedly a lot of discussion to be had around WHY that is, but the numbers are pretty clear on what is happening
I have female patients who come into the ED twice a week for paracetamol poisoning. Always in good overall condition. I have only ever seen men come in after hanging themselves sucessfully.
In case anyone things this is just a guns thing, we see the game gender imbalance in Canada despite the fact that less than 10% of suicides involve firearms: [https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0165032724013971](https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0165032724013971)
Interestingly, if you look at assisted suicide, the numbers show almost no gender difference:
https://www.bfs.admin.ch/asset/de/1023143
What is considered an “attempted suicide”? I can see that category being genuine attemps on life, or any kind of self harm. WHO doesn’t have standard definition, in some instances it includes acts where not injury is done to a person, or even suicidal ideation, which may contribute heavily to the differences.
As for women attempting more: Many people point out correct facts (men tend to choose more violent and effective methods, for whatever reason that may be), but what I have not seen pointed out is that the dead can’t re-attempt. Women tend to choose less effective means, therefore get saved much more often, and are able to re-attempt, some several times.
women want attention, men want results
that’s why we get paid more, we get the job done /s
Unpopular opinion: Men die more because more men than women live fucked up shitty lives and when they commit suicide they mean it, not for attention.
This chart is so annoying. Left you have per 100.000 and right per 100. Ok, but then you look at 15-24yo male and think, oh one per 1000 attempts is completed (which seems actually pretty low) and you notice, not even the numbers match. This makes both charts hard to compare.
This is saying 5% of female preteens attempt suicide *annually*.
Data that isn’t beautiful.
Mixing per 100,000 and %, having both a bar graph and a line graph. How much worse can it get?
I wonder if women are more likely to attempt suicide as a cry for help, where most men assume they won’t get help anyway, so they use something that is more likely to do the job the first time?
Mostly, women don’t really mean it. They do it as a cry for help, so they use methods that have a less likely chance to succeed. When men break, they have fully broken and intend to die.
The real story here is how successful old people are at committing suicide compared to young people.
One wants to die.
The other wants attention.
Pretty simple.
Are men less likely to attempt to commit suicide, or are they less likely to admit that they attempted to commit suicide?
I haven’t dug enough into the research to answer this question, but my suspicion leads me to believe that data on suicides is much more accurate than data on suicide attempts. But admitting this would require us to ask difficult questions about why we treat men so horribly.
If you succeed, you can’t try again.
~5% of women aged between 10-14 attempt suicide annually?? Much higher than I anticipated. Quite unfortunate 🙁
men use guns a lot more for this, but overall they choose more violent methods, such as jumping from somewhere high.
The problem with this is that it is two completely different data sets aquired by different groups with different methodology. The graph makes it appear as though they recorded all of the suicide attempts by gender and divided them into “successful attempts” and “unsuccessful attempts”.
But suicides are determined by coroners and similar people investigating deaths. They don’t have patients. They have a corpse, and they determine how that person died.
Attempts that aren’t successful are discovered by doctors treating living patients, and whether it gets documented depends in part on what the patient reports to the doctor.
So, you would expect data like that to be biased towards a group that goes to the doctor more often, especially for mental health. Which gender is that?
Also, attempts that are successful aren’t reported as attempts at all. The coroner just identifies suicide as cause of death.
Big takeaway for me is that men’s attempts are more and more successful as they get older.
Somehow, men aged 75 and up have among the lowest attempt rates but the highest suicide death rate. I’m so curious as to why.
Inb4 weirdo redpillers come in saying shit like “men better at killing themselves than women! W”
I don’t understand why anyone is calling this a “paradox”. Apparently men are simply a hell of a lot better at successfully committing suicide. What is paradoxical about that?
finally something males are better at!
This data is not beautiful.
Some suicides are a cry for help. But the idea that all suicides fall into this category is whitewashing reality and pretending existence is nicer than it really is. Some are deliberate, considered decisions to end things. And the results reflect this.
It’s always been that way
Comments are closed.