Umfrage zum Rentenalter: Frauen sollen länger arbeiten – finden die Männer [Survey on retirement age: Women should work longer – according to men]

12 comments

  1. Deepl translation of [original](https://www.tagesanzeiger.ch/frauen-sollen-laenger-arbeiten-finden-die-maenner-230018669775) in German.

    Survey on retirement age: Women should work longer – according to men

    The retirement age divides the sexes. According to a study, the majority of men are in favor of raising the retirement age to 65, while women themselves are clearly against it.

    It will be the most important vote of the year, perhaps the most important of the legislative period: In the fall, the electorate will decide whether women should retire at the same time as men in the future – i.e. at 65 instead of 64, as is currently the case. “AHV 21” is the name of the corresponding proposal from the Federal Council and Parliament. Its purpose is to financially stabilize the first pillar of old-age provision. However, the reform is being vigorously opposed by the left and in particular by the Swiss Federation of Trade Unions (SGB). In the view of the SGB, women are still disadvantaged in many cases; an increase in their retirement age is therefore out of place.

    As a recent representative survey now shows, a very close race is to be expected. According to the survey, 45 percent of respondents say “yes” or “rather yes” to AHV 21. 48 percent answered “no” or “rather no”; 7 percent are still undecided. This was determined by the Sotomo research institute on behalf of the SGB.

    It is striking how the yes and no votes are distributed. A deep gender divide is apparent: of the women, only 31 percent are in favor. 35 percent clearly say “no”, and another 26 percent “rather no”. Among men, it is exactly the opposite. Here, 59 percent are in favor. Only 34 percent are against.

    In other words, men believe that women should work just as long as they do in the future. But they are fighting back.

    “I’m not surprised that the sexes view this issue differently,” says Kathrin Bertschy, a Green Liberal member of the National Council and co-president of the women’s organization Alliance F. On average, women receive 20,000 francs less in pensions. Many rejected a higher retirement age as long as other steps toward equality had not been taken, especially equal pay and a better balance between work and family.

    However, Bertschy points out that it is not the AHV that is responsible for the low women’s pensions. The problem is lower incomes and many part-time jobs – “which are also very poorly insured in the second pillar.

    Younger people are also skeptical

    The Sotomo survey also reveals other rifts, for example between the generations. By far the highest level of support for AHV 21 (62 percent) is found among the over-65s – i.e. those who have already retired. Younger cohorts, on the other hand, are more skeptical. Among 36- to 45-year-olds, only a minority of 30 percent say “yes. Other decisive factors are income – the higher, the more positive – and origin: the large (left-wing) cities and the countryside express themselves more negatively than the small towns and conurbations.

    In the view of SGB campaign manager Urban Hodel, the results are logical. Women would know the “poor pension security from personal experience”, hence the high rejection of the “AHV reduction”. The same applies to people with lower incomes, Hodel said. “There’s greater approval among higher-income households because they rely less on AHV than a saleswoman or a nurse.””

    It’s obviously a vote where people are looking very much at their own wallets,” confirms Sotomo executive director Michael Hermann. According to him, the poll results bode well for an exciting referendum campaign. “How it will turn out is completely open at this point in time.”

  2. As a man I am not ok with that. Would even prefer to work 1 or 2 years more for my wife if needed.
    She’ll be carrying our children and raise them (that s what she wants at the moment), I think the job will already be done for her.

  3. I don’t understand the long term strategy of not wanting that. If you retire at the same age and do military service (or similar), you are holding all political cards. There are no arguments left to be against legislation to end salary discrepancies.

    If you “refuse”, you give the SVP free arguments. Why? It’s fair you retire at the same age. Why did I have to pay 3% of my salary for not doing mil but not my sister? Put the pressure on. If you say no to this it looks like you want all the good stuff but not the bad.

  4. Equal everything

    – Equal pay (for equal work! No apple and pears stuff)
    – Equal military duty
    – Equal reproductive rights (as far as possible – both should be able to (financially) „abort“ under certain conditions)
    – Equal time to work
    – Equal awareness regarding gender issues (worse cultural integration amongst men which might kead to harassment, far higher suicide rates amonst men, need for better representation in medical studies for women)
    – and more
    – Additional focus on unequal distribution of wealth between poor/middle class and bonzen wich contributes to many more problems

    It‘s 2022.. there is no more space for cheap excuses and having the cake and eat it too. It‘s time to say no to sexism

  6. It’ll probably take the ECHR to fix that one. Same with the conscription thing.

    It’s fine you want progress in other areas. It’s not fine to keep up discrimination in the code of law.

  7. Nah, can’t do that in Switzerland. Only things that affect men negatively are allowed.

    I would be in favor for retirement age 64 for men.

  10. Fun fact: The logic at the time as to why women need to retire earlier than men was that on average husbands were two years older than their wives. It was important for them to retire at the same time because someone needed to cook for the men when they’re at home.

  12. I was wondering whether this poll was done by Tages-Anzeiger or not. It was conducted by Sotomo with data gathered by both Bilendi (Swiss people register at [www.meinungsplatz.ch](https://www.meinungsplatz.ch) and can undertake survey for financial compensation) and Sotomo themselves.

    Sample size is 1454 (950 deCH, 504 frCH).

    Under data gathering and methodology, they write that they received more responses from men (generally both more men and older peole take part in polls – in 20min poll data I saw it was 65% male, average age 65). The responses get weighted according to demographic and political data to make it representative.

    There is no indication for the expected statistical error, but: the sample size is relatively small, there are more male than female respondents, the respondents are older and the sample is split in 950 deCH and 504 frCH respondents, which is ~65% deCH and ~34% deFR. According to the BFS in 2020 62% deCH, 23% frCH. Then I can’t tell whether there was a question pertaining to people being Swiss citizens with the right to vote. The statistical error in this one is probably not insignificant, pure guess, but I’d say higher single digit.

    (If you look at online polls, always be sure to check whether they are representative or not, when there’s an online poll and you can immediately see the results, it’s not representative because the data hasn’t been weighted (and most like not been checked for attempts to influence the results)).

    [The report can be downloaded on this page.](https://sotomo.ch/site/projekte/reform-ahv-21-bevoelkerungsbefragung-zur-volksabstimmung/)

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