Yes, that’s it. It’s laziness. It’s most certainly not the wages and conditions.
Is the times a tabloid now?
Construction hours suck.
I’m sure if you paid good money and not €200 p/w to your apprentice, there would be no shortage of candidates.
There’s certainly going to be no one jumping out of bed at that hour to do tough work for shit money and struggle to live life as a result of the shit pay.
An “apprentice development manager” made these comments. How the fuck is that making the news?
Poor wages, poor hours, physically demanding work, and a generation that grew up seeing trades get wiped out and livelihoods ruined during the recession, then told that college is the only thing worth doing.
If unemployment was through the roof then his statement might make sense. But it’s around 5% which is nearly as low as pre pandemic. So no, people aren’t reluctant to get out of bed at 7am. They’re just getting out of bed at that time to go to a better job.
Yeah, I don’t think it’s the start time that’s the problem here.
Seems to be another article painting the narrative around why there’s no houses being built. Crisis this, crisis that. Typically, the young people get blamed as always even though if you have to commute to an office for your job and in for 9 you’re more than likely up by 7am anyways to get ready etc.
Wait until they discover we can’t afford to have kids and there’s really a shortage of absolutely everything in 10 years.
What does an apprentice get paid? I worked on a site as a labourer for a summer before 6th year, and the money was savage (for an idiot teenager with no bills or dependants anyways), but that was back in 2003.
Seems like most of Dublin is now in work by 8 already rather than the traditional 9. Do we need to be overworked more?
Does this really surprise anyone though? There’s been such a push for the past 30 years to get people into third level education that trades and vocational apprenticeships have fallen by the wayside.
Students finishing secondary school are bred I thinking that a degree is the only way to secure a job. That’s simply untrue when fucking everyone has a degree – I say this as someone who has one.
And let’s be honest – college culture doesn’t breed good work ethics. Especially in Ireland.
Jesus young people are so lazy and entitled these days.
Nah, I’d say it’s more likely that the pay you’re on as an apprentice is so low that it’s not viable to live off unless you’re in your parents home rent free for most.
You can make great money as an electrician or a plumber or a carpenter but those apprenticeship years are really bloody hard for people to survive on when you could go just make more being a general labourer.
Also, unless you’re self employed and can manage your own hours construction can be a shite sector to work in.
I imagine a big part of it is the bullying and almost feudal relationship that apprentices are subjected to still. Young people don’t want to put up with that kind of shite. The whole ‘they don’t want to get out of bed’ quote is the exact kind of attitude that drives young people away.
Oh piss the fuck off. Reminds me of Bill Cullen back in the recession days on some talk show program basically saying it was young people’s fault they couldn’t find work. It’s a long time ago now but went along the lines of “In my day, i got up at 5am and done any job I could find” – “Bill, there are no jobs” – “Nonsense, you’re not trying hard enough”.
There are young people driving past building sites on their commute to Dublin from Leitrim for office jobs. Clearly the issue is not getting up in the morning.
Tis awful early in fairness
* Choice A:
Be on the dole, get a free house and make 14k a year subletting a room.
* Choice B:
Wake up 6am, drive to the construction site for a back-breaking job – 10 years later still unable to buy your own home.
Kept getting warnings for turning up late like 7:05 7:10, it’s not like there was anyone else on the site. Made me realise how strict time is for some jobs. Compare that to other jobs when they walk in at at9clock.
Yeah it’s great the younger generation aren’t a bunch of pushovers or naive to work themselves hard for crap pay.
That industry would want to “wise up” so to speak. Why would anyone looking for long term stability tie themselves to the construction industry? The financial crash is not that long ago, I work in the mfg world and have ran into plenty of guys who lost their jobs in 08/09 to retrain as engineers across pharma/biomed. They most definitely don’t regret their decision.
I’ve family who have worked their whole lives in the construction industry, all told me to steer clear. And that says it all. Similar is happening in the hospitality sector, their only relief valve is importing cheap labour but the high cost of living and accommodation has torpedoed that.
It all comes down to greed, and I have no sympathy for any of these industries.
Sure why don’t they just start later then if they want more people to do it?
Construction hasn’t changed since the recession. It’s still crony as fuck.
I’ve been in this industry for 8 years, part-time and full time since I was 16, and in that timespan only 5% of completed work is fully paid in accordance with the initial quotation. Sub-contractors are expected to haggle for 10-20% reductions and if they don’t then the client is not long delaying the full payment or refusing to progress the process without the haggle.
On-site, there are almost no labourers below 30 and the only trade making good money are the electrician’s.
I’m up at 6-7am and only home at 6-7pm everyday because of commutes to work in Dublin, Kilkenny or Athlone due to there bejng fuck all high-paying, commercial development outside of urban zones right now.
It’s not worth the toll it’s taking on my body and social life, so many auld fella’s are in that routine but having been to college, I know life shouldn’t be that hard
It’s a joke and at 24 I’m off to do my masters and get the fuck out.
I’ve worked construction for 25 years now ( started at 15) and have 4 children . I have told my son to try his best in school and not to do what I do . I’m 40 now and a broken man , my knees, back , neck etc etc .
If they need a job but don’t take up one of these, then they clearly have choices & are opting for better pay/benefits/conditions/whtvr.
& If getting up for 7am is considered poor conditions…
Calling young people lazy really let’s them off the hook from improving the offer.
Dude I’m can’t just wake up anymore to work. Half of my income goes to revenue and other half to rent. I keep thinking that don’t make sense I progress more in my career to be fked. If I think about that imagine to get out of the bed 7 am
Trades don’t get the respect in society they deserve
I can’t blame them. I am not a morning person so I fully agree that you shouldn’t have to be up before 8.
[The Itish Time is such a fucking rag these days they don’t even spell their own name right.](https://i.imgur.com/MMvqOfE.png)
It’s because we’re not in the country. We’re out in Canada and Australia getting up for their construction industry.
I’m sure there’s a level of that but at the same time, the trades were stigmatized as working class for years, go to college and get a degree and make millions instead.
Other side is most young people.these days see that remote work and tech work is where the money is at so why ruin your back or knees doing a hard day’s work. That being said, a trade is like bar work, you’ll always have a job. My electrician is booked up for months.
Apprentices like PhD students are horrendously treated
Not everyone wants to be getting up at 530am
Construction work is a death sentence for your health.
If there was work in the bed he’d sleep on the floor
21 M, more than half way through an electrical apprenticeship. I check livestock at 4:30 AM, drive 30 minutes to meet the van before 6 and head off down the country. Back home around 7 o’clock in the evening. Could spend upwards of 20 hours a week travelling that I do not get paid for. I’m happy enough as my employer is sound and pays me above the rate but there’s a lot of apprentices out there whos 39 hour weeks turn into 60+ hour week from travel alone. Nothing to do with getting up early. Conditions can be shit for those who want to do it. I can guarantee the bollocks who said that is still in bed by the time I’ve had my second breakfast.
Also, there is a general snobbery about not going to college in Ireland. Lots of lads I know from school that took the piss out of the lads doing trades are finishing up in courses they had no interest in, are now scratching their heads looking at fully qualified tradesmen buying houses at 23/24.
Edit- format
I’m in intel making a fortune. Money flying again and loads of jobs going
I can barely get out of bed at that time to go to my cushy office job..
Get off your arses youngsters! The top 1% needs another wealth injection. And who better to lead the call than The Times.
41 comments
Yes, that’s it. It’s laziness. It’s most certainly not the wages and conditions.
Is the times a tabloid now?
Construction hours suck.
I’m sure if you paid good money and not €200 p/w to your apprentice, there would be no shortage of candidates.
There’s certainly going to be no one jumping out of bed at that hour to do tough work for shit money and struggle to live life as a result of the shit pay.
An “apprentice development manager” made these comments. How the fuck is that making the news?
Poor wages, poor hours, physically demanding work, and a generation that grew up seeing trades get wiped out and livelihoods ruined during the recession, then told that college is the only thing worth doing.
If unemployment was through the roof then his statement might make sense. But it’s around 5% which is nearly as low as pre pandemic. So no, people aren’t reluctant to get out of bed at 7am. They’re just getting out of bed at that time to go to a better job.
Yeah, I don’t think it’s the start time that’s the problem here.
Seems to be another article painting the narrative around why there’s no houses being built. Crisis this, crisis that. Typically, the young people get blamed as always even though if you have to commute to an office for your job and in for 9 you’re more than likely up by 7am anyways to get ready etc.
Wait until they discover we can’t afford to have kids and there’s really a shortage of absolutely everything in 10 years.
What does an apprentice get paid? I worked on a site as a labourer for a summer before 6th year, and the money was savage (for an idiot teenager with no bills or dependants anyways), but that was back in 2003.
Seems like most of Dublin is now in work by 8 already rather than the traditional 9. Do we need to be overworked more?
Does this really surprise anyone though? There’s been such a push for the past 30 years to get people into third level education that trades and vocational apprenticeships have fallen by the wayside.
Students finishing secondary school are bred I thinking that a degree is the only way to secure a job. That’s simply untrue when fucking everyone has a degree – I say this as someone who has one.
And let’s be honest – college culture doesn’t breed good work ethics. Especially in Ireland.
Jesus young people are so lazy and entitled these days.
Nah, I’d say it’s more likely that the pay you’re on as an apprentice is so low that it’s not viable to live off unless you’re in your parents home rent free for most.
You can make great money as an electrician or a plumber or a carpenter but those apprenticeship years are really bloody hard for people to survive on when you could go just make more being a general labourer.
Also, unless you’re self employed and can manage your own hours construction can be a shite sector to work in.
I imagine a big part of it is the bullying and almost feudal relationship that apprentices are subjected to still. Young people don’t want to put up with that kind of shite. The whole ‘they don’t want to get out of bed’ quote is the exact kind of attitude that drives young people away.
Oh piss the fuck off. Reminds me of Bill Cullen back in the recession days on some talk show program basically saying it was young people’s fault they couldn’t find work. It’s a long time ago now but went along the lines of “In my day, i got up at 5am and done any job I could find” – “Bill, there are no jobs” – “Nonsense, you’re not trying hard enough”.
There are young people driving past building sites on their commute to Dublin from Leitrim for office jobs. Clearly the issue is not getting up in the morning.
Tis awful early in fairness
* Choice A:
Be on the dole, get a free house and make 14k a year subletting a room.
* Choice B:
Wake up 6am, drive to the construction site for a back-breaking job – 10 years later still unable to buy your own home.
Kept getting warnings for turning up late like 7:05 7:10, it’s not like there was anyone else on the site. Made me realise how strict time is for some jobs. Compare that to other jobs when they walk in at at9clock.
Yeah it’s great the younger generation aren’t a bunch of pushovers or naive to work themselves hard for crap pay.
That industry would want to “wise up” so to speak. Why would anyone looking for long term stability tie themselves to the construction industry? The financial crash is not that long ago, I work in the mfg world and have ran into plenty of guys who lost their jobs in 08/09 to retrain as engineers across pharma/biomed. They most definitely don’t regret their decision.
I’ve family who have worked their whole lives in the construction industry, all told me to steer clear. And that says it all. Similar is happening in the hospitality sector, their only relief valve is importing cheap labour but the high cost of living and accommodation has torpedoed that.
It all comes down to greed, and I have no sympathy for any of these industries.
Sure why don’t they just start later then if they want more people to do it?
Construction hasn’t changed since the recession. It’s still crony as fuck.
I’ve been in this industry for 8 years, part-time and full time since I was 16, and in that timespan only 5% of completed work is fully paid in accordance with the initial quotation. Sub-contractors are expected to haggle for 10-20% reductions and if they don’t then the client is not long delaying the full payment or refusing to progress the process without the haggle.
On-site, there are almost no labourers below 30 and the only trade making good money are the electrician’s.
I’m up at 6-7am and only home at 6-7pm everyday because of commutes to work in Dublin, Kilkenny or Athlone due to there bejng fuck all high-paying, commercial development outside of urban zones right now.
It’s not worth the toll it’s taking on my body and social life, so many auld fella’s are in that routine but having been to college, I know life shouldn’t be that hard
It’s a joke and at 24 I’m off to do my masters and get the fuck out.
I’ve worked construction for 25 years now ( started at 15) and have 4 children . I have told my son to try his best in school and not to do what I do . I’m 40 now and a broken man , my knees, back , neck etc etc .
If they need a job but don’t take up one of these, then they clearly have choices & are opting for better pay/benefits/conditions/whtvr.
& If getting up for 7am is considered poor conditions…
Calling young people lazy really let’s them off the hook from improving the offer.
Dude I’m can’t just wake up anymore to work. Half of my income goes to revenue and other half to rent. I keep thinking that don’t make sense I progress more in my career to be fked. If I think about that imagine to get out of the bed 7 am
Trades don’t get the respect in society they deserve
I can’t blame them. I am not a morning person so I fully agree that you shouldn’t have to be up before 8.
[The Itish Time is such a fucking rag these days they don’t even spell their own name right.](https://i.imgur.com/MMvqOfE.png)
It’s because we’re not in the country. We’re out in Canada and Australia getting up for their construction industry.
I’m sure there’s a level of that but at the same time, the trades were stigmatized as working class for years, go to college and get a degree and make millions instead.
Other side is most young people.these days see that remote work and tech work is where the money is at so why ruin your back or knees doing a hard day’s work. That being said, a trade is like bar work, you’ll always have a job. My electrician is booked up for months.
Apprentices like PhD students are horrendously treated
Not everyone wants to be getting up at 530am
Construction work is a death sentence for your health.
If there was work in the bed he’d sleep on the floor
21 M, more than half way through an electrical apprenticeship. I check livestock at 4:30 AM, drive 30 minutes to meet the van before 6 and head off down the country. Back home around 7 o’clock in the evening. Could spend upwards of 20 hours a week travelling that I do not get paid for. I’m happy enough as my employer is sound and pays me above the rate but there’s a lot of apprentices out there whos 39 hour weeks turn into 60+ hour week from travel alone. Nothing to do with getting up early. Conditions can be shit for those who want to do it. I can guarantee the bollocks who said that is still in bed by the time I’ve had my second breakfast.
Also, there is a general snobbery about not going to college in Ireland. Lots of lads I know from school that took the piss out of the lads doing trades are finishing up in courses they had no interest in, are now scratching their heads looking at fully qualified tradesmen buying houses at 23/24.
Edit- format
I’m in intel making a fortune. Money flying again and loads of jobs going
I can barely get out of bed at that time to go to my cushy office job..
Get off your arses youngsters! The top 1% needs another wealth injection. And who better to lead the call than The Times.
Thats a fucking sleep in for me