Back to obscurity with ye green party, until people forget and you can once again be the Jr whipping boy in a coalition 👋
Not much point being a green in line with the whip if the whip only pushing FFG agenda.
But didn’t we all just read a chart from VisualCapitalist saying we had full democracy.
Parties should only be forced to vote on the party line if it’s a core issue.
If you regularly can’t get your party to vote with the party on non-core matters without threats and punishments, then maybe it’s shit legislation, or maybe they shouldnt be in your party at all.
Yes it improves party cohesion, but lets look at this current issue – the national maternity hospital. This isn’t a matter of life or death. It isn’t a huge issue where parties need to be united. But even in this relatively minor issue, no deviation is permitted without significant punishment. It’s kinda fucked up.
Our country has gone to shit, they have every right to disagree if that’s they’re opinion. Surely every person in every part should be allowed to have a mind of their own?
Of all the issues they could have got themselves suspended for, this seems a fairly trivial one.
There isn’t enough public land in that area to build a hospital on. To CPO the land would have cost tens or hundreds of millions – it’s one of the most expensive areas in the country. If they spent that kind of money on a CPO we’d all be criticising them for wasting public money
The government now only have a 1 seat majority.
Neassa perpetually has one foot out the door of the Green Party. She is setting herself up for a leadership bid.
This is all politics so she can say she was against XYZ.
In virtually *every* other parliamentary democracy in the world, rebel TDs (MPs) are an everyday fact of political life and the strict three-line whip (vote with the cabinet or face a punishment from party leadership) is only used in exceptionally rare circumstances such as annual budgets, emergency legislation and confidence votes.
This is why Ireland is unique in our parliament being utterly subservient to the small handful of people who sit at the cabinet table. And it’s why, unlike in other countries, contacting one’s government TDs about legislation one disagrees with is so unlikely to achieve anything meaningful.
The standing orders of the Oireachtas which strip speaking rights from unaligned TDs and senators in the event of a suspension, combined with our societal acceptance that all votes are whipped and rebel TDs are virtually non-existent, is one of the biggest problems in our democratic system and one of the reasons our government operates with so little oversight or accountability.
It baffles me that this isn’t talked about more often, or indeed at the top of the agenda when it comes to changing Irish politics. It is the single most corrosive element of our system of government.
My respect for Neasa Hourigan grows every day. She’s an absolutely top drawer politician. Isn’t afraid to stand her ground on what she believes in, and is active locally; engaging with her constituency constantly. I’m not a green voter generally but she rightfully won mine last election, won’t stop now.
I sound like a bot lol
I don’t understand this at all. I feel pure thick here but what’s the point in a vote if you’re suspended for using it? And who exactly decides which way the government is going to vote on a motion anyway?
If just 1 more TD can be turned, then we may be able to have fresh elections.
This might be easier to achieve than people realize. May be a worthy/achievable target for a protest movement to focus on.
13 comments
I 100% get why they have to do this.
I just hope they realize how bad it looks too.
Back to obscurity with ye green party, until people forget and you can once again be the Jr whipping boy in a coalition 👋
Not much point being a green in line with the whip if the whip only pushing FFG agenda.
But didn’t we all just read a chart from VisualCapitalist saying we had full democracy.
Parties should only be forced to vote on the party line if it’s a core issue.
If you regularly can’t get your party to vote with the party on non-core matters without threats and punishments, then maybe it’s shit legislation, or maybe they shouldnt be in your party at all.
Yes it improves party cohesion, but lets look at this current issue – the national maternity hospital. This isn’t a matter of life or death. It isn’t a huge issue where parties need to be united. But even in this relatively minor issue, no deviation is permitted without significant punishment. It’s kinda fucked up.
Our country has gone to shit, they have every right to disagree if that’s they’re opinion. Surely every person in every part should be allowed to have a mind of their own?
Of all the issues they could have got themselves suspended for, this seems a fairly trivial one.
There isn’t enough public land in that area to build a hospital on. To CPO the land would have cost tens or hundreds of millions – it’s one of the most expensive areas in the country. If they spent that kind of money on a CPO we’d all be criticising them for wasting public money
The government now only have a 1 seat majority.
Neassa perpetually has one foot out the door of the Green Party. She is setting herself up for a leadership bid.
This is all politics so she can say she was against XYZ.
In virtually *every* other parliamentary democracy in the world, rebel TDs (MPs) are an everyday fact of political life and the strict three-line whip (vote with the cabinet or face a punishment from party leadership) is only used in exceptionally rare circumstances such as annual budgets, emergency legislation and confidence votes.
This is why Ireland is unique in our parliament being utterly subservient to the small handful of people who sit at the cabinet table. And it’s why, unlike in other countries, contacting one’s government TDs about legislation one disagrees with is so unlikely to achieve anything meaningful.
The standing orders of the Oireachtas which strip speaking rights from unaligned TDs and senators in the event of a suspension, combined with our societal acceptance that all votes are whipped and rebel TDs are virtually non-existent, is one of the biggest problems in our democratic system and one of the reasons our government operates with so little oversight or accountability.
It baffles me that this isn’t talked about more often, or indeed at the top of the agenda when it comes to changing Irish politics. It is the single most corrosive element of our system of government.
My respect for Neasa Hourigan grows every day. She’s an absolutely top drawer politician. Isn’t afraid to stand her ground on what she believes in, and is active locally; engaging with her constituency constantly. I’m not a green voter generally but she rightfully won mine last election, won’t stop now.
I sound like a bot lol
I don’t understand this at all. I feel pure thick here but what’s the point in a vote if you’re suspended for using it? And who exactly decides which way the government is going to vote on a motion anyway?
If just 1 more TD can be turned, then we may be able to have fresh elections.
This might be easier to achieve than people realize. May be a worthy/achievable target for a protest movement to focus on.