In that case we elect not to and your donors can starve…
Its your choice to freeze or starve to death.
The Tory Party
They’ll be supportive if people decide not to pay the bills too I’m sure.
Just people making decisions after all.
This is cowardice.
Government should be doing full blown public information campaigns about the benefits of insulation, turning your thermostat down, adjusting your boiler flow temperature, the benefits of closing your curtains in the evening. Anything and everything.
Instead we get a total vacuum of leadership, because they’re terrified of being called a nanny state.
We don’t graft enough and whether we need to cook food and stay warm enough not to get sick is a ‘decision for individuals”?
What a world.
Maybe they could actually look at how much electricity a household needs to heat their house to a reasonable level and cook a meal or two a day and commit to saying that every single household will be guaranteed that amount of power at a reduced rate every day, and anything you use over that, you get charged for at full rate?
Or is that a little bit “socialisty” for the cons?
“They just need to get on their bike…and pedal hard enough to power the stove”
Good to see they are finally talking about flow temperatures from boilers, a reminder of this excellent post
>Energy prices are silly, save money on your heating
TLDR. If you have a condensing boiler turn down your flow temperatures especially in mild weather, it could save 10-20% on your heating costs.
Longer explanation. Reading energy saving advice from the big energy suppliers is frustrating, it’s all expensive stuff like install more insulation/replace your boiler, or negligible stuff like put a lid on your pans.
You can make a fairly substantial saving with what you likely already have. Most heating engineers install new boilers and rarely mess with flow temperatures because the last thing they want is to come back out to a boiler in warranty with people saying they’re cold. The result is most boilers are up at 70°C+ flow temperature.
Condensing boilers as the name suggests condense the steam produced while burning gas because that steam includes a lot of heat energy. That steam is condensed on a secondary heat exchanger preheating returning heating water before it reaches the primary heat exchanger over the gas burners. https://diyheatingtips.files.wordpress.com/2012/03/condensing.jpg
The more water you can condense back the more energy recovered. The way to do that it to lower outbound flow temperatures so that the returning water from the radiators is as cool as possible so it can condense as much water as possible. https://ars.els-cdn.com/content/image/1-s2.0-S019689041730016X-gr2.jpg
Your heating will run for longer, your radiators won’t be as hot, but you’ll actually use less energy because you’re condensing. If the house starts to feel cold turn up the flow temperatures a bit.
This is essentially the operation of a genuinely good smart thermostat wired using OpenTherm. It allows the thermostat to vary your boilers flow temperature based on various factors. So if you have an OpenTherm thermostat it is hopefully already doing this. You can read more about that here. https://theevohomeshop.co.uk/content/21-What-is-OpenTherm-and-why-use-Honeywell-evohome-with-ithttps://support.google.com/googlenest/answer/9259109?hl=en-GB
And if you’re wondering, Hive, owned by British Gas and their extremely popular Thermostat does not support OpenTherm. Because of course it doesn’t. And what actually prompted this post is visiting my parents this weekend, they have an OpenTherm compatible boiler and thermostat with a fixed flow temperature of 75°C because the installer wired it for simple on/off, not OpenTherm.
If you want to know more about all of this I learnt most of it from Heatgeek on Twitter and YouTube. Octopus also have it as their number 1 tip. https://octopus.energy/blog/winter-workout-gas-saving-tips/
And if anyone actually finds this useful and saves some money and thinks about switching to Octopus here’s my referral. https://share.octopus.energy/loyal-bell-924
This is why usage should be taxed, carbon taxes or emission taxes or whatever. Most people use the energy they need and no more. It’s the 1% and the rest who use the most by far.
Yes Kwarteng just like we can decide what the rate is to be set at. What a wanker.
Some of you may die, but that is a sacrifice I am willing to make.
Its not like a modern economy needs energy to run or anything like that. We’re still all noting down records in physical books and operating peddle-powered machines in mills with only natural lighting.
Fuck me we’ve gone from going back to the 1980s, to back to the 1880s, now it looks like they want us back to the 1780s…
there are many things the UK could do to reduce the costs of energy, both now and for the future.
Unfortunately they will do none of it and in some instances are actively working against it.
The only take home message is that the conservative government are actively complicit in promoting high energy prices both now and in the future.
Traitors the lot of them.
I guess water is optional too then with that logic
We, the government look after the interests of the corporations, you the tax payers, have no say.
Any excuse to do nothing to upset the energy suppliers.
You are Free to freeze.
Seriously as gaffs go, this one will play really well in December.
No but also to a degree yes.
If it’s cold you have to have central heating on, however what is under your control is the thermostat level. If you have it turned up so high that you can wander around in a t-shirt then you can turn it down and put on a top. If the tap water is so hot that you nearly scald yourself then get the temperature turned down.
If it’s dark you need to switch the lights on, if you have lights on in every room whether there are people in the room or not is under your control.
Yeah so I already cut back my energy use to basically minimum last winter. Cutting back more just means going without. Either heat, hot water, or both.
So is who to vote for.
Then why’s the standing charge gone up?
If we collectively work together to reduce our energy needs we could stave off blackouts, but we need a competent government to coordinate that
Giving lucrative contracts to friends during a pandemic emergency without due diligence is apparently a ‘decision for corrupt government’
It’s nudge theory again like with Covid. If we don’t explicitly tell people to do the thing that needs to happen, they’ll likely do it anyway and it won’t be our responsibility for having shut down the economy/rationed energy. Of course there came a breaking point where we had to go into lockdown but later than we should have.
So their answer is to not tell energy companies to stop raising their prices but to tell us to stop living our life.
Are they mentally insane? Honestly, anyone who votes Tory can go fuck themselves.
“It’s your choice if you freeze in December.”
Surviving the winter or dying of hypothermia. Quite a set of options there…
I don’t quite see the outrage here. Feel like people haven’t bothered to read past the headline (surprise surprise).
> No 10 and allies of Liz Truss are resisting the idea that people should be asked to cut their energy use, with the government insisting that consumption of gas and electricity is a “decision for individuals”.
i.e. they’re not going to force you to use energy in a particular way.
Furthermore:
> However, politicians can be sensitive about public perceptions of asking people to use less energy. Some energy bosses have been pilloried for giving tips on keeping warm
You can hardly blame them too…
I fucking hate them, i fucking hate these sacks of shit sitting in westminster. I know what my mind wants to do, but morally it can’t
29 comments
In that case we elect not to and your donors can starve…
Its your choice to freeze or starve to death.
The Tory Party
They’ll be supportive if people decide not to pay the bills too I’m sure.
Just people making decisions after all.
This is cowardice.
Government should be doing full blown public information campaigns about the benefits of insulation, turning your thermostat down, adjusting your boiler flow temperature, the benefits of closing your curtains in the evening. Anything and everything.
Instead we get a total vacuum of leadership, because they’re terrified of being called a nanny state.
We don’t graft enough and whether we need to cook food and stay warm enough not to get sick is a ‘decision for individuals”?
What a world.
Maybe they could actually look at how much electricity a household needs to heat their house to a reasonable level and cook a meal or two a day and commit to saying that every single household will be guaranteed that amount of power at a reduced rate every day, and anything you use over that, you get charged for at full rate?
Or is that a little bit “socialisty” for the cons?
“They just need to get on their bike…and pedal hard enough to power the stove”
Good to see they are finally talking about flow temperatures from boilers, a reminder of this excellent post
[https://www.reddit.com/r/unitedkingdom/comments/rki9f3/energy_prices_are_silly_save_money_on_your_heating/](https://www.reddit.com/r/unitedkingdom/comments/rki9f3/energy_prices_are_silly_save_money_on_your_heating/)
>Energy prices are silly, save money on your heating
TLDR. If you have a condensing boiler turn down your flow temperatures especially in mild weather, it could save 10-20% on your heating costs.
Longer explanation. Reading energy saving advice from the big energy suppliers is frustrating, it’s all expensive stuff like install more insulation/replace your boiler, or negligible stuff like put a lid on your pans.
You can make a fairly substantial saving with what you likely already have. Most heating engineers install new boilers and rarely mess with flow temperatures because the last thing they want is to come back out to a boiler in warranty with people saying they’re cold. The result is most boilers are up at 70°C+ flow temperature.
Condensing boilers as the name suggests condense the steam produced while burning gas because that steam includes a lot of heat energy. That steam is condensed on a secondary heat exchanger preheating returning heating water before it reaches the primary heat exchanger over the gas burners. https://diyheatingtips.files.wordpress.com/2012/03/condensing.jpg
The more water you can condense back the more energy recovered. The way to do that it to lower outbound flow temperatures so that the returning water from the radiators is as cool as possible so it can condense as much water as possible.
https://ars.els-cdn.com/content/image/1-s2.0-S019689041730016X-gr2.jpg
Your heating will run for longer, your radiators won’t be as hot, but you’ll actually use less energy because you’re condensing. If the house starts to feel cold turn up the flow temperatures a bit.
This is essentially the operation of a genuinely good smart thermostat wired using OpenTherm. It allows the thermostat to vary your boilers flow temperature based on various factors. So if you have an OpenTherm thermostat it is hopefully already doing this. You can read more about that here. https://theevohomeshop.co.uk/content/21-What-is-OpenTherm-and-why-use-Honeywell-evohome-with-it https://support.google.com/googlenest/answer/9259109?hl=en-GB
And if you’re wondering, Hive, owned by British Gas and their extremely popular Thermostat does not support OpenTherm. Because of course it doesn’t. And what actually prompted this post is visiting my parents this weekend, they have an OpenTherm compatible boiler and thermostat with a fixed flow temperature of 75°C because the installer wired it for simple on/off, not OpenTherm.
If you want to know more about all of this I learnt most of it from Heatgeek on Twitter and YouTube. Octopus also have it as their number 1 tip. https://octopus.energy/blog/winter-workout-gas-saving-tips/
And if anyone actually finds this useful and saves some money and thinks about switching to Octopus here’s my referral. https://share.octopus.energy/loyal-bell-924
This is why usage should be taxed, carbon taxes or emission taxes or whatever. Most people use the energy they need and no more. It’s the 1% and the rest who use the most by far.
Yes Kwarteng just like we can decide what the rate is to be set at. What a wanker.
Some of you may die, but that is a sacrifice I am willing to make.
Its not like a modern economy needs energy to run or anything like that. We’re still all noting down records in physical books and operating peddle-powered machines in mills with only natural lighting.
Fuck me we’ve gone from going back to the 1980s, to back to the 1880s, now it looks like they want us back to the 1780s…
there are many things the UK could do to reduce the costs of energy, both now and for the future.
Unfortunately they will do none of it and in some instances are actively working against it.
The only take home message is that the conservative government are actively complicit in promoting high energy prices both now and in the future.
Traitors the lot of them.
I guess water is optional too then with that logic
We, the government look after the interests of the corporations, you the tax payers, have no say.
Any excuse to do nothing to upset the energy suppliers.
You are Free to freeze.
Seriously as gaffs go, this one will play really well in December.
No but also to a degree yes.
If it’s cold you have to have central heating on, however what is under your control is the thermostat level. If you have it turned up so high that you can wander around in a t-shirt then you can turn it down and put on a top. If the tap water is so hot that you nearly scald yourself then get the temperature turned down.
If it’s dark you need to switch the lights on, if you have lights on in every room whether there are people in the room or not is under your control.
Yeah so I already cut back my energy use to basically minimum last winter. Cutting back more just means going without. Either heat, hot water, or both.
So is who to vote for.
Then why’s the standing charge gone up?
If we collectively work together to reduce our energy needs we could stave off blackouts, but we need a competent government to coordinate that
Giving lucrative contracts to friends during a pandemic emergency without due diligence is apparently a ‘decision for corrupt government’
It’s nudge theory again like with Covid. If we don’t explicitly tell people to do the thing that needs to happen, they’ll likely do it anyway and it won’t be our responsibility for having shut down the economy/rationed energy. Of course there came a breaking point where we had to go into lockdown but later than we should have.
So their answer is to not tell energy companies to stop raising their prices but to tell us to stop living our life.
Are they mentally insane? Honestly, anyone who votes Tory can go fuck themselves.
“It’s your choice if you freeze in December.”
Surviving the winter or dying of hypothermia. Quite a set of options there…
I don’t quite see the outrage here. Feel like people haven’t bothered to read past the headline (surprise surprise).
> No 10 and allies of Liz Truss are resisting the idea that people should be asked to cut their energy use, with the government insisting that consumption of gas and electricity is a “decision for individuals”.
i.e. they’re not going to force you to use energy in a particular way.
Furthermore:
> However, politicians can be sensitive about public perceptions of asking people to use less energy. Some energy bosses have been pilloried for giving tips on keeping warm
You can hardly blame them too…
I fucking hate them, i fucking hate these sacks of shit sitting in westminster. I know what my mind wants to do, but morally it can’t