Turns out that the measures that worked were…. Closing schools and preventing gatherings as well as quarantine…
It was a mistake to leave the EU
It was a mistake to elect guys like you.
How do these people think that planes fly, that the lights come on when you flick a switch or the tiny device in your pocket can browse Reddit?
Definitely not science at work, that’s for sure.
Fuck this narrative and fuck the direction this country is heading.
We are literally going down the worst possible route
There’s a surprise…so we are meant to believe scientific fact was the problem not his incompetence! It doesn’t take long, soon Truss will claim it was just a “bit of flu” and no big deal.
Don’t criticise rishi’s views, or it’s off to the ministry of love with you.
It was a mistake to empower Sunak… Just ask Johnson.
Even during the pandemic, there were rumours that Sunak was one of the main opponents to restrictions in government, so it’s no surprise that he’s come out with this now.
God forbid people listen to academic professionals and not inherently biased politicians that are financially interested in particular results
I think the problem was only empowering one small type of scientist, mainly the ones concerned with the immediate most obvious impact. We never heard much from economics, sociologists, I’m sure there are many other types that could have painted a wider picture on the implications beyond the next few months which was all the virus scientists told us about. Fair enough it’s their area but it never felt like there was much analysis to figure out if saving 10 people now will kill 20 people in 2 years, or if not kill then ruin their education, businesses, life in general.
So he’s basically trying to appeal to the covid conspiracy wing of the Tory party for some votes. Just when you thought it couldn’t get any worse
And it begins. The anti-science, anti-reason, anti-evidence discourse has begun. Didn’t think the Tories could stoop any lower, yet here we are.
This is the Preparedness Paradox in full effect;
“The preparedness paradox is the proposition that if a society or individual acts effectively to mitigate a potential disaster such as a pandemic, natural disaster or other catastrophe so that it causes less harm, the avoided danger will be perceived as having been much less serious because of the limited damage actually caused. The paradox is the incorrect perception that there had been no need for careful preparation as there was little harm, although in reality the limitation of the harm was due to preparation. Several cognitive biases can consequently hamper proper preparation for future risks.[1]”
This fucking idiot is ignoring the fact that we came a hairs width from a full on collapse of the NHS, along with most other public services, as well as the literal bodies in the streets and thousands of deaths a day.
But it’s because he, and all of Westminster (bar Boris’ little brush with it from shaking hands with positive patients) have been completely and utterly isolated from both the worst of the pandemic itself, and literally every after effect, up to and including not even bothering to wear masks in the Houses of Parliament.
This dude wants us to think he’s the sensible one while spouting scientifically illiterate bullshit for his libertarian house cat Tory members. It’s a fundamental embarrassment that he think this Trump line will make him look like anything other than a fucking moron.
The worst part is loads of people will buy it hook, line & sinker.
Stop letting evidence and facts get in the way of ideology!
Why is not listening to science and evidence so synonymous with the Tory party?
Playing to the crazies again. If anything our mistake was not listening to the experts more.
[deleted]
true, without that we’d likely have killed off more tory voters.
Conservatives: Hmm, what I can I be completely wrong about today?
It’s getting exhausting.
Because right wingers were pissed off with lockdowns they’re blaming them on scientists. Despite scientists literally only doing their jobs by giving advice and doing modelling, etc. the decision to lockdown was the governments.
It was a mistake for the country to empower the fucking tories
He’s so stupid I can’t even comprehend it… restrictions were brought in pre vaccine, when covid was rife and immunity was low. They saved lives. Most scientists agree thousands more lives would have been lost if there had been no restrictions.
Now you have rishi saying, damn, I wish we had let more people die!
He’s both an idiot and a complete dickhead.
>When I had the idea to kill more people, it was met with complete silence! I was so angry! How could people think life is important!
I couldn’t disagree more, some of these ideas the Tories had were an absolute nightmare and it was only because scientists maintained that pressure we actually stopped spreading as much. Eat out to help out was obviously a super spreader event and a miserable/scary experience for most people on the front line in hospitality and probably killed hundreds if not thousands of people as a result.
They didnt empower them at all. They flat out ignored 99% of what they said.
From herd immunity to masks. They had a fucking freedom day ffs.
Its an interesting point though.
I was a civil servant doing policy for many years and there are very good reasons why academics and scientific bodies don’t typically make policy decisions.
Politicians do, supported by what should be high calibre civil servants who can synthesise all the evidence in an objective, impartial way.
As i haven’t explained it, scientists and academia by nature focus on very particular things. An epidemiologist will focus on the spread of disease and its health impacts, an economist on the impact on growth, an child psychologist on the impact of lockdown on childrens mental health, etc etc. Thats great, thats their job.
But the politician has to weigh all of those things up to make policy decisions. I interpret what sunak is saying to be that as covid struck and we were all in a state of panic (remember the days of checking the data daily!) The decision making process shifted to relying too much on the views of the epidemiologists and not enough on a holistic policy.
I’m not saying i agree, and frankly i don’t understand covid and its full potential impacts well enough to have a view, but maybe this comment will be interesting to those who are open to thinking about his comments.
Incidentally, whilst my politics don’t align with sunak, I’ve been really impressed with his intellect during this campaign. Shame he isn’t too good at the politics cos he’d be a better PM in my view than Truss.
This guy is unbelievable. From bragging about having no working class friends to taking money from poor areas to this…
>Sunak also disclosed that he was banned from discussing the “trade-offs” of imposing coronavirus-related restrictions such as missed doctor’s appointments and NHS waiting list backlogs.
>
>
>
>He said that minutes from Sage meetings were edited, which resulted in opposing opinions being omitted from the final draft.
​
This looks prettty serious.
The tories have gone soooooo far right they are copying Trump tactics to cling onto power. God I hope people see through this. I’m bloody scared they won’t though
Being anti Science is always a hallmark of a forward thinking society. Gods help us.
Tories are becoming more and more like the trump loving republicans each day. That’s scary.
I can’t read anything about Sunak or Truss without my opinion of them sinking lower than I thought possible. Going to need a miracle to survive this clusterfuck.
The UK already had a knowledge drain after Brexit as all their EU scientists and doctors left the country. Now Rishi is telling every other scientist still in the UK that they are not welcome there, I guess because he saw how well it worked for the US right wing to full on reject science. What does he think is gonna happen in the UK when all the STEM students move abroad after graduation so they can actually be respected?
Listen to scientists.
But don’t JUST listen to scientists, listen to economists, educators, sociologists, and all the other experts who will give you a balanced view…
If you only listen to epidemiologists you will be heavily biased towards a plan of action that prioritises the control of disease and ignores the impact on the economy, children’s education and welfare etc etc – the job of government is to take a balanced view that does the least harm OVERALL taking into account all possible factors.
Man who was fined for COVID rules doesn’t like COVID rules, shocking. Dudes just trying to get the vote of the more right wing “mah freedom” crowd in the closing days.
The government made the decisions. They had the power.
The scientists provided the best advice given the evidence.
Rishi isn’t stupid. This deliberate politicisation of the pandemic.
I’m a wishy washy floater of a voter and I’m disagreeing with everything these candidates are saying. It’s all avoidance, wishful thinking and dig whistling.
*”We’re following the science”* — used seemingly as an excuse during the pandemic when an unpopular decision needed to be made by the government
Now apparently they’re throwing the scientists under the bus because that’s in their interest.
Much like they were riding on the positivity when clapping for our NHS/keyworkers during COVID and now we’re berating them for NHS backlogs, wanting an inflationary payrise etc.
Fuck this government to the moon.
Yeah, think of all the extra people we could have gitten killed if those pesky scientists hadn’t gotten in the way! Brought to you by the same pig headed anti-intellectualism that gave us Brexit.
40 comments
Fucking scientists with all their… Urm … Evidence.
Just appealing to the low of the low of his party supporters
Oh God. He’s actually going with the “don’t trust the experts” card… I guess though that fits well with the Tory demographic.
My real reason for posting this shameless pandering to absolute idiots was to post this: https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/m000j9jt?partner=uk.co.bbc&origin=share-mobile
Turns out that the measures that worked were…. Closing schools and preventing gatherings as well as quarantine…
It was a mistake to leave the EU
It was a mistake to elect guys like you.
How do these people think that planes fly, that the lights come on when you flick a switch or the tiny device in your pocket can browse Reddit?
Definitely not science at work, that’s for sure.
Fuck this narrative and fuck the direction this country is heading.
We are literally going down the worst possible route
There’s a surprise…so we are meant to believe scientific fact was the problem not his incompetence! It doesn’t take long, soon Truss will claim it was just a “bit of flu” and no big deal.
Don’t criticise rishi’s views, or it’s off to the ministry of love with you.
It was a mistake to empower Sunak… Just ask Johnson.
Even during the pandemic, there were rumours that Sunak was one of the main opponents to restrictions in government, so it’s no surprise that he’s come out with this now.
God forbid people listen to academic professionals and not inherently biased politicians that are financially interested in particular results
I think the problem was only empowering one small type of scientist, mainly the ones concerned with the immediate most obvious impact. We never heard much from economics, sociologists, I’m sure there are many other types that could have painted a wider picture on the implications beyond the next few months which was all the virus scientists told us about. Fair enough it’s their area but it never felt like there was much analysis to figure out if saving 10 people now will kill 20 people in 2 years, or if not kill then ruin their education, businesses, life in general.
So he’s basically trying to appeal to the covid conspiracy wing of the Tory party for some votes. Just when you thought it couldn’t get any worse
And it begins. The anti-science, anti-reason, anti-evidence discourse has begun. Didn’t think the Tories could stoop any lower, yet here we are.
This is the Preparedness Paradox in full effect;
“The preparedness paradox is the proposition that if a society or individual acts effectively to mitigate a potential disaster such as a pandemic, natural disaster or other catastrophe so that it causes less harm, the avoided danger will be perceived as having been much less serious because of the limited damage actually caused. The paradox is the incorrect perception that there had been no need for careful preparation as there was little harm, although in reality the limitation of the harm was due to preparation. Several cognitive biases can consequently hamper proper preparation for future risks.[1]”
This fucking idiot is ignoring the fact that we came a hairs width from a full on collapse of the NHS, along with most other public services, as well as the literal bodies in the streets and thousands of deaths a day.
But it’s because he, and all of Westminster (bar Boris’ little brush with it from shaking hands with positive patients) have been completely and utterly isolated from both the worst of the pandemic itself, and literally every after effect, up to and including not even bothering to wear masks in the Houses of Parliament.
This dude wants us to think he’s the sensible one while spouting scientifically illiterate bullshit for his libertarian house cat Tory members. It’s a fundamental embarrassment that he think this Trump line will make him look like anything other than a fucking moron.
The worst part is loads of people will buy it hook, line & sinker.
Stop letting evidence and facts get in the way of ideology!
Why is not listening to science and evidence so synonymous with the Tory party?
Playing to the crazies again. If anything our mistake was not listening to the experts more.
[deleted]
true, without that we’d likely have killed off more tory voters.
Conservatives: Hmm, what I can I be completely wrong about today?
It’s getting exhausting.
Because right wingers were pissed off with lockdowns they’re blaming them on scientists. Despite scientists literally only doing their jobs by giving advice and doing modelling, etc. the decision to lockdown was the governments.
It was a mistake for the country to empower the fucking tories
He’s so stupid I can’t even comprehend it… restrictions were brought in pre vaccine, when covid was rife and immunity was low. They saved lives. Most scientists agree thousands more lives would have been lost if there had been no restrictions.
Now you have rishi saying, damn, I wish we had let more people die!
He’s both an idiot and a complete dickhead.
>When I had the idea to kill more people, it was met with complete silence! I was so angry! How could people think life is important!
I couldn’t disagree more, some of these ideas the Tories had were an absolute nightmare and it was only because scientists maintained that pressure we actually stopped spreading as much. Eat out to help out was obviously a super spreader event and a miserable/scary experience for most people on the front line in hospitality and probably killed hundreds if not thousands of people as a result.
They didnt empower them at all. They flat out ignored 99% of what they said.
From herd immunity to masks. They had a fucking freedom day ffs.
Its an interesting point though.
I was a civil servant doing policy for many years and there are very good reasons why academics and scientific bodies don’t typically make policy decisions.
Politicians do, supported by what should be high calibre civil servants who can synthesise all the evidence in an objective, impartial way.
As i haven’t explained it, scientists and academia by nature focus on very particular things. An epidemiologist will focus on the spread of disease and its health impacts, an economist on the impact on growth, an child psychologist on the impact of lockdown on childrens mental health, etc etc. Thats great, thats their job.
But the politician has to weigh all of those things up to make policy decisions. I interpret what sunak is saying to be that as covid struck and we were all in a state of panic (remember the days of checking the data daily!) The decision making process shifted to relying too much on the views of the epidemiologists and not enough on a holistic policy.
I’m not saying i agree, and frankly i don’t understand covid and its full potential impacts well enough to have a view, but maybe this comment will be interesting to those who are open to thinking about his comments.
Incidentally, whilst my politics don’t align with sunak, I’ve been really impressed with his intellect during this campaign. Shame he isn’t too good at the politics cos he’d be a better PM in my view than Truss.
This guy is unbelievable. From bragging about having no working class friends to taking money from poor areas to this…
>Sunak also disclosed that he was banned from discussing the “trade-offs” of imposing coronavirus-related restrictions such as missed doctor’s appointments and NHS waiting list backlogs.
>
>
>
>He said that minutes from Sage meetings were edited, which resulted in opposing opinions being omitted from the final draft.
​
This looks prettty serious.
The tories have gone soooooo far right they are copying Trump tactics to cling onto power. God I hope people see through this. I’m bloody scared they won’t though
Being anti Science is always a hallmark of a forward thinking society. Gods help us.
Tories are becoming more and more like the trump loving republicans each day. That’s scary.
I can’t read anything about Sunak or Truss without my opinion of them sinking lower than I thought possible. Going to need a miracle to survive this clusterfuck.
The UK already had a knowledge drain after Brexit as all their EU scientists and doctors left the country. Now Rishi is telling every other scientist still in the UK that they are not welcome there, I guess because he saw how well it worked for the US right wing to full on reject science. What does he think is gonna happen in the UK when all the STEM students move abroad after graduation so they can actually be respected?
Listen to scientists.
But don’t JUST listen to scientists, listen to economists, educators, sociologists, and all the other experts who will give you a balanced view…
If you only listen to epidemiologists you will be heavily biased towards a plan of action that prioritises the control of disease and ignores the impact on the economy, children’s education and welfare etc etc – the job of government is to take a balanced view that does the least harm OVERALL taking into account all possible factors.
Man who was fined for COVID rules doesn’t like COVID rules, shocking. Dudes just trying to get the vote of the more right wing “mah freedom” crowd in the closing days.
The government made the decisions. They had the power.
The scientists provided the best advice given the evidence.
Rishi isn’t stupid. This deliberate politicisation of the pandemic.
I’m a wishy washy floater of a voter and I’m disagreeing with everything these candidates are saying. It’s all avoidance, wishful thinking and dig whistling.
*”We’re following the science”* — used seemingly as an excuse during the pandemic when an unpopular decision needed to be made by the government
Now apparently they’re throwing the scientists under the bus because that’s in their interest.
Much like they were riding on the positivity when clapping for our NHS/keyworkers during COVID and now we’re berating them for NHS backlogs, wanting an inflationary payrise etc.
Fuck this government to the moon.
Yeah, think of all the extra people we could have gitten killed if those pesky scientists hadn’t gotten in the way! Brought to you by the same pig headed anti-intellectualism that gave us Brexit.