James O’Brien on Northern Ireland census figures: ‘This, to me, feels like it could be the beginning of the end of the United Kingdom.’

James O’Brien on Northern Ireland census figures: ‘This, to me, feels like it could be the beginning of the end of the United Kingdom.’ from ireland

43 comments

  1. Honestly believe the ball is rolling now. Nobody is saying bring a border poll tomorrow because of this but it starts the clock ticking. In 20 years that census will make these numbers look mundane

  2. I listen to him all the time, especially in international news stuff and brexit shows, listening to him completely dismantle leavers arguments is amazing to listen to. And O’Brien is his adopted name, so sadly he’s as Irish as Michael flatley.

  5. I’m the only (baptised) Catholic in my household. My wife and kids are Protestants. They’re gonna want to start watching their behavior around the house.

  10. Hopefully this just means more peace and understanding and appreciation of differences and just less violence and division overall.

    Idealistic I know but hopefully there’s more idealists than anarchists out there 🤞🤞

  11. Scotland will never leave the union. They like the power too much – they were happy enough to wear the red coat for queen and country for a century or more – as were lots of dubs.

  17. “IRA atrocities”.

    Saying things like this without mention the UVF etc shows how badly failed people there are by their education system and media. His dad was even a journalist.

  19. I think that we should be aware of the significant proportion of Brits who think like James and share his ideas. We bash them a lot here, I do it myself from time to time, it’s easy to do so with the history, Brexit and the conveyor belt of fools they have elected for leaders, but there’s a lot of decent Brits who aren’t empire-nostalgic morons voting against their best interests. The shame of it is that they’re a bit outnumbered at the moment…

  21. I’m not from the north but I get the impression that generally only DUP supporters are hard line Brexiteers and the rest aren’t really all that bothered by what happens politically. As long as they’re looked after to a reasonable extent.

  22. you can bet on betfair.com on “Vote on Irish Unification to pass before Jan 1st 2030” The odds recently changed from 5/1 to 3/1. Would this be a good bet to make? There seems to be a limit on how much you can bet, €112.00.

  24. I don’t think a border poll wouldn’t be successful and result in a United Ireland anytime soon.

    The middle class, wealthier or economically literate Catholics will secretly not vote for a UI despite publicly having to be seen to support it. In short, they know what side their bread is buttered on.

    Our national debt is amongst the highest in the OECD, our governmental systems, capital projects, et cetera are totally inept.

    Figures vary depending on the source, but Westminster asked to subsidise the Northern executive 10 to 15 billion every year. Even taking the low end of the estimate where are we supposed to find that type of money.

    Our public services are a borderline joke, the U.K.’s are not perfect, but for the most part they are better than ours.

    Sure , there are idealistic or patriotic reasons why many would want a united Ireland but I cannot see it happening any time this decade. But I could be wrong.

  25. The UK ends.

    ‘An ‘ow’d you get that then? By ‘angin’ onto outdated imperialist dogma that perpetuates the economic and social differences in our socie’y.’

    ‘Conservatives’ conserve NOTHING but privilege.

    Everything else goes on the auction block.

  26. Well, if you look back on it the beginning of the end of the United Kingdom was always down to the English elites’ attitudes to the countries that supposedly made up a ‘voluntary union’ which in reality was never voluntary or equal.

    The Union, certainly on this island anyway, was doomed before it began because those at the top of its institutions took an attitude towards Ireland that was basically to treat the majority of its population with utter contempt, barely recognising them as people or seeing them as equals and it was a culture absolutely dripping with sectarianism and classist attitudes.

    It was those attitudes that in 19th century drove the Great Famine and the mass exodus of millions of people who were in all legal contexts, British subjects/citizens. They fled what was then the richest country on the planet, a super power at the middle of an empire, to avoid starvation and they had to make their lives in the ‘New World’ , essentially as refugees and economic migrants.

    They British elites (and also ulster unionism) NEVER EVER took ownership for any of that, nor do they talk about about as being part of their history, and in a way, because we want to own our own history, we also let them off the hook too.

    If it were called *the Great British Famine*, starvation and mass emigration, it would be awkward for them and it makes the 19th century UK look like a failed state and explains very clearly why the Irish independence movement became so serious and ultimately caused the fracturing of the UK and an exit of a large chunk of it.

    However, it’s talked about like it’s something that happened ‘way over there somewhere’ in a complete vacuum and was probably entirely to do with those hot headed *paddies* and their somehow innate irrationality, for failing to be happy little Britons.

    It’s a very much shared history and it’s grim. It’s a huge part of the history of the UK and how it effectively fell apart in 1922, yet they seem incapable of discussing it in those kinds of terms or learning anything at all from what happened. They can only talk about the glory days and everything bad is someone else’s fault or is just edited out and disowned.

    There’s still the same elitism and centralisation of power in London and contempt for, or at best total ignorance of, regions and countries that make up the modern UK and that’s still what’s fracturing it. It never evolved into a modern federal country. It’s always been a supreme England and ‘some other places’ that get dragged along for the ride.

    Even look at institutional names – why is the United Kingdom’s central bank the ‘Bank of England’? Why do they constantly struggle with national UK identity? What does it mean to be British? Loyalty to England? Sometimes the two seem to be interchangeable. Why is English law passed in Westminster, yet it’s supposed to be something akin to a federal parliament? There’s and endless list of these oddities and issues but they’re never ever addressed. They’re ignored, papered over and they erupt now and then and just get brushed aside.

    They go on about the *Irish Question,* they pour scorn and criticism on the EU but the big, the 1024 ton (imperial) elephant sized question sitting in corner, is the *British Question* and it’s the one that is just never asked because nobody ever wants to talk about it because that might undermine their sense of self belief or rock the boat.

    Ultimately that’s what will shatter the UK – a complete failure to modernise or act like a partnership of equals.

  27. He was also wanking himself off about how a monarchy is “the best way to choose a head of state”.

    So I lost all respect for him.

  30. There’s no such thing as the ‘United Kingdom’. No members have a veto. No members voted to join. No members can leave! It’s just England and its colonies.

  31. I think this could be an element somewhere on the path to the end. The beginning of the end already happened, but standing so close still, it’s a bit difficult to say if the real beginning of the end was, but it’ll have to be placed some time before the first Scottish independence referendum in 2014.

    Although I think in fairness that at that point everything wasn’t lost yet. But it just seems that after that referendum, rather than acting on the obvious unhappiness of large parts of Scotland, UK politics became even more England-centric, thanks in no small part to a bunch of Eton boys and a weirdo nationalist who ironically has a French surname and an Irish ex-wife as well as a German second wife (whom he is now separated from). To wit: The whole Brexit referendum which the UK sort of stumbled into because the Tories thought the expected Remain vote would settle an internal party argument. During that long ordeal of negotiations the UK government repeatedly showed they really don’t give a toss about EITHER side of the Irish border, and that has continued ever since, with the ongoing wrangling about the NI protocol, which seems more motivated by trying to score cheap points within the Tory membership than with doing something to improve people’s lives.
    Oh. Of course they’re now on to their I think fourth PM (easy to lose count) within six years or so. Although there have been significantly fewer general elections than that in the same space of time.

    So yeah… In the big picture, that census result is obviously something, but it seems more like another domino, or another jigsaw piece falling into place. Rather than the beginning of the end.

  36. The permanent breakup of the UK would be one of the most satisfying outcomes and a bittersweet end to a post empirical nation that tried to wash millions of litres of blood of its hands

  37. You can do an emergency Baptism … convert them to Catholics.. it’s one of our many super powers 🙂

  40. If/when Northern Ireland leaves the UK, most English people won’t be that bothered. But they shafted Scotland big time and it’s looking like a Scottish independence referendum would pass the next time. Scotland leaving would affect the English economically, militarily and very much psychologically.

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