**TLDR** \– she attempted to help an elderly person at the grocery store and got snapped at and disapproving looks — then the cashier did the exact same thing she tried to aid him with
**edit** \– source: “Why Charity is a Dirty Word in Germany” [https://medium.com/the-expat-chronicles/why-charity-is-a-dirty-word-in-germany-916fb74e5b8](https://medium.com/the-expat-chronicles/why-charity-is-a-dirty-word-in-germany-916fb74e5b8)
” An Unexpected Culture Shock
This morning, I had what may be my biggest culture shock since coming to Germany three months ago — on an otherwise ordinary trip to the grocery store.
As I was waiting in line to pay, an elderly man ahead of me fed his money into an automatic change machine. Unfortunately, the change slot was too low for the man and he couldn’t bend over far enough to collect his money. After watching him struggle for a few seconds, I said in German, “May I help you,” as I reached over to hand him his bill.
“Ney!” he snapped and before I could finish the phrase, he swatted my hand away as if it were a mosquito.
I turned to the person next to me in line to see if he was as stunned as I was, but instead he wagged his finger at me and gave me a reproachful look. In fact, everyone behind me in line seemed to be giving me a collective look as if to say, “You should know better.”
About a minute later, the cashier came around from her desk and proceeded to hand the bill to the man *exactly as I had tried to do.* And with that, order was restored.
Though this wasn’t my first culture shock in Germany, it stung a lot more than any other I’ve had so far. I can’t remember another time in my life where a small attempt to help someone was not only rejected, but viewed with collective disdain.
After speaking with friends from Germany and other European countries later in the day, I got a glimpse into why the Germans responded the way they did — as well as a fascinating lesson on how differently Americans and Europeans view generosity.
As I shared my experience with friends from Germany, Finland, and Italy later in the day, they all came to a similar conclusion as to how my behavior was probably perceived:
I had stepped out of line.
In an attempt to help someone, I had interfered with the role of the cashier. From the perspective of my European friends, a well-functioning society is one in which the needs of people are effectively served by the government or by workers in well-defined jobs. Therefore, an average person stepping in to help is not only viewed as unnecessary, but disruptive.
But what about random acts of kindness and charity, I asked.
To my surprise, many of them viewed the concept of charity negatively. “If the government does its job and society’s working, there shouldn’t be charity,” some of them commented. “Charity means that a society is failing to meet the needs of its people and so citizens need to step in to fill the gap.”
35 comments
i think you are wrong here.
your tried act of kindness wasn’t disruptive, but just uninvited. If they ask you, then you can react and help them. If not, you just stepping boundries. Especialy since this was connected to money, everybody is much more cautious anyway.
Ask if they need help, if they say no leave them alone and wait with an annoyed look on your face. Thats the german way
Rather than developing huge society-spanning theories, I suspect that in this case the issue was that you were trying to touch someone else’s money. Many old people are nervous about being theft victims as it is, and trick thieves that fiddle with someone’s money exist.
>I said in German, “May I help you,” as I reached over to hand him his bill.
I would recommend asking and then *waiting whether they say “yes”*. People asking whether they can do something and then doing it before the other person has a chance to possibly say no can be irritating – you’re recognising that it’s a situation where you should ask for consent, but at the same time you’re doing it anyway.
Very late edit:
>To my surprise, many of them viewed the concept of charity negatively. “If the government does its job and society’s working, there shouldn’t be charity,” some of them commented. “Charity means that a society is failing to meet the needs of its people and so citizens need to step in to fill the gap.”
Yes. I know people from the local Diakonie who run the Tafel (food bank). And they are *very* concerned and frustrated that it’s needed because they are taking over tasks the government should do. The people who come to them should be able to provide for themselves when they receive welfare etc., yet their needs are not adequately covered.
That does not have anything to do with individuals being helpful to other people. That’s not charity.
I am surprised – I am German and would have found it completely normal for you to offer your help. But I think the German way would have been to first ask: “Kann ich Ihnen helfen?”, wait for the man’s reaction and then reach over. Maybe that is the difference?
As for charity: Like your European friends I share the view that it is the state’s job to provide for education, health, social support etc. Nothing against wealthy people donating, but if public infrastructure becomes dependent from their charity, I regard that as a threat to democracy, it would be more of a meritocracy. Better tax the rich a lot so that the state can then, in a democratic process, allocate the money to where it is needed.
> In an attempt to help someone, I had interfered with the role of the cashier.
You tried to grab someone’s money. Also, as you describe yourself, you “asked” to help him AS you reached for it.
If you want to help someone, especially a stranger, first ask if you can help and then wait for a response. Goes triple when it involves them handing you money.
The cashier works there, the old guy does not have to worry that she takes his money and runs with it. And she is responsible for the line to keep moving, so she can “push” her help a bit more than a random stranger.
Some people might just not want strangers to touch their money. The cashier is more of a person of trust due to their role in that “well-defined” job description than the person behind you in line.
I would not go so far as to say that this man rejected “charity”, because to me that requires more than a favor that literally takes a second. Charity is far more than that and this situation had very little to do with that.
But I do agree with the sentiment that a government that relies on charity does generally not do a sufficient job.
Err, I am about just as surprised at the reactions you got as well as the answers from your friends. 😂
I don’t think you stepped out of line. The only thing I would have done differently is waited a bit more to see if the cashier reacts ot notices, and if not, wait for an answer from the man (only because I’ve had my fair share of elderly people wanting to do stuff themselves vehemently).
In my opinion: please do go on being kind to people, as this world sorely needs it. 💚
It’s one thing to help this Gentleman grab a box of pasta or whatever from a very low or very high shelf in the supermarket: always appreciated.
But grabbing someone else’s cash without consent (you asked “may I help you?” – but did you wait for an answer?) is a very different story.
In principle, I share the view about charity. If it’s even necessary, society has failed. It has in some fields, and giving to some organization is ok…ish. But we should put at least as much effort to make politicians raise more taxes and allocate them differently.
I don’t know who you talked to, but that sounds like a lot of bs.
I don’t believe the majority thinks that you „interfered with the role of the cashier“. The elder gentleman either was worried you‘ll steal his money or just didn’t want your help, because especially elder people can be very stubborn when it’s comes to doing things on their own.
Why didn’t you wait to get an answer before grabbing for his money? Probably would‘ve swatted your hand away myself. Just wait for an answer before you interfere with someone’s personal space and belongings.
Don’t touch other people or their stuff without their consent?
Another point to consider is that it is sometimes considered rude to even ask people if they need help.
In Germany, if you want help, you need to ask. Only a few people will pick up on you needing help if you do not make it known.
This is because asking if someone needs help is basically implying they can’t manage, which can be seen as rude.
If you ASK people for help however, they will almost never say no.
So you wanna tell me that you tried reaching the wallet of ab elderly person? and your suprised of the way he reacted.
Most old people ask for help if they need or want it.
Also makes sense he trusts the cashier more than some random person.
What did I just read?
I work in the care sector with old people. Never have I ever seen or heard stiff like this. Like others have mentioned „you should‘ve waited for the old man to say yes“ otherwise it comes off as rude and condescenting. But why the other people were all weirded out by your behaviour or why your friends told you this behaviour is disruptive… Idk. Totally normal and acceptable to help old people!
General kindness is good, and Germans are certainly open to it. Here the mistake was taking action before receiving an answer. Some older people are concerned about being taken advantage of, and if you are infirm or disabled then having people interfere with your actions which are already taking so much effort can be disconcerting. Part of this is the guy is probably a typical grumpy old man but there will be others of his age and younger that will have been happy for the help. Of course store staff have a more trusted position.
The idea that charities shouldn’t be something society depends on because it is the government’s responsibility to properly tax people and invest in a major US/Europe divide and not just a Germany thing.
That reasoning is bullshit, sorry.
The only problem I see here was that you didn’t wait for an answer before you started to interfere with his business and grabbed his bill, which could come across as being too pushy.
You reached for someone else’s money. As you described it, he didn’t even answer to your question when you reached out. So he probably thought you were about to steal his money.
At least that’s how I interpret it.
German supermarket etiquette is bizarre. I’ve seen older women body checked by people in an effort to get to the front of the line when a new register opens. It’s a free for all in there, despite it being a place pretty much everyone has to go to. Every man for themselves! I can’t reach the cash with my aging, decrepit body? Yet I cannot trust my fellow citizen to touch my money that I have ever so safely secured and with great Sparsamkeit, I must continue to endure in this cold, cold world treating others as if they are merely insects. No, you may not help me! Only the clerk can do that for that is the way things are! For now I have merely endured the quiet pity of the Schlanger, but you will endure the shame!!!
Humans can demonstrate a lack of humanity at times. It’s not just a German thing. Take the “these ones are all a little lost” approach on this one.
I think offering help is fine, but starting to move your hand toward him/his money before waiting for a reply is not.
OK English POV (living in RLP) – I am disabled and I am happy for people to offer their help if they see my struggling. But to ask and not wait for an answer (or worse to not ask at all)? Horrendously rude! Lots of people have offered to help with various things here in Germany but always wait until I have said yes or no before helping (except my German f-in-l who totally was rude and inconsiderate by any cultures standards and only ever “helped” if it was advantageous to him).
You’re thinking too hard about this. You should just have waited for him to answer whether he wants help or not. Like for all you know he didn’t even hear you because he’s old and doesn’t hear well anymore and then you being helpful can very easily look like you trying to take his money.
Generally, old people are skeptical about strangers trying to help them. In one way, they feel the person is taking away their ability to solve problems on their own, in another way some old people don’t want to feel like a burden to society. But this is very individualistic. Some may gladly accept help while others reject it outrightly. I must also say the mood and circumstances also play a role.
Hell no. As a cashier, it nowhere states in the contract that we need to help clients while cashiering. The other workers in the store should help, but the cashier is only obliged to the cash register, and if given, a cigarette machine.
Your friends are weird.
Most likely the old guy just thought you want to take his money or you just met one of those older guys who doesn’t want to be helped. But most likely it’s the money thing. That’s why the cashier is allowed to do what you weren’t – they are there to do the payment thing. Sometimes they just empty a wallet with some older person and put together the moey needed to pay.
Just don’t put to much thinking in it and keep up your helpful personality.
Man, that “i understood society” bit at the end was cringe af. No it has absolutely nothing to do with anything the government does/provides. You simply touched another persons stuff without them asking. Knowing german supermarket cashiers, they probably did it much more decisively than you so the old man couldnt even have objected if he wanted to. Also they have authority in their maket that you don’t have.
But i get that you are upset and a little shocked. I don’t know that touching other peoples money is ok in the US but here it definitely isn’t. Don’t let it get to you though. It was a learning experience and in a few weeks it will make a great story to tell your american friends. Cheers.
The reaction of the elderly person was harsh, and born out of suspicion.
This is typically in some areas of Germans, and probably in all big cities. But in small places in the country the reaction would probably not have been so negative.
This is absolutely rare and cannot be generalized for „german society“. In fact it will be the equivalent of calling every American a mass shooter.
However, I experienced something similar in Karlsruhe. I helped a old lady who tripped on the S-bahn tracks and fell. The lady assured she was ok, thanked me and went ahead.
Here’s where it gets strange. I was about 100m away from her and there were so many people nearby. I ran towards her at the blink of an eye but later realised nobody around moved an inch
The only oddity I can see is that you tried to grab his money before (or even without) getting a yes as an answer. Sadly A lot of older people are also pretty racist… so If you don’t really look German he could have been worried about you trying to steal his money or sth. That could explain his behavior but not the others who gave you wierd looks..
I allways use the self checkout register at my local grocery shop and almost every time there are people (mostly elder) having trouble with that and when I ask them nicely if they need help they almost always are glad. I never experienced someone regarding helping as bad. And I’m really confused that your friends agree on that “disrupting the system”-theory ?!?
You are making this way more Philosophical than it should be.
Germans are touchy when it comes to money.
Older people are wary of strangers trying to touch their money.
OP tried to steal money, gets caught, posts on reddit.
/s
>After watching him struggle for a few seconds, I said in German, “May I help you,” as I reached over to hand him his bill.
You didn’t wait for his response, that’s encroaching. You should have waited respectfully for the answer first.
I think it’s not that complicated. I think you should have waited for his answer if he needs help. I have asked people in past if they need help. Sometimes they said “neeeee” with a frown, other time they said yea with a big smile and gratitude. In this case, since it was about money I would have been even more careful in asking.
May be I would have said “please let me know if you need help” from a safe personal distance.
Asking to help is fine, but already starting to do it before waiting for the answer might have triggered him more strongly
I’m sorry but what your friends said makes no sense to me at all.
Imho you got snapped at because you reached for somebody’s money without getting consent first.
Would have been a different thing if you had asked and then acted.
That being said, I would have definitely sided with you on this one and I don’t really get the reproachfull looks from the bystanders.
Maybe you missed some other factor?
In any case I wouldn’t worry too much about it – some old people are just bitter and maybe it came across differently from how you meant it.
It is never inappropriate to help. But as so many have already said, if you ask, wait for the answer.
The guy might not even have heard you correctly and just saw your hand dashing to his money.
If that’s a German thing (waiting for an answer in that particular case) I can really live with that. There are other instances where one absolutely should spring to action without even asking, but this wasn’t one of them
I read the TLDR and the first thought I had was: this must have been in southern Germany. Then you described the reaction of the old man as saying “ney” and my suspicion was confirmed.
Am I right in assuming that this was somewhere in Baden Württemberg or maybe in Hessen?
I am pretty sure that the reaction of the bystanders at least would have been different in the north. The argument stands that the old man probably reacted this way because he was afraid you might tamper with his money (and this is something even more of an issue in the south, in my opinion). But the people around you would probably have recognized that you just tried to help.
This is not about unwanted help, community support or charity, this is about someone else’s money.
You touched someone else’s money without their consent. I’d react puzzled, too, if I were to witness that tbh. And I believe it’s a huge no-go to do that.
Asking if you can be of any help in certain situations is always great imo. But people also always have the right to refuse. Wait to get an answer next time, give people a moment to react.
I personally cannot fully agree with the conclusions your friends circle came to, but that’s another topic.
Edit:
I just see, that this wasn’t your experience, but that you c/p-Ed someone else’s experience. Please clarify this in the OP and give a source. Reposting w/out a source is never ok
Edit2: thanks for adding the source