Just reading about things like this – raves are illegal, but fascist marches are OK and it’s not making any sense.
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-63468598
Why is fascism outlawed in many European countries, but it’s still alive, well, and given a legitimate political platform in Italy?
Edit: i can see the nuance and i appreciate your perspectives
29 comments
Cus we fucking stupid that’s why
Because freedom of thought is guaranteed by our Constitution. It would be pretty fascist to outlaw the right to have fascist ideas, as long as those ideas are not put into practice (and then they stop being just ideas).
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cause we can’t write laws properly
unpopular opinion: it is a fascist thing to forbid a person’s thoughts and ideas.
I don’t think there’s a single country in the world where fascism or any sort of right-wing extremism doesn’t exist or isn’t represented in some form or way. Saying Italy is a fascist country is not just wrong but quite delusional
Fascism is costitutionally banned in Italy but it’s very easy to circumvent such a thing, and there must be a very serious reason or event to get a political party banned for embracing fascism. But events like this don’t just happen there. While I don’t specifically recall the events that put fascist-like parties across the globe in the spotlight, I know about their existance and their names as well and I’m sure if you made your own researchs, you wouldnt have any troubles finding them yourself.
To end the comment, I don’t think Italy is any different to other countries around the globe when it comes to these political parties which look up to fascism and other extremist political movements.
You’ll find that fascist and fascist-like movements are on the rise across the western world. There’s no shortage of Nazi imagery in any pro-trump event, the conservative party in the UK is resorting to rather questionable practice to hold on to power… The list goes on and on.
Look at who people who hold these views are (hint: under-employed, uneducated social media gremlins) and it will become very clear how they got there.
you cannot rebuild the fascist party, but having ideas is not illegal, they are old nostalgics who probably would have taken so many batons during the fascist period.
Fascism is in some way outlawed as well in Italy as you can’t recreate the National Fascist Party. Sometimes lists get banned from elections if there is a clear connection.
However, it is “allowed” because of freedom of speech guaranteed by the Constitution and somehow tolerated because, after the war, “appeasement” towards former fascists was the strategy adopted by the new democratic institutions, basically never actually dealing with what happened and pretending that everything was fine. Former fascists were “reabsorbed” into the democratic establishment.
On the “legitimate political platform” part, actual fascist parties usually stay way below 1% at elections, so it’s alive but I wouldn’t say it’s “well”.
By the way, raves are illegal if they are unauthorized as they can potentially cause public safety issues, as the article you linked says.
A significant part of the political spectrum is made of either actual fascists or people who believe that what Mussolini did was “not that bad” and that he was some sort of benevolent dictator who did not kill anyone (Berlusconi said that almost verbatim when he was prime minister). That means there’s never been the political will in parliament to pass laws like they have in Germany,, were the equivalent of what’s happening in Predappio with swastikas and people shouting “Heil Hitler” wouldn’t be tolerated
Because we have that kind of people in politics. The new senate president is a known fascist
Because we designed it, so, it’s kind of our mojo and it always comes back, one way or another.
The only fascism allowed in Italy is the one with the Red flag.
Also, we are talking about fascism because we are talking about italy, but in other countries, its the same thing with a different name
brits and USA have a role in this, thanks for Gladio guys.
They rebranded
its called freedom baby
Fascism is illegal in Italy. Gatherings at Mussolini’s grave aren’t illegal because in a democratic system people can go wherever the want, you can’t outlaw idiots.
In 1952 the Italian Parlament approved a law known as Legge Scelba (Scelba’s Law, from Mario Scelba, the Minister of Internal Affairs who wrote it) which prohibits, among the other things, the “exaltation of exponents, principles, facts and methods of the fascist party or carries out fascist external manifestations”.
Unfortunately, since our Costitution grants free speech while outlawing only the intent of rebuilding the fascist party, the Supreme Court had to void said section of Legge Scelba. So, unless these disgusting people try to rebuild the Fascist Party or use violence, there is nothing we can do.
Regarding the rave parties, we are talking about thousands of people occupying a private property without any king of authorization nor following the security protocols necessary for any major event.
This time was an abandoned warehouse consided at risk of collapsing. Last time was a plot of land of a poor farmer who’s fuel oil was stolen, the equipments damaged and some sheeps killed.
Because we want the right to go to the bank and to the post office
In Italy we have a law against fascist apology, i.e. it’s forbidden to restore the former fascist party with antidemocratic, violent and subversive purposes.
The Constitutional Court declared in 1957 that “apology” was meant to be intepreted as “active instigation” and not “mere defense or approval”. So in Italy the only way to incur in this felony is actively advocating for a fascist dictatorship, while it allows nostalgics to commemorate Mussolini himself and what he did as long as this doesn’t violate other laws (e.g. those in the “Legge Mancino”).
Fascist marches do not aim to bring back a fascist dictatorship and when those people break the Legge Mancino they are sentenced to pay up to 6000€ or to spend up to one and a half years in prison. Besides those marches are preventively organised, so that policemen can intervene if needed.
Raves instead are improvised with no authorisation and break multiple laws, such as violation of private property and drug dealing. In addition to this, no proper safety measure is taken and often people get sick, get raped, pass out or die.
I have never heard about laws that criminalise “being fascist” in Europe, I’d be glad to learn something new if you told me where to read about those laws
Being a fascist is not illegal, that would be some 1984 thought-criminal dystopian shit.
Conservative parties are winning all across the world, wtf means this guy?
have you fucking ever heard of TRUMP?
come on
Fascism is illegal too.
The difference between fascist marches and raves is that the first can be used for political reasons or to increase your party’s votes, the latter cannot.
because no foreign superpower ever forced us to stare down the abyss we have created, and so there are people who still idealize that time
In fact, Italy and a handful of other European countries are some of the select countries in which Fascism is outright banned.
In the United States for one, given the 1st Amendment, no speech including fascism is against the law.
You might be wondering why a ban on fascism isn’t enforced in a more extreme fashion. Well, because who gets to choose what’s fascism and what is not? The current Government will not always align with your interests or with a political faction you can reason with. The best thing you got is to leave the role of steering away from regressive, violent, harmful ideology mostly up to the civil society, which is a core foundational value of liberal democracy.
Italy is one of the few countries that literally banned an entire ideology.
Fascism is not allowed, the fact that fascist marches are a thing doesn’t mean that it’s allowed.
It’s like saying “why is killing people allowed in USA?” cause a maniac killed someone.
Raves are illegal because first, you don’t invade someone else’s property at your leisure, and second, the moment someone gets hurt we all start crying ohhh why did they allow it???!
There is a reason why a concert needs authorizations: to check that everything is fine. And when it does happen that someone dies in an authorised concert, you take the authority and legally beat the shit out of them.
I think you should check your bias. In the article they don’t talk about Italy allowing fascism. I despise this govern quite a lot but not for the fear of a new regime rising. Most of the people in the new establishment are old politicians known more for how corrupt and inept they are than fascist leaning. Global (and european even more so) power and media are very afraid of any goverment who’s not alligned with the current state of affair and tend to smear who does not comply ( quite a fascist habit, I know). That said a law specifically targetting raves ( the italian judicial system already has laws for anything that could happen during a rave party) sems so stupid that this question arise: Are they making a law to not only punish rave but also protests? time will tell…