>#Not all officers need degrees, 16 police chiefs tell Home Secretary
>__Suella Braverman urged to ditch blanket requirement for officers to have degrees to stop forces missing out on experienced recruits__
>By Charles Hymas,
>HOME AFFAIRS EDITOR
>30 October 2022 • 6:00am
>More than a third of policing chiefs are urging Suella Braverman to ditch the blanket requirement for all officers to have degrees to stop forces missing out on veterans and older, experienced recruits.
>Sixteen police and crime commissioners (PCCs) have written to the Home Secretary to warn her that recruits are spending so much time studying under the new all-graduate system that up to 10 per cent of their officers are stuck in classrooms rather than on the frontline fighting crime.
>They are urging her to change the regulations so that police forces can still use the “traditional” training route under which new bobbies are on the beat after just 20 weeks’ initial police college training and are not required to spend so much time in the classroom.
>They say they are losing out on new recruits from the military, officers who have worked as special constables or PCSOs and older people without a degree seeking a career change.
‘We are turning away good people’
>Matthew Scott, police and crime commissioner for Kent, who organised the letter, said: “We are turning away perfectly good people because we have decided you need a degree to be a police officer. There are many fine police officers who have never had a degree.”
>It is believed Ms Braverman is sympathetic to the request and is concerned about the “over-academisation” of policing. The call for flexibility by the PCCs is understood to be backed by a number of chief constables.
>It comes at a critical time when forces are seeking to hit their recruitment targets in the last year of the 20,000-officer uplift in England and Wales. There are also concerns within some of the 43 police forces in England and Wales about their age profile with so many young, inexperienced officers.
>Kent is among a number of forces already allowed a dispensation by the College of Policing, the professional body for training, to continue recruiting some officers in the traditional way in order to hit its year target of 195. It has to recruit not only new PCs but also replace those retiring or poached by the Met Police.
>The new regime means any officer completing the three-year probation will have to have a graduate-level qualification. This can be done by having a degree on entry or studying for it once in the police under what is known as a “police constable degree apprenticeship”, which includes an “evidence-based research project”.
>It is known as PEQF (Policing Education Qualifications Framework) and has replaced the non-graduate IPLDP+ (Initial Police Learning and Development Programme).
>__‘In the classroom, not the frontline’__
>In their letter, the 16 PCCs warn: “The extraction rates of PEQF are significant, especially for smaller forces, who will see the benefits of the uplift programme almost wiped out. Rather than being out on the street, as much as 10 per cent of their frontline capability will be in the classroom, not on the frontline.
>“There needs to be a more flexible approach. We need to allow local police forces the choice of having IPLDP+ and PEQF courses available to new entrants. This would remove the effective need for a police officer to have a degree at the end of their training from next year, whilst supporting local accountability and decision making.
>“It would give better options to help recruit a wider range of people with suitable experience, including the military, serving Specials and PCSOs, or people seeking a career change, more quickly.”
>The PCCs represent forces across England and Wales and include: Kent; Lancashire; Derbyshire; Nottinghamshire; Gloucestershire; Dorset; Hampshire; Bedfordshire; Humberside; Surrey; Thames Valley; Warwickshire; Essex; Leicestershire; Northamptonshire; and Cleveland.
The police used to be an excellent career choice for people without a degree, as long as you were physically and emotionally fit to serve. My uncle never went to university, spent 25 years in the police and retired at 50 on a great pension.
Shame that’s all gone now. Coppers these days can barely afford to heat their homes.
The trouble here is more that retention for police officers is so poor at the moment that there is a constant string of new recruits who are always in the classroom.
Those with degrees are less likely to stick around for the pay and workloads of police officer whilst being treated so badly by society.
A degree just to be a Bobby, ridiculous. Should be a fitness program, can you run, jump, fight (criminals can).
Trying to make the police a middle class career, problem is that the roughest areas are lower class and as soon as they here a accent not from that area respect goes out the window.
Bring back the local Bobbie who grew up in the area and knows the people.
Then you wouldn’t get privileged kids taking a runner after having to visit their first run down council estate/flats.
I remember a colleague yelling me that they were given a house at a reduced rent as newlyweds because her husband was in the police. The house didn’t have central heating and was small and dilapidated but they could save up for their deposit much faster. Plus free local transport I think. That was London, in the 80s I think
Needing a degree to be a “bobby” is ridiculous, especially given the police pay for constables. To get promoted past Sergeant perhaps.
A degree these days is almost worthless as with a MSc unless it’s in a specialist occupation. It doesn’t really prove anything and those without in many cases display similar or greater ability. The police need an in-house qualification and no entry requirements to attract the widest possible recruitment numbers.
Good training and supervision are far more important than having a degree
You don’t even need a degree to join the likes of GCHQ, be an army officer or be a senior in other emergency services so I can’t see why you’d need one to be a police officer. They should test on aptitude and potential like those other places do
One officer refused to do baton/self defence training as she didn’t like confrontation, been moved to an office job where she will no doubt remain for rest of her career on full police wage, another officer had his dad meet him at a sudden death as he was scared. This is the reality of modern day police degree recruitment, sooner have an ex squaddie any day or someone with a few years work experience, not a graduate when the shit hits the fan.
I always thought the rule for Police to have a degree was ridiculous.
Hey Telegraph – Police “Chiefs” strongly suggests Chief Constables, not, as is the case here, PCCs. One is a senior police officer with a long career in Policing, the other is a politician, with a career in *whatever really*.
It’s a wee bit nit picky but PCCs are politicians, not Police Chiefs.
Why would a police officer need a degree? What degree would that even need to be?
Yeah I’d genuinely be interested in the police but it would be a 30k pay cut for myself to join due to no degree and starting at the lowest point of entry.
As someone who went through the PCDA, I can wholeheartedly say it’s shit.
I assume the curriculum is the same nationwide, and it wasn’t just the Uni we were assigned to being wank, but there’s very little focus on the actual legislation, and more on the theological side of things.
Stuff like the socioeconomic impact of opening more police stations (which tickled me, because we’d been shutting more and more down), how lack of visibility effects public opinion (again, we’d gladly go out on high vis patrols, but didn’t have the numbers).
It didn’t help that the ex-bobbies they brought in to lecture us either couldn’t be arsed, and got the boot due to lack of effort, or they got better paying offers from elsewhere and fucked off rather than deal with the uni’s bureaucracy (fair fucks to them for that TBH.)
I think police should be vetted better, but I don’t think a degree should be necessary
You don’t NEED a degree-but again having a degree is a nice ‘filter’- these people have shown a certain level of intelligence, critical thinking, ability to follow rules and guidelines, organisation, time keeping etc etc
It’s a way of ticking off a lot of boxes which would make someone a dependable employee—-the same way many graduate schemes require a degree even if it isn’t specialised in that field
The societal emphasis on degrees is a problem in itself.
I’ve met many people who can retain information in an academic environment but lack even the most basic semblance of common sense, or other virtues of intelligence.
Obviously not all police officers needs degrees, it’s ridiculous to think they would in the first case.
My dad dropped out of school with no qualifications, joined the police in the 70s and had a good 25 years in the force.
I went to uni, did undergrad, did a PhD. Could I do what he did, as well as he did? Abso-fucking-lutely not, he has an incredible set of soft skills that I could only dream of having, and the patience of a saint.
What I’m trying to say is, there is a unique and desirable set of qualities we should want in our police officers, and these do not line up with formal education, as I see it.
What happened to good old 5 GCSEs including maths and English? That used to be entry requirements for many jobs. It demonstrated a certain level of intelligence. Think about the skills police really need; fitness, communication and commitment. Are these skills really demonstrated by having a degree?
Yep the way these jobs are going. I work in the forensic mental health service (criminally insane) and you are getting book smart people through who have no idea how to even communicate with patients. Need some ex tradesmen and forces. And they disappear at the first sign of trouble but will grass anyone who doesn’t do there job right. Horrible.
My partner is a Bobby, and she has said the standard of trainees coming through on the new degree scheme is absolutely shocking. There’s also no commitment to the job once you’ve been sponsored through the degree, so you can get it and then quit the job immediately. The partnered university are also holding the police force to ransom on a lot of things and threaten to pull the program when they don’t get their way.
Absolute mess
So you don’t need to be a six foot bloke who can deal with a dangerous criminal anymore, you just need a piece of paper. This is just more of the government picking the pockets of future earners.
Everyone needs a degree! We must keep feeding the cash cow. A town/city near you could be turned into student accommodation tomorrow. think about it. All the shops shutting down, gotta be used for something.
We gotta keep atleast one revenue stream alive for taxes
come on
My dad went to Hendon at 18, absolutely hated it and left.
He then worked in a shop for a couple of years, started driving a bus to help him get a CDL and then 12 years later joined the police.
All he had were O Levels, but during training he was consistently the best student and always at the top of the fitness sessions, even as one of the older recruits. He approached his work with life experience and made a point of being ethical and fair, trying to treat suspected criminals the way he’d want to be treated (after arresting them).
He was well respected, was assigned to plain clothes squads near the end of his probation and trusted to work test purchase, surveillance, robbery and pickpocket, anti terror and despite never wanting to take the tests for DC or DS, would work acting sergeant on his squads at times.
I fully believe that a degree in related subjects would be useful, but the experience my dad went through before the police helped shape him to be the kind of police officer we need.
27 comments
>#Not all officers need degrees, 16 police chiefs tell Home Secretary
>__Suella Braverman urged to ditch blanket requirement for officers to have degrees to stop forces missing out on experienced recruits__
>By Charles Hymas,
>HOME AFFAIRS EDITOR
>30 October 2022 • 6:00am
>More than a third of policing chiefs are urging Suella Braverman to ditch the blanket requirement for all officers to have degrees to stop forces missing out on veterans and older, experienced recruits.
>Sixteen police and crime commissioners (PCCs) have written to the Home Secretary to warn her that recruits are spending so much time studying under the new all-graduate system that up to 10 per cent of their officers are stuck in classrooms rather than on the frontline fighting crime.
>They are urging her to change the regulations so that police forces can still use the “traditional” training route under which new bobbies are on the beat after just 20 weeks’ initial police college training and are not required to spend so much time in the classroom.
>They say they are losing out on new recruits from the military, officers who have worked as special constables or PCSOs and older people without a degree seeking a career change.
‘We are turning away good people’
>Matthew Scott, police and crime commissioner for Kent, who organised the letter, said: “We are turning away perfectly good people because we have decided you need a degree to be a police officer. There are many fine police officers who have never had a degree.”
>It is believed Ms Braverman is sympathetic to the request and is concerned about the “over-academisation” of policing. The call for flexibility by the PCCs is understood to be backed by a number of chief constables.
>It comes at a critical time when forces are seeking to hit their recruitment targets in the last year of the 20,000-officer uplift in England and Wales. There are also concerns within some of the 43 police forces in England and Wales about their age profile with so many young, inexperienced officers.
>Kent is among a number of forces already allowed a dispensation by the College of Policing, the professional body for training, to continue recruiting some officers in the traditional way in order to hit its year target of 195. It has to recruit not only new PCs but also replace those retiring or poached by the Met Police.
>The new regime means any officer completing the three-year probation will have to have a graduate-level qualification. This can be done by having a degree on entry or studying for it once in the police under what is known as a “police constable degree apprenticeship”, which includes an “evidence-based research project”.
>It is known as PEQF (Policing Education Qualifications Framework) and has replaced the non-graduate IPLDP+ (Initial Police Learning and Development Programme).
>__‘In the classroom, not the frontline’__
>In their letter, the 16 PCCs warn: “The extraction rates of PEQF are significant, especially for smaller forces, who will see the benefits of the uplift programme almost wiped out. Rather than being out on the street, as much as 10 per cent of their frontline capability will be in the classroom, not on the frontline.
>“There needs to be a more flexible approach. We need to allow local police forces the choice of having IPLDP+ and PEQF courses available to new entrants. This would remove the effective need for a police officer to have a degree at the end of their training from next year, whilst supporting local accountability and decision making.
>“It would give better options to help recruit a wider range of people with suitable experience, including the military, serving Specials and PCSOs, or people seeking a career change, more quickly.”
>The PCCs represent forces across England and Wales and include: Kent; Lancashire; Derbyshire; Nottinghamshire; Gloucestershire; Dorset; Hampshire; Bedfordshire; Humberside; Surrey; Thames Valley; Warwickshire; Essex; Leicestershire; Northamptonshire; and Cleveland.
The police used to be an excellent career choice for people without a degree, as long as you were physically and emotionally fit to serve. My uncle never went to university, spent 25 years in the police and retired at 50 on a great pension.
Shame that’s all gone now. Coppers these days can barely afford to heat their homes.
The trouble here is more that retention for police officers is so poor at the moment that there is a constant string of new recruits who are always in the classroom.
Those with degrees are less likely to stick around for the pay and workloads of police officer whilst being treated so badly by society.
A degree just to be a Bobby, ridiculous. Should be a fitness program, can you run, jump, fight (criminals can).
Trying to make the police a middle class career, problem is that the roughest areas are lower class and as soon as they here a accent not from that area respect goes out the window.
Bring back the local Bobbie who grew up in the area and knows the people.
Then you wouldn’t get privileged kids taking a runner after having to visit their first run down council estate/flats.
I remember a colleague yelling me that they were given a house at a reduced rent as newlyweds because her husband was in the police. The house didn’t have central heating and was small and dilapidated but they could save up for their deposit much faster. Plus free local transport I think. That was London, in the 80s I think
Needing a degree to be a “bobby” is ridiculous, especially given the police pay for constables. To get promoted past Sergeant perhaps.
A degree these days is almost worthless as with a MSc unless it’s in a specialist occupation. It doesn’t really prove anything and those without in many cases display similar or greater ability. The police need an in-house qualification and no entry requirements to attract the widest possible recruitment numbers.
Good training and supervision are far more important than having a degree
You don’t even need a degree to join the likes of GCHQ, be an army officer or be a senior in other emergency services so I can’t see why you’d need one to be a police officer. They should test on aptitude and potential like those other places do
One officer refused to do baton/self defence training as she didn’t like confrontation, been moved to an office job where she will no doubt remain for rest of her career on full police wage, another officer had his dad meet him at a sudden death as he was scared. This is the reality of modern day police degree recruitment, sooner have an ex squaddie any day or someone with a few years work experience, not a graduate when the shit hits the fan.
I always thought the rule for Police to have a degree was ridiculous.
Hey Telegraph – Police “Chiefs” strongly suggests Chief Constables, not, as is the case here, PCCs. One is a senior police officer with a long career in Policing, the other is a politician, with a career in *whatever really*.
It’s a wee bit nit picky but PCCs are politicians, not Police Chiefs.
Why would a police officer need a degree? What degree would that even need to be?
Yeah I’d genuinely be interested in the police but it would be a 30k pay cut for myself to join due to no degree and starting at the lowest point of entry.
As someone who went through the PCDA, I can wholeheartedly say it’s shit.
I assume the curriculum is the same nationwide, and it wasn’t just the Uni we were assigned to being wank, but there’s very little focus on the actual legislation, and more on the theological side of things.
Stuff like the socioeconomic impact of opening more police stations (which tickled me, because we’d been shutting more and more down), how lack of visibility effects public opinion (again, we’d gladly go out on high vis patrols, but didn’t have the numbers).
It didn’t help that the ex-bobbies they brought in to lecture us either couldn’t be arsed, and got the boot due to lack of effort, or they got better paying offers from elsewhere and fucked off rather than deal with the uni’s bureaucracy (fair fucks to them for that TBH.)
I think police should be vetted better, but I don’t think a degree should be necessary
You don’t NEED a degree-but again having a degree is a nice ‘filter’- these people have shown a certain level of intelligence, critical thinking, ability to follow rules and guidelines, organisation, time keeping etc etc
It’s a way of ticking off a lot of boxes which would make someone a dependable employee—-the same way many graduate schemes require a degree even if it isn’t specialised in that field
The societal emphasis on degrees is a problem in itself.
I’ve met many people who can retain information in an academic environment but lack even the most basic semblance of common sense, or other virtues of intelligence.
Obviously not all police officers needs degrees, it’s ridiculous to think they would in the first case.
My dad dropped out of school with no qualifications, joined the police in the 70s and had a good 25 years in the force.
I went to uni, did undergrad, did a PhD. Could I do what he did, as well as he did? Abso-fucking-lutely not, he has an incredible set of soft skills that I could only dream of having, and the patience of a saint.
What I’m trying to say is, there is a unique and desirable set of qualities we should want in our police officers, and these do not line up with formal education, as I see it.
What happened to good old 5 GCSEs including maths and English? That used to be entry requirements for many jobs. It demonstrated a certain level of intelligence. Think about the skills police really need; fitness, communication and commitment. Are these skills really demonstrated by having a degree?
Yep the way these jobs are going. I work in the forensic mental health service (criminally insane) and you are getting book smart people through who have no idea how to even communicate with patients. Need some ex tradesmen and forces. And they disappear at the first sign of trouble but will grass anyone who doesn’t do there job right. Horrible.
My partner is a Bobby, and she has said the standard of trainees coming through on the new degree scheme is absolutely shocking. There’s also no commitment to the job once you’ve been sponsored through the degree, so you can get it and then quit the job immediately. The partnered university are also holding the police force to ransom on a lot of things and threaten to pull the program when they don’t get their way.
Absolute mess
So you don’t need to be a six foot bloke who can deal with a dangerous criminal anymore, you just need a piece of paper. This is just more of the government picking the pockets of future earners.
Everyone needs a degree! We must keep feeding the cash cow. A town/city near you could be turned into student accommodation tomorrow. think about it. All the shops shutting down, gotta be used for something.
We gotta keep atleast one revenue stream alive for taxes
come on
My dad went to Hendon at 18, absolutely hated it and left.
He then worked in a shop for a couple of years, started driving a bus to help him get a CDL and then 12 years later joined the police.
All he had were O Levels, but during training he was consistently the best student and always at the top of the fitness sessions, even as one of the older recruits. He approached his work with life experience and made a point of being ethical and fair, trying to treat suspected criminals the way he’d want to be treated (after arresting them).
He was well respected, was assigned to plain clothes squads near the end of his probation and trusted to work test purchase, surveillance, robbery and pickpocket, anti terror and despite never wanting to take the tests for DC or DS, would work acting sergeant on his squads at times.
I fully believe that a degree in related subjects would be useful, but the experience my dad went through before the police helped shape him to be the kind of police officer we need.