A Labour government could introduce “basic” ID cards to help to count how many people there are in Britain and reduce illegal immigration.
The party is examining the idea of forcing everyone to apply for registration, while limiting the scale of data stored, to address the concerns about civil liberties that emerged during Tony Blair’s premiership two decades ago.
Stephen Kinnock, the shadow immigration minister, revealed that an identity scheme was being looked at “very, very carefully indeed”, arguing it would be “so helpful” in reassuring the public that “we have control of our borders”. In an interview with Times Radio to be broadcast today, he suggested that almost every EU member state had some kind of identity scheme and “it can’t be beyond the wit of man” to devise one for Britain too.
Protesters held a demonstration outside on Sunday after reports of overcrowding and poor conditions
Protesters held a demonstration outside on Sunday after reports of overcrowding and poor conditions
ALBERTO PEXXALI/AP
He claimed that it could deter people from entering Britain illegally, as he suggested that Labour would aim to reduce the number of people crossing the Channel in small boats to zero.
The proposals are likely to be welcomed by the French government, which has repeatedly blamed Britain’s informal labour market for attracting so many illegal migrants to cross the Channel from Calais to the Kent coast.
Gérald Darmanin, the French interior minister, has argued that the British government must emulate France’s strict ID checks that prevent illegal migrants getting a job, saying that finding work in the black market was far easier in Britain than in France.
Migration experts in France said the country’s job protection labour laws and a strict enforcement of ID cards for all employees made employing anyone, even unofficially or illicitly, much harder than in the UK.
Some migrants were loaded on coaches to be taken elsewhere
Some migrants were loaded on coaches to be taken elsewhere
HENRY NICHOLLS/REUTERS
In July a report by the Tony Blair Institute recommended introducing universal mandatory digital identity cards to help to alleviate the Channel migrant crisis, in which almost 40,000 migrants have reached the UK in small boats this year. Under the institute’s plans, all individuals would be required to produce their digital identity card, showing their legal right to reside, to access employment or benefits. The report said that this would make it harder for undocumented migrants to “disappear” into the informal economy.
However, any policy that involves introducing mandatory ID cards is likely to prove controversial. It comes exactly 20 years after New Labour caused concern by running a consultation on their introduction under David Blunkett, then the home secretary.
The plans became bogged down amid arguments over the cards being linked to state entitlements, with legislation opposed in the Commons and Lords before finally being passed in 2006. In 2009, however, Alan Johnson, the home secretary, announced they would not be compulsory for UK citizens, and they were scrapped by the Conservative-Liberal Democrat coalition in 2010.
Supporters of ID cards argue that two decades on, the data people readily share with social media sites and private companies has tilted the balance on privacy arguments. Others emphasise that the absence of a universal identity scheme makes Britain more attractive to illegal migrants than other European countries.
Kinnock said: “I think [ID cards] should certainly be on the table, it needs to be properly reviewed and discussed. I thought it was extraordinary in the wake of Brexit that everybody said, ‘Oh, there are three million EU citizens in the UK’, and it turned out there were five million.
“It is just simply extraordinary that we had two million more people in our country than we thought we did. That is just not sustainable.”
The plans, if introduced, would be a U-turn for Sir Keir Starmer, the Labour leader, who opposed coronavirus vaccine passports as “un-British”.
Really making an effort to make sure those of us ‘who would always vote Labour no matter what lol’… don’t.
People are so ridiculous about ID cards in this country. Probably because they don’t realise the benefits of them and how much easier they make life. No more two forms of identification and proof of address required etc for every little thing. Just one card for everything.
We hate immigration, carry around all kinds of cards and give away our data on a daily basis on our phones, but ask us to have an ID card and ooh no, couldn’t possibly do that governor.
They e been trying to introduce some kinda ID card since I was a bairn.
So is it going to be free ?
What kinda Information will it contain ?
What will it be used for ?
Fuck I’ve not carried ID for years I don’t need it. Hell for the last 2 years I hardly carry a wallet.
Poland have a fantastic ID card system with digital app where you can manage all your government shit. Its better than our crappy system.
This is such an obsession of Labour’s authoritarian right wing. I’m yet to hear a valid argument on why it would be so beneficial.
Smart move to make this about immigration. Get the right wing wanting them. I imagine this is a calculated attempt to safeguard future elections if the Tories try to make it a legal requirement to show ID to vote. A great way to prevent the young and the poor slipping through the net and being shut out.
Finland. Secure process to get one. Also holds health data on for health access. Finland in social benefits terms is a ‘Lefty’ ( crass label but using as shorthand) dream with high taxes and superb state nurseries and free HE and access to housing etc but it comes with responsibilities and the idea of trust that the system isn’t abused. So citizenship and ID. Not a ‘Lefty’ dream. No Finn would accept what we have- no idea as to status- they just prefer cool logic.
I have an already have an ID card that controls my migration to and from this country, My passport.
Something something insert “can i see your papers” in an offensive German accent.
This is like the test and trace app.
“ I don’t want my phone knowing where I am”
Meanwhile used McDonald’s app to order food
ID cards are no major issue but I expect it to be a huge one.
I had to show my driving license to get my order from Screwfix…..
They were trying to introduce ID cards to get into football matches when I was a kid!
The weird paranoia about ID cards in Britain. They’d rather have four or five bits of “Papieren Bitte” to hang onto rather than one. Turn up to a bank to open an account and they want to see a skein of little rags of paper.
Newsflash: you already have ID that the Peelers can identify you with. They can track your phone – not just in the calls, but the location using the cell towers you attach to. They can track your debit cards. They can see everything you post on FaceBook.
A card is so much easier. Actually in Northern Ireland (and yes, for the time being we are still part of the UK) we have had photographic drivers licenses for decades so I’ve always wondered what the worry is about. Then I saw the little paper rags which were British Driving licenses.
In China your digital ID is used to stop you from doing things the government don’t want you to do. If your social credit score is low you can’t travel, enter certain establishments, borrow money etc. The reason some people don’t want a system like that in the U.K. is because they don’t want that to happen here.
I already have a driver’s licence. Why do I need to pay for yet another ID?
I would love a government ID card that lets me log onto a system and allow me to check things and register issues like many other countries (Estonia, Poland, etc). I however don’t want a friend of an Mp to make millions making a crappy system that doesn’t do what was promised.
You don’t control crime by making innocent people prove their innocence. You control it by catching the guilty.
Digital ID is 1 step further to authoritarianism. Once it’s in, you’re foobared.
Exactly how will this control immigration? Do they just reject everybody without some kind of verifiable documentation to prove who they are?
Forget the benefits of having an ID in general for the existing population, I fail to see how this helps with exactly what the headline states
I literally wrote my masters thesis on the 42 pieces of data that the last biometric ID card project would have captured.
There is no good argument for them now and there wasn’t in 2009 either. Much like voter ID, they do not actually solve any problems.
lol, no.
It’s not that ID cards are inherently bad, it’s everything around them that is fucked ie – suddenly it’s illegal to walk around without one, you must present it when asked, etc.
Will they be free? Maybe required to vote down the line? Sent out automatically to every single person when expired?
I don’t trust any UK government to not severely missuse em down the line.
Labour seem almost determined to not get my vote.
All you have to do is just be there and not be the Tories. And every day they struggle at the latter. For fuck sake.
People don’t realize that this will give the police the blanket power to stop and ID anybody, it’s not just a matter of having a convenient little ID card it’s also a matter of drafting laws which make the possession of that card mandatory.
I wondered how Starmer was going to piss it up the wall this time.
Careful, Kier. If you cut it any closer then you might get elected and have to actually fucking do things.
My favourite thing is people just nodding along and espousing the great benefits of ID cards even though we’ve had an absolute shit show of a government ran by monkeys for the past 12 years.
We don’t know what the future holds when it comes to future governments.
I’d rather err on the side of caution and keep this hurdle in place to make that dystopian eventuality a little less likely.
The last time Labour did this, they wanted to scan everybodys irises and take everyone’s fingerprints.
ID cards of this ilk tend to suffer ‘function creep’ over the course of many different governments. Just like ANPR was initially only to catch terrorists.
What they say they are selling you isn’t what you end up buying. ID cards may seem innocuous, but when tech is added to them it becomes increasingly insiduous and centralises identity in a way that governments and corporations can more easily exploit and cut off those who don’t adhere fully to the current agenda.
Labour doing their best to squander that 36 point lead by advocating massively unpopular draconian policies with unclearly communicated benefits.
27 comments
Article Text.
Archived copy here. https://archive.ph/5jnme#selection-875.0-1033.143
A Labour government could introduce “basic” ID cards to help to count how many people there are in Britain and reduce illegal immigration.
The party is examining the idea of forcing everyone to apply for registration, while limiting the scale of data stored, to address the concerns about civil liberties that emerged during Tony Blair’s premiership two decades ago.
Stephen Kinnock, the shadow immigration minister, revealed that an identity scheme was being looked at “very, very carefully indeed”, arguing it would be “so helpful” in reassuring the public that “we have control of our borders”. In an interview with Times Radio to be broadcast today, he suggested that almost every EU member state had some kind of identity scheme and “it can’t be beyond the wit of man” to devise one for Britain too.
Protesters held a demonstration outside on Sunday after reports of overcrowding and poor conditions
Protesters held a demonstration outside on Sunday after reports of overcrowding and poor conditions
ALBERTO PEXXALI/AP
He claimed that it could deter people from entering Britain illegally, as he suggested that Labour would aim to reduce the number of people crossing the Channel in small boats to zero.
The proposals are likely to be welcomed by the French government, which has repeatedly blamed Britain’s informal labour market for attracting so many illegal migrants to cross the Channel from Calais to the Kent coast.
Gérald Darmanin, the French interior minister, has argued that the British government must emulate France’s strict ID checks that prevent illegal migrants getting a job, saying that finding work in the black market was far easier in Britain than in France.
Migration experts in France said the country’s job protection labour laws and a strict enforcement of ID cards for all employees made employing anyone, even unofficially or illicitly, much harder than in the UK.
Some migrants were loaded on coaches to be taken elsewhere
Some migrants were loaded on coaches to be taken elsewhere
HENRY NICHOLLS/REUTERS
In July a report by the Tony Blair Institute recommended introducing universal mandatory digital identity cards to help to alleviate the Channel migrant crisis, in which almost 40,000 migrants have reached the UK in small boats this year. Under the institute’s plans, all individuals would be required to produce their digital identity card, showing their legal right to reside, to access employment or benefits. The report said that this would make it harder for undocumented migrants to “disappear” into the informal economy.
However, any policy that involves introducing mandatory ID cards is likely to prove controversial. It comes exactly 20 years after New Labour caused concern by running a consultation on their introduction under David Blunkett, then the home secretary.
The plans became bogged down amid arguments over the cards being linked to state entitlements, with legislation opposed in the Commons and Lords before finally being passed in 2006. In 2009, however, Alan Johnson, the home secretary, announced they would not be compulsory for UK citizens, and they were scrapped by the Conservative-Liberal Democrat coalition in 2010.
Supporters of ID cards argue that two decades on, the data people readily share with social media sites and private companies has tilted the balance on privacy arguments. Others emphasise that the absence of a universal identity scheme makes Britain more attractive to illegal migrants than other European countries.
Kinnock said: “I think [ID cards] should certainly be on the table, it needs to be properly reviewed and discussed. I thought it was extraordinary in the wake of Brexit that everybody said, ‘Oh, there are three million EU citizens in the UK’, and it turned out there were five million.
“It is just simply extraordinary that we had two million more people in our country than we thought we did. That is just not sustainable.”
The plans, if introduced, would be a U-turn for Sir Keir Starmer, the Labour leader, who opposed coronavirus vaccine passports as “un-British”.
Really making an effort to make sure those of us ‘who would always vote Labour no matter what lol’… don’t.
People are so ridiculous about ID cards in this country. Probably because they don’t realise the benefits of them and how much easier they make life. No more two forms of identification and proof of address required etc for every little thing. Just one card for everything.
We hate immigration, carry around all kinds of cards and give away our data on a daily basis on our phones, but ask us to have an ID card and ooh no, couldn’t possibly do that governor.
They e been trying to introduce some kinda ID card since I was a bairn.
So is it going to be free ?
What kinda Information will it contain ?
What will it be used for ?
Fuck I’ve not carried ID for years I don’t need it. Hell for the last 2 years I hardly carry a wallet.
Poland have a fantastic ID card system with digital app where you can manage all your government shit. Its better than our crappy system.
This is such an obsession of Labour’s authoritarian right wing. I’m yet to hear a valid argument on why it would be so beneficial.
Smart move to make this about immigration. Get the right wing wanting them. I imagine this is a calculated attempt to safeguard future elections if the Tories try to make it a legal requirement to show ID to vote. A great way to prevent the young and the poor slipping through the net and being shut out.
Finland. Secure process to get one. Also holds health data on for health access. Finland in social benefits terms is a ‘Lefty’ ( crass label but using as shorthand) dream with high taxes and superb state nurseries and free HE and access to housing etc but it comes with responsibilities and the idea of trust that the system isn’t abused. So citizenship and ID. Not a ‘Lefty’ dream. No Finn would accept what we have- no idea as to status- they just prefer cool logic.
I have an already have an ID card that controls my migration to and from this country, My passport.
Something something insert “can i see your papers” in an offensive German accent.
This is like the test and trace app.
“ I don’t want my phone knowing where I am”
Meanwhile used McDonald’s app to order food
ID cards are no major issue but I expect it to be a huge one.
I had to show my driving license to get my order from Screwfix…..
They were trying to introduce ID cards to get into football matches when I was a kid!
The weird paranoia about ID cards in Britain. They’d rather have four or five bits of “Papieren Bitte” to hang onto rather than one. Turn up to a bank to open an account and they want to see a skein of little rags of paper.
Newsflash: you already have ID that the Peelers can identify you with. They can track your phone – not just in the calls, but the location using the cell towers you attach to. They can track your debit cards. They can see everything you post on FaceBook.
A card is so much easier. Actually in Northern Ireland (and yes, for the time being we are still part of the UK) we have had photographic drivers licenses for decades so I’ve always wondered what the worry is about. Then I saw the little paper rags which were British Driving licenses.
In China your digital ID is used to stop you from doing things the government don’t want you to do. If your social credit score is low you can’t travel, enter certain establishments, borrow money etc. The reason some people don’t want a system like that in the U.K. is because they don’t want that to happen here.
I already have a driver’s licence. Why do I need to pay for yet another ID?
I would love a government ID card that lets me log onto a system and allow me to check things and register issues like many other countries (Estonia, Poland, etc). I however don’t want a friend of an Mp to make millions making a crappy system that doesn’t do what was promised.
You don’t control crime by making innocent people prove their innocence. You control it by catching the guilty.
Digital ID is 1 step further to authoritarianism. Once it’s in, you’re foobared.
Exactly how will this control immigration? Do they just reject everybody without some kind of verifiable documentation to prove who they are?
Forget the benefits of having an ID in general for the existing population, I fail to see how this helps with exactly what the headline states
I literally wrote my masters thesis on the 42 pieces of data that the last biometric ID card project would have captured.
There is no good argument for them now and there wasn’t in 2009 either. Much like voter ID, they do not actually solve any problems.
lol, no.
It’s not that ID cards are inherently bad, it’s everything around them that is fucked ie – suddenly it’s illegal to walk around without one, you must present it when asked, etc.
Will they be free? Maybe required to vote down the line? Sent out automatically to every single person when expired?
I don’t trust any UK government to not severely missuse em down the line.
Labour seem almost determined to not get my vote.
All you have to do is just be there and not be the Tories. And every day they struggle at the latter. For fuck sake.
People don’t realize that this will give the police the blanket power to stop and ID anybody, it’s not just a matter of having a convenient little ID card it’s also a matter of drafting laws which make the possession of that card mandatory.
I wondered how Starmer was going to piss it up the wall this time.
Careful, Kier. If you cut it any closer then you might get elected and have to actually fucking do things.
My favourite thing is people just nodding along and espousing the great benefits of ID cards even though we’ve had an absolute shit show of a government ran by monkeys for the past 12 years.
We don’t know what the future holds when it comes to future governments.
I’d rather err on the side of caution and keep this hurdle in place to make that dystopian eventuality a little less likely.
The last time Labour did this, they wanted to scan everybodys irises and take everyone’s fingerprints.
ID cards of this ilk tend to suffer ‘function creep’ over the course of many different governments. Just like ANPR was initially only to catch terrorists.
What they say they are selling you isn’t what you end up buying. ID cards may seem innocuous, but when tech is added to them it becomes increasingly insiduous and centralises identity in a way that governments and corporations can more easily exploit and cut off those who don’t adhere fully to the current agenda.
Labour doing their best to squander that 36 point lead by advocating massively unpopular draconian policies with unclearly communicated benefits.