Translation by Deepl for the non-dutch speakers here:
>**N-VA president De Wever draws full Community card in 2024: ‘It’s confederalism or nothing’**
*The N-VA will only step into a federal government after the next elections in 2024 if it organises confederalism. Party president Bart De Wever said this on “De ochtend” on Radio 1. “I fear that otherwise prosperity in Flanders will have completely disappeared by 2029,” he said firmly. “It is confederalism or nothing.”*
Confederalism is the only option to protect Flanders’ prosperity, according to the N-VA. “People urgently need to realise how serious the situation is,” De Wever said in Michaël Van Droogenbroeck’s weekly Saturday interview on “De ochtend” on Radio 1. “The ship is sinking while we are on it. You cannot get this Titanic repaired at the federal level.”
For De Wever, getting that budget in order will require major interventions in social security: from pension reforms, to cuts in unemployment benefits, to savings in healthcare. “It’s time for bitter truths,” he says of this. “You will have to work longer for a pension and there needs to be major chastening in Social Security.”
At the federal level, according to the N-VA president, this can no longer be regulated. “Only spending can be voted on there,” it sounds. Therefore, for De Wever, the current federal Belgium must be reformed into a confederal state. This involves agreeing what will still happen at the national level, all other powers will go to the various federal states or sub-regions.
Although that is not necessarily a guarantee of better governance. For instance, there are several crises going on within some Flemish competences: from the lingering teacher shortage in education to the abuses in childcare. “You have to solve social problems, but you cannot systematically live beyond your means,” parries De Wever. “In the end, you undermine everything by doing so. We don’t do that in Flanders, but we do at the federal level.”
**Confederalism or nothing**
Especially the French-speaking socialists of the PS are thwarted at that federal level, says the N-VA president. “If you want to live like someone from Scandinavia, you’re going to have to work like one of them,” De Wever said. “If you want to work in French-speaking Belgium like a Southern Spaniard or a Southern Italian, you have to live like a Southern Italian. You have to accept that truth, but the PS does not want to reform.”
After the 2024 elections, De Wever therefore has no intention of entering a federal government, even if they become the largest Flemish party. “I only want to talk to the PS about one thing: confederalism,” he says firmly. He also rules out a new Swedish coalition – like the Michel I government with MR, CD&V, Open VLD and N-VA. “It is now confederalism or nothing.”
A possible complete blockade of the country is something De Wever is prepared for. “I fear that otherwise prosperity will be completely gone by 2029 (ed. the end of the next legislature),” he says. “We think our prosperity is consolidated in Flanders, but it can disappear very quickly. And then you have to draw a line in the sand. We are going to confront and then you take a risk. We are not 100 per cent sure what the outcome is going to be, but it is the only chance to save us.”
If he wants to share the authorities among the communities, nothing happens to the debt load they have.
You want to divide the ministry of economy? Ok, here’s 10 billion extra debt for the regions.
Ik vrees dat het niets gaat worden Bartje…
Confederalism doesn’t work. It never has and he knows it. This is just part of his plan to make Belgium even less functional and eventually rejoin the Netherlands.
Hell, it could be argued that Belgium is already using a mixed federal-confederal systems and the elements of it that don’t work are the confederal ones.
Bart de Zever op zijn best
Even if BDW’s solution would magically work and stop the increasing deficit, I really wonder how he proposes to deal with the huge debt of the federal level. Leave it like that? Ignore it? Take over 50 to 60% and say sayonara to the Walloons?
Miljaar wa ne triestige mens.
How about abolishing the 5 other governments and 5 other parlements instead?
Wanhoopspoging van Calimero…. Uit bevragingen blijkt dat niemand zit te wachten op dat confederalisme, het werkt gewoon niet, maar ach, nva is moedig als het neerkomt op zelfvernedering..
Of course, nothing can be done in the next government unless the current one opens up the constitution for change.
NVA signals they’ll go full dirty in the election campaign, promise a lot and refuse to actually take part in govt. Because that’s what “confederalism or nothing” really means.
Ah well, we get the politicians we deserve I guess.
Ah yes. Vivaldi II
Daar is hij weer met meer van hetzelfde. Zet die ploat af!
You know what give full power to the King. I think He would make more good decisions than the clowns at our government
Komaan Bartje zeg nu gewoon wat je eigenlijk wil zeggen, werken tot 70 en dan verwerkt worden tot bio massa of Soylent Green, want daar begint deze discussie toch stillaan naar te neigen.
Dan maar niets. I am sick of this dude
Dus geen regeringsdeelname?
So, under confederalism, you split everything, and then every part of the country can decide to spend more or less, go into deficit or have a surplus, and then every year all the different regional deficits and surpluses are added up and sent to the EU, who will then say whether Belgium is doing well or not doing well.
Why would Wallonia and Brussels not just decide to go even deeper into deficits, and just rely on Flanders to hurt their own population to book surpluses that allow the overall numbers to stay reasonable? They would be idiots to do anything else.
Just about any responsibility the flemish government has pulled towards itself has turned to shit. So eh… pass.
Little calimero is mad ^^
Niets dus
yawn same thing as last time right?
niks it is..
Waarom zit iemand, die weet dat de gezondheid van de bevolking in gevaar is en dit bewust jarenlang verzwijgt, niet in de gevangenis? (3M dossier, politici waren in 2017 al op de hoogte en beslisten om de bevolking NIET in te lichten). Schuldig verzuim bestaat toch in België? En Bartje is lang niet de enige die besliste dat hij zijn gat ging vegen aan uw gezondheid.
Lul
Wa nen triestigaard
belachelijke kloot
Energie, betaalbare huisvesting, geopolitieke instabiliteit. Voor het geval dat hij denkt dat er geen echte problemen zijn.
While not exactly the same, looking at the results of Brexit, what an absolute goddamn disaster.
The idea of “what we do on our own, we do better” is pure fantasy.
The reality of the situation is that companies and countries worldwide will look at you and think “Well, you don’t want to work with others, so you’re not trustworthy”.
Doing this will lessen our position at every negotiation table.
I’d rather have more nationalism and less double rules on top of existing rules and less double taxes.
Showing he lost his feeling with reality. Nobody is blaming, for once, the Walloons for the energy crisis.
Yeah maybe try to fix Antwerpen first and let’s talk again when it’s done ? advices on governance from the burgemeester of a war zone/drug cartel dugout. A bit too rich for my taste
Oh, I guess he’ll get nothing then.
Veel praatjes heeft die man. Verwezenlijkingen nul.
More regional power? Great, more ministerpostjes! /s
And the solutions is the deconstruction of our social security system, what a joke. I’m not saying things can’t be improved there, but reorganising (not deconstructing) social security is only like 20% of the solution. The real issues lie in other fields.
Constructive proposal: back to one federal gouvernement. Every cultural related matter gets a federal minister accompanied with a state secretary for each language (Dutch, French and German). E.g. for education, culture…
One parliament, cultural related matters to be discussed by the elected members per language group. Political parties have to present and their candidates themselves nationally, and not only in their own region or province. Cut the subsidiaries for political parties at least in half. Party presidents play only a role in coalition negotiations and should remain loyal to agreements made. They should not have any political mandate beside. Any politician should only have one mandate. And get rid of all “intercommunales” and other parastatal constructions that only lead to nepotism.
Strange to read only negative comments, but then again this is B1. I actually agree with it, the Walloon government has been going in the red forever and don’t seem to care or want to change anything, despite multiple EU warnings, just have confederalisme and let them dip their own beans. This will probably be downvoted but I wanted to give another perspective that I did not read in this thread.
Dan niets.
Tot ziens.
Onzin. Die lul wil al 20 jaar Vlaamse onafhankelijkheid maar enkel als er verkiezingen aankomen. Die kankerpartij heeft immers geen recht meer te bestaan als confederalisme gerealiseerd wordt. Ze blijven liever aan de vetpotten zitten.
En wat dan als het of niets wordt? Stopt de NVA ermee? Nee dan verzinnen ze iets anders
I’m a Belgian, lived abroad for 10 years. Explaining Belgium is a joke. Your taxes pay for a FIT (Flanders), AWEX(Wallonia), and Brussels Trade representation in most countries in the world. They don’t work together properly and each have their own office. Just think about the cost. The same goes inside Belgium. How much money goes to service programs and governments that are doubled up because of these shenanigans?
42 comments
Translation by Deepl for the non-dutch speakers here:
>**N-VA president De Wever draws full Community card in 2024: ‘It’s confederalism or nothing’**
*The N-VA will only step into a federal government after the next elections in 2024 if it organises confederalism. Party president Bart De Wever said this on “De ochtend” on Radio 1. “I fear that otherwise prosperity in Flanders will have completely disappeared by 2029,” he said firmly. “It is confederalism or nothing.”*
Confederalism is the only option to protect Flanders’ prosperity, according to the N-VA. “People urgently need to realise how serious the situation is,” De Wever said in Michaël Van Droogenbroeck’s weekly Saturday interview on “De ochtend” on Radio 1. “The ship is sinking while we are on it. You cannot get this Titanic repaired at the federal level.”
For De Wever, getting that budget in order will require major interventions in social security: from pension reforms, to cuts in unemployment benefits, to savings in healthcare. “It’s time for bitter truths,” he says of this. “You will have to work longer for a pension and there needs to be major chastening in Social Security.”
At the federal level, according to the N-VA president, this can no longer be regulated. “Only spending can be voted on there,” it sounds. Therefore, for De Wever, the current federal Belgium must be reformed into a confederal state. This involves agreeing what will still happen at the national level, all other powers will go to the various federal states or sub-regions.
Although that is not necessarily a guarantee of better governance. For instance, there are several crises going on within some Flemish competences: from the lingering teacher shortage in education to the abuses in childcare. “You have to solve social problems, but you cannot systematically live beyond your means,” parries De Wever. “In the end, you undermine everything by doing so. We don’t do that in Flanders, but we do at the federal level.”
**Confederalism or nothing**
Especially the French-speaking socialists of the PS are thwarted at that federal level, says the N-VA president. “If you want to live like someone from Scandinavia, you’re going to have to work like one of them,” De Wever said. “If you want to work in French-speaking Belgium like a Southern Spaniard or a Southern Italian, you have to live like a Southern Italian. You have to accept that truth, but the PS does not want to reform.”
After the 2024 elections, De Wever therefore has no intention of entering a federal government, even if they become the largest Flemish party. “I only want to talk to the PS about one thing: confederalism,” he says firmly. He also rules out a new Swedish coalition – like the Michel I government with MR, CD&V, Open VLD and N-VA. “It is now confederalism or nothing.”
A possible complete blockade of the country is something De Wever is prepared for. “I fear that otherwise prosperity will be completely gone by 2029 (ed. the end of the next legislature),” he says. “We think our prosperity is consolidated in Flanders, but it can disappear very quickly. And then you have to draw a line in the sand. We are going to confront and then you take a risk. We are not 100 per cent sure what the outcome is going to be, but it is the only chance to save us.”
If he wants to share the authorities among the communities, nothing happens to the debt load they have.
You want to divide the ministry of economy? Ok, here’s 10 billion extra debt for the regions.
Ik vrees dat het niets gaat worden Bartje…
Confederalism doesn’t work. It never has and he knows it. This is just part of his plan to make Belgium even less functional and eventually rejoin the Netherlands.
Hell, it could be argued that Belgium is already using a mixed federal-confederal systems and the elements of it that don’t work are the confederal ones.
Bart de Zever op zijn best
Even if BDW’s solution would magically work and stop the increasing deficit, I really wonder how he proposes to deal with the huge debt of the federal level. Leave it like that? Ignore it? Take over 50 to 60% and say sayonara to the Walloons?
Miljaar wa ne triestige mens.
How about abolishing the 5 other governments and 5 other parlements instead?
Wanhoopspoging van Calimero…. Uit bevragingen blijkt dat niemand zit te wachten op dat confederalisme, het werkt gewoon niet, maar ach, nva is moedig als het neerkomt op zelfvernedering..
Of course, nothing can be done in the next government unless the current one opens up the constitution for change.
NVA signals they’ll go full dirty in the election campaign, promise a lot and refuse to actually take part in govt. Because that’s what “confederalism or nothing” really means.
Ah well, we get the politicians we deserve I guess.
Ah yes. Vivaldi II
Daar is hij weer met meer van hetzelfde. Zet die ploat af!
You know what give full power to the King. I think He would make more good decisions than the clowns at our government
Komaan Bartje zeg nu gewoon wat je eigenlijk wil zeggen, werken tot 70 en dan verwerkt worden tot bio massa of Soylent Green, want daar begint deze discussie toch stillaan naar te neigen.
Dan maar niets. I am sick of this dude
Dus geen regeringsdeelname?
So, under confederalism, you split everything, and then every part of the country can decide to spend more or less, go into deficit or have a surplus, and then every year all the different regional deficits and surpluses are added up and sent to the EU, who will then say whether Belgium is doing well or not doing well.
Why would Wallonia and Brussels not just decide to go even deeper into deficits, and just rely on Flanders to hurt their own population to book surpluses that allow the overall numbers to stay reasonable? They would be idiots to do anything else.
Just about any responsibility the flemish government has pulled towards itself has turned to shit. So eh… pass.
Little calimero is mad ^^
Niets dus
yawn same thing as last time right?
niks it is..
Waarom zit iemand, die weet dat de gezondheid van de bevolking in gevaar is en dit bewust jarenlang verzwijgt, niet in de gevangenis? (3M dossier, politici waren in 2017 al op de hoogte en beslisten om de bevolking NIET in te lichten). Schuldig verzuim bestaat toch in België? En Bartje is lang niet de enige die besliste dat hij zijn gat ging vegen aan uw gezondheid.
Lul
Wa nen triestigaard
belachelijke kloot
Energie, betaalbare huisvesting, geopolitieke instabiliteit. Voor het geval dat hij denkt dat er geen echte problemen zijn.
While not exactly the same, looking at the results of Brexit, what an absolute goddamn disaster.
The idea of “what we do on our own, we do better” is pure fantasy.
The reality of the situation is that companies and countries worldwide will look at you and think “Well, you don’t want to work with others, so you’re not trustworthy”.
Doing this will lessen our position at every negotiation table.
I’d rather have more nationalism and less double rules on top of existing rules and less double taxes.
Showing he lost his feeling with reality. Nobody is blaming, for once, the Walloons for the energy crisis.
Yeah maybe try to fix Antwerpen first and let’s talk again when it’s done ? advices on governance from the burgemeester of a war zone/drug cartel dugout. A bit too rich for my taste
Oh, I guess he’ll get nothing then.
Veel praatjes heeft die man. Verwezenlijkingen nul.
More regional power? Great, more ministerpostjes! /s
And the solutions is the deconstruction of our social security system, what a joke. I’m not saying things can’t be improved there, but reorganising (not deconstructing) social security is only like 20% of the solution. The real issues lie in other fields.
Constructive proposal: back to one federal gouvernement. Every cultural related matter gets a federal minister accompanied with a state secretary for each language (Dutch, French and German). E.g. for education, culture…
One parliament, cultural related matters to be discussed by the elected members per language group. Political parties have to present and their candidates themselves nationally, and not only in their own region or province. Cut the subsidiaries for political parties at least in half. Party presidents play only a role in coalition negotiations and should remain loyal to agreements made. They should not have any political mandate beside. Any politician should only have one mandate. And get rid of all “intercommunales” and other parastatal constructions that only lead to nepotism.
Strange to read only negative comments, but then again this is B1. I actually agree with it, the Walloon government has been going in the red forever and don’t seem to care or want to change anything, despite multiple EU warnings, just have confederalisme and let them dip their own beans. This will probably be downvoted but I wanted to give another perspective that I did not read in this thread.
Dan niets.
Tot ziens.
Onzin. Die lul wil al 20 jaar Vlaamse onafhankelijkheid maar enkel als er verkiezingen aankomen. Die kankerpartij heeft immers geen recht meer te bestaan als confederalisme gerealiseerd wordt. Ze blijven liever aan de vetpotten zitten.
En wat dan als het of niets wordt? Stopt de NVA ermee? Nee dan verzinnen ze iets anders
I’m a Belgian, lived abroad for 10 years. Explaining Belgium is a joke. Your taxes pay for a FIT (Flanders), AWEX(Wallonia), and Brussels Trade representation in most countries in the world. They don’t work together properly and each have their own office. Just think about the cost. The same goes inside Belgium. How much money goes to service programs and governments that are doubled up because of these shenanigans?