Sitting a test aimed at primary school children should be as easy as ABC for those slightly longer in the tooth.
Unfortunately, a group of politicians came unstuck in both English and maths when they went back to school. Thirteen MPs and peers visited a school in south London to sit the Sats tests taken by 11-year-olds in Year 6.
While individual results were not revealed, only 44 per cent of the politicians reached the expected level for a primary school child in maths. Fifty per cent were at the expected level in spelling, punctuation and grammar. This compares with 71 per cent of pupils being at the expected standard in maths this summer and 72 per cent in spelling, punctuation and grammar.
Robin Walker, the former schools minister who now chairs the education committee, and Emma Hardy, a former shadow minister for education who is on the Treasury committee, were among the MPs that took the tests.
They were joined by the Conservatives Flick Drummond, Caroline Ansell and Gagan Mohindra, and the Labour MPs Emma Lewell-Buck, Ian Byrne and Margaret Greenwood. The House of Lords was represented by the Labour peers Lord Watson of Invergowrie, Lord Hunt of Kings Heath and Baroness Blower, as well as the Green peer Baroness Bennett of Manor Castle and Lord Weir Ballyholme from the DUP.
All marked their own papers and sat them on the understanding that their individual scores would not be published.
Children invigilated parents who took part at Chad Vale primary school in Birmingham
Children invigilated parents who took part at Chad Vale primary school in Birmingham
PINPEP
Year 6 children from Surrey Square primary school in Southwark invigilated the tests, under the same conditions they will face in May: no talking, collusion or calculators.
Walker told The Times he achieved nine out of ten the spelling, punctuation and grammar test and seven out of ten on the maths paper, which he did not finish.
He said: “It was interesting to see how these things have changed. I found them stretching but doable. I’m not sure it made the case for their abolition but certainly the maths paper was challenging.”
Walker agreed with More Than a Score, the group that campaigns for changes to school assessment and organised the event, that schools should go “way beyond” the three Rs and not focus only on what was tested.
“Sometimes there’s an assumption that if all the testing is in English and maths, that means other subjects don’t matter. That’s not the case, particularly as subjects like arts, languages, science and the humanities can drive pupils to engage.”
He stressed that the tests were a measure of the school not the pupil and that no child should feel like a failure if they had not reached the expected level for their age.
Children’s results are used to judge how well primary schools are performing in government tables. The tests are renowned for asking pupils to identify fronted adverbials, subordinate clauses, relative pronouns — and to show their understanding of factors, fractions and co-ordinates.
Alison Ali, from More Than a Score, said MPs would see “how absurd some of the questions faced by children are, how these absurdities influence and narrow the whole curriculum, and how they are only used to judge schools, not to help children’s learning”.
She said: “We want them to question: is this the right way to measure what children can really do? Is it the fairest, most accurate way to judge school performance?”
Hardy said before sitting the test that she supported change. She said: “I feel it is important to do the Sats paper this year to put myself in the situation of a Year 6 pupil to experience the pressure they are under.
“It’s definitely time to review the way primary school children are assessed and primary schools are measured. Testing children under exam conditions in a narrow range of subjects doesn’t always support children’s learning, can often harm their well-being and isn’t the best way to give a full picture of how well a school is performing.”
Take the test
Underline the subordinate clause:
When the crowd heard the clattering sound, the gasped in astonishment.
Identify four nouns in this sentence:
The strength of the wind made the trees in the forest sway and bend.
Identify the relative pronoun in the sentence below.
The children who were going swimming had their lunch earlier than we did.
Find two synonyms in the following sentences: The school will supply all meals during the trip. If parents wish to provide children with additional drinks, they may do so.
Nathan had hoped for a part in the school play. Are the words in bold an example of simple past, past progressive or past perfect?
Divide 672 by 21, show your workings.
Jack says: When you square a prime number, the answer has only two factors.
Explain why Jack is not correct.
>Identify the relative pronoun in the sentence below.
Surprised the Times are encouraging recognising pronouns.
Easy soundbyte.
All it shows is how kids are taught to pass exams and that many people dont end up needint the skills later on.
Exams arent equal to learning
A better idea: test all Brexiteers on the citizenship exam.
> Underline the subordinate clause:
> When the crowd heard the clattering sound, the gasped in astonishment.
Isn’t there something missing there?
all the nouns, pronouns bits I’m less concerned about, as that does seem a little tangential to everyday life – everyone should be passing the maths component though, at that level you should be able to deduce the answers through simple logic :/
*edit:* I think it should be taught of course, but a little less fussed if it’s not remembered
*edit2:* can’t respond any longer as u/heikold blocked me, but read below for a case study in the dunning-kruger effect… *yeesh* (for the record I studied the use and evolution of languages as a core part of my degree, I suspect they did not…)
> While individual results were not revealed, only 44 per cent of the politicians reached the expected level for a primary school child in maths. Fifty per cent were at the expected level in spelling, punctuation and grammar. This compares with 71 per cent of pupils being at the expected standard in maths this summer and 72 per cent in spelling, punctuation and grammar.
There’s a rather nasty narrative around the idea that children are getting stupider, exams are getting easier, everything was better in the old days, etc.
I think this sometimes comes from older people not understanding the way in which education has developed and evolved over the years. They ask their grandchildren to name the year in which a famous battle took place and scoff at the fact that they’re spending longer learning *why* we went to war than learning the years and names of battles!
If educated adults can’t pass these exams without preparation, that tells you that they’re pretty difficult and that the teachers must be doing something right to get the kids into a position where they *can* pass them!
In fairness, if I (or you) did your sats right at this instant, I’d imagine we’d mostly fail.
We aren’t using the terminology or methods in our day to day lives. Or rather, we are but fuck if I remember what they are tbh. 🤷♂️
Yes I can.
I’d be devastated if my intelligence fell within the bottom 50% of MPs’.
Imagine only being as bright as ‘30p Lee’ Anderson, Nadine Dorries or Workington caveman Mark Jenkinson.
I don’t know what the fuck a subordinate clause is, and I got a really low score on my year 6 SATs because of my atrocious handwriting. I don’t remember there being any mention of a subordinate clause in my English gcse exams.
As for maths, there’s absolutely no way I would pass that. None. I highly doubt the average person would fair much better than these MPs on these tests.
I’m all for making MPs look stupid if it’s warranted, but this just highlights how outdated SATs are! I remember being very stressed about the year 6 ones, really anxious (didn’t know what anxiety was back then like), and then being soo disappointed because my score was much lower than expected.
It’s all well and good telling children not to worry if they don’t do well, but schools did (and probably still do) make such a big deal out of them that it’s impossible for children to be unaffected. I cried myself to sleep when I got my scores. Fast forward to year 9 SATs, I got the highest mark in English, because my handwriting had naturally improved.
Surprised as many as half passed to be honest, if you aren’t well-versed in the specific language they use in the exams or know exactly what they want then you may well not get the answer right. Anyone with kids doing SATs will know this I am sure. The maths tends to be OK though.
It’s paywalled so I wasn’t able to access the test because of money. Seems familiar..
Some of it is due to not using the knowledge or skills frequently. I got a B in my GCSE maths exam, but I couldn’t pass one today. I have forgotten the knowledge through a lack of practice.
> Underline the subordinate clause:
> When the crowd heard the clattering sound, the gasped in astonishment.
Can I underline the grammar mistake instead?
The ‘what’ gasped in astonishment?
I suppose it goes to show how education has advanced over the years, but some of these questions look like they were written by the worst kind of officious civil servant, intent on removing the joy of language from education and instead focusing on having everyone meet ‘the standard’. It’s less about educating and instilling a joy for learning in students as meeting standards set by the government and hard mathematical targets.
I’m in my mid 30s now and my maths has tanked like you wouldn’t believe. I used to be alright at mental arithmetic at school. Not great, but to a B standard at GCSE.
Having spent the last 15 years literally with a calculator in my pocket I’ve found I can do even basic sums in my head anymore
In English, my spelling has noticeably tanked due to the availability of autocorrect and spell checker.
I don’t know if it’s progress or regression. On the one hand I’m losing skills I used to have, on the other I almost don’t need them anymore due to technology.
I have no idea why those politicians failed that test. The questions are so simple, don’t they even know basic maths and grammar?
I take it Ofsted aren’t required for Private schools…just money
NATHAN HAD HOPED FOR A PART IN THE SCHOOL PLAY. ARE THE WORDS IN BOLD AN EXAMPLE OF SIMPLE PAST, PAST PROGRESSIVE OR PAST PERFECT?
IDENTIFY THE RELATIVE PRONOUN IN THE SENTENCE BELOW.
I’m not really mad that 40+ year olds don’t remember stuff they learnt about in a school decades ago. We use past perfect and relative pronouns every day, but do most people *know* they’re using it? I don’t think so.
They should be getting the maths ones right though, bar the prime numbers question
> Take the test
> UNDERLINE THE SUBORDINATE CLAUSE:
> WHEN THE CROWD HEARD THE CLATTERING SOUND, THE GASPED IN ASTONISHMENT.
“they” not “the”.
Did I win?
I guess all the shit they failed will be branded as woke lefty nonsense and removed from the curriculum
I doubt many people over a certain age could because, “if you don’t use it you lose it” is a genuine thing. chuckle at the .M.P.s all you like but don;t kid yourself you could do any better.
Well it’s behind a Paywall so I guess I’ll never know
All my British acquaintances who tried the Life in the UK test failed. But this is at some next freaking level.
Judging by the revelations regarding bullying of civil servants, maybe giving MPs and ministers the psychopath test would be a good idea. You can’t tell me that Tory MPs are all sane?
None of that is hard. Took me a sec to realise what the last one was asking, ie why was incorrect, but otherwise, this is incredibly basic stuff, how the fuck are people getting this wrong?
For an MP to get any of this wrong is shocking, their job is literally to scrutinise legislation. If they cant understand it, how can they do it?
How much revision time did they get?
Surely they remember how to do a good cram session?
>Identify four nouns in this sentence:
The strength of the wind made the trees in the forest sway and bend.
Wind, tree, forest. I would have sworn down that there were only three nouns in that sentence and ‘strength’ is not a noun. Never knew that nouns are also used to describe attributes of things, and it feels like that sort of “well, *technically*” type things rather than a reflection of how English is usually percieved. But hey, maybe I’m wrong about that.
>Find two synonyms in the following sentences: The school will supply all meals during the trip. If parents wish to provide children with additional drinks, they may do so.
I think this is a bad question and counterproductive to actually understanding English with nuance. ‘Supply’ and ‘provide’ are very similar words and technically you can call them synonyms, but I would argue they carry different implications, and the subtletly on how the two words are used is deliberately lost in this question. ‘Supply’ and ‘provide’ are both used appropriately in the context of the question – ‘provide’ implies doing something voluntarily, whereas ‘supply’ implies being a result of an implicit or explicit agreement. If you swapped them around, the sentence would be more awkward because of the subtle implications of these two words. It took me a good while to spot the synonyms because of this.
These questions, along with the teaching of phrases like ‘subordinate clause’ and ‘relative advert’ which are completely and utterly useless if you’re not a linguist, to me are a sad indictment of the state of the English curriculum. All the focus on rigorous box ticking and how to facilitate league table competitiveness and nothing on actually providing a valuable education.
Well today’s 11yr olds have to remember 3 PM’s this year
>Underline the subordinate clause:
>When the crowd heard the clattering sound, the gasped in astonishment
30 comments
https://archive.ph/dEeXD#selection-887.0-1027.338
Sitting a test aimed at primary school children should be as easy as ABC for those slightly longer in the tooth.
Unfortunately, a group of politicians came unstuck in both English and maths when they went back to school. Thirteen MPs and peers visited a school in south London to sit the Sats tests taken by 11-year-olds in Year 6.
While individual results were not revealed, only 44 per cent of the politicians reached the expected level for a primary school child in maths. Fifty per cent were at the expected level in spelling, punctuation and grammar. This compares with 71 per cent of pupils being at the expected standard in maths this summer and 72 per cent in spelling, punctuation and grammar.
Robin Walker, the former schools minister who now chairs the education committee, and Emma Hardy, a former shadow minister for education who is on the Treasury committee, were among the MPs that took the tests.
They were joined by the Conservatives Flick Drummond, Caroline Ansell and Gagan Mohindra, and the Labour MPs Emma Lewell-Buck, Ian Byrne and Margaret Greenwood. The House of Lords was represented by the Labour peers Lord Watson of Invergowrie, Lord Hunt of Kings Heath and Baroness Blower, as well as the Green peer Baroness Bennett of Manor Castle and Lord Weir Ballyholme from the DUP.
All marked their own papers and sat them on the understanding that their individual scores would not be published.
Children invigilated parents who took part at Chad Vale primary school in Birmingham
Children invigilated parents who took part at Chad Vale primary school in Birmingham
PINPEP
Year 6 children from Surrey Square primary school in Southwark invigilated the tests, under the same conditions they will face in May: no talking, collusion or calculators.
Walker told The Times he achieved nine out of ten the spelling, punctuation and grammar test and seven out of ten on the maths paper, which he did not finish.
He said: “It was interesting to see how these things have changed. I found them stretching but doable. I’m not sure it made the case for their abolition but certainly the maths paper was challenging.”
Walker agreed with More Than a Score, the group that campaigns for changes to school assessment and organised the event, that schools should go “way beyond” the three Rs and not focus only on what was tested.
“Sometimes there’s an assumption that if all the testing is in English and maths, that means other subjects don’t matter. That’s not the case, particularly as subjects like arts, languages, science and the humanities can drive pupils to engage.”
He stressed that the tests were a measure of the school not the pupil and that no child should feel like a failure if they had not reached the expected level for their age.
Children’s results are used to judge how well primary schools are performing in government tables. The tests are renowned for asking pupils to identify fronted adverbials, subordinate clauses, relative pronouns — and to show their understanding of factors, fractions and co-ordinates.
Alison Ali, from More Than a Score, said MPs would see “how absurd some of the questions faced by children are, how these absurdities influence and narrow the whole curriculum, and how they are only used to judge schools, not to help children’s learning”.
She said: “We want them to question: is this the right way to measure what children can really do? Is it the fairest, most accurate way to judge school performance?”
Hardy said before sitting the test that she supported change. She said: “I feel it is important to do the Sats paper this year to put myself in the situation of a Year 6 pupil to experience the pressure they are under.
“It’s definitely time to review the way primary school children are assessed and primary schools are measured. Testing children under exam conditions in a narrow range of subjects doesn’t always support children’s learning, can often harm their well-being and isn’t the best way to give a full picture of how well a school is performing.”
Take the test
Underline the subordinate clause:
When the crowd heard the clattering sound, the gasped in astonishment.
Identify four nouns in this sentence:
The strength of the wind made the trees in the forest sway and bend.
Identify the relative pronoun in the sentence below.
The children who were going swimming had their lunch earlier than we did.
Find two synonyms in the following sentences: The school will supply all meals during the trip. If parents wish to provide children with additional drinks, they may do so.
Nathan had hoped for a part in the school play. Are the words in bold an example of simple past, past progressive or past perfect?
Divide 672 by 21, show your workings.
Jack says: When you square a prime number, the answer has only two factors.
Explain why Jack is not correct.
>Identify the relative pronoun in the sentence below.
Surprised the Times are encouraging recognising pronouns.
Easy soundbyte.
All it shows is how kids are taught to pass exams and that many people dont end up needint the skills later on.
Exams arent equal to learning
A better idea: test all Brexiteers on the citizenship exam.
> Underline the subordinate clause:
> When the crowd heard the clattering sound, the gasped in astonishment.
Isn’t there something missing there?
all the nouns, pronouns bits I’m less concerned about, as that does seem a little tangential to everyday life – everyone should be passing the maths component though, at that level you should be able to deduce the answers through simple logic :/
*edit:* I think it should be taught of course, but a little less fussed if it’s not remembered
*edit2:* can’t respond any longer as u/heikold blocked me, but read below for a case study in the dunning-kruger effect… *yeesh* (for the record I studied the use and evolution of languages as a core part of my degree, I suspect they did not…)
> While individual results were not revealed, only 44 per cent of the politicians reached the expected level for a primary school child in maths. Fifty per cent were at the expected level in spelling, punctuation and grammar. This compares with 71 per cent of pupils being at the expected standard in maths this summer and 72 per cent in spelling, punctuation and grammar.
There’s a rather nasty narrative around the idea that children are getting stupider, exams are getting easier, everything was better in the old days, etc.
I think this sometimes comes from older people not understanding the way in which education has developed and evolved over the years. They ask their grandchildren to name the year in which a famous battle took place and scoff at the fact that they’re spending longer learning *why* we went to war than learning the years and names of battles!
If educated adults can’t pass these exams without preparation, that tells you that they’re pretty difficult and that the teachers must be doing something right to get the kids into a position where they *can* pass them!
In fairness, if I (or you) did your sats right at this instant, I’d imagine we’d mostly fail.
We aren’t using the terminology or methods in our day to day lives. Or rather, we are but fuck if I remember what they are tbh. 🤷♂️
Yes I can.
I’d be devastated if my intelligence fell within the bottom 50% of MPs’.
Imagine only being as bright as ‘30p Lee’ Anderson, Nadine Dorries or Workington caveman Mark Jenkinson.
I don’t know what the fuck a subordinate clause is, and I got a really low score on my year 6 SATs because of my atrocious handwriting. I don’t remember there being any mention of a subordinate clause in my English gcse exams.
As for maths, there’s absolutely no way I would pass that. None. I highly doubt the average person would fair much better than these MPs on these tests.
I’m all for making MPs look stupid if it’s warranted, but this just highlights how outdated SATs are! I remember being very stressed about the year 6 ones, really anxious (didn’t know what anxiety was back then like), and then being soo disappointed because my score was much lower than expected.
It’s all well and good telling children not to worry if they don’t do well, but schools did (and probably still do) make such a big deal out of them that it’s impossible for children to be unaffected. I cried myself to sleep when I got my scores. Fast forward to year 9 SATs, I got the highest mark in English, because my handwriting had naturally improved.
Surprised as many as half passed to be honest, if you aren’t well-versed in the specific language they use in the exams or know exactly what they want then you may well not get the answer right. Anyone with kids doing SATs will know this I am sure. The maths tends to be OK though.
It’s paywalled so I wasn’t able to access the test because of money. Seems familiar..
Some of it is due to not using the knowledge or skills frequently. I got a B in my GCSE maths exam, but I couldn’t pass one today. I have forgotten the knowledge through a lack of practice.
> Underline the subordinate clause:
> When the crowd heard the clattering sound, the gasped in astonishment.
Can I underline the grammar mistake instead?
The ‘what’ gasped in astonishment?
I suppose it goes to show how education has advanced over the years, but some of these questions look like they were written by the worst kind of officious civil servant, intent on removing the joy of language from education and instead focusing on having everyone meet ‘the standard’. It’s less about educating and instilling a joy for learning in students as meeting standards set by the government and hard mathematical targets.
[Stephen Fry said it best](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J7E-aoXLZGY)
I’m in my mid 30s now and my maths has tanked like you wouldn’t believe. I used to be alright at mental arithmetic at school. Not great, but to a B standard at GCSE.
Having spent the last 15 years literally with a calculator in my pocket I’ve found I can do even basic sums in my head anymore
In English, my spelling has noticeably tanked due to the availability of autocorrect and spell checker.
I don’t know if it’s progress or regression. On the one hand I’m losing skills I used to have, on the other I almost don’t need them anymore due to technology.
I have no idea why those politicians failed that test. The questions are so simple, don’t they even know basic maths and grammar?
I take it Ofsted aren’t required for Private schools…just money
NATHAN HAD HOPED FOR A PART IN THE SCHOOL PLAY. ARE THE WORDS IN BOLD AN EXAMPLE OF SIMPLE PAST, PAST PROGRESSIVE OR PAST PERFECT?
IDENTIFY THE RELATIVE PRONOUN IN THE SENTENCE BELOW.
I’m not really mad that 40+ year olds don’t remember stuff they learnt about in a school decades ago. We use past perfect and relative pronouns every day, but do most people *know* they’re using it? I don’t think so.
They should be getting the maths ones right though, bar the prime numbers question
> Take the test
> UNDERLINE THE SUBORDINATE CLAUSE:
> WHEN THE CROWD HEARD THE CLATTERING SOUND, THE GASPED IN ASTONISHMENT.
“they” not “the”.
Did I win?
I guess all the shit they failed will be branded as woke lefty nonsense and removed from the curriculum
I doubt many people over a certain age could because, “if you don’t use it you lose it” is a genuine thing. chuckle at the .M.P.s all you like but don;t kid yourself you could do any better.
Well it’s behind a Paywall so I guess I’ll never know
All my British acquaintances who tried the Life in the UK test failed. But this is at some next freaking level.
Judging by the revelations regarding bullying of civil servants, maybe giving MPs and ministers the psychopath test would be a good idea. You can’t tell me that Tory MPs are all sane?
None of that is hard. Took me a sec to realise what the last one was asking, ie why was incorrect, but otherwise, this is incredibly basic stuff, how the fuck are people getting this wrong?
For an MP to get any of this wrong is shocking, their job is literally to scrutinise legislation. If they cant understand it, how can they do it?
How much revision time did they get?
Surely they remember how to do a good cram session?
>Identify four nouns in this sentence:
The strength of the wind made the trees in the forest sway and bend.
Wind, tree, forest. I would have sworn down that there were only three nouns in that sentence and ‘strength’ is not a noun. Never knew that nouns are also used to describe attributes of things, and it feels like that sort of “well, *technically*” type things rather than a reflection of how English is usually percieved. But hey, maybe I’m wrong about that.
>Find two synonyms in the following sentences: The school will supply all meals during the trip. If parents wish to provide children with additional drinks, they may do so.
I think this is a bad question and counterproductive to actually understanding English with nuance. ‘Supply’ and ‘provide’ are very similar words and technically you can call them synonyms, but I would argue they carry different implications, and the subtletly on how the two words are used is deliberately lost in this question. ‘Supply’ and ‘provide’ are both used appropriately in the context of the question – ‘provide’ implies doing something voluntarily, whereas ‘supply’ implies being a result of an implicit or explicit agreement. If you swapped them around, the sentence would be more awkward because of the subtle implications of these two words. It took me a good while to spot the synonyms because of this.
These questions, along with the teaching of phrases like ‘subordinate clause’ and ‘relative advert’ which are completely and utterly useless if you’re not a linguist, to me are a sad indictment of the state of the English curriculum. All the focus on rigorous box ticking and how to facilitate league table competitiveness and nothing on actually providing a valuable education.
Well today’s 11yr olds have to remember 3 PM’s this year
>Underline the subordinate clause:
>When the crowd heard the clattering sound, the gasped in astonishment
The what?