Your evidence is very nice but have you considered my anecdotes and Catholic morality
Thankfully, all the new schools built in the last while have been coed. The dept already knows this is true, even if it’s not official policy.
what about a study on their social life and mental health?
Nope, but it does mean our 19 year olds have the social development of 16 year olds elsewhere…
Went to a boys school, it didn’t do me any favors
The analysis showed significant raw gaps in reading, science and maths performance, with pupils in single-sex schools performing better than those in mixed-schools.
However, once the researchers applied a range of individual and school level factors such as the socioeconomic background of the student, the school student-staff ratio, the quality of teaching material available to the school and whether or not the school is disadvantaged, these gaps did not present as statistically significant.
In other words, the fact that children in single-sex schools tend to come from households with higher socioeconomic backgrounds who tend to perform better in school in any case helps explain the gaps we see in performance between the different school types.”
​
Doesn’t seem like a great study in my option.
I can never really summon any concern about this issue. There’s not a huge amount of them, but clearly some parents want them as an option. Different options for people is a good thing.
So it turns out the key to the academic advantage is rich parents. Who would have thought it?
Please please please can we abolish these already (as in make them actually illegal and force every single sex school to become coed). The toffiest of toff schools in England have become mixed in recent years so let’s not pretend that this shift cannot happen.
The only evidence based argument in their favour is a possible academic benefit for girls (although offset by a corresponding decline in academic performance for boys). And maybe there are some operational benefits, such as making it easier to neatly divide a population between two schools.
But let’s be real, gendered schools are a fucking weird idea in the 21st century. They basically don’t exist at all in any European country outside the UK and Ireland. We are an extreme outlier in this area.
We have eliminated gender segregation in virtually every other aspect of our society. Even kids sports are often mixed. So if we are gonna hang onto gendered schools, there should be a very very compelling and evidence based reason to do so. Clearly that doesn’t exist.
But we could talk for days about possible issues with single sex schools
– they reinforce gender stereotypes through subject and co-curricular offerings
– they can produce socially broken kids who don’t know how to interact with the opposite gender
– they generally do a piss poor job at teaching kids about puberty and sex issues that affect the opposite gender
– they can be absolute hell for gay and especially trans kids
And no, this isn’t about parental choice. Teaching kids from the age of 5 that gender segregation is normal is fucking weird and that should not be a choice available to parents.
Shocker
Single sex is best
Brand new mutlimillion boys primary school built in Maynooth, while the girls school remains a bunch of old sheds. Absolutely infuriating, how is it not discrimination, I don’t understand
Now they should do one about social disadvantages when engaging with the opposite sex.
When I was in school it was always said that co-ed schools performed better because there was a shame in looking thick in front of the girls or guys. I know for sure my social skills with women suffered big time because I didn’t regularly talk to them until the first year of college. I will not make that mistake with my own children.
I never realised how my schools were single sex. It’s a bit mad. I went to mixed school for primary and secondary
> there is no difference in maths, science or reading performance for 15-year-olds
> analysis showed significant … gaps in reading, science and maths performance … with … single-sex schools performing better…
> However, once researchers [controlled for] …socioeconomic background … student-staff ratio … whether the school is disadvantaged… these gaps [no longer] present as statistically significant.
So importantly:
* Single sex schools in Ireland *do* have better educational outcomes, because they’re better funded and attended by wealthier kids.
* they saw no statistically significant difference in kids **up to 15**… but critically 15 was about the age girls started getting pregnant and dropping out of my disadvantaged, mixed secondary school
* This study compares OECD test results – so only kids who stayed long enough to sit standardized tests (probably excludes many travellers, FWIW); and also reflects generalized learning outcomes, *not* the leaving certificate results… doesn’t make these results any less valid, just a different point of focus.
We’re looking for a house and going for kids immediately after, and thank God we can both agree that same sex school are a pretty terrible idea that should have more or less been done away with decades ago. She’s not from Ireland, and is absolutely startled at how prevelant they are here.
17 comments
Your evidence is very nice but have you considered my anecdotes and Catholic morality
Thankfully, all the new schools built in the last while have been coed. The dept already knows this is true, even if it’s not official policy.
what about a study on their social life and mental health?
Nope, but it does mean our 19 year olds have the social development of 16 year olds elsewhere…
Went to a boys school, it didn’t do me any favors
The analysis showed significant raw gaps in reading, science and maths performance, with pupils in single-sex schools performing better than those in mixed-schools.
However, once the researchers applied a range of individual and school level factors such as the socioeconomic background of the student, the school student-staff ratio, the quality of teaching material available to the school and whether or not the school is disadvantaged, these gaps did not present as statistically significant.
In other words, the fact that children in single-sex schools tend to come from households with higher socioeconomic backgrounds who tend to perform better in school in any case helps explain the gaps we see in performance between the different school types.”
​
Doesn’t seem like a great study in my option.
I can never really summon any concern about this issue. There’s not a huge amount of them, but clearly some parents want them as an option. Different options for people is a good thing.
So it turns out the key to the academic advantage is rich parents. Who would have thought it?
Please please please can we abolish these already (as in make them actually illegal and force every single sex school to become coed). The toffiest of toff schools in England have become mixed in recent years so let’s not pretend that this shift cannot happen.
The only evidence based argument in their favour is a possible academic benefit for girls (although offset by a corresponding decline in academic performance for boys). And maybe there are some operational benefits, such as making it easier to neatly divide a population between two schools.
But let’s be real, gendered schools are a fucking weird idea in the 21st century. They basically don’t exist at all in any European country outside the UK and Ireland. We are an extreme outlier in this area.
We have eliminated gender segregation in virtually every other aspect of our society. Even kids sports are often mixed. So if we are gonna hang onto gendered schools, there should be a very very compelling and evidence based reason to do so. Clearly that doesn’t exist.
But we could talk for days about possible issues with single sex schools
– they reinforce gender stereotypes through subject and co-curricular offerings
– they can produce socially broken kids who don’t know how to interact with the opposite gender
– they generally do a piss poor job at teaching kids about puberty and sex issues that affect the opposite gender
– they can be absolute hell for gay and especially trans kids
And no, this isn’t about parental choice. Teaching kids from the age of 5 that gender segregation is normal is fucking weird and that should not be a choice available to parents.
Shocker
Single sex is best
Brand new mutlimillion boys primary school built in Maynooth, while the girls school remains a bunch of old sheds. Absolutely infuriating, how is it not discrimination, I don’t understand
Now they should do one about social disadvantages when engaging with the opposite sex.
When I was in school it was always said that co-ed schools performed better because there was a shame in looking thick in front of the girls or guys. I know for sure my social skills with women suffered big time because I didn’t regularly talk to them until the first year of college. I will not make that mistake with my own children.
I never realised how my schools were single sex. It’s a bit mad. I went to mixed school for primary and secondary
> there is no difference in maths, science or reading performance for 15-year-olds
> analysis showed significant … gaps in reading, science and maths performance … with … single-sex schools performing better…
> However, once researchers [controlled for] …socioeconomic background … student-staff ratio … whether the school is disadvantaged… these gaps [no longer] present as statistically significant.
So importantly:
* Single sex schools in Ireland *do* have better educational outcomes, because they’re better funded and attended by wealthier kids.
* they saw no statistically significant difference in kids **up to 15**… but critically 15 was about the age girls started getting pregnant and dropping out of my disadvantaged, mixed secondary school
* This study compares OECD test results – so only kids who stayed long enough to sit standardized tests (probably excludes many travellers, FWIW); and also reflects generalized learning outcomes, *not* the leaving certificate results… doesn’t make these results any less valid, just a different point of focus.
We’re looking for a house and going for kids immediately after, and thank God we can both agree that same sex school are a pretty terrible idea that should have more or less been done away with decades ago. She’s not from Ireland, and is absolutely startled at how prevelant they are here.