Fyi if you care about the environment then be aware having a child is the single worst thing you can do in terms of a lifetime of consumption.
Not sure we medically can have kids safely but I don’t feel good about their quality of life over the next century.
The main problem is the money gap between 0-3 before 30 hours childcare. Me and my partner got a mortgage based on both our full time wages, dropping income would require either large savings to see us through or credit. My partner could stop working altogether but looking at the numbers again we would barely scrape by by having no money for fun or days out. This is even before our mortgage skyrockets on renewal later this year and energy, prices as they are. The numbers no when only putting the necessities to live always end up in a negative so what motivation do we have to have children that doesn’t involve MAJOR sacrifice, if we have a child we want to give them a good life, not just scraping by.
We have two children and childcare costs are completely wild. I don’t even know where it all goes – the cost for our two children is not far from being equal to my partner’s (experienced middle-class professional) salary, but I’m pretty sure the staff (who look after at least 3 children each) are not paid much more than minimum wage. The government offers 30 hours free childcare, but what many don’t realise is that you still have to pay for ‘consumables’ (food, electricity/heating, the air you breathe while you’re dropping off), and you can only get free childcare during term time. Even if you accept that the government for whatever reason wants to lock one parent into doing only about 30 hours of part-time work per week rather than full time, it just doesn’t make any sense to only cover some random part of the year, because it’s a structure that is completely irrelevant to most parents of toddlers.
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My kids are teenagers now. I had a 4 year gap so one would be at school as the other one would need childcare, and didn’t have any more because of the cost. I don’t miss nursery fees, and am in denial about upcoming university costs. 😂. Thing is, this has always been a thing. Financial decisions are always a nightmare with kids. Reading the article doesn’t make me think it’s any different to 10/15/20 years ago.
Cost of raising a child causes people to consider whether or not to have a child? No way!
Thought about another… £700 a month childcare says no.
It’s a tricky one because from a national perspective we need to ensure the population continues to grow in order to fund an aging population but globally we need to reduce the population as the earth can’t sustain 8 billion. How do you square that circle?
Definitely part of the reason I only have one (5yo) so far… we got “lucky” that lockdown happened and reduced our nursery bill massively. It would be a huge hit to our finances now (higher housing costs etc).
Don’t expect the government to tackle immigration any time soon because of this, they know it is the only way to keep the UK productive and keep the birth rate steady.
It was insanely expensive for my mum to send my sister and me to nursery back in the 90s, to the point my dad and her worked loads of overtime and we barely saw them. If we were not at nursery then we were at my maternal grandparents, later breakfast club and after school club as we got older. If it has got that much worse in the last 25+ years then no wonder parents are putting off having kids. As great as children can be, they are not worth getting into extreme debt for.
I work as an IT director, pretty good salary. Wont have more than one kid, child care costs are debilitating on top of all the other shit going on
At this rate there will be a future shortage of child carers.
My wife’s about to go back from maternity and I’ve actually been pleasantly surprised by the cost. We’re getting a childminder for £5 per hour (this is in Essex). They only charge term time, which is perfect as my wife’s a teacher.
When the government 20% discount is added it’s pretty reasonable. Think using a childminder was roughly half what a nursery would cost.
Ha-ha-ha.. “another”… most of us can’t even afford one!
My wife and myself have stopped at one. We are both secondary teachers MLT/SLT and can only afford one if we want to live a relatively comfortable life.. No chance we can afford a second and expect to live comfortably and support two children into adulthood.. Just not workable and that’s all part of the de population plan I guess..
If childcare was more affordable we would definitely have more
Historically one parent was able to work full time to provide enough for the family and avoid the need to pay for childcare. We need to as a society to work towards this for the good of our children and to stop a demographic collaspe followed by an economic collaspe.
Another baby? I probably won’t even be able to afford one.
Who would think it a good idea to bring a child into this world. I have a 5 year old and regret what I’ve done based on what the world is changing into, but as he was born pre this NGO insanity I had no idea.
Ah yes, a classic story that has been winning conservative parties elections for years now. you see the same thing all over the anglosphere.
Step 1: Cultivate and promote a highly individualistic “don’t rely on anyone and ESPECIALLY don’t rely on the state for help” culture.
Step 2: Cultivate an economy highly dependent on immigrant labor.
Step 3: Cultivate an economy where childcare is very expensive, incidentally favoring immigrant families from more collectivist cultures (e.g. no childcare costs cuz grandma lives in the backroom and is free to babysit).
Step 4: Do nothing to actually solve the childcare problem.
Step 5: Use anti-immigrant rhetoric to win elections forever and ever and ever.
Being able to afford housing helps, too. Can’t see many couples trying to settle down in a houseshare crammed in with 5 other strangers.
This is cause a demographic problem, it needs to be sorted asap
Imagine being so right wing you made your own country almost impossible for people to raise children in.
23 comments
Fyi if you care about the environment then be aware having a child is the single worst thing you can do in terms of a lifetime of consumption.
Not sure we medically can have kids safely but I don’t feel good about their quality of life over the next century.
The main problem is the money gap between 0-3 before 30 hours childcare. Me and my partner got a mortgage based on both our full time wages, dropping income would require either large savings to see us through or credit. My partner could stop working altogether but looking at the numbers again we would barely scrape by by having no money for fun or days out. This is even before our mortgage skyrockets on renewal later this year and energy, prices as they are. The numbers no when only putting the necessities to live always end up in a negative so what motivation do we have to have children that doesn’t involve MAJOR sacrifice, if we have a child we want to give them a good life, not just scraping by.
We have two children and childcare costs are completely wild. I don’t even know where it all goes – the cost for our two children is not far from being equal to my partner’s (experienced middle-class professional) salary, but I’m pretty sure the staff (who look after at least 3 children each) are not paid much more than minimum wage. The government offers 30 hours free childcare, but what many don’t realise is that you still have to pay for ‘consumables’ (food, electricity/heating, the air you breathe while you’re dropping off), and you can only get free childcare during term time. Even if you accept that the government for whatever reason wants to lock one parent into doing only about 30 hours of part-time work per week rather than full time, it just doesn’t make any sense to only cover some random part of the year, because it’s a structure that is completely irrelevant to most parents of toddlers.
[removed]
My kids are teenagers now. I had a 4 year gap so one would be at school as the other one would need childcare, and didn’t have any more because of the cost. I don’t miss nursery fees, and am in denial about upcoming university costs. 😂. Thing is, this has always been a thing. Financial decisions are always a nightmare with kids. Reading the article doesn’t make me think it’s any different to 10/15/20 years ago.
Cost of raising a child causes people to consider whether or not to have a child? No way!
Thought about another… £700 a month childcare says no.
It’s a tricky one because from a national perspective we need to ensure the population continues to grow in order to fund an aging population but globally we need to reduce the population as the earth can’t sustain 8 billion. How do you square that circle?
Definitely part of the reason I only have one (5yo) so far… we got “lucky” that lockdown happened and reduced our nursery bill massively. It would be a huge hit to our finances now (higher housing costs etc).
Don’t expect the government to tackle immigration any time soon because of this, they know it is the only way to keep the UK productive and keep the birth rate steady.
It was insanely expensive for my mum to send my sister and me to nursery back in the 90s, to the point my dad and her worked loads of overtime and we barely saw them. If we were not at nursery then we were at my maternal grandparents, later breakfast club and after school club as we got older. If it has got that much worse in the last 25+ years then no wonder parents are putting off having kids. As great as children can be, they are not worth getting into extreme debt for.
I work as an IT director, pretty good salary. Wont have more than one kid, child care costs are debilitating on top of all the other shit going on
At this rate there will be a future shortage of child carers.
My wife’s about to go back from maternity and I’ve actually been pleasantly surprised by the cost. We’re getting a childminder for £5 per hour (this is in Essex). They only charge term time, which is perfect as my wife’s a teacher.
When the government 20% discount is added it’s pretty reasonable. Think using a childminder was roughly half what a nursery would cost.
Ha-ha-ha.. “another”… most of us can’t even afford one!
My wife and myself have stopped at one. We are both secondary teachers MLT/SLT and can only afford one if we want to live a relatively comfortable life.. No chance we can afford a second and expect to live comfortably and support two children into adulthood.. Just not workable and that’s all part of the de population plan I guess..
If childcare was more affordable we would definitely have more
Historically one parent was able to work full time to provide enough for the family and avoid the need to pay for childcare. We need to as a society to work towards this for the good of our children and to stop a demographic collaspe followed by an economic collaspe.
Another baby? I probably won’t even be able to afford one.
Who would think it a good idea to bring a child into this world. I have a 5 year old and regret what I’ve done based on what the world is changing into, but as he was born pre this NGO insanity I had no idea.
Ah yes, a classic story that has been winning conservative parties elections for years now. you see the same thing all over the anglosphere.
Step 1: Cultivate and promote a highly individualistic “don’t rely on anyone and ESPECIALLY don’t rely on the state for help” culture.
Step 2: Cultivate an economy highly dependent on immigrant labor.
Step 3: Cultivate an economy where childcare is very expensive, incidentally favoring immigrant families from more collectivist cultures (e.g. no childcare costs cuz grandma lives in the backroom and is free to babysit).
Step 4: Do nothing to actually solve the childcare problem.
Step 5: Use anti-immigrant rhetoric to win elections forever and ever and ever.
Being able to afford housing helps, too. Can’t see many couples trying to settle down in a houseshare crammed in with 5 other strangers.
This is cause a demographic problem, it needs to be sorted asap
Imagine being so right wing you made your own country almost impossible for people to raise children in.