Or… how about we just recruit the staff that are needed from the best applicants who meet the entry standards?
Regardless of any immutable characteristics.
The only way the armed forces can achieve diversity is by conscription/national service.
Or just hire the best regardless?
​
If we have a war with China, all I’m going to be worried about is if our pilots can shootdown the Chinese pilots. I’m not going to quibbling “well, only 2 percent of the squadron is black” I reckon that fella who shot down three Migs should be grounded to let an ethnic minority have a turn.
It’s statistically impossible to improve diversity without reducing candidate quality.
Listen, I know the Russians are using hypersonic missiles and are swatting drones and aircraft out of the sky, but the really pressing matter is that we don’t have enough black trans female pilots in the RAF.
For god’s sake just employ the best people for the job and fuck diversity.
China and Russia must be shrieking with laughter at this infighting. How the hell can we still be considered a world power with this sort of primitive thinking?
“Commander, the Russian bombers are inbound! Send the boys up to shoot them down!”.
“Do we have any women pilots?”
“What? Um, not at this airfield right now, we need to get the planes up now!”
“No. Let the bombs fall, and we should see it as punishment for our unrepresentative workforce. It’s our shame.”
It’s good for the service that this guy is moving on.
Pilot training is a complete shambles, thanks to Wigston. The security of the UK is sacrificed on the alter of “diversity.”
I absolutely love being discriminated against in my own country
>Sir Mike Wigston has always maintained that necessary and well-intentioned efforts under his leadership to increase the ratio of ethnic minority and female recruits had no impact on the RAF’s operational effectiveness and that standards were never compromised.
Standards are always compromised when you make diversity hires. Wouldn’t surprise me if the Chinese or Russians are secretly paying for this diversity stuff to higher up UK military officials in order to deliberately weaken us. They must be cackling with laughter at this shit.
>The head of RAF recruitment resigned in protest at what was alleged to be an “illegal order” effectively to pause the placing of white male recruits onto training courses in favour of women and ethnic minorities. The order was never implemented but only because Group Captain Elizabeth Nicholl refused to obey it and quit.
So she had more balls than most of the men in the upper echelons of our military then, good to know.
This policy encourages sending minorities to the front lines, surely that’s the opposite of the agenda, aren’t we meant to be giving everyone a cosy life?
Asian people are less likely to join because of the legacy of the war on terror. Black people are less likely to join due to distrust in the wider UK state.
I find it mind-boggling that the recruitment policy will be aimed at trying to marginalise the largest and most willing demographic to join. His job is to defend the country. Man should be sacked.
Here’s a thought, with this big diversity push thats been going on for a while, could there be a chance that its because their not interested in joining the Royal airforce?
The RAF should focus on national security, not pandering to feminists and pushing diversity quotas.
An important part of the article which I think some of you should see:
“During the period in question our selection standards did not drop and there was no impact on the operational effectiveness of the RAF, however, in hindsight, we accept that despite the best of intentions, that some mistakes were made.
“The RAF is now confident that our approach is correct.”
The RAF also pushed back on the suggestion from the anonymous serving RAF airman about a shortage of recruits, saying figures for the past year to March – which have yet to be released – will show the service hit well over 90% of its recruitment targets.
This outperformed the rest of the armed forces.
We don’t need diversity. We need the best, despite background. If they happen to be from a minority feckin’ great. First and foremost we stay a meritocracy!
As long as they all pas the 5 miler of death I can’t see it being a problem.
The RAF can’t hit its recruitment targets, and it is utterly fucking up the process to train pilots, the thing it exists to do.
And instead he’s obsessed with diversity quotas, he can’t fuck off fast enough, the RAF hierarchy is a bunch of white men saying they need less white men (but not in their jobs), their biggest recruitment pool
Maybe the problem is that most of the people in charge are posh, private schooled, out of touch middle aged guys?
And then we’re surprised when a load of our white male RAF pilots go for jobs in China. Something’s gone wrong when *China* is coming off as the least prejudiced option.
It feels like the country is having a nervous breakdown.
What’s the evidence base for improving diversity making the RAF a more effective combat force?
I’ve met a few people in the armed forces who treat it like it’s a leisure club for their personal benefit but if things ever get real these are the only people who will be standing between us and the end of our way of life and I’d rather they were as good as possible at fighting and that’s it.
If there’s not at least 5 blind pilots recruited then clearly the RAF are a bunch of discriminatory fascists. Not that it matters because the whole training program is fucked and we’ll have probably have cured blindness by the time they get anywhere near a plane.
I take issue with recruitment drives centred on diversity.
Man or woman, Black or White, Asian or Arabic. If you can pass the physical and mental requirements, go for it.
Oh wow. A straight white man discriminating based on gender, race, and sexuality.
That’s sure to make him look good, and sure to improve the RAF
A Sikh colleague has both sons in the RAF. The youngest passes out as an officer next week. He’s as proud as punch and rightly so.
Didn’t the RAF already marginalise white recruits then were surprised pilots were going to China instead to train their pilots instead?
Surely this won’t end badly though
This is what happens when your institutions are captured by dogma
God forbid the RAF need to fight a war anytime soon
Edit: I guarantee that the same people who are defending the diversity drive and pro getting more minorities into the RAF will eventually come to say ‘wHy Is ThE rAf SeNdInG a DiSpRoPoRtIoNaTe AmOuNt Of MiNoRiTiEs To WaR’
I’m sick of these identitarians
“How the fuck am I supposed to fly an airplane with no arms?!” – Air Chief Marshall Sir Mike Wigston “that’s not the issue I’m most concerned about..”
At this point I’m surprised that white males are still applying to the RAF.
So it is fine to discriminate a candidate of Polish or Czech origin and pick and kid from a well off Indian family just on the basis of the colour of their skin. Holy shit keep this tribal madness in the USA. White guilt truly is pathetic.
87 percent of the united kingdom is white, the demographics of any workplace is naturally going to skew towards a white dominated workplace, And what does race have to do with competency in the workplace anyways?
Now I am by no means a trained officer in his majestys royal airforce but what does melanin levels have to do with how well an airman can pilot an aircraft and an officer to lead troops/plan operations.
As long as nobody is being denied positions because of their skin color then just choose candidated by their relevant skills
How on Earth are these clowns in positions of power after over 10 years of Tory government.
Isn’t this one of the main reasons people vote Tory? To end this kind of nonsense?
This whole diversity idea is a China or Russia plot to weaken the west, I bet their scratching their heads perplexed as to how well their plan has worked, even they can’t believe the west is so stupid.
Edit: diversity is good, forced diversity isn’t.
No one wants to join military as it
Mabey try making it a more attractive option for people in general first
“Diversity” has become a cult. A state religion even.
Let’s threaten national security and the most dangerous possible time for Diversity. This is borderline treason. He should be stripped of rank and replaced by someone with common sense.
When has ‘testing the limit of the law’ ever been a good thing? This isn’t a law discriminating against minorities, it’s a law protecting other races from discrimination.
1. Are our current methods of deciding who the best applicant is acceptable?
What’s on paper isn’t enough.
People have transferable skills, they have different perspectives, experiences, grit etc
It’s prudent to filter people out by probation periods.
An unlikely candidate could likely end up being the better candidate with some appropriate training.
This fantasy world of merit does not exist.
The pro’s of representation, life experience, cultural, language and perspectives outweighs the tragedy of a few white males having to change careers or wait.
The armed forces do not work in a localised vacuum, they are a global force.
There are many situations where an enemy or allies own biases and assumptions can be exploited with use of a diverse human resource.
N.B. Education, Qualifications and experience are all affected by discrimination.
I’d rather hire the person who managed to get a 1st despite many challenges and a lack of support, than someone who got a 1st with a life of private tutors, private schooling, legacy university acceptance, lecturer favouritism etc.
How many times has the achievements of Women or non-white people been hidden or plagiarised?
Having some *prima facie* less “qualified” diverse candidates will lead to better qualified diverse candidates in the future.
But… let’s not pretend the best candidate has been getting the job.
The needs of the many outweighed needs of the few, otherwise we wouldn’t have any armed forces.
Suck it up buttercup.
Ugh this again. Why does this country insist on trying to fill jobs to a ratio of minorities to majorities that goes beyond the demographics of the country? Most people in this country are white, and it is mostly males who WANT to join the RAF in the first place. You wouldn’t apply to a job in South Korea for example and wonder why it’s mostly Koreans working there, would you?
Gotta be a bit of clown to wanna fight for this country anyways this guy is a prime example
Again, you are putting words into my mouth because I never said anything about attitude lessons.
I did go to a private school but am not sure how that’s relevant.
Ok persons we are gonna
*desk slam*
Tick those boxes!
Stupid…yet again something ‘woke’ many on the left said wasn’t happening.
Hang on, have I got this right?, the recruiter was given an order to limit the number of white recruits in favour of PoC/minorities, but if she did she would be breaking the *positive racism* law?.
I’m confused. Is she the good guy or bad guy for refusing to break this law?.
47 comments
Or… how about we just recruit the staff that are needed from the best applicants who meet the entry standards?
Regardless of any immutable characteristics.
The only way the armed forces can achieve diversity is by conscription/national service.
Or just hire the best regardless?
​
If we have a war with China, all I’m going to be worried about is if our pilots can shootdown the Chinese pilots. I’m not going to quibbling “well, only 2 percent of the squadron is black” I reckon that fella who shot down three Migs should be grounded to let an ethnic minority have a turn.
It’s statistically impossible to improve diversity without reducing candidate quality.
Listen, I know the Russians are using hypersonic missiles and are swatting drones and aircraft out of the sky, but the really pressing matter is that we don’t have enough black trans female pilots in the RAF.
For god’s sake just employ the best people for the job and fuck diversity.
China and Russia must be shrieking with laughter at this infighting. How the hell can we still be considered a world power with this sort of primitive thinking?
“Commander, the Russian bombers are inbound! Send the boys up to shoot them down!”.
“Do we have any women pilots?”
“What? Um, not at this airfield right now, we need to get the planes up now!”
“No. Let the bombs fall, and we should see it as punishment for our unrepresentative workforce. It’s our shame.”
It’s good for the service that this guy is moving on.
Pilot training is a complete shambles, thanks to Wigston. The security of the UK is sacrificed on the alter of “diversity.”
I absolutely love being discriminated against in my own country
>Sir Mike Wigston has always maintained that necessary and well-intentioned efforts under his leadership to increase the ratio of ethnic minority and female recruits had no impact on the RAF’s operational effectiveness and that standards were never compromised.
Standards are always compromised when you make diversity hires. Wouldn’t surprise me if the Chinese or Russians are secretly paying for this diversity stuff to higher up UK military officials in order to deliberately weaken us. They must be cackling with laughter at this shit.
>The head of RAF recruitment resigned in protest at what was alleged to be an “illegal order” effectively to pause the placing of white male recruits onto training courses in favour of women and ethnic minorities. The order was never implemented but only because Group Captain Elizabeth Nicholl refused to obey it and quit.
So she had more balls than most of the men in the upper echelons of our military then, good to know.
This policy encourages sending minorities to the front lines, surely that’s the opposite of the agenda, aren’t we meant to be giving everyone a cosy life?
Asian people are less likely to join because of the legacy of the war on terror. Black people are less likely to join due to distrust in the wider UK state.
I find it mind-boggling that the recruitment policy will be aimed at trying to marginalise the largest and most willing demographic to join. His job is to defend the country. Man should be sacked.
Here’s a thought, with this big diversity push thats been going on for a while, could there be a chance that its because their not interested in joining the Royal airforce?
The RAF should focus on national security, not pandering to feminists and pushing diversity quotas.
An important part of the article which I think some of you should see:
“During the period in question our selection standards did not drop and there was no impact on the operational effectiveness of the RAF, however, in hindsight, we accept that despite the best of intentions, that some mistakes were made.
“The RAF is now confident that our approach is correct.”
The RAF also pushed back on the suggestion from the anonymous serving RAF airman about a shortage of recruits, saying figures for the past year to March – which have yet to be released – will show the service hit well over 90% of its recruitment targets.
This outperformed the rest of the armed forces.
We don’t need diversity. We need the best, despite background. If they happen to be from a minority feckin’ great. First and foremost we stay a meritocracy!
As long as they all pas the 5 miler of death I can’t see it being a problem.
The RAF can’t hit its recruitment targets, and it is utterly fucking up the process to train pilots, the thing it exists to do.
And instead he’s obsessed with diversity quotas, he can’t fuck off fast enough, the RAF hierarchy is a bunch of white men saying they need less white men (but not in their jobs), their biggest recruitment pool
Maybe the problem is that most of the people in charge are posh, private schooled, out of touch middle aged guys?
And then we’re surprised when a load of our white male RAF pilots go for jobs in China. Something’s gone wrong when *China* is coming off as the least prejudiced option.
It feels like the country is having a nervous breakdown.
What’s the evidence base for improving diversity making the RAF a more effective combat force?
I’ve met a few people in the armed forces who treat it like it’s a leisure club for their personal benefit but if things ever get real these are the only people who will be standing between us and the end of our way of life and I’d rather they were as good as possible at fighting and that’s it.
If there’s not at least 5 blind pilots recruited then clearly the RAF are a bunch of discriminatory fascists. Not that it matters because the whole training program is fucked and we’ll have probably have cured blindness by the time they get anywhere near a plane.
I take issue with recruitment drives centred on diversity.
Man or woman, Black or White, Asian or Arabic. If you can pass the physical and mental requirements, go for it.
Oh wow. A straight white man discriminating based on gender, race, and sexuality.
That’s sure to make him look good, and sure to improve the RAF
A Sikh colleague has both sons in the RAF. The youngest passes out as an officer next week. He’s as proud as punch and rightly so.
This has been going on for [years!](https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/police-white-heterosexual-male-discrimination-job-cheshire-matthew-furlong-a8793331.html)
[removed]
Didn’t the RAF already marginalise white recruits then were surprised pilots were going to China instead to train their pilots instead?
Surely this won’t end badly though
This is what happens when your institutions are captured by dogma
God forbid the RAF need to fight a war anytime soon
Edit: I guarantee that the same people who are defending the diversity drive and pro getting more minorities into the RAF will eventually come to say ‘wHy Is ThE rAf SeNdInG a DiSpRoPoRtIoNaTe AmOuNt Of MiNoRiTiEs To WaR’
I’m sick of these identitarians
“How the fuck am I supposed to fly an airplane with no arms?!” – Air Chief Marshall Sir Mike Wigston “that’s not the issue I’m most concerned about..”
At this point I’m surprised that white males are still applying to the RAF.
So it is fine to discriminate a candidate of Polish or Czech origin and pick and kid from a well off Indian family just on the basis of the colour of their skin. Holy shit keep this tribal madness in the USA. White guilt truly is pathetic.
87 percent of the united kingdom is white, the demographics of any workplace is naturally going to skew towards a white dominated workplace, And what does race have to do with competency in the workplace anyways?
Now I am by no means a trained officer in his majestys royal airforce but what does melanin levels have to do with how well an airman can pilot an aircraft and an officer to lead troops/plan operations.
As long as nobody is being denied positions because of their skin color then just choose candidated by their relevant skills
How on Earth are these clowns in positions of power after over 10 years of Tory government.
Isn’t this one of the main reasons people vote Tory? To end this kind of nonsense?
This whole diversity idea is a China or Russia plot to weaken the west, I bet their scratching their heads perplexed as to how well their plan has worked, even they can’t believe the west is so stupid.
Edit: diversity is good, forced diversity isn’t.
No one wants to join military as it
Mabey try making it a more attractive option for people in general first
“Diversity” has become a cult. A state religion even.
Let’s threaten national security and the most dangerous possible time for Diversity. This is borderline treason. He should be stripped of rank and replaced by someone with common sense.
When has ‘testing the limit of the law’ ever been a good thing? This isn’t a law discriminating against minorities, it’s a law protecting other races from discrimination.
1. Are our current methods of deciding who the best applicant is acceptable?
What’s on paper isn’t enough.
People have transferable skills, they have different perspectives, experiences, grit etc
It’s prudent to filter people out by probation periods.
An unlikely candidate could likely end up being the better candidate with some appropriate training.
This fantasy world of merit does not exist.
The pro’s of representation, life experience, cultural, language and perspectives outweighs the tragedy of a few white males having to change careers or wait.
The armed forces do not work in a localised vacuum, they are a global force.
There are many situations where an enemy or allies own biases and assumptions can be exploited with use of a diverse human resource.
N.B. Education, Qualifications and experience are all affected by discrimination.
I’d rather hire the person who managed to get a 1st despite many challenges and a lack of support, than someone who got a 1st with a life of private tutors, private schooling, legacy university acceptance, lecturer favouritism etc.
How many times has the achievements of Women or non-white people been hidden or plagiarised?
Having some *prima facie* less “qualified” diverse candidates will lead to better qualified diverse candidates in the future.
But… let’s not pretend the best candidate has been getting the job.
The needs of the many outweighed needs of the few, otherwise we wouldn’t have any armed forces.
Suck it up buttercup.
Ugh this again. Why does this country insist on trying to fill jobs to a ratio of minorities to majorities that goes beyond the demographics of the country? Most people in this country are white, and it is mostly males who WANT to join the RAF in the first place. You wouldn’t apply to a job in South Korea for example and wonder why it’s mostly Koreans working there, would you?
Gotta be a bit of clown to wanna fight for this country anyways this guy is a prime example
Again, you are putting words into my mouth because I never said anything about attitude lessons.
I did go to a private school but am not sure how that’s relevant.
Ok persons we are gonna
*desk slam*
Tick those boxes!
Stupid…yet again something ‘woke’ many on the left said wasn’t happening.
Hang on, have I got this right?, the recruiter was given an order to limit the number of white recruits in favour of PoC/minorities, but if she did she would be breaking the *positive racism* law?.
I’m confused. Is she the good guy or bad guy for refusing to break this law?.