Imagine thinking it’s the beggars who can dictate how we’ll work, not the skilled workers who can choose freely where in the world to work under what conditions.
Imagine not being willing to educate less qualified workers and insisting on only hiring superstars and veteran seniors and then complaining about the lack of skilled workers.
Imagine voting to restrict the influx of foreign workers whenever you get a chance and then complain about the lack of workers.
Imagine firing people due to their age and not hiring people who are close to retirement age, but then demand that they be retired later.
How is the lack of worker’s the ppl fault???? U want to increase the work hour’s or later for retirement, im already tired of work and im only40, ppl font want to work like our parents did, and they are getting frustrated because now they need to pay more if they want workers, but the Robots are coming so many job are going to be lost, i dont see the problem wait 10year for the Robot and its done.
Companies can still hire from third countries right? Last time I checked I think only canton Zurich and Geneva used up all their permits?
Retirements are predictible. Each time someone retires and the company acts surprised and suddenly wants to hire a senior but doesn’t find one?
I facepalm.
Quite cringy, as usual, when the “Arbeitgeberverband” releases some statement.
It’s also interesting how SRF simply leaves the claim that “Switzerland has one of the *lowest* average retirement ages in Europe” uncommented. Of course that’s a blatant lie.
I always find it rather pointless to argue with people (or in this case: lobby organizations) that already lie to your face when it comes to the very basic facts.
This is a free market right? So if a resource becomes scarce it should become so much more expensive. There they have the solution: pay more, find people.
Sure, 42 hours plus overtime isn’t enough already.
Maybe if they still at least tried to train people just a little bit on the job and did not want a bachelors + a master + 3 year working experience in the relevant filed to qualify for a internship or entry level job, there wouldn’t be a shortage.
Pay people enough, problem solved.
Here is my consultancy fee.
We should all work less, not more!!
I read a good proposal by an economist (who I almost always disagree with) recently:
Incentivize higher workloads with a break in the tax progression. Why would you work more when the incremental tax burden and the additional daycare cost offset any additional income to a large degree.
HAHA no!
If there’s one thing that surprised me in Switzerland, it’s that people get paid huge amounts of money to be really bad managers who simply expect their subordinates to solve all the problems, alone, for relatively low amounts of money, compared to the average salaries here.
I always thought technological progress (incresed productivity, automation) will lead to higher quality of living and less working time. Oops probably not, very few will cash in all the benefits and the ordinary people are told to work ever more like fucking slaves.
The biggest lack of skills is in HR.
Every company have worked for, HR systematically suck.
They suck on recruitment, they suck on pay, they suck on training, they suck on planning, they suck on career management, they suck on giving overtime, they suck on preventing burnouts, they suck on basic paperwork, they just suck on everything they touch.
It’s to the point I am utterly convinced that after a few years in the same company, I could do better than any of them at their job. I mean it, and I would not dare thinking that about another profession which is not my own.
Please let’s fix HR before they break something else.
Maybe we should all work a little less and be a lot happier
Yeah, no. As a young skilled worker. I’m not accepting this. I rather live in poverty than work myself to the bones. My standard of living is fucked, anyway. So, why should I work more. Give me a 100 – 150% salary increase and I might think about doing 45+ hours a week. And forget about doing that until I’m 70…
Ah, thoes clowns again. Most employers are not willing to invest in their employees skillsets, they much rather go hire someone who already has experience in an area, than paying for an existing employees education. No wonder we have a skilled labour shortage.
Try finding a part time job the field you have an apprenticeship in, so you can go study part time? Try finding an employer who pays more than a pittance as part time intern? If you want skilled labour, you have to pay for the education of this skilled labour. On the level of apprenticeships, this is totally normal and is taken for granted. In higher education this is suddenly all the problem of the individual or their parents. Put that in your pipe and smoke it.
Edit: No stipemdium doesn’t count. That’s taxpayers paying for education and getting one is bloody hard and can pretty arbitrary in most cantons. Also in many cantons it doesn’t really cover the cost of living, and if you earn too much on the side, your stipendium is going to be cut, creating situations where you can’t be economical independant.
Edit2: oh, yes and finding affordable student housing is also a real PITA. Add to that the exploding health insurance etc. Going for higher education just isn’t a really good proposition in the short term, if your parents can’t or won’t put you up for the duration or you have to move out to attend your curriculum of choice.
The Swiss corporate world is one that really shocked me. Both from a cultural perspective and recently, an operational perspective.
Culturally: gossip is so common among grown ass adults. I feel like I’m in a playground so I don’t engage with anyone tbh. There are also some very backwards mentalities here with regards to hiring, nepotism and other things.
Operationally: Switzerland is the greatest cost centre for many companies where now, many jobs in accounting and HR for example are being off-shored to India, Philippines and Poland. This has now created a strange dynamic for many companies where a lot of people don’t know what exactly is happening with regards to the employment landscape and there isn’t really a clear vision because massive re-orgs keep happening at lightening pace. Things like sales and client-facing roles will all remain albeit at a much more stripped-down/lean style and with higher intensity. These are strange times indeed.
I think the combination of these factors make working in Switzerland difficult. As much as I enjoy living here, I detest working here – but I love the money.
F the boomers with their typical lies
Fricking pay proper wages you bonzen from generation me, then you have enough people working
Sure sure, for the same wages and wage increase I assume, and also with forced 3 days/week in the office, plus forced socializing (“do something good for the people, in the bname of the company, in your free time”).
Set up normal inmigration laws, with normal requirements. And force companies of a certain size and bigger to have a percentage of juniors and train them.
I love how every solution they suggest means more work for employees while no reduction in earnings for companies.
Wild idea: How about we introduce 4 day week? How about shops not being open 8-20 EVERY day of the week? I bet we’d have more than enough workers in no time.
I love how it is randomly decided if the SRF article will get a comment section. Although if you observe where you can and cannot comment you start to see a pattern where every topic that might stirr up some controversy is being blocked from commenting.
opposite should be done – 4 day workweek like a lot of companies are introducing it in the UK. Dont be a slave to your job, theres more beneath it!
As the subreddit curmudgeon who’ll complain about the kids wanting to work less:
Lol, fuck off. We don’t need to work more
Based on personal experiences, most skilled workers nowadays seem to choose part time work as soon as they earn enough to afford it because they prefer to have a real life besides their work. So, in my opinion work conditions and flexibility should strongly be improved. At the same time, I agree that daycare needs to be more affordable and the compatibility of family and work has to be optimized considerably to make work more attractive.
It seems some Gen Z are having a hard time comprehending that their 4 day work week was just a dream 🙂
30 comments
they can fuck off
lol
Imagine living so far away from reality.
Imagine thinking it’s the beggars who can dictate how we’ll work, not the skilled workers who can choose freely where in the world to work under what conditions.
Imagine not being willing to educate less qualified workers and insisting on only hiring superstars and veteran seniors and then complaining about the lack of skilled workers.
Imagine voting to restrict the influx of foreign workers whenever you get a chance and then complain about the lack of workers.
Imagine firing people due to their age and not hiring people who are close to retirement age, but then demand that they be retired later.
How is the lack of worker’s the ppl fault???? U want to increase the work hour’s or later for retirement, im already tired of work and im only40, ppl font want to work like our parents did, and they are getting frustrated because now they need to pay more if they want workers, but the Robots are coming so many job are going to be lost, i dont see the problem wait 10year for the Robot and its done.
Companies can still hire from third countries right? Last time I checked I think only canton Zurich and Geneva used up all their permits?
Retirements are predictible. Each time someone retires and the company acts surprised and suddenly wants to hire a senior but doesn’t find one?
I facepalm.
Quite cringy, as usual, when the “Arbeitgeberverband” releases some statement.
It’s also interesting how SRF simply leaves the claim that “Switzerland has one of the *lowest* average retirement ages in Europe” uncommented. Of course that’s a blatant lie.
In fact Switzerland [has one of the highest average retirement ages](https://de.euronews.com/next/2023/01/12/rentenalter-europa-vergleich) in Europe.
I always find it rather pointless to argue with people (or in this case: lobby organizations) that already lie to your face when it comes to the very basic facts.
This is a free market right? So if a resource becomes scarce it should become so much more expensive. There they have the solution: pay more, find people.
Sure, 42 hours plus overtime isn’t enough already.
Maybe if they still at least tried to train people just a little bit on the job and did not want a bachelors + a master + 3 year working experience in the relevant filed to qualify for a internship or entry level job, there wouldn’t be a shortage.
Pay people enough, problem solved.
Here is my consultancy fee.
We should all work less, not more!!
I read a good proposal by an economist (who I almost always disagree with) recently:
Incentivize higher workloads with a break in the tax progression. Why would you work more when the incremental tax burden and the additional daycare cost offset any additional income to a large degree.
HAHA no!
If there’s one thing that surprised me in Switzerland, it’s that people get paid huge amounts of money to be really bad managers who simply expect their subordinates to solve all the problems, alone, for relatively low amounts of money, compared to the average salaries here.
I always thought technological progress (incresed productivity, automation) will lead to higher quality of living and less working time. Oops probably not, very few will cash in all the benefits and the ordinary people are told to work ever more like fucking slaves.
The biggest lack of skills is in HR.
Every company have worked for, HR systematically suck.
They suck on recruitment, they suck on pay, they suck on training, they suck on planning, they suck on career management, they suck on giving overtime, they suck on preventing burnouts, they suck on basic paperwork, they just suck on everything they touch.
It’s to the point I am utterly convinced that after a few years in the same company, I could do better than any of them at their job. I mean it, and I would not dare thinking that about another profession which is not my own.
Please let’s fix HR before they break something else.
Maybe we should all work a little less and be a lot happier
Yeah, no. As a young skilled worker. I’m not accepting this. I rather live in poverty than work myself to the bones. My standard of living is fucked, anyway. So, why should I work more. Give me a 100 – 150% salary increase and I might think about doing 45+ hours a week. And forget about doing that until I’m 70…
Ah, thoes clowns again. Most employers are not willing to invest in their employees skillsets, they much rather go hire someone who already has experience in an area, than paying for an existing employees education. No wonder we have a skilled labour shortage.
Try finding a part time job the field you have an apprenticeship in, so you can go study part time? Try finding an employer who pays more than a pittance as part time intern? If you want skilled labour, you have to pay for the education of this skilled labour. On the level of apprenticeships, this is totally normal and is taken for granted. In higher education this is suddenly all the problem of the individual or their parents. Put that in your pipe and smoke it.
Edit: No stipemdium doesn’t count. That’s taxpayers paying for education and getting one is bloody hard and can pretty arbitrary in most cantons. Also in many cantons it doesn’t really cover the cost of living, and if you earn too much on the side, your stipendium is going to be cut, creating situations where you can’t be economical independant.
Edit2: oh, yes and finding affordable student housing is also a real PITA. Add to that the exploding health insurance etc. Going for higher education just isn’t a really good proposition in the short term, if your parents can’t or won’t put you up for the duration or you have to move out to attend your curriculum of choice.
The Swiss corporate world is one that really shocked me. Both from a cultural perspective and recently, an operational perspective.
Culturally: gossip is so common among grown ass adults. I feel like I’m in a playground so I don’t engage with anyone tbh. There are also some very backwards mentalities here with regards to hiring, nepotism and other things.
Operationally: Switzerland is the greatest cost centre for many companies where now, many jobs in accounting and HR for example are being off-shored to India, Philippines and Poland. This has now created a strange dynamic for many companies where a lot of people don’t know what exactly is happening with regards to the employment landscape and there isn’t really a clear vision because massive re-orgs keep happening at lightening pace. Things like sales and client-facing roles will all remain albeit at a much more stripped-down/lean style and with higher intensity. These are strange times indeed.
I think the combination of these factors make working in Switzerland difficult. As much as I enjoy living here, I detest working here – but I love the money.
F the boomers with their typical lies
Fricking pay proper wages you bonzen from generation me, then you have enough people working
Sure sure, for the same wages and wage increase I assume, and also with forced 3 days/week in the office, plus forced socializing (“do something good for the people, in the bname of the company, in your free time”).
Set up normal inmigration laws, with normal requirements. And force companies of a certain size and bigger to have a percentage of juniors and train them.
I love how every solution they suggest means more work for employees while no reduction in earnings for companies.
Wild idea: How about we introduce 4 day week? How about shops not being open 8-20 EVERY day of the week? I bet we’d have more than enough workers in no time.
I love how it is randomly decided if the SRF article will get a comment section. Although if you observe where you can and cannot comment you start to see a pattern where every topic that might stirr up some controversy is being blocked from commenting.
opposite should be done – 4 day workweek like a lot of companies are introducing it in the UK. Dont be a slave to your job, theres more beneath it!
As the subreddit curmudgeon who’ll complain about the kids wanting to work less:
Lol, fuck off. We don’t need to work more
Based on personal experiences, most skilled workers nowadays seem to choose part time work as soon as they earn enough to afford it because they prefer to have a real life besides their work. So, in my opinion work conditions and flexibility should strongly be improved. At the same time, I agree that daycare needs to be more affordable and the compatibility of family and work has to be optimized considerably to make work more attractive.
It seems some Gen Z are having a hard time comprehending that their 4 day work week was just a dream 🙂
lol at them.