in that case Greece should be looking east at ~~constantinople~~ istanbul and not Britain.
either way the Elgin Marbles were purchased therefore they are right where they belong. blame turkey for selling them
It’s a difficult balance.
I fully support the desecration of London based arts & humanities. I also enjoy triggering the coalition of purple haired anti-imperialists and right-wing nationalists who pine for the return of such artefacts.
The country from which most of the works in the British Museum come from is Italy and yet we are the only ones who see it as an advertisement for our country
The British Museum would be empty if they had to return all the ~~stolen~~ violently borrowed items they have.
Let’s see if the British government gives a different reply than their usual ‘nuh uh’
Weird, you’d think Greece and India might have more important things to worry about than old stones and diamonds.
Some stuff given back is immediately sold by local African autocrats.
>Victims of colonial appropriation
So this means we are getting back all those priceless Anglo-Saxon gold artifacts back from Denmark?
As well as payment for all the tin the Romans took? With the expected 5% compound interest for 1600+ years?
We are at least going to get a repayment for all that English tax money being syphoned off to Normandy and Anjou, right?
Right guys?
Why does India always mention the Koh-i-Noor? it was legally and verifiable gifted to the British.
To be blunt, portraying it in that manner is pretty much torpedoing any chance of it ever happening. The Elgin Marbles are a complex case and not one that is going to be solved by another country wading in for nationalist purposes like that.
The biggest hurdle to the debate is that the two sides have very different interpretations of what happened. The Marbles were purchased, not stolen, in a transaction that was completely legal and above board at the time. However the “seller” was in essence an occupying power (the Ottomans) who the Greeks saw as having no right to them at all and certainly not to sell them.
From the Greek perspective, the marbles were flogged off by Imperial powers who had no right to them, and any deal made at the time is null and void due to who was making the deal. From the British perspective, the deal was legitimate. And beyond that, there is no guarantee that the Marbles would have survived the War of Independence and would likely have been neglected for years (possibly beyond all repair) before the Greek state looked after them properly. The fact is that Britain was way ahead of its time in preservation of artefacts, even if the way they acquired them was at best questionable at times. They were preservers as well as looters.
I’ve seen the Elgin Marbles in the British Museum, and I’ve been to the Parthenon and the Parthenon Museum. I do think they should return to Greece, but not because they were stolen. Because they have a rightful home that can now take care of them. My hope is that in reframing the debate in that way the impasse can be broken.
Britain doesn’t owe either of these countries, nor should they give the artefacts to them.
Loads of imperialistic brits coming up with whataboutisms here.
You know you can admit this should all be returned and think the receiving countries aren’t perfect you know? Those aren’t exclusives
You don’t see all of Europe asking Italy for everything the Romans plundered from them, this will literally do nothing
This seems a bit counterproductive isn’t it? The more foreign governments push for this, the more the British government will resist, since conceding would be seen as a diplomatic defeat and embarrassment at home and abroad. I guess it’s a good way to rile up nationalistic support domestically though.
Personally I think the Elgin Marbles should go back to the Acropolis, regardless of whether they were acquired legally or not, but I am against the blanket repatriation of all artifacts from museums, it should be on a case-by-case basis – for example I think the Rosetta Stone should stay in London.
So I guess this move is dictated by common goals, as India has also claimed back the famous Koh-i-noor diamond that adorns the imperial crown Charles used in the coronation.
They can ask.
But we currently use a Pakistani call center to answer all calls, so, good luck with that.
piss off
I don’t think the UK gives a rats ass about what India or Greece says.
So you know all the Benin bronzes in Germany? Where did they all go?
22 comments
Unexpected but very welcome
Absolutely right.
We purchased them from the Ottomans, it’s time to return them to Turkey (For the right price).
India is supposedly planning on doing this to get the Koh-i-noor diamond back, but this [report](https://www.ndtv.com/india-news/uk-media-reports-on-indias-move-to-bring-back-kohinoor-incorrect-sources-4034407#pfrom=home-ndtv_uktrending) seems to indicate otherwise.
in that case Greece should be looking east at ~~constantinople~~ istanbul and not Britain.
either way the Elgin Marbles were purchased therefore they are right where they belong. blame turkey for selling them
It’s a difficult balance.
I fully support the desecration of London based arts & humanities. I also enjoy triggering the coalition of purple haired anti-imperialists and right-wing nationalists who pine for the return of such artefacts.
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Fo9DC19WcAEwxnO.jpg
The country from which most of the works in the British Museum come from is Italy and yet we are the only ones who see it as an advertisement for our country
The British Museum would be empty if they had to return all the ~~stolen~~ violently borrowed items they have.
Let’s see if the British government gives a different reply than their usual ‘nuh uh’
Weird, you’d think Greece and India might have more important things to worry about than old stones and diamonds.
Some stuff given back is immediately sold by local African autocrats.
>Victims of colonial appropriation
So this means we are getting back all those priceless Anglo-Saxon gold artifacts back from Denmark?
As well as payment for all the tin the Romans took? With the expected 5% compound interest for 1600+ years?
We are at least going to get a repayment for all that English tax money being syphoned off to Normandy and Anjou, right?
Right guys?
Why does India always mention the Koh-i-Noor? it was legally and verifiable gifted to the British.
To be blunt, portraying it in that manner is pretty much torpedoing any chance of it ever happening. The Elgin Marbles are a complex case and not one that is going to be solved by another country wading in for nationalist purposes like that.
The biggest hurdle to the debate is that the two sides have very different interpretations of what happened. The Marbles were purchased, not stolen, in a transaction that was completely legal and above board at the time. However the “seller” was in essence an occupying power (the Ottomans) who the Greeks saw as having no right to them at all and certainly not to sell them.
From the Greek perspective, the marbles were flogged off by Imperial powers who had no right to them, and any deal made at the time is null and void due to who was making the deal. From the British perspective, the deal was legitimate. And beyond that, there is no guarantee that the Marbles would have survived the War of Independence and would likely have been neglected for years (possibly beyond all repair) before the Greek state looked after them properly. The fact is that Britain was way ahead of its time in preservation of artefacts, even if the way they acquired them was at best questionable at times. They were preservers as well as looters.
I’ve seen the Elgin Marbles in the British Museum, and I’ve been to the Parthenon and the Parthenon Museum. I do think they should return to Greece, but not because they were stolen. Because they have a rightful home that can now take care of them. My hope is that in reframing the debate in that way the impasse can be broken.
Britain doesn’t owe either of these countries, nor should they give the artefacts to them.
Loads of imperialistic brits coming up with whataboutisms here.
You know you can admit this should all be returned and think the receiving countries aren’t perfect you know? Those aren’t exclusives
You don’t see all of Europe asking Italy for everything the Romans plundered from them, this will literally do nothing
This seems a bit counterproductive isn’t it? The more foreign governments push for this, the more the British government will resist, since conceding would be seen as a diplomatic defeat and embarrassment at home and abroad. I guess it’s a good way to rile up nationalistic support domestically though.
Personally I think the Elgin Marbles should go back to the Acropolis, regardless of whether they were acquired legally or not, but I am against the blanket repatriation of all artifacts from museums, it should be on a case-by-case basis – for example I think the Rosetta Stone should stay in London.
So I guess this move is dictated by common goals, as India has also claimed back the famous Koh-i-noor diamond that adorns the imperial crown Charles used in the coronation.
They can ask.
But we currently use a Pakistani call center to answer all calls, so, good luck with that.
piss off
I don’t think the UK gives a rats ass about what India or Greece says.
So you know all the Benin bronzes in Germany? Where did they all go?