“We do want to strengthen our democracy,” Mr Reynolds said. “We believe if people make a contribution to this country, if they live here, there’s an argument for having them involved in [the democratic] process.”
So, in other news, we want all those who pay taxes to vote…
Make access to citizenship easier, but probably shouldn’t extend this right unless it’s reciprocated
It’s 5 years of continuous residence (6 months of every year minimum) for it to apply. Which allows a vote. That nay or may not impact government outcome.
On the other hand you can just get your buddy to donate via an offshore and directly influence policy directly.
Think of it this way will a settled voter have a direct line into any party? Then would someone throwing millions into a party get direct access?
In a week where the government voted against tightening foreign money to stop outside influence they really don’t have a leg to stand on.
Why give ANY ammunition for the Tories? This is stupid.
Win power first.
Why is this always being framed in relation EU citizens?
Isn’t it all foreign nationals with residency? So Canadians and Australians, or Japanese.
But all the media articles frame it in terms of the Tory pro-brexiteer agenda.
*Labour’s shadow business secretary, Jonathan Reynolds…*
*”We do want to strengthen our democracy,” Mr Reynolds said. “We believe if people make a contribution to this country, if they live here, there’s an argument for having them involved in [the democratic] process.”*
****
To give someone who just happens to be working here the vote is crazy talk. To allow someone who is working here a possible chance at citizenship, obviously.
Labour making themselves unelectable again, at a time where we need change.
I genuinely don’t like this. Ireland is different because of complex and painful historical reasons, but I already don’t like that we give Indians and Australians the vote even though they’re not British citizens and unless they’re 80+ years old have never been British subjects.
Citizenship is meant to mean something. Parliament is meant to be representative of the *British people*, not the people who *happen to live in Britain,* including those who would freely admit no identity connection to this country.
Parliament makes the most serious decisions a body can make, do we go to war, do we make peace, do we send people to prison, do we give people certain rights. Our representatives should be accountable to those who this country belongs to, or *should* belong to – British citizens.
Lawfully resident foreign citizens are welcome in this country, but they have no legal allegiance to it. If they want the right to vote for our parliament, they should take on the duty of becoming a citizen.
Almost no other country on earth hands out voting rights to national assemblies to non-citizens like we do.
Hmm I’m torn. If they’ve got settled status then it’s their home too. So it would make sense for them to have a say in the country’s matters. But at the same time it does kinda defeat the purpose of naturalisation if people can live here forever and have all the rights that citizens get without actually being one.
It seems quite risky to state this now though. It’s a fairly controversial idea and so it could go either way in gathering support. Maybe it’ll be popular among EU nationals, but they’re not voting in the next GE anyway. So there’s not much point fighting for their vote right now.
Would make more sense to say this after winning the GE to grab a few million more votes.
I guess the idea is immigrants are more likely to vote for Labour. Whether you agree with it or not, It wasn’t Labour who started monkeying wrong with voting rights for their own benefit
Great to hear, its nice to see Labour finally coming out about its plans to get this country back on track. I see no issue with this, if you’ve lived here for five years and regularly pay taxes, why shouldn’t you have say?
The sting won’t be taken out of immigration propaganda until blunt truths are laid out.
Those with permanent leave to remain can vote already. Point that out and then ask about the motive of the media organization running this non-story
The rights and wrongs of Brexit aside. If your not a citizen of this country then you shouldn’t have the right to vote.
Why would Starmer think this is a winning policy or even a good idea?
No sane country would give voting rights to people who are non citizens. They vote, they leave and the UK citizens who by definition can’t leave are stuck living with the consequences for 5 years. It’s madness.
Out of all the things Labour could be talking about – strikes, the NHS, the cost of living, fuel costs, rejoining the EU and protest laws – they choose to talk about something that not even left wing people agree with.
They’re just making themselves un-electable.
Correct headline should be “Labour Considers Extending Voting Rights to EU Citizens **With Permanent Residency in the UK**.”
It is still an extension, and a good few people will take issue with it (personally I think the local elections only rule at present is the best option) but after the last decade or so it’s a little hard to believe this wasn’t a tactical headline omission by the BBC.
I’m torn on this to be honest, on one hand, if you live here, pay taxes and abide by the laws of the land.. then why shouldn’t you get to vote?
On the other hand, if you aren’t a citizen, why should you get to vote? You living and working here does not mean you have the countries best interest at heart and if the country collapses you can hop on a plane back to wherever you hold citizenship.
Personally if I had a choice I think I would vote against this, although I’m finding it hard to justify exactly why.
I really do not think this is helping Starmer though.. this guy has gone from his party having a sure win in the next GE to what? Is this really happening? Could the Conservatives actually win again??
We need proportional representation before any other kind of voting reform.
As a European living here, I appreciate the consideration, but I don’t believe I should be entitled to vote until I have citizenship. This plan is unfair the citizens of the UK.
I find this hysterical because of the Britons living outside of the UK that couldn’t vote in the referendum for Brexit, nor in the 2019 general election. This hit those living in the EU especially hard and the vote is being promised again, but will believe it when I see people confirming it. But now non-citizens are being promised a vote under labour. Ok.
[removed]
Can someone clarify, is this (I.e. letting foreign nationals living in your country who are not citizens vote in your national leadership elections) a thing in other countries in the EU?
If you have UK citizenship, then you can vote in the general election. Without citizenship, you don’t have a stake in the future of the UK, where the decisions made in parliament can influence the rest of your life.
If you have settlement (indefinite leave to remain) then you should be limited to local/council elections only. You should have the opportunity to vote on issues local to where you live, but if you are unwilling to become a British citizen then you shouldn’t be able to vote in the general elections.
EU citizens or EU British citizens?
Would be very dumb to allow EU citizens to vote in a different counter wtf
Can a non-citizen be conscripted in times of war? Nope.
Therefore, there is no right to vote for the national legislature. Point being, as well as there being positives to being a citizen, there’s also downsides and legal constraints, the upside to which is the right to vote. Want to vote? Prove your willingness to commit to the country by obtaining Citizenship along with all the pros and cons that comes with.
Paying income tax for 5 years is nothing. Tax is a statutory requirement, not evidence of personal investment in a state.
Terrible idea from Labour, this. Bound to be pretty unpopular, i’d imagine, too. I suspect (or should I say, hope) that it’ll just be watered down to including 16y/o in the franchise.
Getting closer to a GE. Guess it’s time for labour to start shooting themselves in the foot
They want to include 16 and 17-year-olds because they’re easily swayed.
Lmao, most EU countries (certainly the ones where people came over en mass) are much more conservative than the UK is in general.
Labour might be shooting themselves in the foot here.
Not like they were any better on Brexit, so what do they have to offer Polish, Romanian, and Bulgarian voters? Left LGBTQ politics, and a huge for muslims?
Not sure that’s a vote winner in those demographics.
Kinda like how Voter ID seems to have somewhat backfired on the Tories, by alienating older voters.
27 comments
“We do want to strengthen our democracy,” Mr Reynolds said. “We believe if people make a contribution to this country, if they live here, there’s an argument for having them involved in [the democratic] process.”
So, in other news, we want all those who pay taxes to vote…
Make access to citizenship easier, but probably shouldn’t extend this right unless it’s reciprocated
It’s 5 years of continuous residence (6 months of every year minimum) for it to apply. Which allows a vote. That nay or may not impact government outcome.
On the other hand you can just get your buddy to donate via an offshore and directly influence policy directly.
Think of it this way will a settled voter have a direct line into any party? Then would someone throwing millions into a party get direct access?
In a week where the government voted against tightening foreign money to stop outside influence they really don’t have a leg to stand on.
Why give ANY ammunition for the Tories? This is stupid.
Win power first.
Why is this always being framed in relation EU citizens?
Isn’t it all foreign nationals with residency? So Canadians and Australians, or Japanese.
But all the media articles frame it in terms of the Tory pro-brexiteer agenda.
*Labour’s shadow business secretary, Jonathan Reynolds…*
*”We do want to strengthen our democracy,” Mr Reynolds said. “We believe if people make a contribution to this country, if they live here, there’s an argument for having them involved in [the democratic] process.”*
****
To give someone who just happens to be working here the vote is crazy talk. To allow someone who is working here a possible chance at citizenship, obviously.
Labour making themselves unelectable again, at a time where we need change.
I genuinely don’t like this. Ireland is different because of complex and painful historical reasons, but I already don’t like that we give Indians and Australians the vote even though they’re not British citizens and unless they’re 80+ years old have never been British subjects.
Citizenship is meant to mean something. Parliament is meant to be representative of the *British people*, not the people who *happen to live in Britain,* including those who would freely admit no identity connection to this country.
Parliament makes the most serious decisions a body can make, do we go to war, do we make peace, do we send people to prison, do we give people certain rights. Our representatives should be accountable to those who this country belongs to, or *should* belong to – British citizens.
Lawfully resident foreign citizens are welcome in this country, but they have no legal allegiance to it. If they want the right to vote for our parliament, they should take on the duty of becoming a citizen.
Almost no other country on earth hands out voting rights to national assemblies to non-citizens like we do.
Hmm I’m torn. If they’ve got settled status then it’s their home too. So it would make sense for them to have a say in the country’s matters. But at the same time it does kinda defeat the purpose of naturalisation if people can live here forever and have all the rights that citizens get without actually being one.
It seems quite risky to state this now though. It’s a fairly controversial idea and so it could go either way in gathering support. Maybe it’ll be popular among EU nationals, but they’re not voting in the next GE anyway. So there’s not much point fighting for their vote right now.
Would make more sense to say this after winning the GE to grab a few million more votes.
I guess the idea is immigrants are more likely to vote for Labour. Whether you agree with it or not, It wasn’t Labour who started monkeying wrong with voting rights for their own benefit
Great to hear, its nice to see Labour finally coming out about its plans to get this country back on track. I see no issue with this, if you’ve lived here for five years and regularly pay taxes, why shouldn’t you have say?
The sting won’t be taken out of immigration propaganda until blunt truths are laid out.
Those with permanent leave to remain can vote already. Point that out and then ask about the motive of the media organization running this non-story
The rights and wrongs of Brexit aside. If your not a citizen of this country then you shouldn’t have the right to vote.
Why would Starmer think this is a winning policy or even a good idea?
No sane country would give voting rights to people who are non citizens. They vote, they leave and the UK citizens who by definition can’t leave are stuck living with the consequences for 5 years. It’s madness.
Out of all the things Labour could be talking about – strikes, the NHS, the cost of living, fuel costs, rejoining the EU and protest laws – they choose to talk about something that not even left wing people agree with.
They’re just making themselves un-electable.
Correct headline should be “Labour Considers Extending Voting Rights to EU Citizens **With Permanent Residency in the UK**.”
It is still an extension, and a good few people will take issue with it (personally I think the local elections only rule at present is the best option) but after the last decade or so it’s a little hard to believe this wasn’t a tactical headline omission by the BBC.
I’m torn on this to be honest, on one hand, if you live here, pay taxes and abide by the laws of the land.. then why shouldn’t you get to vote?
On the other hand, if you aren’t a citizen, why should you get to vote? You living and working here does not mean you have the countries best interest at heart and if the country collapses you can hop on a plane back to wherever you hold citizenship.
Personally if I had a choice I think I would vote against this, although I’m finding it hard to justify exactly why.
I really do not think this is helping Starmer though.. this guy has gone from his party having a sure win in the next GE to what? Is this really happening? Could the Conservatives actually win again??
We need proportional representation before any other kind of voting reform.
As a European living here, I appreciate the consideration, but I don’t believe I should be entitled to vote until I have citizenship. This plan is unfair the citizens of the UK.
I find this hysterical because of the Britons living outside of the UK that couldn’t vote in the referendum for Brexit, nor in the 2019 general election. This hit those living in the EU especially hard and the vote is being promised again, but will believe it when I see people confirming it. But now non-citizens are being promised a vote under labour. Ok.
[removed]
Can someone clarify, is this (I.e. letting foreign nationals living in your country who are not citizens vote in your national leadership elections) a thing in other countries in the EU?
If you have UK citizenship, then you can vote in the general election. Without citizenship, you don’t have a stake in the future of the UK, where the decisions made in parliament can influence the rest of your life.
If you have settlement (indefinite leave to remain) then you should be limited to local/council elections only. You should have the opportunity to vote on issues local to where you live, but if you are unwilling to become a British citizen then you shouldn’t be able to vote in the general elections.
EU citizens or EU British citizens?
Would be very dumb to allow EU citizens to vote in a different counter wtf
Can a non-citizen be conscripted in times of war? Nope.
Therefore, there is no right to vote for the national legislature. Point being, as well as there being positives to being a citizen, there’s also downsides and legal constraints, the upside to which is the right to vote. Want to vote? Prove your willingness to commit to the country by obtaining Citizenship along with all the pros and cons that comes with.
Paying income tax for 5 years is nothing. Tax is a statutory requirement, not evidence of personal investment in a state.
Terrible idea from Labour, this. Bound to be pretty unpopular, i’d imagine, too. I suspect (or should I say, hope) that it’ll just be watered down to including 16y/o in the franchise.
Getting closer to a GE. Guess it’s time for labour to start shooting themselves in the foot
They want to include 16 and 17-year-olds because they’re easily swayed.
Lmao, most EU countries (certainly the ones where people came over en mass) are much more conservative than the UK is in general.
Labour might be shooting themselves in the foot here.
Not like they were any better on Brexit, so what do they have to offer Polish, Romanian, and Bulgarian voters? Left LGBTQ politics, and a huge for muslims?
Not sure that’s a vote winner in those demographics.
Kinda like how Voter ID seems to have somewhat backfired on the Tories, by alienating older voters.