Could it be brexit? Could it be austerity? Could it be the housing pyramid scheme? Could it be the clown show that is the conservatives party?
No. Gen Z are to blame.
>that of young people showing a reluctance to work beyond what is expected of them
You mean, fullfill their contracted requirements? If you want overtime or “above and beyond”, you should offer something more to make the worker want to do it, not threaten them/insult them.
​
Also lol at the “office culture” etc, we all know the real issue here and it has nothing to do with productivity, nothing to do with office culture, nothing to do with “what if they aint working” (in which case you will have proof… because they wont be doing their work).
The real issue is now, as always, that overpriced office space rental/ownership is a huge part of the market and people invested in office property are bricking it.
Long before the end of this piece I was hearing it in Jacob Rees-Mogg’s voice. If you’d handed me the text without the context I’d have been convinced it was intentional satire.
I can’t really put in to words how deeply, profoundly stupid this article is.
One of the things they are raging about is that Gen Z people change jobs more frequently. But that’s entirely normal at the start of any person’s working life, it was the case for me too, swapped through a few crappy jobs fairly quickly and then found a decent one to stick with for a while. Jobs don’t reward loyalty particularly these days so changing is often the only way to increase salary to match inflation at all.
Most of the rest of it seems to be ‘old people discover young people bitching/joking about their jobs on tiktok, are confused and angry and take them completely seriously’
And then there’s the chart where they freak out about our productivity being lower than USA’s…ignoring that Japan, which has one of the most notorious ‘work yourself to death in the office’ cultures, is way way below the UK, USA, France, Italy…
Gen Z here.
My first job was remote working from home during the pandemic. For the first 4 months or so I went above and beyond what was expected of me.
My “reward” was a new title (same pay) and extra responsibilities. I burned out VERY quickly after this and just couldn’t cope with it anymore.
As a result I withdrew from the extra responsibilities only doing what was on my initial contract.
Long story short the director got very mad at me for not wanting to run his business for him anymore on min wage and did his best to make my experience more crappy since he couldn’t actually fire me for it.
If you want a young, productive workforce then you also have to put the effort in to nurture them. It’s easy to ignore a remote worker’s struggles because you don’t have to see them struggling. If you want your remote workers to be happy you have to put that effort in yourself too.
No it seems that young people are correct in their belief that their employer doesnt give a shit about them.
>Much of the language is couched in terms of “asserting boundaries”, “knowing your worth”, and other ideas of self-care popular among Gen Z.
Bloody selfish youth, putting their own self worth and well being ahead of profit margins they won’t see a penny of.
Imagine calling yourself a newspaper and holding 20 somethings more accountable for the economy than the politicians you helped put in charge.
Shirking, fuck you Telegraph, your readership are dying off and I hope your paper follows
>“Frankly, if I don’t get paid for overtime why should I be expected to provide more of a service? It makes no sense to do that.
He’s looking after himself first. Perfect Tory attitude. You would have thought the Telegraph would love it, lol.
Argh, how absolutely typical of the Telegraph.
I’m Gen X/ Millennial cusp, but I can see that technology has offered a new future way to work, that was proven to work during the pandemic. Why should we stick to an absolutely pointless system that sucks your soul away when we don’t have to? Work should be about getting the job done, not just being under the thumb between 9-5.
They wonder why their politics doesn’t appeal to young people and why people are not turning more conservative as they get older anymore. They have nothing to offer younger generations, no hope or future, so they turn against them.
As a gen z person living in the UK I frankly see very little point in working for a company they treat you like shit make you work hard and very little money at the end. Considering that basically you will never own a house because the prices are ridiculously high I don’t blame them. Blaming young people on the collapse of the economy is just another Tory thing to cover up Brexit and the cost of living crisis 😂 WHICH THEY HAVE CAUSED NOT YOUNG PEOPLE
What many young people have realised is that work doesn’t pay enough to provide the kind of life that their parents and grandparents had. In the 50s, 60s, and 70s, a house could be bought and paid for with one income (usually the man). In this day and age, this is unattainable unless you happen to belong to a wealthy family or are fortunate to have a really good job.
In China, there is the ‘lying flat’ movement, and young people do the bare minimum to earn just enough to manage. In the USA, workers are ‘quiet quitting’ because while their companies might be posting record profits, they aren’t seeing any of that money, so what’s the point in working hard?
The US, to its shame, has reinstituted child labour in some states rather than pay workers more. https://www.theguardian.com/law/2023/may/01/us-surge-efforts-reduce-child-labor-regulations
Gen Z can afford more and better “stuff” such as smartphones, computers, flat screen TVs, cars, and suchlike, but not property since it became a commodity.
The world can’t afford billionaires.
Some of the comments on that article are fucking moronic. You have people stating that if you’re salaried that means you get to do unlimited unpaid overtime, what fucking planet are they on?
​
I am contracted to do X hours for Y salary. Anything after that needs to be paid for as overtime.
maybe the feudalism fetishists shouldnt have gutted the economy via landlords and to the benefit of entrenched wealth?
Weird that they have a whole article bashing young people for working from home, yet they have a graph at the bottom of it showing that young people aren’t the ones who work from home.
I mean, it’s there in big and bold, yet the article it’s in says the opposite of what it says.
>For Generation Z, those born from 1997 onward, “hybrid” models of home and office work are all they have ever known.
Funny that the Telegraph blame the pandemic for something they seem to think started in 2013… Or perhaps the Telegraph writers are of the social class that *doesn’t* have to start work at 16.
>But a common thread begins to emerge watching them back-to-back – that of young people showing a reluctance to work beyond what is expected of them, particularly if they work from home.
Well… no. Of course not. Who in their right mind is going to do more work than is required of them for the same (low) pay? What is this, the USSR? Let’s not encourage a something-for-nothing culture, eh? We live in a world populated by capitalists and ruled by capital and capitalists. The people who are purportedly *paying* these young people for 40 hours a week of work are capitalists. Therefore they should know that nothing comes for free. Least of all the labour of other people. If they want more work, they can pay more for it. I disagree with capitalism, which is why I get pretty narked off when I see its biggest champions completely failing to adhere to its principles. If you can’t do it right, don’t do it at all, so let’s try bringing it all down and organising ourselves according to anarcho-communism.
>[Liz Emerson, of the Intergenerational Foundation, a think tank that champions young people, argues young workers are missing out on crucial development by not being in an office](https://i.imgur.com/sUiqYMn.png)
[Another pretty graph from the article](https://i.imgur.com/7nYXKGL.png). With a little edit from me of course. Output has fallen from 96 [something unspecified] per hour to 100 per hour. Scary. Output isn’t like Boris Johnson. It doesn’t fall upwards.
Bloody millennials. Walking round like they rent the place.
Millennials🤝Gen Z
Getting blamed by Boomers for the things they’re not responsible for.
LOL get fucked.
Start writing hit-pieces on the private schoolboys shirking from the Houses of Parliament. At least there isn’t fucking cocaine all over my house.
Pay crap wages, strip benefit packages then people will move jobs.
I have lost count how many times I have contracted into companies who have issues with retention and are confused at why it’s happening, yet offer no yearly pay rises, no progression, no benefit packages they just expect people to stay becasue they already work there….
Putting out an article like this now, is absurd as putting out an article in the late nineties/early oughts whingeing that millennials are ‘shirking responsibility’ by sending emails instead of sweating over reams of paper being sent over a fax machine, or avoiding daily walks down to the post office to send physical letters.
Luddites
Older generations spend an entire day posturing in an office and manage to get less done
The problem with this mentality is whats the alternative?
I can’t think of a single country on the planet which doesn’t have massive issues with economic unfairness being experienced by younger populations. Unless it’s one of those smaller nations in northern Europe or the Middle East…and they come with a whole host of complications themselves.
I genuinely think there is a productivity and ambition problem with a lot of the UK. Part of is due to government mismanagement and low wages, part of it also a rather delusional sense of lifestyle. Social media has done a lot of damage bombarding young people with the lifestyles of the 1% which make anyone’s life, by comparison, seem mediocre. I also see too many here who scoff at the thought of education, in fact, that now seems to have spread to even trades. There seems to be so much of the British workforce working bullshit jobs attained with questionable “soft skills” that its no surprise that we require immigrant labour for not only unskilled labour, but a lot of skilled labour too. I’m a software engineer earning _a lot_ of money and I’ve been kinda shocked at the amount of one stage interviews I’ve had which makes me think there is a severe lack of talent out there, despite how tepid the job market is in tech. For comparison, an American firm I interviewed for last year expected me to fo 5 interviews and a coding challenge as part of the interview process.
UK salaries _are_ poor but there are still plenty of professions where one can command a very respectable income which still experience a lack of workers. Hell, I’m starting to notice there is a lack of people with a tangible ability to “do something” in general. My girlfriend gets her nails done and her technician (which employs British born girls) charge £50+ a pop for a design. Both the owner and technicians are making a killing. I feel so many young people either lack the ambition, are suffering health/mental health problems debilitating them or are tiding over in some low skilled job whilst bullshitting on YouTube/instagram/tiktok hoping to be another Jake Paul/Molly Mae/KSI. Yeah, desiring fame has always been a thing but I feel social media sells the illusion of it being within reach way more than it actually is.
The problem with the UK is not only shoddy leadership but a cultural problem as well. We seem to be stuck between a desire for European social safety nets whilst also wanting American style lasse faire capitalism. We all want affordable housing, but then half of us are terrified at the thought of our homes losing value and a bunch more move into the somewhat morally dubious “BTL” market. You can’t refuse anything other than WfH (which i fo myself) and then act surprised when they ship your job to India or bring over an immigrant to fill it instead. We, as a society, need to pick our poison.
Who the fuck even reads the daily telegraph these days?
For decades the best use of it was wrapping for fish and chips …
… or wiping your shitty arse in a pinch
In 1988 I left school and went immediately into work. I had £50 a week on a Youth Training Scheme. Yes it was shit. But it was work. Flash forward a few years I became manager of first floor of the store I was trained in. Yes it was shitty, yes it was long hours. But I stuck at it because I know it takes hard work to get results. To note – I am not for or against this article. I saw many young staff come and go, but they all stayed for at least a year usually while studying. That was during the 90s however. The last 10 years we burn through young staff like wildfire, aside from one or two of them, none of them want to work and frequently call in sick on Friday nights and weekends.
Wow, the millennials have finally passed the baton. Have fun being blamed for all the world’s problems for the next two decades Gen Z.
I reckon this more to do with the fact they had to spend 20+ years going into the office. Personally I work longer hours at home and leave the office a bit earlier to make it up and hit the gym.
P.s. I’m a Millennial and even before the pandemic did 2 days a week at home.
It’s a good job gen z doesn’t vote or us boomers would really be in the shit
The Torygraph have decided to give up on any younger readership by blaming them for absolutely everything, including problems that it’s own readers caused by doing as the Torygraph told them to.
The Torygraph is gaslighting its own readers.
God I despise these generation terms and anyone that uses them seriously.
Z’ers barely have jobs anyway, apart from influencers or only fans “entrepreneurs”
Newspaper columnists generally work from home. They are telling on themselves. Mind you, the piss poor quality of the stuff the Telegraph prints is more than enough evidence that they aren’t doing anything productive.
The Telegraph is so awful, it’s not even fit to be used as toilet paper.
This sub is completely fucked lol.
“Who would do more work than they’re required for no reason” – but at the same time expect “inflation matching raises” for no reason. Very funny
Heh. We have people shirking from home from all generations. The gen z crowd are among the best for actually coming to the office. It’s the 35-65 crowd who won’t bloody show up.
37 comments
Name a more iconic duo than boomers from the Telegraph bitching about young people
Since the article can be paywalled, here is a non-paywalled version:
https://archive.is/jNYgg
Could it be brexit? Could it be austerity? Could it be the housing pyramid scheme? Could it be the clown show that is the conservatives party?
No. Gen Z are to blame.
>that of young people showing a reluctance to work beyond what is expected of them
You mean, fullfill their contracted requirements? If you want overtime or “above and beyond”, you should offer something more to make the worker want to do it, not threaten them/insult them.
​
Also lol at the “office culture” etc, we all know the real issue here and it has nothing to do with productivity, nothing to do with office culture, nothing to do with “what if they aint working” (in which case you will have proof… because they wont be doing their work).
The real issue is now, as always, that overpriced office space rental/ownership is a huge part of the market and people invested in office property are bricking it.
Long before the end of this piece I was hearing it in Jacob Rees-Mogg’s voice. If you’d handed me the text without the context I’d have been convinced it was intentional satire.
I can’t really put in to words how deeply, profoundly stupid this article is.
One of the things they are raging about is that Gen Z people change jobs more frequently. But that’s entirely normal at the start of any person’s working life, it was the case for me too, swapped through a few crappy jobs fairly quickly and then found a decent one to stick with for a while. Jobs don’t reward loyalty particularly these days so changing is often the only way to increase salary to match inflation at all.
Most of the rest of it seems to be ‘old people discover young people bitching/joking about their jobs on tiktok, are confused and angry and take them completely seriously’
And then there’s the chart where they freak out about our productivity being lower than USA’s…ignoring that Japan, which has one of the most notorious ‘work yourself to death in the office’ cultures, is way way below the UK, USA, France, Italy…
Gen Z here.
My first job was remote working from home during the pandemic. For the first 4 months or so I went above and beyond what was expected of me.
My “reward” was a new title (same pay) and extra responsibilities. I burned out VERY quickly after this and just couldn’t cope with it anymore.
As a result I withdrew from the extra responsibilities only doing what was on my initial contract.
Long story short the director got very mad at me for not wanting to run his business for him anymore on min wage and did his best to make my experience more crappy since he couldn’t actually fire me for it.
If you want a young, productive workforce then you also have to put the effort in to nurture them. It’s easy to ignore a remote worker’s struggles because you don’t have to see them struggling. If you want your remote workers to be happy you have to put that effort in yourself too.
No it seems that young people are correct in their belief that their employer doesnt give a shit about them.
>Much of the language is couched in terms of “asserting boundaries”, “knowing your worth”, and other ideas of self-care popular among Gen Z.
Bloody selfish youth, putting their own self worth and well being ahead of profit margins they won’t see a penny of.
Imagine calling yourself a newspaper and holding 20 somethings more accountable for the economy than the politicians you helped put in charge.
Shirking, fuck you Telegraph, your readership are dying off and I hope your paper follows
>“Frankly, if I don’t get paid for overtime why should I be expected to provide more of a service? It makes no sense to do that.
He’s looking after himself first. Perfect Tory attitude. You would have thought the Telegraph would love it, lol.
Argh, how absolutely typical of the Telegraph.
I’m Gen X/ Millennial cusp, but I can see that technology has offered a new future way to work, that was proven to work during the pandemic. Why should we stick to an absolutely pointless system that sucks your soul away when we don’t have to? Work should be about getting the job done, not just being under the thumb between 9-5.
They wonder why their politics doesn’t appeal to young people and why people are not turning more conservative as they get older anymore. They have nothing to offer younger generations, no hope or future, so they turn against them.
As a gen z person living in the UK I frankly see very little point in working for a company they treat you like shit make you work hard and very little money at the end. Considering that basically you will never own a house because the prices are ridiculously high I don’t blame them. Blaming young people on the collapse of the economy is just another Tory thing to cover up Brexit and the cost of living crisis 😂 WHICH THEY HAVE CAUSED NOT YOUNG PEOPLE
What many young people have realised is that work doesn’t pay enough to provide the kind of life that their parents and grandparents had. In the 50s, 60s, and 70s, a house could be bought and paid for with one income (usually the man). In this day and age, this is unattainable unless you happen to belong to a wealthy family or are fortunate to have a really good job.
In China, there is the ‘lying flat’ movement, and young people do the bare minimum to earn just enough to manage. In the USA, workers are ‘quiet quitting’ because while their companies might be posting record profits, they aren’t seeing any of that money, so what’s the point in working hard?
The US, to its shame, has reinstituted child labour in some states rather than pay workers more. https://www.theguardian.com/law/2023/may/01/us-surge-efforts-reduce-child-labor-regulations
In every case, money keeps on flowing upwards, and very little flows back down, and there are currently over 2,600 billionaires in the world, and that number is growing. https://en.as.com/latest_news/how-many-billionaires-are-there-in-the-world-in-2023-n/
Gen Z can afford more and better “stuff” such as smartphones, computers, flat screen TVs, cars, and suchlike, but not property since it became a commodity.
The world can’t afford billionaires.
Some of the comments on that article are fucking moronic. You have people stating that if you’re salaried that means you get to do unlimited unpaid overtime, what fucking planet are they on?
​
I am contracted to do X hours for Y salary. Anything after that needs to be paid for as overtime.
maybe the feudalism fetishists shouldnt have gutted the economy via landlords and to the benefit of entrenched wealth?
Weird that they have a whole article bashing young people for working from home, yet they have a graph at the bottom of it showing that young people aren’t the ones who work from home.
I mean, it’s there in big and bold, yet the article it’s in says the opposite of what it says.
>For Generation Z, those born from 1997 onward, “hybrid” models of home and office work are all they have ever known.
Funny that the Telegraph blame the pandemic for something they seem to think started in 2013… Or perhaps the Telegraph writers are of the social class that *doesn’t* have to start work at 16.
>But a common thread begins to emerge watching them back-to-back – that of young people showing a reluctance to work beyond what is expected of them, particularly if they work from home.
Well… no. Of course not. Who in their right mind is going to do more work than is required of them for the same (low) pay? What is this, the USSR? Let’s not encourage a something-for-nothing culture, eh? We live in a world populated by capitalists and ruled by capital and capitalists. The people who are purportedly *paying* these young people for 40 hours a week of work are capitalists. Therefore they should know that nothing comes for free. Least of all the labour of other people. If they want more work, they can pay more for it. I disagree with capitalism, which is why I get pretty narked off when I see its biggest champions completely failing to adhere to its principles. If you can’t do it right, don’t do it at all, so let’s try bringing it all down and organising ourselves according to anarcho-communism.
>[Liz Emerson, of the Intergenerational Foundation, a think tank that champions young people, argues young workers are missing out on crucial development by not being in an office](https://i.imgur.com/sUiqYMn.png)
[Another pretty graph from the article](https://i.imgur.com/7nYXKGL.png). With a little edit from me of course. Output has fallen from 96 [something unspecified] per hour to 100 per hour. Scary. Output isn’t like Boris Johnson. It doesn’t fall upwards.
Bloody millennials. Walking round like they rent the place.
Millennials🤝Gen Z
Getting blamed by Boomers for the things they’re not responsible for.
LOL get fucked.
Start writing hit-pieces on the private schoolboys shirking from the Houses of Parliament. At least there isn’t fucking cocaine all over my house.
Pay crap wages, strip benefit packages then people will move jobs.
I have lost count how many times I have contracted into companies who have issues with retention and are confused at why it’s happening, yet offer no yearly pay rises, no progression, no benefit packages they just expect people to stay becasue they already work there….
Putting out an article like this now, is absurd as putting out an article in the late nineties/early oughts whingeing that millennials are ‘shirking responsibility’ by sending emails instead of sweating over reams of paper being sent over a fax machine, or avoiding daily walks down to the post office to send physical letters.
Luddites
Older generations spend an entire day posturing in an office and manage to get less done
The problem with this mentality is whats the alternative?
I can’t think of a single country on the planet which doesn’t have massive issues with economic unfairness being experienced by younger populations. Unless it’s one of those smaller nations in northern Europe or the Middle East…and they come with a whole host of complications themselves.
I genuinely think there is a productivity and ambition problem with a lot of the UK. Part of is due to government mismanagement and low wages, part of it also a rather delusional sense of lifestyle. Social media has done a lot of damage bombarding young people with the lifestyles of the 1% which make anyone’s life, by comparison, seem mediocre. I also see too many here who scoff at the thought of education, in fact, that now seems to have spread to even trades. There seems to be so much of the British workforce working bullshit jobs attained with questionable “soft skills” that its no surprise that we require immigrant labour for not only unskilled labour, but a lot of skilled labour too. I’m a software engineer earning _a lot_ of money and I’ve been kinda shocked at the amount of one stage interviews I’ve had which makes me think there is a severe lack of talent out there, despite how tepid the job market is in tech. For comparison, an American firm I interviewed for last year expected me to fo 5 interviews and a coding challenge as part of the interview process.
UK salaries _are_ poor but there are still plenty of professions where one can command a very respectable income which still experience a lack of workers. Hell, I’m starting to notice there is a lack of people with a tangible ability to “do something” in general. My girlfriend gets her nails done and her technician (which employs British born girls) charge £50+ a pop for a design. Both the owner and technicians are making a killing. I feel so many young people either lack the ambition, are suffering health/mental health problems debilitating them or are tiding over in some low skilled job whilst bullshitting on YouTube/instagram/tiktok hoping to be another Jake Paul/Molly Mae/KSI. Yeah, desiring fame has always been a thing but I feel social media sells the illusion of it being within reach way more than it actually is.
The problem with the UK is not only shoddy leadership but a cultural problem as well. We seem to be stuck between a desire for European social safety nets whilst also wanting American style lasse faire capitalism. We all want affordable housing, but then half of us are terrified at the thought of our homes losing value and a bunch more move into the somewhat morally dubious “BTL” market. You can’t refuse anything other than WfH (which i fo myself) and then act surprised when they ship your job to India or bring over an immigrant to fill it instead. We, as a society, need to pick our poison.
Who the fuck even reads the daily telegraph these days?
For decades the best use of it was wrapping for fish and chips …
… or wiping your shitty arse in a pinch
In 1988 I left school and went immediately into work. I had £50 a week on a Youth Training Scheme. Yes it was shit. But it was work. Flash forward a few years I became manager of first floor of the store I was trained in. Yes it was shitty, yes it was long hours. But I stuck at it because I know it takes hard work to get results. To note – I am not for or against this article. I saw many young staff come and go, but they all stayed for at least a year usually while studying. That was during the 90s however. The last 10 years we burn through young staff like wildfire, aside from one or two of them, none of them want to work and frequently call in sick on Friday nights and weekends.
Wow, the millennials have finally passed the baton. Have fun being blamed for all the world’s problems for the next two decades Gen Z.
I reckon this more to do with the fact they had to spend 20+ years going into the office. Personally I work longer hours at home and leave the office a bit earlier to make it up and hit the gym.
P.s. I’m a Millennial and even before the pandemic did 2 days a week at home.
It’s a good job gen z doesn’t vote or us boomers would really be in the shit
The Torygraph have decided to give up on any younger readership by blaming them for absolutely everything, including problems that it’s own readers caused by doing as the Torygraph told them to.
The Torygraph is gaslighting its own readers.
God I despise these generation terms and anyone that uses them seriously.
Z’ers barely have jobs anyway, apart from influencers or only fans “entrepreneurs”
Newspaper columnists generally work from home. They are telling on themselves. Mind you, the piss poor quality of the stuff the Telegraph prints is more than enough evidence that they aren’t doing anything productive.
The Telegraph is so awful, it’s not even fit to be used as toilet paper.
This sub is completely fucked lol.
“Who would do more work than they’re required for no reason” – but at the same time expect “inflation matching raises” for no reason. Very funny
Heh. We have people shirking from home from all generations. The gen z crowd are among the best for actually coming to the office. It’s the 35-65 crowd who won’t bloody show up.