US State Department does not call Karabakh Armenians’ exodus ethnic cleansing until there is ‘evidence’
by dekokraft
US State Department does not call Karabakh Armenians’ exodus ethnic cleansing until there is ‘evidence’
by dekokraft
9 comments
Even the Armenian PM Pashinjan denied it being an ethnic cleansing.
No shit, these accusations are strong and require more than just hearsay.
If you know anything about the level of hate Azeri’s has been cooking up for 35+ years, or just read about the insane actions even civilian Azeri‘s have committed… It’s with good reason Armenians don’t wait around to find out.
This is ethnic cleansing, because everyone knows there’s no life under Azeri rule.
FFs, they even made a national hero of the guy who axe-murdered a sleeping Armenian colleague at a NATO seminar in Budapest. [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ramil_Safarov](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ramil_Safarov)
Staying is suicidal. Balkan level hate is amateur hour compared to this. If you KNOW your killers have been brainwashed to hate you, and you the killers are going to be rewarded for killing you. Would you stay?
This is imo what people don’t get about the conflict. It’s not about legal borders, it’s about not getting genocided.
Right they are. We shouldn’t be so quick to jump to conclusions.
As the first prosecutor of the International Criminal Court has said, you don’t need to put guns in the face of people to commit genocide or by extension ethnic cleansing. Creating intolerable conditions and credible threats of violence of the kind Armenians have been subjected to is more than enough.
Ocampo wrote this even before the attack on Karabakh and the ensuing flight of the Armenians as soon as the road was opened for them to leave:
> The blockade of the Lachin Corridor by the Azerbaijani security forces impeding
access to any food, medical supplies, and other essentials should be considered a
Genocide under Article II, (c) of the Genocide Convention: “Deliberately inflicting on
the group conditions of life calculated to bring about its physical destruction.”
There are no crematories, and there are no machete attacks. Starvation is the
invisible Genocide weapon. Without immediate dramatic change, this group of
Armenians will be destroyed in a few weeks.
> Starvation as a method to destroy people was neglected by the entire
international community when it was used against Armenians in 1915, Jews and Poles
in 1939, Russians in Leningrad (now Saint Petersburg) in 1941, and Cambodians in
1975/1976. Starvation was also neglected when used in Srebrenica in the winter of
1993/1994.
> Analyzing the Srebrenica case, the International Court of Justice ruled that
“deprivation of food, medical care, shelter or clothing” constitute Genocide within the
meaning of Article II(c) of the Genocide Convention.
> State parties of the Genocide Convention assumed the duty to prevent and
punish Genocide. The International Court of Justice ruled that state parties should “not
wait until the perpetration of Genocide commences,” and “The whole point of the
obligation is to prevent or attempt to prevent the occurrence of the act.”
https://www.cftjustice.org/wp-content/uploads/2023/08/Moreno-Ocampo-Expert-Opinion.pdf
Samantha Power, who wrote a book about genocide and included a chapter about the Armenian Genocide shut up about it when she took a job for Obama at the State Department. Refusing to use the word while she was there. Now, under Biden, who recognized it, she can use the genocide word, but not the ethnic cleansing yet.
I think this makes it clear that it’s best not to look to politicians for the answers to these questions.
Classic Armenian tactics:
– Ask government representatives questions with loaded words and loaded assumptions
“Are you going to sanction Azerbaijan about the genocide and/or the war crimes they committed?”
– Government representative doesn’t use the same loaded words, doesn’t make the same loaded assumptions or expresses doubt while answering the question: “I’m not sure”, “the ‘alleged’ war crimes”, “the claims you mention” and so on.
– Armenians: BOOOO GOVT REP DOESN’T USE OUR TERMINOLOGY AND OUR LOADED WORDS AND DOESN’T SUPPORT OUR NARRATIVE BOOO COMPLICIT GENOCIIIDE BLOOD IN YOUR HAANDS
Dude they named a street after Enver Pasha. Come tf on now.
So does blockading and starving an entire population for months until they surrender and leave not count as evidence of ethnic cleansing?
1) News.am is a Russian-backed tabloid in Armenia that is generally not tolerated in the Armenia subreddit. It’s literally owned by Putin’s buddy and pro-Russia oligarch Robert Kocharyan (https://en.aravot.am/2018/08/21/217496/), whose forces have tried numerous times to oust the democratically elected government (they’re still trying to do this as we speak this very moment).
Here is what the r/Armenia automod has to say.
>Dear r/Armenia, the moderation team would like to remind you all that news.am is a tabloid-grade news outlet with poor quality reporting – usually no real reporting beyond a few sentences copied from somewhere else. Please, try to use other, more credible sources when submitting important news.
https://old.reddit.com/r/armenia/comments/swsbep/artsakh_expresidents_generals_forming_new/hxnxi20/
2) Headline is sensationalist. What Miller said is that they want an international fact-finding mission to determine what happened before doing anything. This is literally in-line with what the Armenian government has been pleading with the rest of the world to do for the last 9 months of blockade (but never materialized).
Many such press pieces of the Armenian government asking for what Miller is proposing:
>Armenia reiterates need for international fact-finding mission in Lachin Corridor and Nagorno-Karabakh
https://armenpress.am/eng/news/1118440/
>Armenia again calls for international fact-finding mission to Lachin Corridor and Nagorno Karabakh
https://armenpress.am/eng/news/1110245.html
But News.am, being a Russian mouthpiece, wants to make the West look bad amid Armenia’s liberalization and Westernization so they can convince the population to pivot back to Russia.
3) OP is an Azerbaijani in Baku. They deleted evidence of this before they started hanging out in several Armenian subreddits and talking about Armenia. I wonder why? Proof: https://i.imgur.com/qj45Dfi.png
4) Here is the original source material for anyone to read: https://www.state.gov/briefings/department-press-briefing-october-3-2023/#post-487618-ARMENIAAZERBAIJANRUSSIA