Dissenting opinion? Ban. You wanna ban? BAN. Banned from the stand. Banned. Chill Gazpacho.
Israel is getting so prissy right now. Playing the weaponized word game super hard. Maybe they should focus on their “ground invasion” instead of trying to McCarthy everyone into silence
[removed]
Even if you disagree with what UN said, it’s maddening to ban the most important diplomatic body from your country when you’re stuck in a geopolitical conflict that every nation on Earth has a stake in.
Oh you have any criticism of the way we’re handling things? BANNED… also you’re a racist.
If anything, this proves that we need independent reporting. Hamas are lying about everything, Israel are trying to silence anyone that doesn’t repeat their rhetoric (also, calling them antisemites)… Then going as far as to flat out ban the UN because they dare speak a truth about how this conflict is not a simple thing?
There’s no real truth out there, only the bias reporting from each sides’ media.
If you gave a 13 year old sovereignty.
I think you have to see this in the context of internal Israeli politics. Netanyahu’s government are getting a LOT of criticism for their handling of security in the run-up to this conflict, as well as their longer-term policies that have inflamed relations with the Palestinians.
So the most enemies they can flail at, the stronger they hope it makes them look in the voters’ eyes. If the nasty UN are picking on poor old Israel, then Bibi’s government can try and look strong and just – it’s further building the siege mentality that has seen Israeli politics drift slowly rightwards for decades.
I would imagine the ban will last weeks if not days, and then normal diplomatic relations will be renewed. Whether they like it or not, Israel needs the UN.
This wasn’t decided in a vacuum.
In the years 2012-2017, the General Assembly passed 150 resolutions condemning countries for actions taken against a certain public. 124 of them, over 82 percent of all condemnation decisions, were against Israel. This number is not proportional considering the statistical data of the UN and other bodies regarding the population of Israel, its democracy index and more. On the other hand, so far the General Assembly has not yet passed a single resolution calling, for example, for reform in the Palestinian Authority or Hamas. In fact, the UN Human Rights Committee has a section that deals only with Israel, and it is the only country for which a special permanent section has been established in the agenda of each session. This means that whenever people want to talk about human rights violations in the Human Rights Committee, they will discuss Israel’s (alleged) violations .
The consequences of the use of different language towards Israel, the idle discussions and condemnations, are that many people in the world perceive Israel in a negative way that does not reflect reality. Simply put – people develop hatred for Israel because they think it is a country that commits crimes and violates international law, because the UN chooses to treat it only in such a negative way.
The negative language that is unique to Israel alone, the disproportionate amount of discussions, the international bodies that deal with it even when they have nothing to do with the conflict, and huge budgets that serve only one side – all come together with the goal of blackening Israel’s face. For most of the world’s citizens, the UN still represents a neutral body that seeks to promote the general good of humanity. As a result, many people are misinformed about Israel, ascribe credibility to it, and develop a negative opinion of it.
*”When you tear out a man’s tongue, you are not proving him a liar, you’re only telling the world that you fear what he might say.” ~ George R.R. Martin*
Man fuck Hamas, but people really do be here on reddit applauding the rise of fascism.
Israel has been the victim of a horrendous crime against humanity, so my sympathies are with their people.
However, if I can make one criticism of Israel’s government, it would be their arrogance and absolutist tone. Questions need to be asked about how seriously the government took the intelligence about Hamas’ attack, and to what degree it could have been prevented or minimised were they not so complacent. Perhaps this is why they’re being so bullish – to deflect criticism away from themselves.
Weeks ago, Biden warned Israel about letting their anger cloud their judgement – admitting that the US doing so led to mistakes post-9/11. Whether or not Israel “needs” the UN, their very public spat with them won’t do Israel any favours with the allies that they *do* need.
I appreciate that some people may take issue with this, because they feel a compulsion to defend “their side” 100% without room for nuance or criticism. However, there are similar views within Israel itself – a family friend who lives in Tel-Aviv has said Netanyahu should resign, and it [sounds like they’re not alone](https://amp.theguardian.com/world/2023/oct/22/pressure-grows-on-israel-to-negotiate-release-of-gaza-hostages) in their criticism of how the government has handled this crisis.
Nothing says “peaceful and considerate” like banning UN staff after they call you out.
Funny that nobody is actually quoting the relevant part:
“It is important to also recognize the attacks by Hamas did not happen in a vacuum.
The Palestinian people have been subjected to 56 years of suffocating occupation.
They have seen their land steadily devoured by settlements and plagued by violence; their economy stifled; their people displaced and their homes demolished. Their hopes for a political solution to their plight have been vanishing.
But the grievances of the Palestinian people cannot justify the appalling attacks by Hamas. And those appalling attacks cannot justify the collective punishment of the Palestinian people.”
This will do nothing to help their cause.
Yeah nothing says “modern democracy” like barring the UN from your country ………..
Oh man Israel is headed down a dark parth this century.
Israel is losing the plot here. I so honestly hope, with the power of democracy, Israelis realise their current leader is unfit to lead and get rid of him asap
God netanyahu needs to go.
Ohhh nooooo he said something mean so we have to ban UN staff. Really wish they could be here as witnesses to potential war crimes, just absolutely *gutted* we had to ask them to leave.
Okay, maybe I’m biased here since I’m portuguese and I’ve always respected Guterres.
The UN has acknowledged the suffering in ocupied palestinian territories for a long time now. He rightfully accused Hamas and denounced its terrorist nature, emphasised how it does not lawfully serve as any representation of the palestinian people… And it did all of this while underlying how this does not impede Israel’s right to self-defense, only its unmeasured response – which has comitted a number of civilian casualties due to either negligence or apathy, a horror that the UN is sadly too familiar with.
So I don’t get it. Anyone in his position would have to say the same things.
Israel must maintain its right to self-defense. Hamas is a terrorist organisation. This escalation is the result of populist exhacerbation from continuous clashing of these two facts. To deny *how* and *why* they are facts is, at the very least, insulting – and, at worst, a complete contradiction of previous UN statements and humanitarian projects.
The UN is a forum. Its voice, whoever they are, is there only to judge situations according to the UN charter. This was no different. Shame on the Israeli government for this façade.
Yeah, that isn’t a good look. Netanyahu is (almost) as bad for Israel as Hamas is for the Palestinians
I mean, Israel has never cared about Human rights laws – and it’ll stay that way as long as the US backs them.
Banning the UN? Haha I’m fucking done with these clowns.
“The only democracy in the Middle East”
Considering how many UN officials have died in airstrikes, this might actually save lives. Very uncharacteristic of them.
So when does the UN start treating Israel as a hostile nation in response? You know, sanctions, embargoes, stuff like that. Or is the UN as usual just going to silently bow down to Israel yet again?
26 comments
Dissenting opinion? Ban. You wanna ban? BAN. Banned from the stand. Banned. Chill Gazpacho.
Israel is getting so prissy right now. Playing the weaponized word game super hard. Maybe they should focus on their “ground invasion” instead of trying to McCarthy everyone into silence
[removed]
Even if you disagree with what UN said, it’s maddening to ban the most important diplomatic body from your country when you’re stuck in a geopolitical conflict that every nation on Earth has a stake in.
Oh you have any criticism of the way we’re handling things? BANNED… also you’re a racist.
If anything, this proves that we need independent reporting. Hamas are lying about everything, Israel are trying to silence anyone that doesn’t repeat their rhetoric (also, calling them antisemites)… Then going as far as to flat out ban the UN because they dare speak a truth about how this conflict is not a simple thing?
There’s no real truth out there, only the bias reporting from each sides’ media.
If you gave a 13 year old sovereignty.
I think you have to see this in the context of internal Israeli politics. Netanyahu’s government are getting a LOT of criticism for their handling of security in the run-up to this conflict, as well as their longer-term policies that have inflamed relations with the Palestinians.
So the most enemies they can flail at, the stronger they hope it makes them look in the voters’ eyes. If the nasty UN are picking on poor old Israel, then Bibi’s government can try and look strong and just – it’s further building the siege mentality that has seen Israeli politics drift slowly rightwards for decades.
I would imagine the ban will last weeks if not days, and then normal diplomatic relations will be renewed. Whether they like it or not, Israel needs the UN.
This wasn’t decided in a vacuum.
In the years 2012-2017, the General Assembly passed 150 resolutions condemning countries for actions taken against a certain public. 124 of them, over 82 percent of all condemnation decisions, were against Israel. This number is not proportional considering the statistical data of the UN and other bodies regarding the population of Israel, its democracy index and more. On the other hand, so far the General Assembly has not yet passed a single resolution calling, for example, for reform in the Palestinian Authority or Hamas. In fact, the UN Human Rights Committee has a section that deals only with Israel, and it is the only country for which a special permanent section has been established in the agenda of each session. This means that whenever people want to talk about human rights violations in the Human Rights Committee, they will discuss Israel’s (alleged) violations .
The consequences of the use of different language towards Israel, the idle discussions and condemnations, are that many people in the world perceive Israel in a negative way that does not reflect reality. Simply put – people develop hatred for Israel because they think it is a country that commits crimes and violates international law, because the UN chooses to treat it only in such a negative way.
The negative language that is unique to Israel alone, the disproportionate amount of discussions, the international bodies that deal with it even when they have nothing to do with the conflict, and huge budgets that serve only one side – all come together with the goal of blackening Israel’s face. For most of the world’s citizens, the UN still represents a neutral body that seeks to promote the general good of humanity. As a result, many people are misinformed about Israel, ascribe credibility to it, and develop a negative opinion of it.
*”When you tear out a man’s tongue, you are not proving him a liar, you’re only telling the world that you fear what he might say.” ~ George R.R. Martin*
Man fuck Hamas, but people really do be here on reddit applauding the rise of fascism.
Israel has been the victim of a horrendous crime against humanity, so my sympathies are with their people.
However, if I can make one criticism of Israel’s government, it would be their arrogance and absolutist tone. Questions need to be asked about how seriously the government took the intelligence about Hamas’ attack, and to what degree it could have been prevented or minimised were they not so complacent. Perhaps this is why they’re being so bullish – to deflect criticism away from themselves.
Weeks ago, Biden warned Israel about letting their anger cloud their judgement – admitting that the US doing so led to mistakes post-9/11. Whether or not Israel “needs” the UN, their very public spat with them won’t do Israel any favours with the allies that they *do* need.
I appreciate that some people may take issue with this, because they feel a compulsion to defend “their side” 100% without room for nuance or criticism. However, there are similar views within Israel itself – a family friend who lives in Tel-Aviv has said Netanyahu should resign, and it [sounds like they’re not alone](https://amp.theguardian.com/world/2023/oct/22/pressure-grows-on-israel-to-negotiate-release-of-gaza-hostages) in their criticism of how the government has handled this crisis.
Nothing says “peaceful and considerate” like banning UN staff after they call you out.
Funny that nobody is actually quoting the relevant part:
“It is important to also recognize the attacks by Hamas did not happen in a vacuum.
The Palestinian people have been subjected to 56 years of suffocating occupation.
They have seen their land steadily devoured by settlements and plagued by violence; their economy stifled; their people displaced and their homes demolished. Their hopes for a political solution to their plight have been vanishing.
But the grievances of the Palestinian people cannot justify the appalling attacks by Hamas. And those appalling attacks cannot justify the collective punishment of the Palestinian people.”
This will do nothing to help their cause.
Yeah nothing says “modern democracy” like barring the UN from your country ………..
Oh man Israel is headed down a dark parth this century.
Israel is losing the plot here. I so honestly hope, with the power of democracy, Israelis realise their current leader is unfit to lead and get rid of him asap
God netanyahu needs to go.
Ohhh nooooo he said something mean so we have to ban UN staff. Really wish they could be here as witnesses to potential war crimes, just absolutely *gutted* we had to ask them to leave.
Okay, maybe I’m biased here since I’m portuguese and I’ve always respected Guterres.
The UN has acknowledged the suffering in ocupied palestinian territories for a long time now. He rightfully accused Hamas and denounced its terrorist nature, emphasised how it does not lawfully serve as any representation of the palestinian people… And it did all of this while underlying how this does not impede Israel’s right to self-defense, only its unmeasured response – which has comitted a number of civilian casualties due to either negligence or apathy, a horror that the UN is sadly too familiar with.
So I don’t get it. Anyone in his position would have to say the same things.
Israel must maintain its right to self-defense. Hamas is a terrorist organisation. This escalation is the result of populist exhacerbation from continuous clashing of these two facts. To deny *how* and *why* they are facts is, at the very least, insulting – and, at worst, a complete contradiction of previous UN statements and humanitarian projects.
The UN is a forum. Its voice, whoever they are, is there only to judge situations according to the UN charter. This was no different. Shame on the Israeli government for this façade.
Yeah, that isn’t a good look. Netanyahu is (almost) as bad for Israel as Hamas is for the Palestinians
I mean, Israel has never cared about Human rights laws – and it’ll stay that way as long as the US backs them.
Banning the UN? Haha I’m fucking done with these clowns.
“The only democracy in the Middle East”
Considering how many UN officials have died in airstrikes, this might actually save lives. Very uncharacteristic of them.
So when does the UN start treating Israel as a hostile nation in response? You know, sanctions, embargoes, stuff like that. Or is the UN as usual just going to silently bow down to Israel yet again?