What does Old Korean and Old Japanese sound like to Finnish people?

Modern languages: [KOREAN & JAPANESE – YouTube](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wQUSTJ9gMeA)

Closest relatives: [JEJU & OKINAWAN (youtube.com)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VQg97pb3NYc&t=5s)

Wondering since Korean and Finnish share a number of grammatical similarities such as agglutination and vowel harmony. There aren’t any other languages around that sound similar to Korean, but Finnish doesn’t seem particular dissimilar since it’s a Uralic language which was thought to have been related to the hypothetical Altaic grouping in the past. If you only have time/interest for hearing samples, feel free to skip the spoilered part with information.

>!Modern Korean has a fairly regular vowel inventory of /a/ /ʌ/ /o/ /u/ /ɯ/ /i/ /e/  /ɛ/  /ø/  and /y/. It includes all the vowels Finnish has as well. According to the linguist Itō Chiyuki /yʌ/ used to be /e/ in the past. It also has a number of dipthongs. Korean has the vowels Finnish has as well, while /ɑ/ and /æ/ are similar to /a/ and /ɛ/. Finnish lacks /ɯ/ which Korean shares with Japanese instead.!<

>!The liquid /ɾ/ is seen as a archetypical characteristic, which is absent in most other languages.!<

>!Korean has little influence from other languages due to early state formation and geographic isolation. Most of the changes occuring over time happened due to internal development. Genetically Koreans cluster with Japanese, but aren’t particularly close to any others. O1b2 is their characteristic Haplogroup.!<

https://preview.redd.it/atgytoya0m9c1.png?width=474&format=png&auto=webp&s=14c8f5490c93fbcd09d245fb2ddc2fad56f37a60

>!The only foreign influence comes from a literary language called Classical Chinese, from which it derives much of its technical terminology from. This is also true for Japan and Vietnam. Modern English is the largest immediate influence with a few loanwords being used in everday speech.!<

>!It is theorized that Proto-Korean had contact with Proto-Japonic.!<

>!Some info on Korean and Old Korean/Old Japanese:!<

>!Same can be said for its consonants. Irregularities occur with tenses, which are romanized as tt, nn, pp, though they are written as clusters in their written form. Examples are 있다 itta (‘to be’), 했다 hætta (past form of ‘to do’), 서었다 sʌtta (past form of ‘to stand’) and 새끼 saekki (‘young animal, child’) though they are written as issta, haista and sʌsta based off their original Middle Korean pronounciation from the 15th century (from a earlier polysyllabic form that eliminated inbetween vowels and gave rise to the consonant clusters, e.g. isita > ìstá > itta, sasʌki > 삿기〮 sàskí > saekki). Korean grammar didn’t change between Old Korean and Modern Korean.!<

>!Most of the lexis is polysyllabic and the common monosyllabic word structure is CVC, which always become polysyllabic forms due to inflection, mostly with suffixation. So Korean words tend to become quite lengthy. Old Korean words more commonly had a CVCV structure, but lost the final vowel over time (e.g. ‘tree’ namoko > namok > namk > namu, ‘stream’ nari > nai > næ, ‘bear’ koma > kom,…)!<

>!The language with the most grammatical commonalities to Korean are Ainu, Japanese and Nivkh who are commonly grouped together as sorts of native languages to the area. All the various “Altaic” languages are also somewhat similar, with their overlaps and differences. Unlike Altaic, Japanese syntax has large overlaps.!< [How Similar are Japanese and Korean?](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JB2ZCa2arqA)

>!Its cultural cues have a lot of unique features exclusive to the two, not really thought to be borrowed from another.!<

>!Japanese talk “in a similar way” to Koreans, so i’m often able to make out the implication/meaning of a sentence while not knowing the concrete details of it. Maybe this is due to personal bias, since my family speaks a dialect (Satoori), which preserved the intonation form of the past. A sample would be this:!< [네이티브 경상도민만 구분할 수 있는 대구경북 부산경남 억양 차이 ㅋㅋㅋㅋㅋㅋㅋㅋㅋㅋㅋ](https://www.youtube.com/shorts/8XrXRrwY1Xk)

>!Top is Northern Southeastern Korea, Mid is Southern Southeastern Korea and the bottom one is the Central Korean dialect (also known as Standard Korean, the form most people are aware of)!<

>!It’s called “pitch accent” and is present in Osaka dialect (ほうげん【方言】 hougen) too. !< [Intonation of Japanese and Busan Dialect are Quite Similar? \[Korean Billy\]](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GdMQ3l2nBl0).

>!Japanese pitch accent system:!< [古代日本語の発音が難しすぎる件](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6dUTNC-fN44)

>!It is sometimes mistaken for tonality, which tends to have more complexity. Japanese sounds seem to have heavy elongating stress on final the syllable so it sounds very fluctuating and swinging.!<

[Japanese dialects](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-GCdztnwXyw&t=482s)

>!Numerals (modern):!<

[古代朝鮮語と日本語の数詞を比較するずんだもん](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ispP38Th0b0) >!(Old Korean – Old Japanese numerals)!<

>!\*kǝtǝn-ak > \*hʌtʌnah > \*hʌtnah > hʌ(n)nah > hana | pitǝ – hito-!<

>!tupǝr-ak – tupɨl – tul | puta – huta-!<

>!seti-ǝk – set | mi-!<

Some sample text:

**How old Old Japanese sounds:** [古代日本語会話講座-上代日本語で喋ってみた Old Japanese conversation](https://youtu.be/NzwmtkEzAo0?si=LXBGhVagXX3syJwI&t=51)

**How Old Korean sounds:** [Old Korean](https://youtu.be/DXjsp5s2BS0?si=PKiUzpelabRp86gU&t=246)

Old Korean words: [古代朝鮮語の発音は長ったらしい](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EgrV47hqShw)

Names of Japanese rulers: [歴代天皇の当時の名前と意味(私見)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rL958IehRuc)

Japanese is the only language family where linguistic theories regarding a genetic relative to Korean are seriously considered.

Sources:

[日韓祖語を再建しよう Proto-Koreo-Japonic #ずんだもん解説 #日琉祖語 #古代朝鮮語](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0AoNHdDhpaQ&t=81s)

[日韓祖語を再建しよう 補足①「畑」Proto-Koreo-Japonic #ずんだもん解説 #日琉祖語 #古代朝鮮語](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KLQ8OjEw584&t=0s)

[日韓祖語を再建しよう 補足②「針」Proto-Koreo-Japonic #ずんだもん解説 #日琉祖語 #古代朝鮮語](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jnb9mcgfwOI)

[日韓祖語を再建しよう 補足③「空」Proto-Koreo-Japonic #ずんだもん解説 #日琉祖語 #古代朝鮮語](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uAfAOhVqIjw)

[The Role of Contact in the Origins of the Japanese and Korean Languages. By J. Marshall Unger. Honolulu: University of Hawai‘i Press, 2009. xiii, 207 pp. $48.00 (cloth). | The Journal of Asian Studies | Cambridge Core](https://www.cambridge.org/core/journals/journal-of-asian-studies/article/abs/role-of-contact-in-the-origins-of-the-japanese-and-korean-languages-by-j-marshall-unger-honolulu-university-of-hawaii-press-2009-xiii-207-pp-4800-cloth/25C6DD0839EF4582F066C5F0C01F5891)

[Alexander Francis-Ratte | Furman University](https://www.furman.edu/people/alexander-francis-ratte/)



by DerpAnarchist