You can care about wales and love wales while believing wales would be better in the union. It doesn’t make you less Welsh. Just imagine what a Welsh independence referendum would do to communities and families. I saw what happened in Scotland, it’s still bad.
[deleted]
What a load of absolute twaddle
Of course wanting indy means you’re q nationalist in the xontecf. of Wales.
Welsh nats aren’t the people to be claiming this bs either.
He literally deprecated the issue from
The people being nationalist to the wider wales instead. Guys an idiot that’s twisting things to suit his narrative quite frankly rather than objectively looking at fact.
Also
> Robin Mann, Reader in Sociology, Bangor University
You mean first year student without a degree mate.
Wales is Nationalist, I dont see why it’s a bad thing?
It’s kind of the point of the people/gov to look out for the people in the country, people want to live a better life.
What is bad is inward looking, not stepping out to the world. It’s one of the thing’s Ireland & Scotland do better than Wales, they export culture and cultural produce in a way Wales has not.
edit also Independence for Wales is a relay bad idea, we dont have the money.
What’s the problem?
No, it just means you want to be a free country like any other, independent from the English Empire.
Without full control of wales the ARAF could roam freely across into English roads and cause some serious disruption. It’s a cost they simple can’t afford
Oxford definitions for nationalist
a person who strongly identifies with their own nation and vigorously supports its interests, especially to the exclusion or detriment of the interests of other nations.
(all indy supporters would voluntarily self identify as this)
a person who advocates or supports the political independence of a particular nation or people.
(this is backing independence)
So yes, it is fair to say if you support Welsh independence you are a nationalist
Backing independence is just stupid. Especially in the current climate where the world is getting particularly dangerous and even environmental policies are being dropped in favour of economic stability following increased competition and tariffs between countries.
Being a small independent country is not safe. At a minimum we need the UK, and at a minimum the UK needs the EU. Even Wales in the EU without the UK leaves Wales exposed.
Also, there is no good nationalism, it’s all the same, and it always results in hatred of others whether you think you’re in the side of the angels or not. Currently there is more hatred towards English people in Wales than I have ever seen in my lifetime, and it’s the “left wing nationalists” who love Gaza, love the working class, and hate rich people fuelling it all. Nationalism needs to be challenged whenever it raises its head. Always.
A nation is the traditions of the people, and particularly for Cymru, the language. Nationalism therefore, simple is not popular within Wales (the geographic region defined by Westminster).
A lot of the support for independence (and how it’s promoted by many) is only for economic or political reasons, not ideological. And that isn’t a stable foundation for a state.
I mean, if the vibes match with the meaning why be scared to call yourself a nationalist?
By definition someone who supports and advocates for the political independence of their country is a nationalist.
Also by definition someone who believes their country is better than others and all the connotations is also a nationalist…
But almost everyone understands Welsh Nationalists are typically people proud of their country’s unique heritage and culture and would support whatever they believe would be in the best interest of the country’s residents, including further devolution of independence if necessary…
If there are people out there that somehow hear Welsh Nationalists and immediately start imagining a group calling for an ethnostate and to embark on an imperiaist project for a “Greater Wales”, I’d love to see what crazy social media posts they’re reading.
There’s a big difference between cultural nationalism and the far-right kind we see in the form of Reform or the AfD. Welsh nationalism isn’t anti-immigrant – it’s about empowerment, not supremacy.
As a proud Welshmen I have never understood the desire for independence, England and Wales are so intertwined with countless generations crossing back and forth over the border we are essentially all related.
Whilst I think Wales, Scotland and Northern Ireland should have greater independence I think it would be a huge mistake to push for full independence, and what would be the outcome be greater dependency on the EU?
There are different forms (15) of nationalist, obviously the bigoted types are evil and as someone who is very much on the annibyniaeth side and is welcoming of anyone. Which one is this post detailing?
I’d be interested in this authors’ definition of Nationalist – they seem to imply that there’s a negative spin on Nationalism (i.e. ‘Nationalist’ like right wing wing American Republicans, Nigel Farage/Tommy Robinson, AfD and FPÖ in Germany/Austria) as opposed to the lesser globally known but more locally relevant progressive Nationalists (Irish/NI Sinn Feinn, Scottish SNP, Welsh Plaid Cymru, Cornish heritage and culture/language groups, etc).
Even if true independence isn’t in the cards now, it’s shifted the discussion to be more willing for increased Devolution. In 1979 Wales voted against it at all, whereas today people would generally demand more of it that what Wales already has recieved. It opens the possibility for a gradual improvement in circumstances until independence *is* a concievable possibility (it also gives the Senedd a chance to make a dogs’ bollocks of it and dissuade further devolution and independence dreams).
I think the difficulty in pinning down what a nationalist is is in part due to political expectations at all scales. In an ideal situation, I think Wales *could* handle independence down the line. Does that extend to the Senedd, today? probably not. In the same vein, it explains why there’s just as many people who support Welsh Independence as [there are people who would abolish the Senedd](https://nation.cymru/news/third-of-welsh-public-would-support-abolishing-senedd-new-poll/) – those beliefs aren’t neccesarily mutually exclusive based on how you interpet the question. You can wish for independence, but not as the Senedd currently operates.
15 comments
You can care about wales and love wales while believing wales would be better in the union. It doesn’t make you less Welsh. Just imagine what a Welsh independence referendum would do to communities and families. I saw what happened in Scotland, it’s still bad.
[deleted]
What a load of absolute twaddle
Of course wanting indy means you’re q nationalist in the xontecf. of Wales.
Welsh nats aren’t the people to be claiming this bs either.
He literally deprecated the issue from
The people being nationalist to the wider wales instead. Guys an idiot that’s twisting things to suit his narrative quite frankly rather than objectively looking at fact.
Also
> Robin Mann, Reader in Sociology, Bangor University
You mean first year student without a degree mate.
Wales is Nationalist, I dont see why it’s a bad thing?
It’s kind of the point of the people/gov to look out for the people in the country, people want to live a better life.
What is bad is inward looking, not stepping out to the world. It’s one of the thing’s Ireland & Scotland do better than Wales, they export culture and cultural produce in a way Wales has not.
edit also Independence for Wales is a relay bad idea, we dont have the money.
What’s the problem?
No, it just means you want to be a free country like any other, independent from the English Empire.
Without full control of wales the ARAF could roam freely across into English roads and cause some serious disruption. It’s a cost they simple can’t afford
Oxford definitions for nationalist
a person who strongly identifies with their own nation and vigorously supports its interests, especially to the exclusion or detriment of the interests of other nations.
(all indy supporters would voluntarily self identify as this)
a person who advocates or supports the political independence of a particular nation or people.
(this is backing independence)
So yes, it is fair to say if you support Welsh independence you are a nationalist
Backing independence is just stupid. Especially in the current climate where the world is getting particularly dangerous and even environmental policies are being dropped in favour of economic stability following increased competition and tariffs between countries.
Being a small independent country is not safe. At a minimum we need the UK, and at a minimum the UK needs the EU. Even Wales in the EU without the UK leaves Wales exposed.
Also, there is no good nationalism, it’s all the same, and it always results in hatred of others whether you think you’re in the side of the angels or not. Currently there is more hatred towards English people in Wales than I have ever seen in my lifetime, and it’s the “left wing nationalists” who love Gaza, love the working class, and hate rich people fuelling it all. Nationalism needs to be challenged whenever it raises its head. Always.
A nation is the traditions of the people, and particularly for Cymru, the language. Nationalism therefore, simple is not popular within Wales (the geographic region defined by Westminster).
A lot of the support for independence (and how it’s promoted by many) is only for economic or political reasons, not ideological. And that isn’t a stable foundation for a state.
I mean, if the vibes match with the meaning why be scared to call yourself a nationalist?
By definition someone who supports and advocates for the political independence of their country is a nationalist.
Also by definition someone who believes their country is better than others and all the connotations is also a nationalist…
But almost everyone understands Welsh Nationalists are typically people proud of their country’s unique heritage and culture and would support whatever they believe would be in the best interest of the country’s residents, including further devolution of independence if necessary…
If there are people out there that somehow hear Welsh Nationalists and immediately start imagining a group calling for an ethnostate and to embark on an imperiaist project for a “Greater Wales”, I’d love to see what crazy social media posts they’re reading.
There’s a big difference between cultural nationalism and the far-right kind we see in the form of Reform or the AfD. Welsh nationalism isn’t anti-immigrant – it’s about empowerment, not supremacy.
As a proud Welshmen I have never understood the desire for independence, England and Wales are so intertwined with countless generations crossing back and forth over the border we are essentially all related.
Whilst I think Wales, Scotland and Northern Ireland should have greater independence I think it would be a huge mistake to push for full independence, and what would be the outcome be greater dependency on the EU?
There are different forms (15) of nationalist, obviously the bigoted types are evil and as someone who is very much on the annibyniaeth side and is welcoming of anyone. Which one is this post detailing?
I’d be interested in this authors’ definition of Nationalist – they seem to imply that there’s a negative spin on Nationalism (i.e. ‘Nationalist’ like right wing wing American Republicans, Nigel Farage/Tommy Robinson, AfD and FPÖ in Germany/Austria) as opposed to the lesser globally known but more locally relevant progressive Nationalists (Irish/NI Sinn Feinn, Scottish SNP, Welsh Plaid Cymru, Cornish heritage and culture/language groups, etc).
Even if true independence isn’t in the cards now, it’s shifted the discussion to be more willing for increased Devolution. In 1979 Wales voted against it at all, whereas today people would generally demand more of it that what Wales already has recieved. It opens the possibility for a gradual improvement in circumstances until independence *is* a concievable possibility (it also gives the Senedd a chance to make a dogs’ bollocks of it and dissuade further devolution and independence dreams).
I think the difficulty in pinning down what a nationalist is is in part due to political expectations at all scales. In an ideal situation, I think Wales *could* handle independence down the line. Does that extend to the Senedd, today? probably not. In the same vein, it explains why there’s just as many people who support Welsh Independence as [there are people who would abolish the Senedd](https://nation.cymru/news/third-of-welsh-public-would-support-abolishing-senedd-new-poll/) – those beliefs aren’t neccesarily mutually exclusive based on how you interpet the question. You can wish for independence, but not as the Senedd currently operates.
Comments are closed.