1 Populist vs 20 Democrats & Republicans (ft. Cenk Uygur)
I’m Jake Uder. I’m host of the Young Turks live uh weekdays 6:00 to 8:00 p.m. Eastern on YouTube. I’m also the head of the TYT network. I’m also founder of Just Democrats Wolfpack and Rebellion Pack where we’re trying to bring the country together. And here I am surrounded by 20 Democrats and Republicans and I’m going to try to bring them together. Claim number one is that Democrats and Republicans agree on economic issues and try to divide us and distract us with culture wars. How are you, Jank? Good to meet you. Good to meet you. My name’s Oliver. Hey, Oliver. Yeah. So I guess um the first place I want to start off with your claim is to first say that I think there’s a grain of truth in it. And I think I would largely agree that when it comes to the system of neoliberalism, the system of capitalism, I think there can be a lot of overlap. I think where I would probably push back a little bit is when we look specifically at what policy issues get passed and how they affect people, there seems to be a very big difference. So for example, under the Biden administration, we saw with the expansion of the Affordable Care Act and Medicaid, we saw over 8 million people become eligible for Medicaid who were previously not eligible. If we contrast that right now with what’s in Trump’s big beautiful bill, over a 10-year period, that would make um between 15 and 16 million people ineligible for Medicaid. So, it seems on a crucial economic issue that affects people’s ability to, you know, um survive, have quality health care, live quality lives. There seems to be a stark contrast. So, I’m just wondering kind of, you know, your thoughts on that. So, where I would disagree is the word stark. So, I understand there is a contrast. That’s why I vote Democrat. But, uh these are giant butts here. So, first of all, they say on Medicare, oh, we should negotiate drug prices. The Democrats say, and then they never deliver. They didn’t even try to negotiate drug prices other than on insulin and maybe 10 other drugs. And you go, “Well, that’s pretty good.” No, that’s 10 drugs out of tens of thousands of drugs. At a maximum, it’s only a $6 billion savings when in reality, what we actually would do if we negotiated the drug prices is several hundred billion dollars in savings. So what I’m saying to you is while the Democrats do some things that are positive, they do it almost as a release valve. So they go, okay, for here’s another example that you mentioned, the Affordable Care Act. You know what it was called before it was called Obamacare. You can enlighten me. Oh, the Romney was a plan that was tried in a Republican state. Exactly. It was called Romney Care. And you know who came up with it? The Heritage Foundation. The same people who came up with Project 2025. That is a corporate release valve so that people don’t build up too much pressure and go to a rebellion or a revolution. But in the bottom line is that was a tiny tiny little fix thought of by a right-wing think tank. And then now when you say negotiate drug prices, Obama never did it even though he ran an ad called belly where he said he was going to do it. Uh Biden does at most 6% of it. The Democrats are constantly doing 5 to 10% as a little release valve, but keep the machine going exactly as it is. And we can totally agree that there should be more that’s done. I guess maybe I was taking your claim too literally which is that Democrats and Republicans agree on economic issues. And maybe you qualify in there. Is it largely agree? Is it mainly agree? Oh, it’s definitely lar Yeah, it’s not 100% agree otherwise it it would be too obvious. But is it true that they largely agree? Of course. So I’ll give you many other examples. Pay family leaves at 84%. Yet the Democrats never seem to be able to pass it. Why do they never pass it? Cuz they’re not trying. They said they’d do the public option. Joe Biden didn’t even announce them introduce the public option. Why? Because they agree with Republicans. Well, I don’t think they agree with Republicans necessarily. I just think that sometimes it’s hard to pass legislation in a bitterly divided Congress. Would you acknowledge that it’s difficult very often in order to get things done? You don’t. You don’t. That is the number one excuse Democrats use. Oh golly, gee, there was nothing we could do. And they say there was nothing we could do. There was nothing we could do. In reality, in reality, it he didn’t even try for the public option. Biden, he didn’t introduce it. So that pulls it over 70%. Why not try? Sure. $15 minimum wage. The Republicans didn’t take that out of the bill. Joe Biden took it out of the bill. You see those things where you can tell intent and the intent is he actually agrees with the donor class and the Republicans. He doesn’t want those things. And brother, if you can’t pass a bill at 84%. Then are you saying the Democrats are the most incompetent politicians in history? I’m not saying they’re the most incompetent party and I’m also not saying they’re perfect. I think that we re we risk running into an issue where we equate the two parties as being virtually the same which leads people to not voting whatsoever at all because they think the whole class is against them and I’m in complete agreement with you that the the parties are the two party system is fundamentally broken and that Democrats in a lot of ways have a lot of the same issues. I guess what I pro predominantly have an issue with is those who maybe don’t take the time to have nuance in the discussion and just say oh they agree on economic issues and they only want to divide us on cultural issues. I think it’s important. It’s important to make that cuz otherwise people stay home, they don’t vote, and then we’re in the situation that we’re in right now when a lot of people don’t end up voting. No, but Oliver, so let me tell you my perspective on it. That’s really important. So Democrats always say, “Hey, look, there’s a 5 to 10% difference, so you should vote for us.” But they don’t quite say it that way. You understand that. I understand that. A lot of people here understand that. But it’s a thing, right? No, but hold on. This is super important. But they tell the voters, “We’re going to make a big difference. We’re going to do minimum wage. we’re going to do public option. We’re going to do paid family leave. And when they don’t, people get disappointed and disappointed and that leads them to not voting. That leads them to hating the Democratic party. What I’m saying is go with populist left. That is the one thing that has not been tried. We would actually do the bills. We do the bills. Otherwise, then you’re the same as the Republicans. Fair enough. All right. Thank you very much. Thank you, Oliver. Hey, Jay. Great to meet you. Nice to meet you. Great to be speaking with you. Um I agree with your overall term here. Um I would say that at the end goal they agree that the economically we all want the same things, right? But the way we get it is two completely different economical viewpoints. We have the left that tends to be more socialist and communist and we have the right that is more crony capitalist. Okay. The left wants to take your taxes and they want to distribute it the way they want. Yeah. The right wants you to keep your taxes right now. They want you to keep your overtime taxes. They want you to keep your taxes uh untipped. So what is what is your Yeah. So first of all, brother, you got to stop saying socialism, communism. None of the democ because none of the democratic politicians are in favor of that. They’re actually Bernie Bernie quite literally. Yeah. No. So he says he’s a democratic socialist. Even he doesn’t really go towards uh what you would consider socialism because you’re putting socialism and communism in the same bucket where they don’t belong. None of them are in favor of ending corporations, ending capital, etc. In fact, Kla Harris and Joe Biden, their number one problem is that they’re corporatists, not that they’re socialists or communists. They will do they will do whatever corporate donors tell them to do business mandates. No, brother. No, but that’s drug companies. They’re doing the exact opposite of communism. They’re saying corporate donors, we will do whatever you corporations want. So, when you turn to the Republicans, it’s the same thing as Oliver. They have a 5 to 10% release valve with Donald Trump now. He’s pretending to be a populist. So, he goes, “Oh my god, Donald Trump isn’t pretending. He is a populist. Well, look at the He just won the popular vote, both left and right. No, no, no. Hold on. So, when you talk about that bill, the budget bill that is not big or beautiful. Well, it is big, but it’s definitely not beautiful. The majority of the tax cuts go, of course, as always, to the rich, right? But they put in a tiny release valve of, oh, we’ll help the middle class a little bit on on tips and overtime. Whether that even stays in the bill is a different question. What are they doing here? Let me tell you a fact. I make I I make more money in taxes. Yeah. No, I’ll tell you a fact. So what they do is they throw a little morsel at you as Obama and Biden throw a little more salon you on for social policies as we discussed earlier. But the overwhelming majority always goes to rich. For example, in this bill they’re cutting Medicaid and SNAP by 1.1 trillion. Do you know how much is going to people making above $500,000 a year in tax cuts? 1.1 trillion. Okay. So they’re literally taking from the poorest people and giving it to the richest people, which is what the liberals have been doing forever. So what’s the difference? How are they doing? So, no, brother. What I’m saying is you’re actually proving my point. Democrats and Republicans constantly say that they have giant differences. Then what did they what did the Republicans do? They do massive tax cuts for the rich. And then Obama, by the way, came in and actually made Bush’s tax cuts permanent, which cost us even more than the original Bush tax cuts did. So, there’s a lot of theater about how they disagree, but at the end of the day, you always get tax cuts more money when Republicans are in office. Why do me as a business owner? Cuz you save money. So, you know why? So, I’m a small business owner. So, we save a little bit of money. The giant corporations save a ton of money. Isn’t it better everybody saves money? No, it’s not because that makes no sense. No, brother. It’s easy to say, “Okay, then we shouldn’t have any roads, bridges, cops, fire departments.” Nobody’s saying that. We just don’t want our money going to say there’s no we shouldn’t have any tax. We just don’t want our money going to foreign uh countries. Oh, I couldn’t agree. On drag events. And by the way, that’s another thing that proves my point. Republicans and Democrats always do whatever Apac tells them. So, that is a foreign government. whole different argument. No, it’s not an argument. It’s the same argument. It’s a donor class. Thank you, Jay. Yeah. Hey man, nice to meet you. Nice to meet you. So, when you talk about this concept of like a release valve, it seems like you’re downplaying very relevant and very important differences that exist between the parties. know the Affordable Care Act, you you understand that expanded coverage to like millions of people, more people got Medicaid, uh premiums were subsidized, like this is good policy, and I agree with you. Sometimes in many cases, Democrats lack a spine. They don’t push hard enough. But I think chalking it up to like they’re pretty much the same. There’s just a little release valve difference is a little bit reductive. Yeah, it’s not at all reductive. And the Affordable Care Act is the perfect example of it. So, you’re right. It was better than the previous system because the previous system had pre-existing conditions and you can get blocked for that. And the American people despise that. So, it needed to be changed. That is part of the reason why a right-wing think tank, Heritage Foundation, came up with Romney Care. It’s a release valve and it’s a Republican idea. Then Mitt Romney took it and passed it in Massachusetts. That’s why it’s called Romney Care. Then Obama and Ram Romney ran a campaign where they pretended to be on exact opposite ends of the spectrum with the same exact health care plan. Literally the same exact healthare plan. So, do you think the ACA is like a right-wing health insurance plan? It was literally created by a right-wing thinking. The Republicans right now in Congress are trying to push a reconciliation bill that literally guts Medicaid when the ACA expanded Medicaid. Yes. So they always move the goalpost. So what what do they do? They bring in Okay, here’s our release valve. Okay, now the American people are still mad. Of course they are because and here let’s talk about the next steps that happened. Obama said, “Oh yeah, we might do the public option.” Which would have been not universal healthcare, but a good step forward. I was there. Young Turk’s been around forever. And I was like, “Yes, you got to do the public option.” Then Obama says publicly, “Oh, I guess we can’t do the public option.” Wink. And they immediately took it out of the bill. What’s that? That’s because of Joe Lieberman, right? But 59 59 other Democrats would have voted for Okay. See, that’s exactly what I’m talking about. So they always Hold on. They always have an excuse. So right now under Biden, the excuse was, “Oh, we don’t have enough senators. Oh, golly. Gee, hold on. Let the filibuster and the parliamentarian and then under Obama, they had 60. They could pass anything they wanted.” They’re like, “Let’s take a really, really long time with Romney care. Oh, oops. We ran out of our 60. Things changed.” Okay, now the Republicans are ignoring the parliamentarian when they’re trying to pass this bill. So, the Democrats keep finding excuses. Why did they take the public option out of the bill? You think they want the public option back again? I don’t think the Democrats want the public option at all. When 59 senators said, “We’ll vote yes on this and Liberman.” That’s what I’m trying to tell you, brother. They don’t mean it. So, let me give you two examples. Getting that from. Where am I getting it from Joe? Where am I from? Number one, the public option polls at over 70%. They didn’t even try to pass it. Number two, when Biden came into office said he was going to do public option, and then he lied and he never once introduced it. He never introduced compared to Obama. Oh, now they don’t have political capital. Golly, oh my god, I can’t. I can’t. I can’t. The voters are sick of I can’t. Why don’t you actually try? So tell me why they’re such losers and can’t pass paid family leave at 84%. Are they losers or do they actually secretly agree with the Republicans and they don’t want any of this because they’re corporate donors. I agree with you on policy. I want paid family leave. I want singlepayer healthcare. But this is not like super easy to pass. You’re like, if they just all pass in two weeks, we’re going to get like Okay, so here’s how you do it, guys. You see, you’ve been taught by mainstream media and Democratic politicians to accept failure. Oh my god, there’s nothing we could do to pass it. There’s nothing. Here’s how what you do. Super easy. Listen, listen. paid family leave is at 84. Why do I keep insisting on that? Because here’s what you would do. You would introduce it. 74% of Republican voters want it. And then you would say, “I dare you to vote against it. If you vote against it, you’re voting against 84% of Americans and you will lose your next election. I will campaign against you. I will find a Republican to campaign against you.” And then, but you say, “No, God, don’t even try. Don’t even try. Oh, we have these giant differences, but we never pass our bills. We never even try.” And who took out $15 minimum wage? Joe Biden took out $15 minimum wage. So they never mean it, brother. When is it going to get through to you that they don’t pass? They say that Republicans agree with us. They agree nominally. I’ll give you a great example of this. If you pull Republicans, should we cut Medicaid? They say no. When Medicaid’s actually cut and you pull them, they’re just cutting waste, fraud, and abuse. So like nominally, yes. Everyone agrees universal healthare is good. When you get into the nitty-gritty of actual policy, it gets a lot more complicated. I agree. Democrats should fight much harder. Use the bully pulpit. campaign on these issues, but the idea that they’re willfully, purposefully sabotaging themselves, some of them, sure, but this is not as easy as you’re painting it out to be. Okay, so number one, on pay on minimum wage, we at the UN fought for Bernie to put it back in and at least get a vote. Okay, it got a vote. And guess what happened? The eight Democratic senators who were pretending to be in favor of it all of a sudden voted with the Republicans. They had more than enough to block it cuz the Democrats don’t mean it. They always do rotating villains. So, brother, at what point are you going to say the failure is on purpose and not golly gee, they’re the Washington generals against majorities when you have slim majorities. Paradigm shifting policy is just harder to pass. But 60 is not a slim majority. You constantly make excuses. Obama minimum wage. They still didn’t do it. If they could have 80 and you still find it was massive legislation that he got with 60. Yes. Beautiful Romney care from Heritage Foundation. All right, guys. Nice meeting you, man. Thank you, man. How are you? Hey there. Nice to meet you. Nice to meet you. So, you raised a very interesting point when you said that Democrats and Republicans agree essentially on the same issues and that they want to distract us with culture wars. The question that I would raise is why are culture wars a distraction when they are such a vital issue important to myself as a conservative and I’m quite certain to every Democrat in this room. Issues like abortion, social justice or things that affect us in ways that maybe some policies only benefit the rich. Why should we not focus on things that benefit Americans every day and that could affect women’s bodies or gay people’s right to get married or maintain the right? Yeah. So, I’m not saying that social issues are not important. That’s why I vote Democrat instead of Republican because I believe women should have the right uh to an abortion and many of the other things that are on the left. Okay. But at the same time, when you talk about transports, for example, do you know how many trans athletes there are in the NCAA’s? No, I don’t. 10 out of 500,000 athletes. So for 10 people, we had this giant debate and and and the far right were like, “No, that’s it. This is what the Democratic Party is all about.” And the far left was like, “Yes, that is all we’re about. And this is about vulnerable communities and you have to protect them.” So, this is the hill we’re going to die on and we’re going to talk about this non-stop. Okay? But meanwhile, we’re getting robbed every single administration. Trillions of dollars in tax cuts under Republicans and under Obama. Tax cut after tax cut for rich, the four for the corporations. Deregulation after deregulation. You know why they want to split us? They want you to fight left and right. They want you to look left and right. They don’t want you to look up. Look up. Okay? Of course, having to look up is is very vital. Okay? My my master always tells us to look up. That’s why I wear the cross. But the point that I’m making is is that social issues in order to really wouldn’t it be wouldn’t it make sense to effectively mobilize people you should start with things that they that can touch them every single day. Social issues impact children, women, men, all of us across all ages and across all ideologies. Shouldn’t it be for the American population whose average attention span is maybe 43 to 56 seconds at best to influence them politically, wouldn’t it be best to start with something like a social issue that would then raise their awareness to issues dealing with the rich and issues dealing with taxes? Why not? because that splits us. It splits us on purpose. Those don’t unify. I say the exact opposite. Why don’t you start on bills we all agree on that have over 70% popularity like getting money out of politics, anti-war, lowering drug prices through Medicare. Instead, you get to social issues. Here, I’ll give you I’m from a vulnerable community. I’m I’m from a Muslim background, right? But if I told Democrats, I want you to focus only on Muslim rights. That’d be mental. Don’t do that. I’m not saying don’t care about Muslim rights. I want you to care about that. I want everyone to have 100% same rights. What I’m saying is we build credibility by actually delivering for all of the American people. We raised all of your wages. We brought down drug prices for everyone for Republicans and Democrat. But by your but by your logic that could undermine certain things like going back in history for a second here, the civil rights movement, things like that which were inherently social and economic issues in combination. Why not? My question is why not work with both of those issues side by side? Why are you deliberately attempting to prioritize one over the other? No. So what I’m saying to you, brother, is two things. Number one, you can walk and chew gum at the same time. So you don’t have to give up Muslim rights. You don’t have to give up civil rights. You don’t have to stop worrying about that, etc. You can fight on that, but don’t forget, you’re not supposed to hate the other side. They want you to hate the other side. Stop hating the other side. Fight on the issues you don’t agree on. And then on the things you do agree on, stop listening to establishment Republicans and establishment Democrats that divide you so that you never realize, hey, why are all the most of the tax cuts going to the rich? Why are corporations getting every break? Why is it that in every bill all the subsidies go to oil companies, banks, etc. So why don’t we unite on the things we agree on first? But by your own logic, that that does a disservice to the fact that many well it doesn’t do a disservice. It acknowledges the fact that as you still vote Democrat, you are still in essence supporting the very system that you’re at the same time talking about tearing down. So it’s a lot of double talk, is it not? No. What I do, you can’t vote Democrat and then say that well well because they still support the rich and the rich get all the tax cuts, I’m still going to cast my vote, which is the most powerful political weapon you have to the very establishment that you’re on one hand trying to tear down. That’s why that’s why primaries are critical. What if I want one thing for you guys all to think about is you must vote in your primaries because the mainstream media doesn’t want you voting in the primaries because that’s where you can make real change. So that’s why they they love it when you go, “Oh, well, if you don’t vote for a Democrat, Trump’s going to be in office and Trump’s the boogeyman.” And the Republicans will say likewise, right? So go vote in your primary so you don’t have to worry about Democrats or Republicans. You’re still in the same party. But get rid of the bums who are for corporate donors who always serve donors and get people that you love on both economic issues and social issues. You don’t have to give up one, but you have to insist on them representing you and not the donor class. Very great conversation, brother. Great conversation. Hello. Hey, nice to meet you. Nice to meet you. Um, so I’m not going to disagree with you that in every case Democrats don’t go after the most radical economic policy. Um, one example, not radical, they all pull over 70%. Yeah, sure. Um, I’m a Democrat myself. I agree with a lot of what you say. One example, um, of what you said before is that Joe Biden uh, wanted to cut the corporate or raise the corporate income tax to 28% instead of back to 35%. However, I think that one point to consider uh would be the fact that a lot of the times Democrats are having to clean up the mess that Republicans made and when someone like Joe Biden only has two years of adequate Senate support, right? It’s very difficult to argue that he should be pursuing farther left tactics when we’re just trying to get a reconciliation bill passed that can be supported by Joe Mansion. Right? The economy was completely destroyed in 2020 after co. It was completely destroyed in 2007 after Obama. So, there has to be a little give there. So on economic issues, what I’m telling you, brother, is that they’re playing good cop, bad cop on you, on all of us. Okay? So the tax cuts is a perfect example. So you’re right. Donald Trump takes it from 35 to 21. It’s a massive corporate tax cut. That’s on Trump. That’s on the Republicans. Then Joe Biden says, “Well, I’m going to fight that.” And he gets a lot of votes to go fight that. And he says, “I’m going to bring it back up to 28%.” I’m like, “Wait, it was at 35. So already he’s conceding.” Yeah, I love corporate tax donor corporate tax cuts. Hold on. Then he says, “Oh, well, Joe Mansion wants to make it 25.” So, golly, gee, I don’t have a choice. 25. Then, did he fight for 25? No, he never introduced it. Never fought for 25. So, you tell me. Joe Biden for had four years and kept it at 21% and never even tried. Well, realistically, he had two years to get a bill passed. It’s the truth. At the end of the day, right, if Joe Mansion sticks it somewhere and he says, “Well, okay, maybe I’ll let you have an expansion on the child tax credit, for example, if you keep it at 20.” We don’t know all the backdoor negotiations that happened between Joe Biden and Joe Mansion. At the end of the day, right, uh you can’t have everything you want e whether you’re Joe Mansion or Joe Biden. Did you ever consider that they don’t mean it? The reason that Joe Biden never tried to raise corporate taxes is because he doesn’t want corporate taxes to go up. It was all a trick. It was all a game played on all of us. No, I know. There was nothing they could do. That’s why they didn’t even bother trying. They didn’t even They never bothered trying on any of this. And you keep insisting, “Well, good enough. Good enough. Good enough. I’ll take my 5% change. Thank you, sir. May I have another, sir? So, please, for God’s sake, wake up and unite to actually get economic policies that we love, the whole country wants, except those corrupt politicians. In West Virginia, Kla Harris lost by 30 points. Okay. If you put someone that is to the left of Kla Harris on any economic issue, they’re going to lose by that same margin. You’re totally wrong. Do you know what percentage of Americans want to not cut taxes on the rich, but raise taxes? Probably all of them when you ask it that way. No, no, no, no. What do you mean? On television they constantly say, “Oh, cutting taxes is popular. Raising taxes is very unpopular.” That’s not true. Raising taxes on the rich polls at 76%. You would win West Virginia. You would win Kentucky if you ran on populist campaign. If you said, “Yes, I’m going to raise taxes on the rich. Yes, I’m going to give you lower drug prices. Yes, I’m going to give you higher wages.” But the Democrats don’t say that. They say, “Oh, I’m going to try a little bit and then I’m not even going to introduce any of those.” that you’re seeing it through is the lens that a lot of voters seeing see it through when they’re going to vote for people like Joe Mansion, people that will give us a Senate majority. I Yeah, good. Thank you. Hi, Zena. Nice to meet you. Nice to meet you, Zena. Awesome. So, I think that we largely agree um like kind of others have said, I I just just like want a little clarity on understanding how Democrats like water down their social issues, things like DEI and other um measures to kind of bridge the gap that we’ve seen in like racial disparity for example. How in your worldview do we reconcile such issues? So in the beginning, did we need affirmative action? Definitely. Because what happened be before the civil rights movement was so let’s say that your firefighters or your long shoreman, those are really good jobs. They pay pretty well. They’re good blue blue collar jobs. What do you want to do? You pass it want to pass it on to your kids cuz you’re normal, right? That’s the type of thing that you want to do. But unfortunately at that point almost all the jobs are held by white people. So we do affirmative action because guys, we got to let others in otherwise it’s not fair, right? And so that makes sense. But then over the course of decade after decade after decade, we wind up with DEI. And DEI has some good things in it, but it also had some abuses in it. Like so we covered on the Young Turks. There’d be situations where a white woman would say, “Okay, now can I tell you my perspective?” And they would say, “No, shut up. Your job is to learn.” No, no, no, no, no. Don’t do that. Don’t do that. Okay. So, are you talking about like fringe cases in which like someone would say that they feel unfairly treated by DI? Because I think in any type of law that we’re going to see passed, we’re going to see fringe cases in which the law is is I guess manipulated in some case to negatively affect certain groups. But I think that we see like largely the effect on the black population is extremely substantial and extremely important. Um for example, we see that like um I think there’s a study done um I don’t remember if it was 2015 or 2002, but it was a study done where they simulated a class-based um DEI program instead of race. What we found was equally qualified black individuals were much less likely to be chosen on this class-based protocol. and and we saw that like um the protocol actually um represented a lot less of the black population that exists in this country whereas DEI ensures that we have a representative pool of applicants and um admitted students in our colleges which is extremely important. So look again DEI and affirmative action had their role had their place and often times they have a role now. So, but what what it also does at the same time though is it serves to divide us. And so, look, if you say to me, hey, maybe Muslims have a disadvantage even if you take class into account. So, should we give a little bit of extra weight to Muslim candidates? I would say absolutely not. Do not do that because then what it does is it makes everyone bitter about the Muslim candidates and it makes them seem like they find super important when in fact they did. what you’re explaining is the response to the policy and you’re not actually digging at the the policy in of itself. You’re saying because people will come out and be, you know, racist or islamophobic or whatever it might be because of a policy that is ensuring um equality of opportunity, we should cancel the policy. But that is not a critique of the policy. That’s a critique of the Republican or usually conservative response to said policy. So, do you have a problem with the policy or the response? So, my my point here is that this is among the different things that the Democrats do where they say, “Hey, we’re I think they’re being performative. They say, “Oh, we’re in favor.” But the outcome, but what it actually what the thing that would help African-American community, Latino community, Muslim community, all those communities is actually raising the minimum wage prices. But we never do the material help. We never do the things that equal things out economically. You still haven’t critiqued the policy in of itself. You’re saying people will get angry if we come out and we we you know promote these um different metrics. I am critiquing the policy. So what exactly about the policies? Because it divides us. How does the policy even though it has a saying that racism exists? Yeah. So racism no but not by saying that racism exists. So you have to acknowledge reality, right? What you’re saying is now we’re going to put black people in this category. We’re going to put white people in this category because there are categories that other subconscious level that we even if you get a benefit from that you say hey you know I reduced racism by 10% 20% etc. What you’re doing is you’re not noticing the giant downside of that, which is then people start to view each other as black, white, that happening unconsciously all the time. You’re right. But what I would love is for us to stop doing that psychology stop looking at me as a Muslim and you as a black I want him to look at you as an American, me as an American. If you want less racism and less racial categorizing or us to see that as less of an initial categorization, studies show that we need to attack racism and race as a concept like headon. We cannot ignore them or or you know input race neutral neutral um policy into place. We what what we find is that characterizing race, saying what it is, saying what racism is and thus, you know, confronting ourselves with our biases is what limits them. So no, we can’t say oh you know let’s stop dividing people with the with the corrective policy. the corrective policy is is helping something that has always existed that’s that’s happening all the time. So I told you I have an issue with the policy itself. I think it divides us and do the Democrats actually passed their agenda even if they agreed with you. Did they pass voting rights act? They did not. The problem is situating to write framework which I think was what you’re doing here when you said the response to DEI is going to be negative. The thing is when we Sorry. Thank you. All right. Thank you. Hey, good to meet you. Good to meet you. Uh, so Democrats don’t want to pass their agenda. I would say they want to pass their agenda. It’s just if you asked 50 Democrats what their agenda is, you’d get 60 different answers. We’ve got the environmentalists who hate the labor people. The labor people hate the environmentalists. We have the gay rights lobby. We have racial justice people. We have all different people. Immigration activists like everybody thinks that their issue is the most important one. And I know you don’t acknowledge that uh usually at the beginning of an administration there’s the maximum political capital. And if they don’t get something in that time, then they weren’t really trying. But what has happened in the past, we saw Biden pass a number of bills in those first two years. uh the CHIPS Act, the Inflation Reduction Act, uh the Bipartisan Infrastructure Law, the American Rescue Plan, Obama passed the Affordable Care Act. We’ve passed all kinds of things, but we also all disagree on what the hell the Democrats should do. And that leads to the point where somebody is always frustrated in our coalition because we are not just a big tent, we’re a three- ring circus ring. Like, we have such a big tent it’s collapsing in on itself. So, this idea that we don’t want to pass an agenda, the last point I’ll make because I’m taking up a lot of time, I would just look at the places where Democrats have all the power, like here in California. California, when you were growing up, I was growing up. I’m actually an 80-year-old man. That’s why I got my Mr. Rogers sweater. It was smog here in LA. Like, you couldn’t see 50 ft in front of your house. We created not just the most powerful environmental regulator in this country, carb is the most powerful environmental regulator in the world. And that was Democrats that did that. So this idea that when Democrats have power, they don’t actually know what to do with it is bogus. We’ve seen it here in California. We’ve seen it in New York with free college. We’ve seen it in in many states. So I just don’t agree that we don’t actually want to do anything. Okay. So you mentioned about a dozen things there. Let me take two of them as an example. So the CHIPS act that you mentioned, right? Uh the Democrats told us uh when we were covering it live on the Young Truth, “Oh, this is such a monumental bill. It’s so important.” And I was like, okay, nobody’s going to vote based on that. So, put that aside because that was definitely true, but okay, not pertinent to whether they were trying to do something that the Democratic voters wanted. So, that they said that was for national security. Okay, there’s some truth to that, right? And they said it was to don’t worry, this is to create more jobs. So, now what did they do? Very typical Democratic bill. They passed over $50 billion in corporate subsidies. The number one recipient was Intel, 8.5 billion in grants and 11 billion in loans. So about 20 billion overall. I said, “For God’s sake, at least put in guardrails so they can’t fire people.” They said, “Oh, don’t worry. Intel is going to create 10,000 jobs.” You know what they did? They didn’t put in the guardrails. And right afterwards, Intel fired 20,000 people. That’s just weird to mention guardrails against firing people when you rejected a union at your company and fired somebody for organizing. Yeah, that is absolutely not true. You could say that if you like. That is true. Look it up. There’s a union now. But yeah, you could look it up to a bunch of liars. But this is a random thing that you’re throwing in there, I guess, to just personally attack me. But there is a union. I’ll tell you facts. Do you want Do you want to explain facts? So facts are yes, IATSI is at Young Turks. It’s been at Young Turks for over five years. Did you or did you not reject a card check? Yeah, I did. And so in fact, card check. Yes, that is the one thing I disagree with in the proact. And yes, you are allowed to disagree with one part of the bill or 5% of a bill. Right. And so in in our case, what happened my personal dealings at Young Turks? Okay, fine. We can do it. It’s not personal. It’s a public thing. No. No. Okay. No problem. Okay. But let me address it. Now you got into a weirdo thing that not about policy, not about the Democrats, but about my company. Fine. So, so since you smeared me, let’s explain. So, that people come in and go, “Okay, surprise. We didn’t ask you for anything, but we formed a union.” I go, “Guys, great. Prove it.” They say, “Oh, we had a secret vote.” And then people come up to me, other employees, what a car is. Hold on. Other employees come up to me and go, “They’re they’re intimidating us. We didn’t ask. We’re getting We’re getting way off base here.” I know because you brought us off base with a random attack. guard rail. Let me just say one thing. Let me finish cuz you’re not going to smear me and not let me explain. Okay. So then I said since people felt intimidated, it’s okay. Let’s You felt intimidated. No. How do you know? You’re not even that. You weren’t there. You’re just making stuff up because you’re the one that So hold on. You’re the one that went to the What the hell was this filibuster? Okay, let me answer. So then I said, “For God’s sake, just do a vote. No problem. You get a union.” The very next day they did a vote and it passed and they got a union immediately. Immediately as soon as I was sure that all of our employees were not being intimidated or bullied, they instantly got a union and we’ve had a union for 5 years. There’s people who are like in response to public people who are making stuff up 24/7 and they keep telling people like you that we rejected a union when we didn’t. We authorized it immediately as soon as we had a a fair vote. Okay. Now, back to what you thought was I thought we were arguing about. You haven’t voted out. Good talking to you. Not really, but okay. [Applause] Hey, Jake. Hey. How you doing? Good. Good. I have a lot of respect for you, but I worry about your progressive populism is dangerous. In fact, to me, you kind of sound like a political pickup artist. Like, just do this one trick and we can fix it all. And to me, it’s no different than what MAGA is doing with their faux populism, with the deep state, with undocumented immigrants, someone to blame. You’re just giving people corporate corrupt Democrats or corporate media as an excuse. And I think you’re just taking advantage of disaffected people and not showing them we got to get more involved. We got to invest more. We got to try harder and get good people in there. So, you’re saying that don’t even try progressive populism. Just go along with the establishment Democrats cuz they know how to win. They That’s why they beat Donald Trump twice. Oh, right. They lost to Trump twice. They don’t know anything. Their number Their number one thing was, “Oh, we know how to win.” They were liars. They didn’t know how to win at all. They got clowned by a guy who’s not that bright. Now, number two. Oh, we have this giant agenda, $15 minimum wage. All the things that we’ve talked about throughout the day. Oh, golly gee, we just couldn’t pass any of it. Oh, wow. Okay, but hey, vote for an establishment Democrat. Don’t get tricked by leftwing populism, brother. Do we actually ever try leftwing populism? Here’s the three things we’ve tried. We’ve tried establishment Democrats, complete failures. We’ve tried establishment Republicans, complete failures. We tried fake populism under Donald Trump, complete failure. So, the only thing we haven’t tried is left-wing populism. And you say, “Don’t try it. Go back to the establishment Democrats. Go back to the donor class. Are you crazy? Let’s try the one thing we didn’t try, the Bernie Sanders wing, economic populism.” You say the American Rescue Plan that took half the kids in poverty out of it, millions of kids who go to bed hungry, is crumbs, is doing nothing. That is a big deal. What about the millions of people have health insurance now because of the Affordable Care Act subsidies? No, you can call whatever you want, but the reality is millions of people have health insurance today because of what the Democrats did when they controlled the House, the Senate, and the White House in 2022 under the Inflation Reduction Act and the American Rescue Plan. I can’t stand that you call it crumbs. People don’t want their whole lives given to them. They just want a little breathing room like our big president Biden used to say. So, you say you’re super happy with the 5 to 10% that the Democrats gave you? It’s not by there’s there’s two things here. Number one, I don’t know what economic class you’re in, but the average American is not happy with 5 to 10% change. They want giant change. They want the actual By the way, the Democrat agenda is great. Our populist plank, the six most popular bills in the Democratic agenda are super popular with independents and even with Republicans, but they never ever do the most popular bills because they’re economic bills. and you say that’s good enough, but then why not try the entire agenda? Why not go with an economic populace like Bernie Sanders or Roana that’s going to give you the whole agenda and actually try? Why give up ahead of time? Those are great plans and we should strive for them. But this is a giant country, the third largest country in the world. We have a complicated democracy. We have to do things slowly. I know you don’t like that. I know you want to get there. Boom, boom, boom. But people do not want to abandon what they’re used to. It sounds great on paper. Would you like singlepayer healthcare where you save trillions of dollars and you pay less? Of course. But then when you show people how we get there, they’re scared. They’re nervous. And they have a right-wing media machine on overload that is scaring the hell out of people. That’s what we’re up against. This is reality, man. Welcome to it. So Martin Luther King called this the tranquilizing drug of gradualism. So they tell you, don’t worry, we’ll do a tiny bit and then when you elect us again, we’ll do another tiny bit and 200 years later this will get done. Hold on. Let me explain. Not going to bed hungry. Is let me explain in the context of healthcare. They say we’re for universal healthcare. You go. Okay, great. Let’s do Medicare for Oh, no way. Wait too long. Okay, no problem. No problem. Can we do public option? This debate goes all the way back to the Affordable Care Act. They go, “Oh, yeah, sure. We love the public option.” Oh, golly gee, we had to take the public option out. There was nothing we could do. Okay, Obama says he had to take it out because the drug companies were opposed to it. First of all, you’re admitting that you’re giving into the donor class. Then Joe Biden comes in and goes, “How can we do public action over 70% 50/50 split Senate with guys like Joe Mansion and Kirstston Cinema?” You know how you do it, brother? You know how you do it? By the filibuster by trying. They tried every day. No. No. But lit literally they on the inside. You’re stating a misstatement. Okay. So they Joe Biden never introduced the public option. If you never introduce a public option, by definition, you did not try. Second of all, how do you pass? Oh, the senator split. Okay, you put pressure on. So, can pressure work politically? Well, we know because Donald Trump did it to Republicans. Now, he did it for his own cause and for his own self argrandisement. But anytime a Republican cross him in the first term, he said, “We’re going to eliminate Joe Wilson in South Carolina.” And boom, he was eliminated. Now, imagine if you did that. You want to bully ours? Yes, I do. Their lines. What do you want to do? Okay. So, can I explain? I They represent their people. Joe represents his people. They sent him there. How do you know that you’re not from West Virginia? Okay, hold on. They represent their donors. So, it’s an excuse. The donors are not existent. More billions of dollars given to Joe Mansion donated to Kamla than outside groups in this election cycle. It’s a boogeyman and you’re wasting people’s time with this. It’s nonsense. Do you know that Joe Mansion and Kristen Cinema after they voted against minimum wage increase went to the National Restaurant Associated and collected checks? They literally work for their owners. It is super literal. And what you’re saying to people is ignore it. Ignore the donors. Ignore them. Everybody who sends money to disrespectful to Joe Mansion and I intend to disrespect Joe Mansion. I despise Joe Mansion. I despise those corporate Democrats who never ever deliver for you, who never even try to deliver for you. You know, here’s what you say. [Applause] Let’s see. Hey. Hey. So, your your claim is that Democrats don’t want to pass their agenda. You’ve talked about $15 an hour minimum wage. So, how can you explain then that Joe Biden did in fact increase to $15 an hour for federal contractors with an increase again this year to 1775? Yeah. So, again, it’s a release valve. So, why why hold on hold on? Yes. Because it affects a tiny tiny percentage of Americans. 300,000 people. 300,000 out of 330 million people. So that’s why if you actually did a minimum federal minimum wage, moved it to $15, that would move $92 billion from corporations to the average American. Okay? So that’s what we want. I assume you want it. I want it. All Democrats want it. It polls at around 67%. So what I’m saying to all of you guys is please expect better of your politicians. So when they give you a 3%, oh hey look, I did it for 300,000 people. Hey, look, the drug prices, I lowered it on 10 drugs out of 10,000 drugs. Don’t say that’s good enough. They’re shielding. That’s a That’s a shield so that you don’t question them when they say, “Oh, I’m not going to do it for everyone.” You just said that all Democrats want to raise it to $15 an hour. That has not been your claim this entire time. No. No. Voters. Voters. Voters. Right. But Democratic politicians do, too. If Joe Biden If Joe Biden didn’t want to do it, why did he increase it? But for federal contractors, he didn’t have the votes to pass it. That’s exactly what I’m telling you. So what he does is he does it for 5% of people with student debt relief. He did it for 10% of people. He didn’t do it for 90%. So in the case of the federal minimum wage, let me let me get bring it back to you. Federal minimum wage. So he says, “Oh, progressives, don’t worry. It’s bare minimum. We’re definitely going to do it.” So they pass it in the House, they bring it to the Senate. Joe Biden does an interview during the Super Bowl right after he’s elected and he says, “Oh, we’re taking $15 minimum wage out of the bill.” So Joe, the Republicans didn’t take it out of the bill. Joe Biden took it out of the bill. did Trump did get rid of it on executive order. So now they don’t have it at all. So you’re saying then that that Trump you’re saying that Democrats and Republicans are both equal in terms of economics, right? How is that equal in terms of economics when Joe Biden raised it and then Trump took it away by executive order? So, but wait a minute. But you’re saying that even though he took it out and then when Bernie put it back in, eight Democratic senators, including the two Delaware senators that are the closest allies of Biden, voted against federal minimum wage being increased to $15. So, can you not see that they’re literally voting against it? They’re literally taking it out of the bill. They’re literally tricking you. They don’t actually want to pass it. They get your vote by saying, “Oh, I’m going to do it. I’m going to do it.” And then the minute they get in office, they’re like, “I was just kidding. take it out of the What evidence do you have that Joe Biden actually did want those senators to vote against it? What evidence? Two pieces of evidence. Number one, it passed in the House. And I even talked to Democratic congressmen. They assured me, don’t worry, it’s going to pass in the Senate. It goes to the Senate and it’s out of the bill. Schumer made that decision in conjunction with Joe Biden. So why did Schumer and Biden take it out of the bill? That’s my evidence. So Jen, is your claim then and secondly, by the way, when they did vote on it, his two biggest allies, both the Delaware senators, voted against the $15 minimum wage. That’s overwhelming evidence. Do you think that they didn’t ask Joe Biden? No. They called Joe Biden and Joe Biden said vote against it cuz he was lying. That’s not It’s just not true. But also, that is literally true and anybody can look it up. Are you claiming then that all Democrats to take corporate money are against the people? Is that your claim? Absolutely. Yes. Okay. So then why did TYT take $20 million of corporate money? Here we go again with personal tax. Okay. No problem. No problem. No problem. I want to answer it. No problem. Okay. Yeah. So $20 million is an investment. It is not here take the money and you do and then you do what we tell you to do. Everyone has if you’re building a business you have to take investment to get to the next level. Hold on. If you if you don’t if you don’t take the investment you’re going to be tiny. So what some leftists say is no. Don’t ever build anything. Don’t ever take an investment. Don’t ever do anything and build a big business. So instead what let the right-wing take not only investment money but direct money like Dennis Prager did $23 million. take it from the fracking billionaires, all those guys, and serve those guys. Take Let the right-wing grow and grow and grow. But as soon as there’s a successful leftwing channel, don’t take an investment. Don’t take any money. Just be super small so we can’t compete with the rightwing. How does that make sense? I’m I’m pro you taking that investment. I’ve built a business. I understand that. I just think that it’s ironic for you then to sit up here and say that everybody that takes corporate money is against the people because then you would be No, that doesn’t make That’s apples and oranges. Why is it apples and oranges? I can explain perfectly. So when are should corporations be allowed to exist? Absolutely. Should corporations be allowed to give money to our politicians so they control our government? Absolutely not. No way. So when a corporation does an investment, that’s a perfectly logical and normal thing to do. When a corporation buys a politician and those politicians then vote with them, that is a terrible thing to do. I’m actually a I’m a capitalist. I believe in capitalism, but I believe in democratic capitalism where democracy checks capitalism. Otherwise, it becomes corporatism and becomes a monster. But I don’t want to defeat all the companies. And I certainly don’t want to defeat left-wing media companies. That makes no sense at all. You see how it’s apples and oranges? One is a company and the other one’s a politician. One is normal business. The other one is to influence our government. Let’s talk about [Applause] Hey, before we go any further, we want to take a moment to say thanks so much to Straight Arrow News for powering the How are you? Hey, nice to meet you. Nice to meet you. Um, so personally, I don’t like absolutes, so I try to stay away from them. When you say the Republicans, are you talking about the party establishment? Are you talking about the politicians? You talking about the citizens? Okay, I’m so glad you asked that. I always mean the politicians. Okay. So, for all of these, don’t take offense if you’re a Democratic or Republican voter. I’m talking about the politics. I’m neither one. But, uh, so do you think that the Republicans care more about the rich than the Democrats? Do you think the Democratic establishment really doesn’t just care about the rich? So, as I said, I think that both parties are similar on economic issues and they play good cop bad cop on us. Do the Republicans push the tax cuts? Yes. Is it almost always under Republican administrations? Yes. Do they ever balance the budget? No. Never. So do you think that like the idea that uh employers who have a lot of money that they provide jobs and that’s a way to give back to the poor? Do you buy buy into any of that concept at all? I mean as like entrepreneurs who are going out to innovate. I’m a classroom teacher. So like I go out try and build entrepreneurs who can employ people and do something like that. Isn’t that some that entrepreneurial spirit can be more aligned with the conservatives would you say? No I don’t agree. I’m an entrepreneur. I run a small business and so they are always talking about small businesses and then they uh immediately change the goalpost to cuts on capital gains. Wait, that has nothing to do with small business. Cuts on estate tax. That’s for the super rich. That has nothing to do with small businesses. So, brother, they use small business as like a marketing tool. Oh, we’re for the average American. We’re for small business. Then the actual tax cuts are for the mega rich and for the mega corporations. What about minimum wage? like as a business owner, you know, like the the repercussions of minimum wage. I haven’t been to McDonald’s in a while. I went I went it’s been years. I went and it’s just like just a screen, you know, like there is that element, you know, of the minimum wage raising and that leading to more unemployment. Yeah. So, I don’t agree with that either. So, uh so first of all, everything requires bounds. So, you can’t have a $100 minimum wage. I get that. Right. But having said that, are we anywhere near uh where we should be on minimum wage? No. We’re at $7.25 federally on minimum wage. That is a disaster. And so what that is is if you work every single day, 40 hours a week, 52 weeks, no vacation at all, you only make $15,000 at $7.25. No one can live on $15,000. So when you push up minimum wage, what it does is it pushes up all wages. And that is a good thing, not a bad thing. They always tell you, “No, no, no, give it to the corporations and then it’ll trickle all over you decades later.” No, there’s an um economics called middle out. And what that does is it gives directly to the middle class and then they spend it more and it creates a better economy, especially for small businesses like yours and mine, etc. So there’s a way to do this. It gives to the average guy first. But the Republicans never do that. They always push for tax cuts for the richest people in the country. So why do you why do you see do you believe that the the populist element of Trump where a lot of the working class they’re like, I know he’s a Yankee with gold toilets, but I’m going to vote for him because he’s not like vilifying me. Do you think that they’re just being manipulated by Trump? Yeah, 100%. So, look, I I don’t want people manipulated. That’s why I do things like this. I don’t want you getting manipulated by the politicians on either side. In a time where we have massive deficits and a $ 38 trillion debt, why are we giving another $1.1 trillion to people making over $500,000? It doesn’t make sense. I appreciate it, man. Thank you, brother. I’m Elijah. Hey, Elijah. Nice to meet you. It’s nice to meet you, too. Do Republicans care about the rich? I do think they care about the rich. Um, coming from somebody that voted for Trump, I do believe that. But I do think that they do support middle-ass Americans, especially Trump. I think this big, beautiful bill, people say it’s it’s hurting Americans. If you actually read through it, I’m getting a 3% reduction on my yearly income tax. Every single tax bracket is getting some type of reduction on their income tax or a 0% reduction. And that’s for the wealthiest class. So, that is helping middle class. Also, I know that the deficit is going up. Think about ICE, you know, he’s putting more money into ICE. I would argue that stopping immigration actually or enforcing it even more heavily helps the middle class worker in America. There’s less jobs that are being taken. When you import a bunch of people, like your housing costs are going to go up. It’s inflating the people that need houses in a city. Um, it’s or apartments or whatever. It’s it’s taking it is taking jobs for for middle class to lowerass people like me. It’s taking jobs. Unfortunately, some of your premises are wrong. So when you take the whole bill, including the cuts to Medicaid and SNAP and other cuts, the bottom 30% actually wind up paying more than they did before. So they’re literally they’re literally taking from the bottom 30% and giving it to the top 10%. I mean, but when you talk about SNAP, that’s people that are already taking from all of us. So Okay, see that’s your point of view as a Republican. Do you know the least popular part of the bill, the poll just came out, only 24%, maybe even lower, support cutting SNAP. It is the single most unpopular part of the bill overall. Americans do not want you to take from people who desperately need food just to give to people making above $500,000. The second most unpopular part of the bill is the one that gives to people above $500,000. So people don’t want that. So the bottom 30% are very badly hurt by this bill. What you’re talking about is the middle the percentile the middle 10% gets a 04% bump. That’s again the nickels and dimes that they throw you. The Republicans throw Republican the Republicans throw nickels and dimes at you. Five to 10% change in their tax cuts and the Democrats through their policies throw 5 to 10% change. You don’t think that a nickel and dime can help somebody in a dire situation. But brother, why do we have to help the rich even more? Why do they get the biggest tax cuts? You know, you could do a tax cut without one going to the rich. You could say it at $400,000. When you own the business and you get a tax cut, you have more money to spend on your employees. I understand that’s a regonomics principle, but it could be. And when you import and when you’re a Democrat and you import all these people from third world countries, you’re paying them under minimum wage because you see them as the help. Well, yeah, that’s going to that’s going to benefit you. But when Republicans stop this and they force people to, you know, that work like to be citizens or they want people to be citizens, they’re being forced to at least earn minimum wage. The reason why we’ve never fixed the immigration problem is because corporations want cheaper labor, which is why and we should fix that. But the Republicans and the Democrats never fixed that. And so our border crossings are you know the top the top.1% are going to get tens of thousands of dollars in tax breaks. You’re not explaining why they need that. They don’t need that. Why do cor do you know that oil companies get about 15 to30 billion in subsidies every year? How come the Republicans never talk about oh we’re gonna cut waste fraud and abuse but you’re not going to cut $30 billion from the richest companies in the world? How come Trump’s not negotiating drug prices? How come Trump is best friends with big pharma and he’s not touching drug prices at all? He’s making matching them to Europe. Yes. Okay, now that’s a perfect example. The he he said that as an executive order knowing that he did an the same executive order in the first time around and the courts knocked it down. He knows the courts. No, it is his fault because hold on, hold on, let me explain. Let me explain to you. So then what Ro Connor did, he’s a Democrat. He’s really smart. He went and got a Republican co-sponsor and said, “Let’s take the executive order and turn it into a bill verbatim. Trump’s executive order. All of a sudden, Trump and the Republicans not in favor of the bill. Oh, there you go. It was a trick all along. [Applause] Hi, how you doing, sir? Good. How you doing? I work in Republican politics. One of the first jobs I took was in a small district, but it was in Lucas County, Ohio, and it was a poor district, and I was representing a Republican. when my candidate would go and we’d be knocking doors together talking about how he wanted to improve their lives. Is he an anomaly or are you only talking about federal? Yeah. So, like what where do we draw the line here? So, first of all, are there some good guys in politics? Very rare. But yes, I think Bernie Sanders is a good guy. I think Roan is a good guy. By the way, I think Thomas Massie is honest and he’s a Republican, right? I don’t agree with his policies, but I think he’s honest. But again, a very it’s an exception. So if you tell me no, trust me, the politician I worked with was great. Were you there when he was talking to the donors? He didn’t have any. Okay. Well, then Well, that’s the problem is when we go down the ladder where you know 90% of the elections that take place in this country, they’re not at the federal level. They’re not with politicians that are receiving hundreds of thousands, millions of dollars. Yeah. They get bought for cheaper. They get bought for 5,000. or is it possible that they want to step in and govern? So, brother, I hear what you’re saying. You’re saying that the the closer you get to the voters, the more honest they are. That’s actually true. Look, look. So, I appreciate Okay, so number one, you’re saying, can I just explain? So, if you’re doing as as small a seat as a city council, you actually knock on doors. That’s why progressives win a lot of the city council seats because the election is with such a small number of people. You don’t need Oh, can I just let me finish? So, let so that way you don’t need as much money. you don’t need donors. They’re more responsive to their uh actual voters. The larger you get, once you get to a congressional district with 750,000, the donor money decides how much ads you can take and and whether you’re going to win or not. So, they may become completely beholden to the donors. So, when you’re talking about, hey, really low-level Republicans that yet have not gotten a lot of donor cash and you say, well, look, hey, don’t worry, they’ll stay true. But they never do. when they move up to the next level, they immediately, even if they were true at the lower level, 99% of them all other than Massie, they take the donor money and they do exactly what the donors tell them to do. Is it just a simple misunderstanding or an oversimplification of our system? Go ahead. Thank you. Good to meet you. Good to meet you, brother. All right. So, I’m glad you clarified already. You’re talking about Republican politicians. Um, and you brought up donor money, and I know that’s a big issue with you. Um, but I think that’s just not really how it works. I think you have a lot of politicians that start off, as you said, kind of in the those lower levels. They do an office here, they do a job here, and then they slowly rise up. And if you can track their views, you see that their views don’t actually really change a whole lot over time. when the donor money comes in, it’s not like they suddenly change their views and they’re a completely new person. They’ve had the views that they’ve had for a very very long time. So, how how can you sit here, Shank, and look in your crystal ball and say, “Oh, the I know I can look into the souls of Republicans and say, “Oh, well, they’re not actually genuine in some of these proposals.” So, let’s take an example of a person who doesn’t have a soul, Ted Cruz. Um, so you know that. You know that. Yeah. Okay. I’m kidding. Okay, I think. Okay. So, so listen, he says to Tucker Carlson recently, “Oh, I just I mean, yes, I’ve taken millions from Apac, but I just happen to have that position. I had it earlier. I mean, I know that Apac would give me millions of dollars. I if I say, let’s give billions back from the American taxpayer to Apac. Let’s make sure we support all their wars. Let’s fight all their wars for them.” Oh, look at that. I happen to agree with my donors. Hey, listen. When I started out, I really wanted to give $30 billion of subsidies to oil companies and I still want to give credit. How do you know Ted Cruz is lying? How do you know that? Okay, but even in that scenario, think about it, brother. There’s a Hold on. I’m I’m answering your question. You’re saying, okay, so in the hypothetical where they uh we have, first of all, in the real world, there’s 330 million people in the country, right? So, you’re saying maybe like the oil subsidy loving guys or were all Republicans to begin with, and the Republicans all love oil subsidies. So, it’s just organic. No, brother. They’re finding the just a handful of people in the country that’ll raise their hand and go, “Yes, I will do whatever corporate donors want. I will do whatever uh the rich want.” And they go, “Ah, there’s a guy who agrees with me. Let’s give him money. Let’s give him 5,000 in the beginning, then 50,000 later, then 500,000 later.” Actually, what is the question? So, how do you know that Ted Cruz is being disingenuous about his views on Israel? You still haven’t answered the question. That’s the easiest question in the world. It’s so easy that answering for me. Okay. So, you’re saying your hypothesis, my hypothesis is Ted Cruz and the politicians take millions of dollars from donors and do exactly as they’re ordered. And how do I know that? Cuz their voting record matches with their donors perfectly. You’re saying, but maybe maybe there’s a hypothetical 1 to 2% chance that Ted Cruz just was born out of the womb loving Israel’s wars and he’s like, I can’t wait to give money to Israel. Where is Oh, look at that. What a coincidence. Apac is giving me millions of dollars. I actually in politics try to assume good intentions on both sides. Well, sure you can you can say that’s a mistake, but I also try to make claims with evidence and all all you’ve said is, “Oh, he gets all this money from Apac, therefore he’s corrupt.” As opposed to as opposed to how do you know that Ted Cruz did not have these views views before and that Apac wanted to support him because of the views he already had? So your thesis is that all of the Republicans that do every that take hold on hold on. Yeah. Your thesis is all of these Republicans take hundreds of millions of dollars from donors. They do exactly what the donors say, but they already believed in all the things that the donors wanted earlier. So it’s just a happy coincidence. No, it makes perfect. And by the way, the mainstream media totally agrees with you. It makes perfect sense in my mind that these uh organizations would only be giving money to people that they know support the cause. That’s not a charity pick out of 330 million people. Crazy. Let me tell you how politics actually works. A donor walks in this room. Please answer my question. What evidence do you have? So you’re saying I don’t have evidence of Ted I I can’t read Ted Cruz’s mind. Yes, you can. Okay. So, brother, by your thesis, you can’t read Joe Biden’s mind. You can’t read Kla Harris’s mind. So, they’re all innocent. They’re all angels. Oh my god. The donor money isn’t affecting any of them because I can’t read their minds. But I can read their voting. I can read their voting record. I can read their voting record. I could read uh their donations. Open Secrets tells you you sound exactly like mainstream media. These politicians are honorable and they just happen to agree with the donors that gave him hundreds of millions of dollars. All right. [Applause] Hey Chang, good to see you again. Good to see you. So you are claiming that Republicans only care about the rich uh when Donald Trump and both Elon Musk lost money while they were in office. And then on top of it, you can shake your head no. Um, on top of it, why would you say that when currently we have I know you keep saying it’s it’s some a pressure valve, but we have them actually fighting for working- class people by giving them less t uh less taxes on tips, less taxes on overtime. Yeah. So, first of all, Donald Trump has made a tremendous amount of money and his family has. So, right after he left office the first time, his son-in-law got a two billion dollar deal from the Saudis and he was in charge of our policy towards Saudi Arabia and the Middle East. That’s a disaster. That’s Hunter Biden on steroids. So in this time around, he has a memecoin. He’s got World Liberty Financial. People are pouring money in. One guy put in $75 million. And then look at that. He stopped an investigation from the SEC about that guy. Let’s talk about how he’s helping middle class. Three at least three white collar criminals who donated either to his campaign or to his memecoin. And then he got a 400 million jet from Qatar. He got another talk about how he’s helping middle class people. So what if Democrats ignoring all the money from that? And I’m answering your question. Elon Musk, by the way, lost hundreds of billions of dollars from gold. Tesla stock went down dramatically. Well, that’s his fault. He lost money is what you’re saying. No, no, no, no. But remember, why did why did Mus No. Why did Musk and Trump get into a fight? Cuz Trump did not put in the electric vehicle mandate and the subsidy that Elon wanted. Elon said, I gave Elon. So Elon gave $300 million and he’s like, now I want that subsidy that’s going to get me billions back. Now I want Golden Dome. That’s going to get me hundreds of billions of dollars back. And Trump said, “I’m going to give you Golden Dome, but I’m not going to give you this.” What have Democrats done to help the middle class with taxes? That was a really smart marketing strategy by Donald Trump and part of the reason that he won the election. So, I remember we talked to somebody on the Young Turks and he said he was down in Western Virginia and he said, “Listen, it Hillary Clinton tells us that all of our jobs are going to be gone.” Donald Trump comes in and lies and tells us that he’s going to bring back the jobs. But he’s like, he’s at least got the decency to lie to us. Is it a lie or is it what he’s trying to do and just hasn’t done it? So 50% the what have Democrats done to help me? To be fair to the Democrats, as someone earlier said, in this case, they would at least protect Medicaid and SNAP cuts. Okay? And so that goes to the bottom 30% free stuff, but not free stuff. It’s okay to give the rich tons of free tax cuts, tons of subsidies, but when you give it to someone who’s starving, oh no, that’s a real problem. I didn’t say that. Okay? I said it’s okay that you’re giving them free stuff, but it’s not okay to help me with my taxes. So, brother, if then want to answer this for me, then why don’t they only propose a tax cut for the middle class? Why don’t they say, “Hey, we’re not going to cut from the poor and we’re not going to give to the rich. We’re only going to do it for the middle class.” Why don’t they ever from what I understand, they’re not cutting out the good parts of Medicaid. They’re only cutting out the corruption and fraud. So, you laugh at that. Is that okay? Can we agree that we should cut out fraud from Medicaid? That is not what this is at all. What do you mean it’s not? There’s tons of fraud. Here’s the trick. No, here’s the trick. Okay. There’s tons of fraud at the Pentagon. Hundreds of billions of fraud at the Pentagon. And they added to the fraud only Republicans. Here’s what happened on Medicaid. Okay? They say, “Okay, we need a work requirement. So, we’re going to cut 10 million people off of Medicaid.” But Medicaid is for poor people. So, if they’ve been on it for 20 and 30 years, the minute they get a job, they actually hold on. They make enough money to get out of Medicaid. They don’t they stay on it forever. So, that it’s a trick that it eviscerates Medicaid. There are people that stay on it for 10 years at a time. know that if you need Medicaid and you and you don’t have healthcare through an through a job and and your kid gets cancer, we’re going to let them die. Why% It’s going to happen, brother. According to happen every day, according to estimates, 70,000 people are going to die because of those Medicaid cuts estimates. Do you believe everything you hear? Tax cuts for the rich just needed to be larger and larger. 1.1 million tax. They’re okay with fraud as long as people get the help they need. They’re okay with it. But they’re not cutting fraud. They’re cutting the entire Medicaid. Hey. All right. My last claim is media and money control all of politics. Hey, nice to see you again. Good to see you, bro. Okay, so we disagree on the framing. We might not agree on the substance. So when you say they control all of politics, I feel like that breeds a lot of cynicism, which is kind of my issue with populism is you tell these people like it’s hopeless. Corporations, media control all of it. But what’s kind of implied in your premise like media for example, media is effective because it influences the people who actually vote and have a lot of power. Same thing with super PACs. They’re spending on advertisements a lot of the time. So I think when you paint this narrative that they control all of it, disproportionate, yes, a lot more than they should. Yes, we agree. Campaign finance reform, yes. I feel like a lot of people, especially in my generation, just check out of politics. Like the corporations are going to do what they want to do. The media is gonna do what they want to do. I’m just gonna scroll on TikTok. And I feel like it’s very damaging to our society. Yeah. So, number one, I’m a huge believer in hope. So, I would never say don’t get involved in politics. In fact, that’s why I started Justice Democrats to bring progressives in the Congress. I started Wolfpack to take money out of politics. And Rebellion Pack is saying no, get involved. And that 2028 primary and on the Democratic side is maybe the most important election of our lifetimes. We have to pick a populist so that we’ll actually deliver for the American people. So if you deliver for the American people, if you stop lying to them and say you’re going to do things and then never do it. If you actually do those things that are very very popular, then you’ll re-energize the entire voting base. You say we need to pick a populist. Is your definition of populism just like when good things happen that’s populism? Like is it conceivable for there to be a candidate who is a great president for example, but they’re not necessarily a populist or is that like necessitated? So all populism means is serving the average guys as opposed to serving the corporate donors. So I’ll give you No, no, no. It’s not a marketing technique. It’s very No, it’s very No, you’re asking if it’s vague or or or specific. And it couldn’t be more specific. There’s literally a populist plank on tt.com. And that’s the core of what our candidates run on Rebellion Pack. And those are six policies. Money out of politics, anti-war, uh lower drug prices by negotiating at Medicare. by the way, lower housing prices by by banning private equity from buying residential real estate. They’re robbing us of our wealth creation in this country. That’s going to destroy the middle class. So paid family leave, again, these are very easy to pass. If you say you can’t pass at 84%. Then you can’t pass anything. But we don’t passion polls. We don’t pass things through public opinion polls. You need people to get involved on a very granular level sometimes. Like for example, paid family leave. There’s different ways to fund that. There’s different amounts that can cover different amounts of months. I agree we need it. It’s a very good policy. If you advocate for it properly, it will win. But this goes back to But they never do. But this goes back to my initial problem. They never do that. Who? Why do why do the Democrats never fight for a bill at 84? I think the Democrats right now are extremely spineless. We don’t disagree on you. But do you know why they’re spineless? Cuz their donors told them to be spous. I think they’re also very scared. They’re very riskaverse. Let me Democrats are riskaverse. That’s the actual problem. No, no. I think the real problem is when you’re at the top, you don’t want anything to change. You want the status quo to remain the same. That is why mainstream media and establishment Democrats and Republicans say civility is the most important thing. Cuz if you’re civil, you don’t rock the boat. Why don’t you want why don’t they want you to rock the boat? Cuz it’s their boat. Okay. Such a simplification. It’s not an oversimpl every single time. Do you know that on in legislation on the Young Turks, we predict ahead of time what’s going to happen? We have nearly 100% track record. You know why? Not because we’re geniuses, but because it’s super easy. Look at where most of the money is. And that side wins 100% of the time. Passing legislation that’s like very paradigm changing is just super easy. Is that your position? So things like paid family leave. But again, anything that pulls over agree that’s complicated, right? No, I don’t think it’s structured at all. Where is the funding coming from? How many months are covered? Yeah, I get it. There’s different there’s different issues you have to adjudicate the disagreement negotiation. Let me answer this. Let me answer this. Okay. So, the earlier guy asked, “Would I bully the politicians?” Absolutely. Why? Because I want to bully them and it makes me feel good. No, it’s for a purpose. Although it’s kind of fun. Uh, okay. But it’s for a purpose, brother. If you’re voting against 84% of Americans, you’re a traitor. You’re a traitor to your voters. So, why are you on a very I’m asking a question. I’m asking a question of them. Why are you voting against 84% of the voters? And if you’re a Democrat, you’re voting against 90% of your voters. If you’re a Republican, you’re voting against 74% of your voters. I know why you’re voting against them. Because the donors told you to vote against the American people. It is that simple. But you want to defend politicians for no reason. They’re not your friends. They’re not your allies. It’s not just a piece of paper that says paid family leave. There’s stuff that goes into it that’s complicated. Appreciate it. Pleasure to meet you today. All right. Good to meet you, brother. I like your shirt. Thank you. People over politics. Um, so I do agree with you that money has a control over politics. We see super PAC spending. We see Mitch McConnell and longtime figures 40 years in politics and I’m pretty sure everyone’s just sick of it. I don’t agree with on the media half and I kind of want to kind of want to explain why. A lot of people don’t tune into mainstream media anymore. And I’m sure you know this. who run the one of the biggest progressive channels on YouTube, but it’s hard to it’s hard to see media having this big influence when so many people are tapped out. So, I’m kind of wanting to understand why you think it’s uh they spent $16 billion at a minimum in this last election cycle. Where did most of that money go? It went to mainstream media. Okay. So, mainstream media has 16 billion reasons to make sure you don’t find out that the donor money is corrupting. Okay. So, now what is the effect of that? So when you see uh in the 2016 race, for example, Donald Trump, Hillary Clinton, Bernie Sanders, right? Now, Donald Trump eventually got about $5 billion in free media and now to be fair to him, he did a lot of interviews and Hillary decided not to do a lot of interviews, but a part of that was the media’s decision. You know how much before the primaries ended, Trump had already gotten $2 billion in free media, right? Do you know how much Bernie Sanders had gotten? $28 million. About what? uh I think 1% of what Trump had gotten because the mainstream media thinks that Bernie Sanders would actually do change and they don’t want change. They’re all at the top. Almost all the anchors are millionaires and the last thing they want is a left-wing populist who’s actually going to make a difference. Oh, a fake populist like Trump, no problem. Send in the clowns. Establishment Democrats and Republicans, Mitch McConnell, Nancy Pelosi, both raised a billion dollars from corporate donors and have done exactly what the corporate donors want. They’re like, “That’s great. let’s pump them up. But whenever you got a real challenge to power, mainstream media attacks. Speaking on the terms of left-wing media, if you consider your networks like I guess MSNBC, if we can, if we’re going to classify that as left, CNN kind of, I don’t think these are the type of networks that would completely destroy and eviscerate a liberal candidate. Think about someone like Alexandria Casiocortez. Think about somebody like Jamie Rasin. If they were going to be in a primary, I don’t think that you’re going to see a whole smorgas board just go after them right now. I’m pretty sure you would have seen CNN or MSNBC’s coverage tilt favorably towards them compared to someone like Donald Trump if they would have been nominated in this type of election. That’s actually not true. MSNBC is the biggest opponent of a progressive populist in the Democratic party. whenever like when Bernie was about to win after he won the first three states in 2020, then they sent out uh Chuck Todd, Chris Matthews, and others to say if Bernie wins, he’s a communist that’ll start executions in Central Park. He said that’s what Chris Matthews said. Chuck Todd talked about his followers being brown shirts. I said in the beginning of that campaign, the people in power will be so opposed to Bernie that by the end they’ll call him anti-Semitic. And they called him anti-semitic, okay? Even though he’s Jewish. So on AOC, no one covered her in mainstream media before her historic primary win. We covered her 34 times. So the reason for that is because yes, some parts of media now are better. To your original point, independent media is better for all its problems and warts and etc. It’s at least opening up the discussion to more free thought and getting people thinking. But mainstream media has you inside these tiny guard rails and the minute you step outside of it and populist left always steps out of it and says, “Why don’t we deliver for the American people?” I’ll give you one last example. Those guys attack. So, uh, when Biden went to do student debt relief, Stephanie Rule did an, uh, so Fox News did segments on it against it. CNN did segments against it. And then Stephanie Rule on MSNBC did a segment against it because that’s an economic issue. The minute it’s an economic issue, they all circle the wagons and they play good cop, bad cop, and they all say, I’m sorry. Pleasure to talk with you. Thank you, brother. [Applause] Hi, Preston. Nice to meet you. And nice to meet you. Um, so I think I really want to focus a lot on the media part with you, just because mainly for the fact that I think we can all unbiasedly agree that, let’s be honest, Trump during his whole election campaign. It was very anti-Trump, very pro-democrat, and how he was the absolute just most terrible thing that could happen if he gets voted in as basically a threat to our democracy. And so when it comes to that and everything, let’s be honest, very high percentage was very negative towards him. How can you explain the outcome if the media controls everything when it comes to elections and politics? Yeah. So, uh, that’s a great question and so one I get asked often. So, when you talk about money and politics, it controls almost all the races, but the ones that are the smallest, it controls the most because there’s almost no media coverage of a Montana congressional race. So, whoever has more money wins. In fact, in congressional races, whoever has more money wins 95% of the time. But the one giant exception is presidential races cuz there’s so much free media in presidential races and everyone is paying attention. So, you could actually go the route of going into media yourself and making your own argument. That’s why I thought Trump would win in 2016. That’s why I was really worried about it in 2024 because Democrats have become like corporate talking point robots, the establishment Democratic politicians. So they don’t like to engage in with Joe Rogan or the these other folks. And I’m like, what are you doing? You’re giving away billions of dollars in free media. Trump had the right strategy. But at the end of the day, because he was all over media and he got billions of dollars in extra media coverage, that is part of the reason why he won. While media has influence and everything else, it still comes down to the individuals to vote. So whenever it comes down to that, then how can you explain they still have control even though at the end of the day it’s still the individual’s right and individual individual’s ability to go vote and make because how does anything ever get into your head? So like when you go into a voting booth you see names, right? But if you never saw that person uh and you never heard their name because they didn’t have enough money for ads and the media didn’t cover it, that person has no chance of winning. It’s like there’s a mythology in mainstream media that two people go into an octagon and then people decide which one is better, right? That’s not how it actually has to be able to see all of these things. I’m sorry. Nice to meet you. All right. Nice to meet you. Hey, nice to meet you, Kyle. Yeah. So, I think money doesn’t necessarily have a mind. So, I’d like to kind of take it to who’s making the decisions on how to allocate the capital. And so, does party loyalty here play at all? Right? Like, at the end of the day, you’re going to have politicians who can influence where that capital is coming from. And if you’re towing the party line, saying what they want you to say, that to me seems more impactful than, right, the ability to go and find donors yourself to raise a significant capital to win like a race. So, let me give you a couple of examples. So Ted Cruz got $13 million from the Mercer family when he was running for president in 2016. If you remember, Donald Trump insulted his wife. So at the Republican National Convention, Ted Grus did not endorse him. So but right afterwards, he’s changed his mind and started phone backing for Donald Trump. What happened in between? What happened in between is after his speech, he went up to the sweets that the Mercer family had at the convention and they slammed the door in his face and they said, “We now have a new guy there. We’re picking.” It’s like the Hunger Games. So, the sponsors decided that they were going to go with Donald Trump now. So, Ted Cruz, realizing I’m going to lose my donor money if I don’t do as I’m told, said, “I’m so sorry.” And then he grabbed the phone and was like, “Oh, yeah. Donald Trump is the best. Forget about my wife. Who cares about her?” Why? Because he’s going to seek the donor money. And but you can do it on both sides. Look, we have Mo Brooks, for example, is a Republican who was running for Senate in Alabama, and he gave a speech where he said, “Look, in order to become a chairman of a committee, whether you’re a Democrat or Republican, you have to raise a million dollars, but you cannot raise it from John and Jane Doe. So, you raise it from the industry you’re supposed to be regulating with the implicit promise that you do not regulate them and you give them whatever you want. So, in order to be a committee chairman, whether you’re a Democrat or Republican, you must take what is a campaign contribution, but really a bribe from that industry and make sure you protect that. I think it’s like a it’s a cynical view that the Yes, it is. And it’s true. Well, again, I think what what we’re talking about is to what degree does the political structure and government structure just enable, right? Like I don’t think like a claim around Republicans only caring about the poor or not caring about the poor, only caring about the rich. Are they just acknowledging the practical reality of in order to facilitate a successful race, you have to raise capital, so you have to please donors. So they’re not going to get pleased. Like I don’t they don’t need to be evil. They don’t need to be evil. They could just be like, “Hey, I want status. I want to be a senator, so I’m going to take 13 million here, 10 million there, etc., and then I’m going to serve the donors.” Yeah, you could say it’s necessary, but that’s why this system sucks. That’s why we need to change it, get money out of politics. If you get money out of politics, then they have to serve the voters and be our representatives instead of the representatives of the donors. In terms of the solutions here though, money will always play a role in politics. Is there a practical reality where you think money is not going to play a role in So between 1938 and 1978, bribery was illegal and in that 40 years we built the greatest middle class the world has ever seen. Was our system perfect? No. But productivity went way up and so did wages in 1978 the Supreme Court bribery. Yeah. It campaign contributions when they’re coming from corporate donors off rich donors. They can still pour money into media campaigns to influence the outcomes of the elections. So like money practically speaking I just don’t see how you ever get to a point where money is not at all influential in a political race. Yes. So don’t give up hope. So can you do it? Of course you can cuz we had it. We had it between 3878. We did and it led to the greatest middle class. It led to the best economy in that period of time. But social media mainream but you’re taking a historical period where today you’re saying just give up. Don’t even try to take donor money. I’m saying it’s there’s there are things that you can make progress on today. But I’m saying practically speaking, I think you can get a constitutional amendment. You know why I think you can get a constitution amendment to get money out of politics? Because 93% of Americans believe that politicians represent their donors and not their voters. All right. Thank you. No. Hey there. We met a long time ago. Yeah. I was going to say you look familiar. So on the local level, right, LA city council could upzone everything. let construction companies, property management companies come in, wholesale, develop, build massive apartment buildings, run these properties, right? LA City Council has not done that. Are you saying development companies, uh, real estate companies and property management companies are not moneyed interests? No, that’s amazing that you picked that example. Uh there’s there’s two uh industries that are the most impactful on local and state races. It’s utility companies and real estate companies. So real estate companies totally own New York and California even though they’re Democratic. So uh Andrew Como when he was governor passed a whole bunch of things. There were tax breaks for real estate companies and it didn’t help the average person at all. In California we raised $24 billion to help the homeless and homelessness went up 53%. Why? because they do things like, “Oh, no. We we’re going to have more affordable housing and then they build highrises that are for super rich people and then you don’t get the affordable housing and homelessness goes up.” They don’t build because if you live on a block of single family housing, okay? And city council makes it so that next to your house, some company could come in, destroy it, build a huge apartment complex on your block. People hate it. Nimism is real. No one wants that on their block. And city council doesn’t want to freak out their voters. Like there’s this thing called like politics where they don’t want to they don’t want to massively upset people so they don’t rock the boat. And it’s just and the the homeowners aren’t giving any money. Like real estate developers are not the little guy and they’re not getting their way. Yeah. So it you it’s interesting that you picked that example because I actually have personal experience with that through someone that works at TYT. They land ran for city council. As I said earlier, it’s easier for progressives to win at city council level because it’s a smaller group of people and you could knock on doors and that’s what she did. So that’s why sometimes the city councils are better certainly better than the national guys etc. But when her experience was when she went in the real estate interests were massively powerful. She fought against them. It was in the middle of LA and eventually they cared so much about getting her out that they started funding someone to make sure she’s removed from the city council. Real estate has massive interest. What’s the money on the other side of not building? So, no, there is no Yeah, that’s what I’m saying. That’s why real estate almost always wins. You’re saying no. Sometimes at the local level, real estate interests don’t win. Yes, because very rarely because it’s such smaller percentage of people voting. You can get progressives in there that block that because they’re not representing the donor interest. But even in places like LA, they eventually get overwhelmed by the money that real estate guys bring in. And that’s I literally have personal experience with what happened in LA in that I want to move to media. Don’t you think especially with alternative media people creators like chase the audience and they try to be as outrageous as possible to like because I don’t know outrage sells and it’s and audience capture is a huge thing. So they’re running around chasing audiences. It’s not money coming up top down. It’s like bottom up people are angry want like disagreement. Yeah, you’re not wrong about that brother. So there’s a giant distinction uh between mainstream media and now online and independent media. So as I said earlier, online and independent media has at least got people thinking and it’s a wide range of opinions and I greatly prefer it. Mainstream media does not care and it doesn’t do the thing you’re talking about. What it does is it says no, Joe Mansion is a moderate. Mitch McConnell often times is considered a moderate, etc. That’s nonsense. They do nothing but lies to get you to vote for corporate politicians on the Democratic Republicans. Alternative media is helping our politics. You think it generates better is much much better than mainstream media. Mainstream media says no. On I I’m sorry that I keep going back to it because it’s such an obvious and stark case. On paid family leave, the 16% they call moderates like Mansion and the Republicans that block it. The 84% that want it, they go, “Oh, radicals. No, no. Progressives like Bernie Sanders are radicals. They’re total liars.” Who’s still watching CNN to get their political opinions? a lot of people older voters over 70 year olds. But you’re not acknowledging the whole like there’s so many people not paying attention to those channels anymore. And that’s a great thing. That’s why after the Trump election I said at least we’re out of the establishment prison. We’re in the populist woods and there are things that go bump in those woods. I know not everybody you’re not going to get all the hosts you want. You’re not going to get all the opinions you want. You’re not even going to get truth all the time. In fact, most of the time you’re not even going to get truth from the right and sometimes even from the left. Okay. So, but what you’re going to get is a wide range of opinions and at least you get to make that decision instead of mainstream media shoving it down your throat. All right. Thank you, brother. [Applause] Glad I got to come back up. All right. Great. So, you made an interesting claim. It’s very hard to disagree with media and money control all of politics. It’s more so who controls the money. uh when President John Kennedy passed executive order number 11110 which began the process of abolishing the Federal Reserve which we know is a private institution he was mysteriously assassinated a couple months after that. So the question is that the money powers of the world they have a monopoly over the things that we use to transmit and receive information. So my question to you is how exactly do you combat such a machine that has been in existence since mankind has been on the planet? Yeah, that’s why I mentioned 1938 to78 because when you make it illegal, it’s much much harder to do the bribes. It’s not that today people don’t get bribed. They do, but it’s it’s more rare, right? But in 78 76 and 78, the Supreme Court had two decisions that basically said corporations are people and they have a right to spend unlimited money on politics. When they did that, one of the descending justices, Justice White, said you just killed our democracy. And that’s exactly what happened. Now, theoretically, you could overturn the Supreme Court, but you’re not going to overturn this Supreme Court that is massively procorporate. That’s why I’m saying you need to do an amendment to go above the Supreme Court. But you can, and that’s why I start a Wolfpack. If you get money out of politics, if you say in this constitution in a way that the Supreme Court cannot overrule these people cannot buy our politicians. That is the answer. We can get back to a time where we it created great growth in this country and most of the earnings went to the middle class. Do you know that after those uh decision, Supreme Court decisions, productivity still skyrocketed, but wages flatlined and the difference was $12 trillion that they stole from the average American went to corporate executives instead of going to the average. That sounds fantastic. I’m not disagreeing with that. But what I’m asking you is you are talking about fundamentally restructuring the entire political system which will require frankly Thomas Jefferson said once that the tree of liberty has to be watered from time to time with the blood of tyrants and patriots. Money has obviously integrated itself into the Supreme Court, into the Congress houses, into the White House even with all the money that President Trump won did lose in the election because he lost to quote him and lost billions of dollars. But he also was he was donating billions of dollars. If we don’t have at right now, do you have a populist candidate that we as as the people should be supporting? Who’s who’s the candidate? So, we’re going to see that through the system, the primaries, etc. But John Stewart’s amazing, Roana’s amazing. And how much money have they gotten from corporate donors? So, Roana does not take any money from corporate donors. If you’re going to be in rebellion pack, you’re not allowed to take corporate pack money. So, there’s a way to do it that way. Get enough of the legislators that are honest. And by the way, there are some Republicans who are now not taking corporate pack money. Uh Thomas Massie, uh Josh Holly, that’s the road to to redemption, etc. But a amendment fixes the entire system. But the question then goes back to in order to get an amendment that requires a two-thirds majority in both houses of Congress. Correct. No, you can actually go around Congress. twothirds of the states can propose a convention to just propose an amendment and then threearters of the states have to ratify which requires the legislature to take action right so how do you get legislators that already are slaves to the corporate donors cuz the book that I believe in says money the love of money is the root of all evil and I think that’s absolutely true a lot of these brothers love money a lot of these sisters love money so how do you then work because what this actually is is more of a moral issue so how do you then re-establish proper functioning morality within the hearts of politicians who have already demonstrated they’ve been bought by this thing called the US How does because that’s what this is. Yeah. Two ways to do that, brother. So, number one, what Wolfpack does is it pressures state legislators. The Republican guy or the conservative guy I was talking to earlier, remember we said when you get to the lower and local levels, it gets better and better. The national level is the worst cuz that involves the most amount of money. So, state legislators, you can move. In fact, Jamie Raskin was opposed to our uh legislation when he was a state uh representative in Maryland. And then we talked to him and we convinced him and he said, “You guys are right. Now I’m going to support the constitutional amendment. So you do get some really good people at the state level. So that’s a much better path because they have less money. But even so, brother, the bigger state is great. But here’s just quick question. State is fantastic, but we need changes that impact all Americans to take place at the national level. So it’s fine for you to focus on state. I understand that the lower the lower the lower ranking an elected official is, the the easier it is probably to change them. How do you change the person that’s sitting currently at 1600 Pennsylvania Avenue or the nine Supreme Court justices that are currently in on Capitol Hill? So that’s that’s the great thing about the Wolf Pack Pack blend. It doesn’t require the president at all and it and it goes above the Supreme Court. So it doesn’t require Congress, the president or the Supreme Court. It’s a total endun of the American people against Washington DC. And by the way, that’s why the founding fathers put it in there to make sure that if Washington got too corrupt, you can actually call for conventions at the state level and get it done. And how do you do that on a national scale? You need one incredible leader to instead of worrying about himself to worry about the American people. If he actually anyone who gets money out of politics is going to have statues built of them all across the country. You need one brave and honest person to say yes. I’m going to fight for all of you guys and I’m going to put a world of pressure. Yes, on politicians. Yes, on politicians in my own party to get this done. So based on that, what does that ideal politician look like then? Because we haven’t seen it. Trump ran. He said, “We’re going to drain this swamp.” He didn’t drain. He hasn’t drained the swamp. We’re still waiting on the release of the Epstein Files. We’re still waiting on the full unredacted release of MLK. We’re still waiting on the unredacted release of JFK. What does that actual candidate look like? Cuz all this rhetoric is fantastic, I got to tell you. So, in our lifetime, because of overwhelming money in politics, we haven’t seen an ideal candidate like that is what you’re saying. And I largely agree except Bernie Sanders is super honest. He doesn’t have he doesn’t have the So, look, he my my problem No, my problem with Bernie is that he didn’t have the fight in him. Like I love the brother, but he should have fought Hillary harder. He should have fought Biden harder. And you need strength to be able to win, right? So, but remember FDR did it. JFK did it. LJ did it. You mean the same president? FDR did what? What did FDR do besides steal Americans wealth? No. With the illegal executive order that took our gold from us. What did he do? He did social security. FDR stole the last real wealth we had. He stole it when he forced Americans to turn in gold to the Treasury at a rate of $20 an ounce. No. It’s totally possible. You’ve got to believe and you got to have hope. I’m going to I’m going to run for office one day. I do believe it. Let me if I may just just really quick point. You’re talking to somebody that’s going to run for president in 15 years. Okay? I’ve already started this. I’m running for Congress in 2030. So, it’s not that I don’t believe, but what I’m asking is you are talking about the fundamental moral restructuring of America. Right now, 2025, there is no politician on Capitol Hill in the White House that has the the the sort of fire that you’re describing. And the only and what you’re saying is is again it’s great rhetoric but if we don’t even know what that ideal candidate looks like. So the reason I mention somebody like John Stewart is you can’t know ahead of time who the ideal candidate is. They got to come through the primary and win, right? But the reason I mention him is because he can get past the Ptorian guard of the mainstream media cuz he’s a celebrity. So that gets him into the Trump land where they cover him because oh my god he’s famous, right? So that allows him to get past the media, get past money in politics. And if one person like that, whether it’s him or someone else, then raises their hand goes, “Hey, I want the 90% of Americans that want to get money out of politics and you elect me and I’m gonna fight like hell and I’m gonna make sure that we end this problem, this scourge of money in politics.” He will be intensely popular. He will win. He can execute that and we can get the amendment. We always, we’ve gotten so many amendments. They are definitely possible. They want you to give up hope. Don’t give up hope. Wolfpack has a plan to do that. Rebellion Pack has the plan to elect a president that can do that. Let’s go execute those. Let’s go fight for populism and win. I got a lot more to say, but that was great. Okay. Thank you, brother. Very good. Okay. I’m torn on this because there’s a couple people who didn’t talk, but everybody made good points and and uh was certainly sufficiently aggressive. Uh so yeah, uh but uh Oliver was it. Yeah, you made good points and you didn’t come up a second time, so I’ll go with you. Thank you so much. Yeah, no problem. Look forward to this opportunity. Um so my general claim is that um Chanker’s um populism fails because it treats social issues as a distraction rather than essential to achieving economic justice. So kind of my claim here is that there are a lot of social issues that are really important and also really popular with American people as you’re talking about with a lot of economic issues that are just as popular. If we look at something like um the um public opinion polling regarding Roie Wade, like 70% of Americans were against that uh the overturning of that. If and I think also what’s important in this conversation is to say that the the line between social and economic issues is not like very clear-cut. If we look at something like abortion and reproductive rights, it is the case that um if someone gives birth in this country, a woman gives birth, um it’s upwards of $18,000, which is a huge economic hit to her. And the um the Turnaway study found that when women get abortions or if they’re actually denied abortions, they follow up with them about 5 years later, they’re four times as likely to either remain or have fallen below the federal poverty line. So, I think just in general, I’m with you on the claim that we should focus on issues that Americans largely agree about. I just kind of have an issue with I mean I I I saw a recent appearance of yours that you know culture war issues as it’s it’s framed just totally divide. I think I think there’s a bit of a grain of truth to that and we should focus on what unites us but there are some cultural issues that really do unite us even if that’s not immediately clear in our media landscape. Yeah. So let me agree and disagree in part. So first of all if you say hey here’s a social issue that polls 70%. Should we lean into it? Of course. I’m saying don’t lean into the social issues where we’re in a great disadvantage. Okay, so this just simple logic and strategy. So for example, Trump again did the travel ban. Originally, it was a Muslim ban. You remember that’s what he promised on the campaign trail in 2016. And so he’s done some variation of that. Would I tell Democrats cuz it affects me and it affects vulnerable communities. You should focus on that first. No. Do not focus on that first. Focus on the things that unite us first. And then you come in and you pass a public option or a paid family leave or higher wages. What you do is you earn credibility with the average American and they go, “Okay, now I’m willing to listen. You delivered for me. I now have higher wages or lower drug prices.” So, what were you saying about the Muslim ban or what were you saying about transports or whatever issues that we care about and need to and need people protected on? Yeah. And I’m really sympathetic to a lot of that. I guess my major issue is a lot of the political revolutions that we see are founded on social issues. So, let’s take a look at something like the Civil Rights Movement, which was followed up by the Voting Rights Act and other things like that that drastically improved people’s economic standing because they were able to participate in the labor force without discrimination. We see that they go hand in hand. So, I’m I guess I’m just wondering if we’re fighting for women to have reproductive autonomy, which allows them to be full participants in the labor force and not be hamstrung by the fact that they’re being forced to carry a pregnancy against their will. It seems like that will actually allow women to be more economically productive and contribute to our economy in ways that benefit all of us and are popular. So, I’m can can we walk and chew gum at the same time like you talked about? Like I think let’s do let’s do both, right? Yeah. I literally said that earlier as you just referenced. And so, brother, you’re not wrong that they’re intertwined often times, right? So, for example, um while they were doing the civil rights campaign, one of the things that they were pushing forward was something called a freedom budget, which Nina Turner is trying to bring back now. And so if you notice, by the way, uh Martin Luther King Jr. got assassinated once he started doing the poor people’s campaign, right? When he got into issues of class and Fred Hampton got assassinated when he tried to bring the different groups together, when he tried to unite the country, unite different races and and different economic classes. So what really uh puts the powerful back on their heels, what they’re really worried about is if we all unite. That’s why I’m trying to tell all you guys here, please let go of the Republican politicians and the Democratic politicians that have been driving us apart. So, if they use social issues to bring us back together, great. But they almost always use the social issues to divide us so that we’re so at loggerheads that we don’t go, “Hey, maybe we should raise our wages.” I think it depends on the issue. And I think you can definitely speak to both things. I guess I’m just wondering then if we use that type of reasoning, what would be your advice during around the civil rights movement? Because for example, racial integration was very unpopular before the Civil Rights Act was passed and the Brown v Board of Education decision. Would you say that politicians don’t lean into it? It’s too controversial. You’re going to alienate people. Just focus on economic issues. And if they did that, where would we be today? Yeah, cuz you’re right. There has to be a moral exception from time to time. So then the question is, wait, is it a giant moral exception or is it is it a relatively small issue on a hill we’re choosing to die? So let me give you the distinction. So gay marriage I thought was a core constitutional right. So even when it was very unpopular, I fought for it and we fought and fought and fought until we won. And we convinced the majority of the American people and only after we convinced the majority did we convince Democratic politicians like Obama and Biden to move. If we had just gone uh after the politicians, we would not have succeeded in the beginning. So now when you get to trans women have the right or they must be allowed to go into sports leagues like the WNBA. We’re not at a core constitution and I’m not even addressing that issue. I’m talking directly because you talk about a moral issue and I think abortion is a moral issue and everyone in this circle will agree with that regardless of what side they fall on it. And I think that women super aggressive super hard on that. So I I guess just then I’m worried that when your messaging is so much culture war issues distract, culture war issues divide. What it sounds like to me is women’s bodily autonomy isn’t a core moral issue that is worth fighting for in the same way that gay marriage is to you. That that’s what it sounds like to correct the record. No, no, I love that you’re clarifying that. No, that’s a core constitutional right. That’s your liberty that’s being taken away. I mean, you want to talk about cancel culture, you know, that’s when you say, “Hey, you don’t have the right to control your own body.” We’re canceling that right. We’re taking that freedom away from you. Look, when you look at transgender issues, for example, okay, so should they be allowed to serve in the military? And I know a lot of right-wing will disagree with me, but yes, that’s a core constitutional issue. Yes, they should have the same rights, but I don’t have a right to play in the NBA. They don’t have a right to play in the WNBA. That’s not a constitutional right. My problem is sometimes the extreme left, they say, “Okay, no, we you should do the maximalist approach and that is the better strategy. We’re going to die on that hill.” Basically, yeah. And I’m saying don’t die on that hill. And I’ll give you an example again for my own community. I’m desperate to get the Palestinians peace. I’m desperate to get Israel to stop the genocide and they’re attacking, etc. So, they do a protest in Washington DC. They burn the American flag and write Hamas on a statue. No. Oh, don’t do that. I’m going to because if you burn the American flag, you’re saying you want to drive Americans away from you. No, invite Americans. Bring American flags to that. Could not agree more. I think then what I just don’t see then how that comes back to the claim that culture wars kind of divide us. And if they do, does that mean did you not see the trans issue divide the hell out of us? 100%. You are using one issue to describe all of the Okay. Well, we can we can talk about that, but one like I mean you would then have to specify and be a bit more clear cuz look, I understand that we’re on YouTube and the goal is to get clicks and when you make kind of very like absolute statements like all Democrats and Republicans are the same. You see what I’m saying? Do you see what I’m saying? I see what I’m saying. I see what I’m saying and I I probably agree a lot with you on on a lot of stuff. I just I think that when you sideline social issues and make it seem like social issues are secondary to me, like I just I think that there are some things that shouldn’t be secondary. All I’m trying to get people to realize is that first of all, in my opinion, the right-wing is the one that brings up all these issues. They look went looking for a fight on critical race theory. They went looking for a fight on DEI. They went looking for a fight on transports. When they get you in a situation where they’ve got you on an unpopular policy, correct? Stop fighting. stop falling into that trap and that ambush. I and I agree with you. I I I definitely agree with you in part. I think the problem as well with how the the the prompt is framed is it it treats right-wing fake culture war issues that they make up with real actual issues like women’s bodily autonomy. So like I I think there’s just an issue distinction is no problem at all. It’s just what I’ve lived in the real world is that when I say, “Hey, maybe we shouldn’t go maximalist on every issue.” All of the other left-wing hosts attack me and go, “You’re not pure enough. I’m gonna get more clicks than you by being even more pure. And I’m the first person to stand there and agree with you that maximalism might not be the the correct correct solution. Often isn’t. I just think and as we’re winding down, it’s just really important to not neglect social issues such as women’s access to their own bodies, such as LGBTQ right. Okay, good. Then I just I guess then asking you moving forward, maybe make an emphasis that your populism doesn’t neglect the very groups that you claim to want to fight for. You got to do it. Awesome. Thank you so much. It’s been great. Okay, good. First of all, 20 against one, I was born for it. I’m a populist like Jake and I was familiar with the Young Turks. His debate style was very, very good. I think he gave both the opposing speaker and himself ample opportunity to have an actual conversation, which is a rarity on a show like this. I have to say, I’ve seen Chank move a little bit. You know, the 2018 Chank of Justice Democrats did really focus on these issues like he was sitting here today doing. And I would love to see a return of that chank. I think in my conversation he kind of dodged a little bit. I would have loved to have a little bit more of an open discussion on kind of how he aims to reconcile racial differences in this country. I don’t want him to lean away from social issues and not put emphasis on them because they’re hard. Shying away from it because it might lose you some people isn’t the way that progress is made. In a lot of online debates, people are really playing to the audience at home. They’re not really trying to convince the person they’re talking to to reconsider their assumptions. And Oliver was able to successfully get Chank to realize, no, actually social issues are important. Z did absolutely amazing. I’m actually a follow of hers on TikTok and I’ve seen a lot of her content and we do disagree. We’re on completely opposite sides of the political spectrum, but she spoke with clarity. She spoke concise points. She made Jay backtrack this a little bit, which is always fun to watch, especially again in a show like this. One of the people who was rightwing said it to to me at the end after we wrapped. He said, “I was really surprised at how much we all agreed on.” Exactly. But you got to get past the media, the money in politics, and the politicians to get to the places where we agree.
Go to https://SAN.com/surrounded to get better news only on the Straight Arrow News app and stay fully informed with Unbiased, Straight facts. Thanks so much to our partner, Straight Arrow News, for powering the fact checks in this video!
Hey you 👈 Wanna be in a Jubilee video? https://bit.ly/be-in-a-video
LET’S BE FRIENDS
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/jubileemedia/
TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@jubilee?lang=en
Website: https://www.jubileemedia.com
OUR LOVE + DATING CHANNEL 🍑
YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@lovecommanectar
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/lovecommanectar
Nectar app: https://lovecommanectar.co/m/download-nectar
ARE YOU A BRAND? WANNA WORK WITH US?
Email partnerships@jubileemedia.com
LIKE EDITING VIDEOS?
Explore how our official partner OpusClip and OpusSearch can streamline your short-form post-production process today!
https://bit.ly/4iTscB7
FEATURING
Cenk:
https://www.instagram.com/TheYoungTurks
Adam:
@adamkhan__
Oliver:
https://www.instagram.com/olivermniehaus
Zee:
https://www.instagram.com/ZeeToTheHill
Todd:
https://x.com/ToddAKitzler
Shane:
https://www.instagram.com/politicswithshane
Emeka:
https://instagram.com/mekie_ogbatue
Zina:
@zinaaweenaa
Austin:
@realaustinoffscript
John:
https://www.instagram.com/johnrippps
Alex:
https://www.tiktok.com/adard42
Will:
https://www.instagram.com/willreusch
Beau:
https://www.instagram.com/_whiteprivilege
Micah:
https://www.instagram.com/micahkunkle
Guy:
@imreallyimprtnt
Presley:
https://www.instagram.com/_15presley15_
Elijah:
https://www.instagram.com/et_of_america
Nick:
https://www.youtube.com/@nickthegaines
TIMECODES
00:00 Intro
01:00 Claim #1 Democrats and Republicans Agree on economic issues and try to divide us with culture wars
23:57 Claim #2 Democrats don’t want to pass their agenda; it’s a marketing ploy, not a mission
46:24 Claim #3 The Republicans only care about the rich, and everything else is a mirage
01:05:18 Claim #4 Media and money control all of politics
01:33:57 Oliver’s Claim Cenk Uygur’s populism fails because it treats social issues as a distraction rather than essential to achieving economic justice
28 comments
@Jubilee you have out done yourself👏👏👏. This is the best one you've done so far 🔥🔥🔥🔥
Pleas don’t ever advocate for populism. That doesn’t work by definition.
Oliver is a loser every time
The young woman who was talking about DEI was giving Uygur the business. She is completely correct.
Any kids that haven’t had to use the ACA need to zip it. The ACA robs people. They subsidize and cover people based on an estimate of what they make for the year and then if you make $1 more than what you estimate you owe all the subsidies back. They don’t tell you that when you sign on! I owed an extra $7000 when I filed taxes after I paid $400 a month for coverage for two people. It’s a scam!!
Next guest will be Ana Kaspirian!
Get Scott Horton or Dave Smith on this. They would obliterate anyone with facts. Not dogma.
Why do they keep having the same low knowledge “liberals” and “conservatives”? Are they so called “influencers”? Maybe I’m out of the loop.
IF THE PEOPLE DEMAND A NEW UPGRADED MODERN SYSTEM TO CUT DOWN CORRUPTION LIES AND DECITE IN GOVERNMENT AND THE JUSTICE SYSTEM WE WOULDN'T HAVE THE PROBLEMS WE HAVE TODAY WOULD WE
IT'S THAT SIMPLE IT AIN'T ROCKET SCIENCE IS IT YOU LOVE YOUR CHILDREN PROVE IT
Why do I find myself agreeing more and more with Cenk? Is it him or me that has changed?
28:21 this process starts when white people stop getting offended when learning about the past. Yes, "race" is a concept that was made up wholecloth by people with very little melanin to justify the way they wanted to treat people not like them. Now that you know this information, don't go into a tailspin, let's do something to fix it
I don’t get WHY all these people are fighting FOR their oppression?!?
Only one guy in the room knows how the world works
im tired of this sports teams mentality
“It’s easier to fool a person, than to convince them they have been fooled.”
I love a Jub video that doesn’t have self proclaimed fascists, proud of you guys
I agree with cenk
If he was another Mehdi they would focus more on Colour and Race and White hhhh it’s clear tht Jubelee is remote-controlled by a fascist agenda!
damn cenk is cooking i am reconsidering my tyt membership pls cenk i love you brother more of this
Cenk is full of it.
I want to see 1 real communist vs 20 progressive democrats so we can finally put to rest this idea that democrats are communist.
We need Kyle Kulinski on this bish.
We all know policy makers across the world are influenced by billionaires & multimillionaire donors, they jz want us to think otherwise
30:04 we actually do agree on one thing the democrats should do: something, anything at all, more than they're doing now, take your pick
“But how do you know?”
Money -> Vote?
What else are they there for?
We need a Dave Smith episode next
There’s a lot of ppl who’s faces do not match what I thought their voice should sound like. Welp! 🃏
I'm now 45 minuts in an Cenk could not be making a better argument for republicans.
Comments are closed.