CLEVELAND, Ohio \u2014 In this episode of the Wine and Gold Talk podcast, Ethan Sands, Jimmy Watkins, and Chris Fedor discuss the Cavs\u2019 offseason, focusing on their roster needs and potential player signings with their 14th roster spot.<\/p>\n
Takeaways:<\/b><\/p>\n
1. Cavaliers Need to Fill 14th Roster Spot<\/p>\n
The Cleveland Cavaliers still need to fill their 14th roster spot to meet NBA requirements of having at least 14 players (maximum 15) on the roster to start the season. The team typically keeps the 15th spot open for potential mid-season acquisitions or buyout market opportunities, making the decision for the 14th spot particularly important.<\/p>\n
2. Point Guard Depth Is a Priority<\/p>\n
Chris Fedor emphasized that point guard depth should be a priority given Darius Garland\u2019s expected absence at the beginning of the season and questions about Craig Porter Jr.\u2019s readiness for a bigger role. The team has learned from past experiences about the importance of having multiple playmakers, and they recently let Ty Jerome go in free agency, creating a potential void in the backcourt.<\/p>\n
3. Malcolm Brogdon Considered an Ideal Fit<\/p>\n
Malcolm Brogdon was mentioned by both hosts as a logical fit for the Cavaliers, offering playmaking, defense, and shooting experience. However, they acknowledged he likely wants a situation with more guaranteed playing time and might be waiting to see where Russell Westbrook signs before making his decision about joining a team where he could get more minutes.<\/p>\n
4. Role Acceptance Is Critical for 14th Roster Spot<\/p>\n
A key consideration for the 14th roster spot is finding someone who understands and accepts their limited role. The ideal candidate would be comfortable potentially never playing significant minutes and not complaining about lack of playing time. Tristan Thompson was cited as an example of someone who understood this role last season and didn\u2019t create issues about playing time.<\/p>\n
5. Gary Payton II Suggested as Defensive Option<\/p>\n
Jimmy Watkins suggested Gary Payton II as a potential replacement for Isaac Okoro\u2019s defensive role. He highlighted Payton\u2019s defensive abilities, 6\u20328\u2033 wingspan, and playoff experience with the Warriors. Watkins also noted the connection between Payton and Cavaliers assistant coach Kenny Atkinson from their time together in Golden State, suggesting this relationship could be beneficial.<\/p>\n
6. Veteran Leadership vs. On-Court Production<\/p>\n
The hosts debated whether the Cavaliers should prioritize veteran leadership (like Tristan Thompson) or on-court production with their 14th roster spot. Jimmy Watkins questioned if teams can afford to use roster spots primarily for leadership in the current NBA environment where depth is increasingly important, suggesting the team needs players who can contribute on the court when called upon.<\/p>\n
7. Russell Westbrook Not Considered a Good Fit<\/p>\n
Speculators suggested Russell Westbrook as a potential option, but both Chris Fedor and Jimmy Watkins strongly disagreed. They cited concerns about Westbrook\u2019s expectations for playing time (he averaged 27 minutes with Denver last season), his ball-dominant style that wouldn\u2019t complement Evan Mobley\u2019s development, and potential chemistry issues if he\u2019s unhappy with a reduced role on a championship contender.<\/p>\n
8. Limited Free Agent Market Remains<\/p>\n
The hosts acknowledged the limited options remaining in free agency, with many of the best available players either looking for more playing time or not being ideal fits for the Cavaliers\u2019 system. The list of remaining free agents discussed included Malcolm Brogdon, Chris Boucher, Monte Morris, Cory Joseph, Gary Payton II, Precious Achiuwa, and several others, but each comes with limitations or concerns.<\/p>\n
9. Tristan Thompson Return Considered Logical<\/p>\n
Despite his limited on-court impact, Tristan Thompson was mentioned as a logical option for the 14th roster spot due to his willingness to accept a veteran minimum contract, his established relationships within the organization, and his leadership value to younger players like Darius Garland. His familiarity with the team culture and acceptance of a limited role make him a safe, if not impactful, option.<\/p>\n
10. Cavaliers in No Rush to Make Decision<\/p>\n
Chris Fedor emphasized that the Cavaliers are in no hurry to fill the 14th roster spot, understanding that this player likely won\u2019t be a consequential member of the rotation. The team is prioritizing finding the right fit both in terms of playing style and personality rather than simply signing the most talented available player, and they may wait to see if better options emerge as training camps approach.<\/p>\n
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Subscribe and listen on <\/a>Apple Podcasts<\/a> or Spotify<\/a>.<\/p>\n The video version of the podcast is on YouTube<\/a> as well.<\/p>\n Transcript<\/b><\/p>\n NOTE: This transcript was generated by artificial intelligence and could contain misspellings and errors.<\/p>\n Ethan Sands: What up Cavs Nation? I\u2019m your host, Ethan Sands, and I\u2019m back with another episode of the Wine and Gold Talk podcast. Joining me today, fresh back from Las Vegas, Jimmy Watkins. And alongside him, you know him, you love him, Chris Fedor, Cas beat reporter. And guys, we have to get into the final stages of the off season for the Cleveland Cavaliers, specifically because they still don\u2019t have a full roster. They\u2019re still looking for their 14th man on this roster and obviously I don\u2019t know, NBA standards say that you have to have at least 14 players with a maximum of 15 players on the roster to start the season. And I\u2019ve been a big proponent of the Cavs need to go get a true enforcing big. Well, that is not a hot commodity of players that actually would fit in the Cav system that could make an impact. All of these different things. So as much as I would have loved for the Cavs to have signed somebody in unrestricted free agency earlier on into the process, that could have been a more enforcing big and more rebounding and all of these things that I\u2019ve talked about on previous podcasts at length, it doesn\u2019t look like that\u2019s the best option for the Cavs in the last bit of free agents still left on the market. So I picked two different players that I think could fit into the Cav system. It would make sense. And then Jimmy, I was telling Chris before the podcast started, I got two head turners that you guys might scratch your head about or just laugh me off the show, but we\u2019ll get into those later. The first two names that I have that I thought could potentially make an impact on this Cavs team, Malcolm Brompton and Chris Boucher. Those are my top two guys that are still on the free agency list. That makes sense. Either you get a wing slash guard and Malcolm Brogdom that can defend, can shoot, has experience, or Chris Boucher, another stretch power forward type player that has experience in the playoffs and has the opportunity to play alongside Jared Allen, Evan Mobley and Larry Nance Jr. I think he\u2019s a good fit as well. When you talk about the scoring acumen, when you talk about the defense, when you talk about the length and the stretch that the Cavs like to play with and he can run and gun as well. But guys, as we talked about on this podcast before, it\u2019s more so what the Cavs need than a who the Cavs need at this point, 14th roster spot. But I want to ask you guys this, if you could pick a Skill set, a type of player, a wing, a guard, a big. What do you think the Cavs need? And if you have a player in mind, list them off. Who do you think the Cavs should go get with the 14th roster spot? Chris, let\u2019s start with you.<\/p>\n Chris Fedor: Yeah. For me, I just wonder, guys, about the readiness of Craig Porter Jr. To step into a bigger role. I know the Cavs have been viewing him as, you know, a backup point guard at the NBA level for the last couple of years, but I just don\u2019t know. This is a team that has championship aspirations. This is a team whose starting point guard is probably going to miss some time. At the beginning of the season, they let go of Ty Jerome or they decided not to bring back Ty Jerome in free agency. So I think one of the things that they have learned over the last three to five years is just how many playmakers they should have on the roster and what this team and what this offense looks like when they\u2019re short on playmakers, when they\u2019re short on point guards, there are times, this is a couple of years ago, where they had to rely on Kevin Pangos to actually, like, dribble and organize and just get some minutes at the point guard spot. So I think in some ways it\u2019s kind of been a cursed position for the Cavs, but. But I think given the situation that they\u2019re in right now, I think it would benefit them to have another ball handler. I think it would benefit them to get some more depth at. At the point guard or shooting guard position. If it\u2019s a shooting guard that can run the offense, great. If it\u2019s not a shooting guard that can run the offense than a backup point guard or a third point guard, somebody that can battle with Craig Porter Jr. I just don\u2019t like the idea of putting too much on the plate of Donovan Mitchell and just saying, hey, like this is Donovan Mitchell, he can handle this responsibility while Darius Garland is out for however long he\u2019s going to be out. And I don\u2019t like the idea of putting more responsibility on somebody like Lonzo Ball. He\u2019s going to have playmaking responsibility. Obviously, he\u2019s going to have a versatile role where he does a little bit of playmaking, a little bit of creating. You want him to do those things, but I just don\u2019t think you want to overdo it with Donovan or overdo it with Lonzo because you just don\u2019t have enough depth at that spot. So to me, that\u2019s kind of where I would look first. Malcolm Brogdon is somebody that I\u2019ve had on my radar for a number of weeks now. I don\u2019t think this is the situation that he\u2019ll choose. I think he wants a place where he can play and play real NBA minutes. And I think he\u2019s waiting to see where Russell Westbrook goes and then go somewhere else that has an opening at point guard potentially. I think Corey Joseph is interesting because here\u2019s the other thing. Beyond just what kind of skill set, what player are we looking at here? It has to be somebody who understands what this role is. It has to be somebody who\u2019s willing to come to a situation and maybe never play and never complain about it and never start saying some things behind the scenes about a lack of playing time or a lack of consistent minutes or something along those lines. The beauty of Tristan Thompson in the particular role that he was in last year is that he was never going to say anything about flying time. He was never going to sit there and chirp about not getting opportunities because he knew what he was signing up for. And whoever this is that comes here, they have to know their guy. Number 14 on a team that has championship aspirations. And there\u2019s not really a pathway to playing time, at least consistent playing time, especially when this team is at full strength.<\/p>\n Jimmy Watkins: So I would hope at this point of the process, July 28, that those conversations are almost built in. Like, if you are a unrestricted free agent right now and you\u2019re in contact with the Cavs, who have one roster spot left, sure, have the conversation. But I feel like we should kind of understand each other. Like, this is a team that won 64 games, that did some light rotation shuffling, but didn\u2019t make any major changes. Like, you kind of should know, like Malcolm. To Chris\u2019s point, Malcolm Brogdon might not want that role. That\u2019s why Malcolm Broughton won\u2019t show up here. Right. I was thinking of a. A name I would throw out there for a similar role. I was thinking I want Lonzo Ball Insurance as well, and just extra playmaking. If Lonzo\u2019s healthy, that\u2019d be great. Between Brogdon and Lonzo, maybe together they give you 82. Another guy like that, Monty Morris.<\/p>\n Chris Fedor: Yeah.<\/p>\n Jimmy Watkins: Who is. Has not played. Let\u2019s see, Monte basketball hasn\u2019t played more than 45 games since 20, 22, 23. You don\u2019t love that. He\u2019s going to be in his age 30 season next year. You don\u2019t love that. But veteran, steady in presence, has put together some playoff runs before. Can run your bench like that\u2019s that\u2019s stability. That\u2019s a guy whose career 39% three point shooter on three attempts a game and limited minutes like at this again also while these other restricted free agents unrestricted free agents need to understand where the Cavs are I think the Cavs need to understand where they are in the ecosystem right now. And beggars can\u2019t be choosers and everything at every player at this point is going to have some sort of wart. That\u2019s why they\u2019re out here. You know if you\u2019re throwing out some senor names I don\u2019t mind Chris Boucher. I think he could actually play. You could play some five he did that with Toronto. If you want a small ball another small ball option Again Larry Nance Jr. Has not been the picture of health over the last few years this career so if you want some depth there I get that precious Achua similar if you want like your old school I get rebounds. Let me be a tough guy. I\u2019ve been in the playoffs DeAndre Jordan like actually played in the play like I was there it happened actually played in the playoffs last year. I was watching. I was watching. I\u2019m a tele I couldn\u2019t believe it was happening but it did happen for Denver last year and then I don\u2019t say if we for an Isaac Koro replacement like innings eater defense first guy about Gary Payton II like there\u2019s a lot of moving pieces in Golden State right now. They are orienting their entire off season around what Jonathan Kaminga is doing. Bad thing to do by the way kids don\u2019t plan your off seasons around Jonathan Kaminga. That\u2019s not going to work out well for you. You\u2019re going to miss out on a lot of good other options while you\u2019re doing that. But like we\u2019ve heard them like Al Horford seems all but assured to go there. We\u2019ve heard Seth Curry\u2019s name floated in that direction. We\u2019ve heard Ben Simmons name in that correction direction. I\u2019m just like hearing all this stuff and it\u2019s like what\u2019s happening with Gary Payton because Gary Payton the second a little bit shorter than Isaac Coral but six eight wingspan and and and has actually contributed to to a deep playoff run before. Wow. Now let\u2019s not get crazy. Gary Payton II is not a good three point shooter his playoff track like he had he he shoots one and a half threes a game career in the playoffs he\u2019s not he\u2019s not going to shoot a lot but he\u2019s he\u2019s done enough in those, in those playoff runs to let Steve Kerr keep trusting him. And they\u2019ve even like they would go super small and like Gary Payton the second play like de facto center at times. They were doing some crazy stuff with Gary Payton II and I\u2019m not so sure how that would work with the Cavs having one not nonish shooting down. We can\u2019t really even call him in Mobile a non shooting big anymore. But like other big people, other big people who like to occupy paint space from time to time. That would be challenging. It also needs to be pointed out that anyone who\u2019s ever played in the warriors system was playing with Stephen Curry and Klay Thompson for most of their careers. That\u2019s not a, that\u2019s not a realistic offensive environment that can be created in other places. Those are the two greatest shooters of all time. They both have the defense\u2019s maximum attention always. They create space that other teams are going to struggle to create. That being said, Kenny Atkinson runs a lot of similar concepts to the Golden State Warriors. Him and Gary Payton the second know each other. They were both a part of that title run. They might speak the same language. Gary Payton II has been a DNP guy for long stretches. To our conversation about can he embrace that role? I think he could. He seems to be a likable teammate. He makes a lot of sense to me. And if we\u2019re just looking again, the Cav didn\u2019t make many changes. But big picture, they replaced Ty Jerome with Lonzo Ball. They replace positionally Tristan Thompson with Larry Nance Jr. If we\u2019re going position for position, the one hole that they actually haven\u2019t replaced yet is the Isaac Coro spot. Now you can just say that DeAndre Hunter, Dean Wade, Sam Merrill will soak up that minute and suck up those minutes. I think that\u2019s fine. Yeah, Jaylon Tyson, I think that\u2019s fine. I think that\u2019s a fine solution going forward. But if you want another Isaac Coro type guy, we just had the conversation all playoffs about like this defense up to up to snub right now. Like we like that\u2019s not a question we really anticipated having on. On that kind of level. This is a guy, this is another Swiss army knife type piece that you can deploy at your will. And I think he would be agreeable to a, to a bit roll.<\/p>\n Chris Fedor: The belief around the NBA has been that that Peyton\u2019s either going to go back to the warriors or join the Los Angeles Lakers. Um, I guess we\u2019ll see on that sort of thing. But you bring up a point about him having a relationship with Kenny at this point, when you\u2019re filling out your roster, a lot of these coaches have been using that last roster spot is just somebody who can be an extension of them, somebody who can be.<\/p>\n Jimmy Watkins: Just.<\/p>\n Chris Fedor: In a guy who understands the system, a guy who has familiarity with a coaching staff, a guy who has a built in relationship in, in some capacity. And Gary Payton II certainly does have that with, with Kenny Atkinson. It\u2019s just a question is, is there a better situation waiting for him out there and is it one that he thinks would potentially have a little bit more of a path to playing time? Javante Green kind of fits that mold too. Obviously the Cavs brought him this season and they talked about his defense and they talked about him getting through screens and his physicality and his athleticism and stuff like that. I think he\u2019s a possibility just, just because of the time that he spent here with the Cavs getting to know this, this team, this roster, this organization, the coaches that were a part of it as well. I wouldn\u2019t rule him out, but, but I do think oftentimes when you\u2019re talking about this guy, lots of coaches in the NBA and J.B. bickerstaff did the same thing. You just like bringing somebody in that can speak the same language that you speak and they can help just because they can be an extension of the coaching staff and there\u2019s a level of familiarity there.<\/p>\n Jimmy Watkins: I also wouldn\u2019t hurt a little more new blood, you know, like this, this team, this team has not, not again, whoever. It\u2019s not like massive drastic changes or anything like that. I just think that can get a little stale in a locker room. A lot of these guys have been hearing repeating similar talking points over the last couple of years. They\u2019ve had similar experiences. Wouldn\u2019t hurt to bring in somebody who has deep playoff run experience with Kenny, but has it from a different perspective can, you know, maybe even like in a, in a meeting jog Kenny\u2019s memory about something they did in Golden State? Like some, something like. I don\u2019t, I don\u2019t hate the idea of, of new blood. Also, I like Javante Green\u2019s just like older Gary Payton. They\u2019re very similar players.<\/p>\n Ethan Sands: Okay, time to get into my crazy options that you will probably not like.<\/p>\n Jimmy Watkins: But how about this. Wait a minute, real quick. I just did some research. Gary Payton older than Javante Green. Learn something every day. Learn something every day.<\/p>\n Ethan Sands: Interesting. But as I was saying, as someone that I know is older than Javante Crane and Gary Payton, the second Russell Westbrook, a guy with a lot of grit. I know, Jimmy, I know you do not like this idea. A lot of grit, a lot of playoff experience. Someone who has seen his role decline over the past years but still has that extra brush step is learning to be a better defender, is a great leader and is is being told from NBA players around the league is a great teammate as well. I think there\u2019s a lot that it feels that he feels is left on the bone. And if there\u2019s one person that I feel like is still in this unrestricted free agency class that is ring chasing the most, it might be Russell Westbrook. And also we talked about the point guard necessities for backup duties and all these things. Plus I do want to point out that his name has been linked to the Sacramento Kings. So whether or not this is feasible and all these things is still up in the air. But Russell Westbrook\u2019s one of those guys where I just think you want to see what he has left and how he can contribute to a winning team, a winning organization. And you saw a little bit of that with Denver and how he was able to make some passes. Obviously he averaged like six assists a game last year, which I think is comparable for some of the players that the Cavs have on the roster, especially coming off the bench.<\/p>\n Chris Fedor: Okay, so there are a couple of things. Well, I did not expect you to say Russ, of. Of all the people out there, I did not expect you to say Russ. There\u2019s some truth to the things that you\u2019re saying, but no, he is used to playing 20 minutes a night, and that\u2019s just not available here. And you talk about ring chasing. Depending on the situation that a guy is in, they probably do want to compete for a championship, but they want to compete for a championship on their terms and they want to be a part of a team that wins a championship and not a cheerleader for a championship team or not a bench warmer for a championship team. Especially somebody like Russ, who it feels like he still believes that he can play and he can play at a high level and he\u2019s never, not averaged double figures in scoring throughout the course of his career. So I just don\u2019t think he played 27 minutes a night last year for the Nuggets. No, that\u2019s not available to him here. And I just don\u2019t think. I think there are certain people that, yeah, he can be a good teammate and he probably is a good teammate when he\u2019s happy, when he\u2019s getting the things that ultimately he may want, like if, if you believe that he is a good teammate, if you believe that that is part of who he\u2019s been throughout the course of his career. He\u2019s also been competing for MVPs throughout the course of his career and playing as many minutes as he would want. And I just think he\u2019s the kind of guy where the minute things don\u2019t go the way that he wants them to go, playing time, opportunity, role usage, all that kind of stuff, you\u2019re going to hear about it and you\u2019re going to have a very unhappy future hall of Famer behind the scenes that could be disruptive to your chemistry. And you might sit here and say, well, Donovan could help police the locker room. Max Stru can help police the locker room. Russ is a big personality now and he has been throughout the course of his career. So there are so many different reasons why I say no beyond just, I don\u2019t know how he would fit in this kind of offense, the style of player that he is and defenders shading away from him when he\u2019s out behind the three point line and. But the biggest thing to me is I think whoever this is has to accept a specific role. And there is no way that Russell Westbrook is accepting a role that is going to have him be the 14th man on a team that is competing for a championship. And he\u2019s only going to play 12 to 16 minutes a night if that. And that\u2019s probably at the high end.<\/p>\n Jimmy Watkins: Does that sound like a good teammate that Chris just described? Didn\u2019t sound like a good teammate to me. Russell Westbrook\u2019s such a good teammate that he\u2019s been on six teams in seven years. We\u2019re about to go for seven on eight. What if he\u2019s not a good teammate? Why does he keep bouncing around? Yeah, why do you keep bouncing around?<\/p>\n Chris Fedor: Anyway, he\u2019s not a good teammate. How is that? His reputation?<\/p>\n Jimmy Watkins: Well, I, I think he\u2019s a legend and people respect him and people don\u2019t want to badmouth him, but it\u2019s very clear that he\u2019s very difficult to play with, particularly at this stage in his career. And by the way, most superstars as they age get more difficult.<\/p>\n Chris Fedor: Yeah.<\/p>\n Jimmy Watkins: Oftentimes the last guy to know that they don\u2019t have it anymore is the guy. Russell Westbrook has kind of seemed like one of those guys. He\u2019s kind of maybe sort of a little bit starting to get it. It took playing with the best passer in the world for him to learn, oh, maybe I should cut off the ball a little bit more. And know my role and maybe I don\u2019t need the ball all the time. I don\u2019t think he would. It\u2019s honestly, like, it\u2019s just, it\u2019s never going to happen, so we don\u2019t have to worry about it. But you want to talk about empowering Evan Mobley, Things Russell Westbrook won\u2019t do for 400. Right there, it\u2019s Russell. Russell Westbrook. Russell Westbrook running the bench unit. Evan Mobi\u2019s Evan Moby. Russell also would make Evan Mobley look like Thomas Bryant calling for the ball while LeBron shooting the Kareem record breaking shot. Like, you\u2019re just not getting the ball. You\u2019re just not getting the ball. He\u2019s made no all Stars since the bubble year. And the thing about, okay, maybe Jonathan Mitchell and Max Strus would be able to police the locker room about that. Those dudes grew up watching this guy.<\/p>\n Chris Fedor: I know.<\/p>\n Jimmy Watkins: And it\u2019s really, really. When you introduce that dynamic to do, like, Donovan, Mitchell\u2019s closer to, like, Dwyane Wade than Russell Westbrook, but, like, there are similarities in their game. I\u2019m sure Donovan grew up modeling his game a little bit after Russ. That\u2019s a hard conversation to have, man. It\u2019s a hard conversation to have. Russell Westbrook is going to get like, if everything goes according to plan, if in this imaginary world that doesn\u2019t exist where Russell Westbrook\u2019s on the Cavs, he\u2019s going to get benched for Lono ball. How does Russell Westbrook feel about that?<\/p>\n Chris Fedor: Yep.<\/p>\n Jimmy Watkins: How does that go over in the locker room? He\u2019s, by the way, he\u2019s playoff liability at this point in his career. He\u2019s Mr. Try to do too much sometimes. It\u2019s, it\u2019s. It legitimately still can channel itself into like, wow, look at this burst of energy this guy gives.<\/p>\n Chris Fedor: He plays, yes.<\/p>\n Jimmy Watkins: Hard as heck. Except on defense. Except on defense. He plays really hard. He. He plays with an attitude that\u2019s cool. The Cavs could use that. He also turned. That manifests itself in him turning the ball over and taking terrible shots. Not. It\u2019s not a good fit.<\/p>\n Chris Fedor: Do you remember the end of the Kevin Love experience here in Cleveland? To me, that would have similar vibes. And one of the problems that Kevin had was that he thought he should be playing. He thought there was still more that he could contribute from an on court perspective. And he was essentially looking at Dean Wade like, huh? What? Really? I\u2019m a future hall of Famer. This guy\u2019s playing instead of me. Like, wait a minute, hold on. I won a championship. My jersey might be hanging in those rafters. And you\u2019re telling me that I\u2019m out of the rotation, Like, I can still play. I\u2019m still Kevin Love. And him and I had those conversations shortly after he joined the Heat about how difficult it was for him to try and accept that the Cavs believed that he didn\u2019t have enough to offer on the court because he said himself, on the record, I can still play. I still have more to give. And if you have a guy that feels like that, he sits there and he looks at all the things that he\u2019s accomplished throughout the course of his career and believes that he can still play and be effective and be a contributor, they\u2019re going to be really, really unhappy not being a contributor.<\/p>\n Ethan Sands: I\u2019m not going to disagree with that. And I think, Chris, you make a great point about K Love, and obviously it made me think about Tristan Thompson just because of their relationship and all of that stuff. But Tristan Thompson also told me, on the record, I\u2019m better out than a lot of these MF\u2019s around the league. And he still believes that he can play as well. Right. So. So I\u2019m.<\/p>\n Chris Fedor: But he also understands.<\/p>\n Ethan Sands: Yes, yes.<\/p>\n Chris Fedor: That. That leadership is a big part of who he is and why he\u2019s still in the NBA. Or at least why he was still in the NBA at the time that he was having those conversations with you.<\/p>\n Ethan Sands: A thousand percent. A thousand percent. Okay. And I preface that before we get into that, that you guys were not going to like these. So even the.<\/p>\n Jimmy Watkins: I don\u2019t think there\u2019s one I could like less. Honestly, I don\u2019t think there\u2019s one I could like less.<\/p>\n Chris Fedor: I agree.<\/p>\n Ethan Sands: Well, all right. Well, here we go. Let\u2019s try this one. Cam Reddish from the last one.<\/p>\n Chris Fedor: Jesus. What are we doing? Oh, no, no.<\/p>\n Ethan Sands: Oh, man. Wow.<\/p>\n Chris Fedor: I didn\u2019t think you could be worse. What\u2019s next? Ben Simmons?<\/p>\n Ethan Sands: No, because I don\u2019t want Ben Simmons.<\/p>\n Chris Fedor: Oh, okay.<\/p>\n Jimmy Watkins: Simmons is the best name I\u2019ve heard so far. The best name I\u2019ve heard.<\/p>\n Ethan Sands: Hey, what? Creature of environment. Six foot eight, stretch wing, growing defender. I do think that when he was with Atlanta, he was shooting the lights out when he was given opportunity. Then you get to the Lakers, your role diminishes all these things. It\u2019s just someone that I feel like deserves a shot to have just a lot of confidence built into them. Right. And obviously you understand that he\u2019s not going to be asking for minutes because he\u2019s going to be happy with whatever is given to him. But I think there are different organizations around the league that have built in a better way to work with players, even if they\u2019re not getting minutes right. There\u2019s never been a time where I felt like Craig Quarter Jr. Was losing his confidence and never felt like Jaylon Tyson was losing his confidence. And that\u2019s in part because of how these. These teams are. The Cleveland Cavaliers in general have worked with their players. And I\u2019m not saying that Cam Reddish would make an impact in any department. I just think he\u2019s a guy that one. Coming from Duke, you hear all of these stories about growing up playing against Cal Reddish and these NBA players are talking about he\u2019s one of the best players they played against. I think that player still in there somewhere. He just needs a place to find itself to come to fruition.<\/p>\n Chris Fedor: Oh, my gosh. So there\u2019s a first round pedigree, obviously. And there was one point years ago where the Cavs did like Cam Reddish and they were intrigued by Cam Reddish. But the term toxic has followed him around since he left Duke. It has followed him around throughout the NBA. And I just. He seems to have this belief that. That he\u2019s better than he is. And I don\u2019t think he\u2019s somebody who blends into the fabric of a team because he wants more opportunity, he wants more responsibility, he wants more usage. He wants more than what a team would be willing to give him in terms of a role. So I think there\u2019s a reason why you\u2019re talking about somebody who was a high first round pick, a lottery pick that to this point has washed out in his career. And it\u2019s not as much about the basketball related stuff.<\/p>\n Jimmy Watkins: So, yeah, camrendish is a. How many times we gotta teach you this lesson, old man kind of player. Right. We\u2019ve said the first round pedigree. It gets players. It gets players a long way.<\/p>\n Chris Fedor: You go.<\/p>\n Jimmy Watkins: You go get picked high like Camden and even like high school pedigree, camaraderie. Had a ton of high school pedigree. He\u2019s on the Duke team with RJ Barrett and Zion Williamson. I remember watching him thinking like, ooh, there\u2019s some smooth parts to this guy\u2019s game. I kind of, kind of see the vision here. It\u2019s just never happened. And at this point where we six, seven years in, it ain\u2019t happening. Like Cam. Cam Reddish\u2019s path to an NBA career at this point is completely scrapping the idea he ever had of himself. Yeah. And becoming a. A role player at 3 and D wing, he needs to, he\u2019s having ego death. Cambridge needs to have an ego death. He needs to let go. And clearly he\u2019s, he has not been. Been willing to do that. I, I like what Ethan said about the Cavs do a good job of working with players who don\u2019t get minutes and still maintain their confidence.<\/p>\n Ethan Sands: That\u2019s cool.<\/p>\n Jimmy Watkins: Craig Porter Jr. And Jaylon Tyson can do that because they\u2019re building towards something. They chasing a carrot. Cam\u2019s chasing something that doesn\u2019t exist. Like eventually Kenny Akinson wakes up every day or the coaching staff wakes every day, said Craig Porter Jr. If you do this, this, this and this, like one day, then you could be this Jaylen Tyson. You do this, this, this, and this, and one day, you know, you could be a playmaking wing three and D guy. I don\u2019t know. With a little playmaking juice to you. Cam Reddish has had those conversations and he\u2019s done none of it. All the things that he was supposed to do, he didn\u2019t do them. It\u2019s. It\u2019s kind of just like if I\u2019m, honestly, if I\u2019m choosing the best. This is almost an oxymoron. But the best NBA situation for Cam Reddish right now is like a tanking team with no culture. Like for. In Cam Reddish\u2019s mind, like, you want to get some shots up. Cool. Go play for like Brooklyn or someone. Someone who just needs empty calories bucket getting. If you can even still do that. Like, it\u2019s been so long since he\u2019s been in a position where he\u2019s had the ball in his hand. Like, I just think that he\u2019s, he\u2019s like very dangerously flirting with like out of the league territory. So there\u2019s. Oh yeah, draft pedigree.<\/p>\n Chris Fedor: I mean, the latest. We have a lot of supposed to work out or try out for the Mavericks.<\/p>\n Jimmy Watkins: Exactly, exactly. That\u2019s. That\u2019s where he is in his career. So if that ain\u2019t the wake up call, I don\u2019t know what is. And the Cavs don\u2019t need a wake up call guy right now.<\/p>\n Chris Fedor: Yeah, I don\u2019t think it\u2019s the right fit. I don\u2019t think it\u2019s the right player for roster spot number 14. I don\u2019t think it\u2019s the right fit or the right player for, for this organization, period.<\/p>\n Jimmy Watkins: Kind of can\u2019t believe how much he played for the Lakers. They really spoke to how desperate the Lakers were wing wise. They were like, hey, this is our defensive stopper. Since when? Since when, when is you. I get. He\u2019s athletic I guess you\u2019re athletic. I guess he\u2019s athletic, but he can\u2019t really shoot. He can\u2019t. He doesn\u2019t. I guess he\u2019s athletic enough to defend, but he doesn\u2019t do it at a super high level. I just. I don\u2019t know. He\u2019s. He\u2019s. Which is a bummer because I liked him. I liked him in college.<\/p>\n Chris Fedor: Yeah.<\/p>\n Ethan Sands: And it\u2019s just so crazy to think of him now is like, Jimmy, you just said he\u2019s not a shooter. Like, that\u2019s what he was known for. Like, that\u2019s insane to me that, like, it was always.<\/p>\n Jimmy Watkins: It was kind of always theoretical. Everyone. Like, I\u2019m not. Oh, he\u2019s got a good jump shot.<\/p>\n Chris Fedor: Yeah.<\/p>\n Jimmy Watkins: Does he? He didn\u2019t make a high percentage of threes at Duke. Well, okay. He can, like in Atlanta. I\u2019m. I\u2019m just looking at his cameras. Is a career 32.2% 3 point shooter on 3.4 attempts per game. He has shot better than 35% one time in his career. He\u2019s not a shooter. He\u2019s a shooter in that he shoots. They don\u2019t go in again.<\/p>\n Ethan Sands: For fans listening, I prefaced with the fact that nobody was going to like these. They\u2019re just ideas that have come up not only from the Internet, but our subtexters and subscribers throwing these names around. I wanted to see what you guys thought.<\/p>\n Chris Fedor: But wait, somebody came up with Cam Reddish.<\/p>\n Ethan Sands: Hey. Hey, man. Hey, man. Don\u2019t hate messenger.<\/p>\n Jimmy Watkins: Was it Cam from la?<\/p>\n Ethan Sands: I don\u2019t think I asked for people to send their names next to these ones, but I do think that there are players that the Cavs are looking at that we might not be thinking of? Right. So, Chris Jame to end today\u2019s podcast. Is there a player that you don\u2019t think is necessarily on everybody\u2019s radar that you wouldn\u2019t be surprised if the Cavs were giving them a second look? And no, I\u2019m not talking about Victor Oladipo, who is also looking for a career resurgence, but someone outside of that.<\/p>\n Chris Fedor: Well, I wouldn\u2019t completely dismiss Tristan Thompson. I just think the Cavs are in no hurry with. With this kind of situation. I think they understand the makeup of this roster and they understand that guy 14 is really not going to be a consequential member of the Cavs. So given what\u2019s remaining in free agency, given what they\u2019ve already done this off season, they\u2019re just in no hurry to figure out who they\u2019re going to give this spot to. And I think it could Be a big. It could be a wing, it could be a point guard. I know everybody wants answers on these things, but at the end of the day, it\u2019s more about is it the right fit, is it the right fitting player? And is it the right fitting person? And it may not be the most talented guy that\u2019s available in free agency. The most talented guy available in free agency is maybe Ben Simmons at this point. Russell Westbrook, Malcolm Brogdon, somebody else I\u2019m missing. Malik Beasley, technically, hey, like a Tim up there.<\/p>\n Jimmy Watkins: I don\u2019t know how this works, but like Malik Beasley was going to be like a 20 million per year player before all this happened. If, if, like, if he gets on the other side of this clean adjacent, would you, oh, here we go. Would you roll the dice? Malik Beasley? I would say. I would also say nothing wrong with waiting till the bio market. If you don\u2019t. If there\u2019s. We\u2019re naming a lot of guys that you don\u2019t like right now. Okay, sign a two way guy and see where it, see where that guy ends up. And there\u2019s gonna be a lot of Western Conference teams that think they\u2019re gonna make the playoffs. They\u2019re not gonna make the playoffs. The west is really deep. The west is really deep. And those teams are going to be like, well, what do we do now? This veteran player, we. It\u2019s time for us to tank. It\u2019s a deep draft class next year here. Go find, go find a championship contender to help out in the East. With the vacuum of the talent that has just left the East. There\u2019s probably some, some ambitious Eastern Conference playing regulars or even below who think, hey, why can\u2019t we be a top 60? They\u2019re not going to be top six teams. They can\u2019t all be top six teams. And they\u2019ll look around and they\u2019ll go, maybe it\u2019s not time for us to tank. And then they\u2019ll cut loose one of their, one of their good players. A lot of guys out there. I also will just say about the Victor Oladipo thing. I saw when Chris first subtexted about that, like, I don\u2019t know, two weeks ago at this point. There\u2019s something in there about how Dan Gilbert has always really liked Victor Oladipo. And I thought to myself, hmm, if only there was a way that Dan Gilbert could have gotten Victor Oladipo on the Cavs earlier. If only.<\/p>\n Chris Fedor: I just think that\u2019s where we\u2019re at in terms of free agency. Listen to these names that we\u2019re Talking about here, how many of those are actually appealing? How many of those are you saying, hey, that guy could be a helpful player on a championship team. Hey, that guy can add some insurance. That guy could add depth. Yeah, I mean, I certainly think there are some of those names out there, but I don\u2019t know that the situation that the Cavs are offering will be appealing to those guys. So guy number 14, they\u2019re going to have to scrape the bottom of the barrel or it has to be somebody who is just like, you know what, I probably can\u2019t play much anymore. Just let me latch on and see if I can get a ring. You\u2019re third in odds for an NBA championship. If I can\u2019t play anymore, if I can\u2019t help on the court, can I help behind the scenes while also maybe possibly getting a ring? I don\u2019t know who fits that profile, but that would be the kind of player that could be in interest to the Cavs and some of the other guys that we talked about. Like, I do think Monte Morris is a logical fit for this team in the situation that they\u2019re in and in the situation that his career is in. I think Corey Joseph is a logical fit for this team. Is he going to complain about not getting minutes? No, he understands where he\u2019s at at this stage of his career, but he can probably help you. Enough ish. Enough ish. Just get through the grind of the 82 game regular season and just be there in case that\u2019s what this position is. Can you be there in case things don\u2019t go the way that they were expected to go or a pile of injuries happens all at the same time? Can you prevent us from having to go and pull somebody up from the Cleveland Charge?<\/p>\n Jimmy Watkins: Corey Joseph, AKA the Lightning Rod. Never forget, it was the Magic\u2019s Lightning Rod last year. But it feels like Cory Jost has been eating innings at backup point guard since he got in the league. God bless him.<\/p>\n Ethan Sands: And I do want to make this last bit of context for all of our listeners. Whoever signs with the Cavs for the 14th roster spot will have to sign a veteran minimum. And people around the league understand if you sign a veteran minimum, it is very hard to then again sign a contract in the NBA that is not for a veteran minimum. That is in part along with what Chris mentioned with the leadership behind the scenes, why I think the best option for the Cavs is if they bring back Tristan Thompson. Even though Larry Nance has the leadership. Even though Larry Nance has the pedigree and the relationships built in with players that are already here. It\u2019s not quite to the level of Tristan Thompson. It\u2019s not quite to the experience level of playing alongside the growth period like Tristan Thompson has over the last couple of years. I think it\u2019s just very important to remember what Tristan Thompson not only means to Darius Garland and other players in this in this locker room, but also to the Cavs organization as a whole hole. But yeah, it\u2019s slim pickings.<\/p>\n Jimmy Watkins: I make a quick two quick second April points that because two things that you just mentioned, Ethan, are on on the Tristan Thompson point. I love Tristan Thompson. He\u2019s a franchise icon. He might have his retire his number retired in the Raptors one day. That being said, he can\u2019t help you on the basketball court anymore. And as we get deeper, as we get into this new era of basketball, I feel like people are saying like the second like people are acting like the second neighbor\u2019s been around for like, oh, we\u2019ve got seven unique championships. Second neighbor\u2019s working. Second secondary has been in effect for two years. We\u2019re still very much learning what the reality of the NBA looks like. But one thing I can confidently say is that depth is more important than ever and that\u2019s 1 through 15. So can you really afford to be wasting roster spots on leadership? Which that\u2019s not a waste. That\u2019s the wrong word. But like can you afford to be getting encore zeros? I think that\u2019s an open question. I would also say that the thing that you said are minimums. That that\u2019s true and has been for a long time where guys are very hesitant to sign the first one because it\u2019s hard to get off that. I wonder if that\u2019s changing because there\u2019s gon. We\u2019re going to come to this point often now where teams are super duper capped out and they\u2019re not going to have many options. Look, it\u2019s like if you want to play for a championship contender, like you might have to pick one. You might have to pick I play for a minimum versus I play for a championship contender. So I wonder if maybe your more guys are going to be more willing to do that and we might see some more salary fluctuations because guys who just end up having to take scraps every now and again have outsized impacts and the cap environment changes for other teams and they\u2019re like, well, this guy\u2019s worth, you know, a BAE or a tax taxpayer mle or something like that. Just. Just two thoughts.<\/p>\n Ethan Sands: Let me just rephrase how I worded it. I think Tristan Thompson is the most logical option for the Cavs at this point only because as Jimmy was saying, it\u2019s very hard to get off the minimums. I don\u2019t know if Malcolm Brogdon\u2019s signing a minimum. I don\u2019t know if Chris Boucher is signing a minimum. As I mentioned at the beginning of this podcast, those are the two players that I think fit the best and make the most sense for the Cavs if they want to get the most out of that 14th roster spot. But again, there\u2019s the question of are they ready to take a step back from whatever role they had? Are they ready to have less minutes? All of these things. And on top of that, this is the list of players not completely, but like the best available. As we mentioned, Gary Payton, Ben Simmons, Russell Westbrook and Malcolm Brogdon and Chris Boucher. But Thomas Bryant is going overseas guy like he thinks that is the best opportunity for him to get playing time. Minutes, money like in Thomas Bryant was a spark plug for the Indiana Pacers in last year\u2019s NBA Finals. Not a whole lot of minutes, not a whole lot of things that he did. Not a whole lot of time on the floor. But when he was there he made an impact and he couldn\u2019t get minutes or another contract he in the NBA allegedly. Then you have guys like Amir Coffey, Cody Martin, precious Achua campaign, Delon Wright, Markel folks, Alec Burks, Tory Craig, Landry, Shemit. Like these are guys that are again, we\u2019re scraping the bottom of the barrel to try and find out who could be on this Cavs 14 man roster because we know even though you\u2019re allowed to have 15 on there, they the Cavs like to keep that 15th roster spot open just in case there\u2019s someone on the bio, just in case they want to make a midseason acquisition. Right. So I do think this is a difficult conversation that we\u2019re having and we make a lot of jokes about players that probably aren\u2019t going to do all of these things. But Tristan Thompson has shown that he\u2019s willing to play on the veteran minimum. He feels like he can make an impact. Even though we think he might be in the dog days of his career. I think he wants to show what he can still do and I think there\u2019s connections within the organization that might allow him to do that, even though that\u2019s might not be the best option for the Cavs if they\u2019re looking to get something more play ready from their 14th roster spot.<\/p>\n Chris Fedor: Cody Martin\u2019s an interesting name from a standpoint of the Cavs had conversations with the Charlotte Hornets about Isaac Okoro and assignment trade last off season when they were determining what are we going to do with Isaac\u2019s contract and they were trying to see, okay, what is the value around the NBA. How does the NBA view Isaac in terms of his salary moving forward and in terms of what we could potentially get in a trade. One of the teams that they had conversations about, one of the players that they had conversations about Cody Martin.<\/p>\n Ethan Sands: And with that last nugget of information from Cav reporter Chris Felt, that\u2019ll wrap up today\u2019s episode of the Wine and Gold Talk podcast. But remember to become the Cavs insider and interact with Chris, me and Jimmy by subscribing to Subtext. This is where you can let us know what you want to hear on the podcast. This is where you can send in your takes on who the Cavs should sign for the 14th man roster spot and figure out what you thought about our takes on today\u2019s podcast. Well, you can always only do that if you sign up for a 14 day free trial. Or visit cleveland.comcavs and click on the blue bar at the top of the page. If you don\u2019t like it, that\u2019s fine. All you have to do is text the word stop. It\u2019s easy, but we can tell you that the people who sign up stick around because this is the best way to get insider coverage on the Cavs from me, Chris and Jimmy. This isn\u2019t just our podcast, it\u2019s your podcast. And the only way to have your voice heard is to through some tanks. Y\u2019 all be safe. We out.<\/p>\n If you purchase a product or register for an account through a link on our site, we may receive compensation. By using this site, you consent to our User Agreement<\/a> and agree that your clicks, interactions, and personal information may be collected, recorded, and\/or stored by us and social media and other third-party partners in accordance with our Privacy Policy.<\/a><\/p>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"CLEVELAND, Ohio \u2014 In this episode of the Wine and Gold Talk podcast, Ethan Sands, Jimmy Watkins, and…\n","protected":false},"author":3,"featured_media":101929,"comment_status":"","ping_status":"","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"footnotes":""},"categories":[40],"tags":[1260,62,67,132,68],"class_list":{"0":"post-101928","1":"post","2":"type-post","3":"status-publish","4":"format-standard","5":"has-post-thumbnail","7":"category-nba","8":"tag-nba","9":"tag-sports","10":"tag-united-states","11":"tag-unitedstates","12":"tag-us"},"share_on_mastodon":{"url":"https:\/\/pubeurope.com\/@us\/114936262398445612","error":""},"_links":{"self":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.europesays.com\/us\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/101928","targetHints":{"allow":["GET"]}}],"collection":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.europesays.com\/us\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts"}],"about":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.europesays.com\/us\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/types\/post"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.europesays.com\/us\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/users\/3"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.europesays.com\/us\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/comments?post=101928"}],"version-history":[{"count":0,"href":"https:\/\/www.europesays.com\/us\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/101928\/revisions"}],"wp:featuredmedia":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.europesays.com\/us\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media\/101929"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.europesays.com\/us\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media?parent=101928"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.europesays.com\/us\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/categories?post=101928"},{"taxonomy":"post_tag","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.europesays.com\/us\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/tags?post=101928"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}